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Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: Darren Avey on November 16, 2010, 11:42:51 AM
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"Man, id have loved to have boxed a peak Mike Tyson, id have whipped his ass, id have broken his spirit by laughing everytime he hit me, and then id have broken him physically with a brutal KO around the 5th."
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Its on eastsideboxing.com
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tyson at his peak would crush anyone put in front of him..............
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So then why doesn't he step into the boxing ring and fight a world class boxer now and dominate and make boat loads of money instead of fighting for peanuts kickboxing ???
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D-Want to fight
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"Man, id have loved to have boxed a peak Mike Tyson, id have whipped his ass, id have broken his spirit by laughing everytime he hit me, and then id have broken him physically with a brutal KO around the 5th."
lmao ....break his spirit.....
tyson could not and would not be broken .... he was an animal .... the fight went at his pace,,,
he is the fastest heavyweight ever ..... with extreme power in his punches.
nonsense
tyson at his peak would crush anyone put in front of him..............
i agree ..... i know a little bit about boxing and i think tyson was the best heavyweight ever ... and he would have destroyed any fighter lighter than him also.
tyson was a sheer animal in the ring and that combined with outstanding boxing skill and speed, makes him quite a scary guy
this overeem character has no clue
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This dude is a retard.. He just wants some pub. No way anyone was whipping a Iron Mike Tyson in 1988..
"took a punch and smiled"
fuckin yeah right.. the mike tyson documentary shows the most devistating uppercuts known to man.
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D-Want to fight
;D
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This dude is a retard.. He just wants some pub. No way anyone was whipping a Iron Mike Tyson in 1988..
"took a punch and smiled"
fuckin yeah right.. the mike tyson documentary shows the most devistating uppercuts known to man.
yep his uppercuts
the speed and power in them still make me kinda laugh
this guy overeem is clueless
boxing is a whole different game from MMA ...... its like baseball and rally driving
this prick would be KOed and would come round seconds later on the canvass with that " wtf happened there look" all over his funny face
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where's the link ?
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yep his uppercuts
the speed and power in them still make me kinda laugh
this guy overeem is clueless
boxing is a whole different game from MMA ...... its like baseball and rally driving
this prick would be KOed and would come round seconds later on the canvass with that " wtf happened there look" all over his funny face
There is this Documentary called "Tyson" its pretty cool for like the first half. It focuses on his fighting and traing..dude was unfair
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lmao ....break his spirit.....
tyson could not and would not be broken .... he was an animal .... the fight went at his pace,,,
he is the fastest heavyweight ever ..... with extreme power in his punches.
nonsense
i agree ..... i know a little bit about boxing and i think tyson was the best heavyweight ever ... and he would have destroyed any fighter lighter than him also.
tyson was a sheer animal in the ring and that combined with outstanding boxing skill and speed, makes him quite a scary guy
this overeem character has no clue
Ali and Foreman to name two would have given Mike huge problems. By huge problems i mean would have broke him down and stopped him.
You clearly know jack about boxing.
Mike was always known to be mentally frail, it was his biggest weakness. Fastest handspeed at heavy goes to Ali, although Mike obviously had more power.
Overeem wouldn't do anthing against Tyson, it would be domination. However Alistair has said nothing of the kind.
Darren talking like a girl like normal. ;)
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What's worse is that he said BOXING, not fighting in general...He'd get his ugly ass beat.
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Why does this board keep moderating language...
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Not a chance.
He is good, but his boxing is not that good.
8)
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Its on eastsideboxing.com
How about you prove it? dumbass.
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If Overeem said that he's pretty stupid, doubt that he did.
thats because .....he didn't.
I like how overreems goes from never being cocky to claim to whoop tysons ass while laughing at him an no one gets it... gullible people are the worst
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Post a link.
Tyson's biggest wins are against an over the hill Larry Holmes and a blown up LHW Michael Spinks.
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How about you prove it? dumbass.
I ran a search of Overeem's name on that site and found nothing of the sort. I also ran a search on google and it did make mention of Overeem being the MMA Mike Tyson and some speculation by others of who would win in a fight. But nothing about a boxing match and Overeem saying he would be Tyson.
Need a link Darren or your credibility is even more shot.
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I ran a search of Overeem's name on that site and found nothing of the sort. I also ran a search on google and it did make mention of Overeem being the MMA Mike Tyson and some speculation by others of who would win in a fight. But nothing about a boxing match and Overeem saying he would be Tyson.
Need a link Darren or your credibility is even more shot.
he is trolling...
Im suprised people are so damn gullible here actually.
I hate to dmit it but I dont even think people at RX/MD would have swallowed the bait.
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Post a link.
Tyson's biggest wins are against an over the hill Larry Holmes and a blown up LHW Michael Spinks.
Overeem is an accident waiting to happen. If he could beat world class boxers he would be fighting in boxing instead of K-1.
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i know who Larry Holmes and Michael Spinks are ...but who in the FUCK is Alistair Overeem ??? ??? ??? ???
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he is trolling...
Im suprised people are so damn gullible here actually.
I hate to dmit it but I dont even think people at RX/MD would have swallowed the bait.
QFT
Fuck Darren Avey and his mother
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Tyson is still the yardstick in which being the ultimate bad-ass his measured by , everyone still uses him ( regardless if Overeem said this ) The Gracies wanted their shot at him , every new tuff-guy of the month claims they would have beaten him , he is the man they need to try and beat to prove something , Tyson owns a lot of minds
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Tyson is still the yardstick in which being the ultimate bad-ass his measured by , everyone still uses him ( regardless if Overeem said this ) The Gracies wanted their shot at him , every new tuff-guy of the month claims they would have beaten him , he is the man they need to try and beat to prove something , Tyson owns a lot of minds
THIS
QFT
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Ali and Foreman to name two would have given Mike huge problems. By huge problems i mean would have broke him down and stopped him.
You clearly know jack about boxing.
Mike was always known to be mentally frail, it was his biggest weakness. Fastest handspeed at heavy goes to Ali, although Mike obviously had more power.
Overeem wouldn't do anthing against Tyson, it would be domination. However Alistair has said nothing of the kind.
Darren talking like a #girl like normal. ;)
ok i know jack ....... ::)
everyone gives ali the nod when the issue of speed comes up, when infact tyson was faster
ali had outstanding accuracy combined with outstandning speed.
yes tysons biggest weakness was his mental state, while ali was the opposite
if you were fighting tyson when hes in the right frame of mind you would be swallowed up .....including an artist boxer like ali
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This dude is a retard.. He just wants some pub. No way anyone was whipping a Iron Mike Tyson in 1988..
"took a punch and smiled"
fuckin yeah right.. the mike tyson documentary shows the most devistating uppercuts known to man.
D-want to fight?
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Tyson is still the yardstick in which being the ultimate bad-ass his measured by , everyone still uses him ( regardless if Overeem said this ) The Gracies wanted their shot at him , every new tuff-guy of the month claims they would have beaten him , he is the man they need to try and beat to prove something , Tyson owns a lot of minds
fighters fear him thats why..... and some have fancied their chances at taming him over the years
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ok i know jack ....... ::)
everyone gives ali the nod when the issue of speed comes up, when infact tyson was faster
ali had outstanding accuracy combined with outstandning speed.
yes tysons biggest weakness was his mental state, while ali was the opposite
if you were fighting tyson when hes in the right frame of mind you would be swallowed up .....including an artist boxer like ali
Ok. The Green, Smith's, and Tucker's of this world survived Mike in his prime. Someone with Ali's style, footwork and chin would be poison for Mike.
Foreman would physically push him back like Holyfield did and unload uppercuts and bombs at will, swarmers couldn't beat foreman.
Cus D'Amato said this himself, you know, Mike's trainer...
Prime Ali is faster than Mike, he isn't as explosive and doesn't carry his power but he is faster.
I'm a huge Tyson fan but he had weaknesses in his style like anybody else. Styles make fights. Knocking over cans is a touch different to dominating ATG's.
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Ok. The Green, Smith's, and Tucker's of this world survived Mike in his prime. Someone with Ali's style, footwork and chin would be poison for Mike.
Foreman would physically push him back like Holyfield did and unload uppercuts and bombs at will, swarmers couldn't beat foreman.
Cus D'Amato said this himself, you know, Mike's trainer...
Prime Ali is faster than Mike, he isn't as explosive and doesn't carry his power but he is faster.
I'm a huge Tyson fan but he had weaknesses in his style like anybody else. Styles make fights. Knocking over cans is a touch different to dominating ATG's.
Yeah Mike couldn't fight going backwards and this is exactly how Holyfield dismantled him and got Mike so frustrated.
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D-want to fight?
LMAO ;D
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Ok. The Green, Smith's, and Tucker's of this world survived Mike in his prime. Someone with Ali's style, footwork and chin would be poison for Mike.
Foreman would physically push him back like Holyfield did and unload uppercuts and bombs at will, swarmers couldn't beat foreman.
Cus D'Amato said this himself, you know, Mike's trainer...
Prime Ali is faster than Mike, he isn't as explosive and doesn't carry his power but he is faster.
I'm a huge Tyson fan but he had weaknesses in his style like anybody else. Styles make fights. Knocking over cans is a touch different to dominating ATG's.
yep good points there
naa i still dont see ali being faster, as u said tyson has the explosive speed and power behind it, what tyson lacks (not in general, just compared with ali) i thinks is accuracy combined with the speed
yep the styles thing of course..... tyson would always be at a reach disadvantage...and with ali's reach and footwork and ring craft, use of time, ring space & trying to burn the other fighter out.....
i think ali could win ,,,, i think if tyson was off mentally then ali could do what he did with foreman in '74 and i think he could burnout tyson/break him quicker than foreman .....
if a much lighter older henry cooper can daze and knockdown ali forcing dundee to use smalling salts and stall for time ..... then im sure an animal like tyson would have ali in trouble aswell
this could go on like ND & hulkster .... its the same old story ....comparing boxers from different eras
u make a good case and seem to know what ur talking about
i think i secretly would just like to see tyson win ...... but ali was quite awesome and could beat anyone on the correct day
its all about whos the best on the day,whos the fitest whos in the best shape of their life
how often do u actually get 2 fighters together when they are both in the best shape of their life
all this bullshit comes into play
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Mike Tyson was ken norton with speed...
A power puncher = always a wild card in a fight.. Advantage Mike
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Typical arrogant dutchman.
That being said he should switch over to the sweet science and start making real money.
Klitschko's get payed more for one fight than Alistair in 5 years time.
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yep good points there
naa i still dont see ali being faster, as u said tyson has the explosive speed and power behind it, what tyson lacks (not in general, just compared with ali) i thinks is accuracy combined with the speed
yep the styles thing of course..... tyson would always be at a reach disadvantage...and with ali's reach and footwork and ring craft, use of time, ring space & trying to burn the other fighter out.....
i think ali could win ,,,, i think if tyson was off mentally then ali could do what he did with foreman in '74 and i think he could burnout tyson/break him quicker than foreman .....
if a much lighter older henry cooper can daze and knockdown ali forcing dundee to use smalling salts and stall for time ..... then im sure an animal like tyson would have ali in trouble aswell
this could go on like ND & hulkster .... its the same old story ....comparing boxers from different eras
u make a good case and seem to know what ur talking about
i think i secretly would just like to see tyson win ...... but ali was quite awesome and could beat anyone on the correct day
its all about whos the best on the day,whos the fitest whos in the best shape of their life
how often do u actually get 2 fighters together when they are both in the best shape of their life
all this bullshit comes into play
Fair enough, you make good points too. We're talking about the some of the top fighters the sport has produced, nothing is certain.
Very rarely do two guys come in at their best, when you get two great fighters that do, you get fireworks. Arguello v Pryor comes to mind.
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Hitman vs Haggler?
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alist who?
pics?
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Hitman vs Haggler?
haha!
the true Marvelous One!
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haha!
the true Marvelous One!
Remember that fight.. 2 fighters at the top of their game.. going toe to toe in the middle if the ring
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i know who Larry Holmes and Michael Spinks are ...but who in the FUCK is Alistair Overeem ??? ??? ??? ???
I think some goofy mma guy on roids
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Tyson is still the yardstick in which being the ultimate bad-ass his measured by , everyone still uses him ( regardless if Overeem said this ) The Gracies wanted their shot at him , every new tuff-guy of the month claims they would have beaten him , he is the man they need to try and beat to prove something , Tyson owns a lot of minds
Really??What happened?
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speed kills.
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Really??What happened?
Why don't you address the claim you made? Where's the link where Overeem said that? BTW, the Gracies had an open challenge to anyone, even boxers. This even went back to the days of Primo Carnera.
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Why don't you address the claim you made? Where's the link where Overeem said that? BTW, the Gracies had an open challenge to anyone, even boxers. This even went back to the days of Primo Carnera.
Kimura should have stopped their "challenges" when he ragdolled Helio.
Mike tyson along with 99% of the world probably never even heard of the Gracies and their floor rolling antics when they challenged him. Just publicity like most of the shit they do.
Overeem never said shit about Tyson, he doesn't have that type of personality anyway.
Darren being a fucking troll like normal.
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"Man, id have loved to have boxed a peak Mike Tyson, id have whipped his ass, id have broken his spirit by laughing everytime he hit me, and then id have broken him physically with a brutal KO around the 5th."
Overeem would destroy him. Tyson wouldn't connect. Overeem would clinch with him and knee his head to unconsciousness.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Overeem would destroy him. Tyson wouldn't connect. Overeem would clinch with him and knee his head to unconsciousness.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
Queensbury rules sounds like it's had a thorough overhaul.
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Tyson is still the yardstick in which being the ultimate bad-ass his measured by , everyone still uses him ( regardless if Overeem said this ) The Gracies wanted their shot at him , every new tuff-guy of the month claims they would have beaten him , he is the man they need to try and beat to prove something , Tyson owns a lot of minds
Dude, any MMA fighter at the UFC and PRIDE level would utterly demolish Tyson without even breaking a sweat. He is a one-dimensional boxer. He is not even a striker, but a hand striker. Not only does he have no ground game, he doesen't even have stand-up besides his fists. Even against pure strikers like the guys who fight in K-1, Tyson would be at a huge disadvantage because those guys use their legs and knees, and the legs have a greater reach and more power than the arms. Tyson would be knocked out by leg kicks or kneed to a coma. I do give Tyson a fighting chance, because he was very fast and powerful with his fists, but against a top MMA fighter he would probably lose because they would take him to the ground and submit him.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Dude said he would laugh as mike punched him.. Mike would knock his block off
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Dude, any MMA fighter at the UFC and PRIDE level would utterly demolish Tyson without even breaking a sweat. He is a one-dimensional boxer. He is not even a striker, but a hand striker. Not only does he have no ground game, he doesen't even have stand-up besides his fists. Even against pure strikers like the guys who fight in K-1, Tyson would be at a huge disadvantage because those guys use their legs and knees, and the legs have a greater reach and more power than the arms. Tyson would be knocked out by leg kicks or kneed to a coma. I doo give Tyson a fighting chance, because he was very fast and powerful with his fists, but against a top MMA fighter he would probably lose because they would take him to the ground and submit him.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
You would have to be supreme at Muay Thai to stop someone with his footwork and speed getting inside. k-1 is a limited format. Mike would have to drill leg kicks for a few months, understand the scoring. k-1 talent pool is tiny.
Bottom line is Mike never trained Wrestling or Muay thai.
Overeem trains boxing and he wouldn't do anything in boxing.
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You would have to be supreme at Muay Thai to stop someone with his footwork and speed getting inside. k-1 is a limited format. Mike would have to drill leg kicks for a few months, understand the scoring. k-1 talent pool is tiny.
Bottom line is Mike never trained Wrestling or Muay thai.
Overeem trains boxing and he wouldn't do anything in boxing.
You are completely delusional if you think that Tyson would stand more than a puncher's chance against a top MMA fighter. He would be taken to the ground and either submitted or ground-and-pounded. If we are talking about Tyson against top K-1 strikers, his chances are better but he would most likely be kneed to a coma. Stop being such a...Tyson fanboy.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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You are completely delusional if you think that Tyson would stand more than a puncher's chance against a top MMA fighter. He would be taken to the ground and either submitted or ground-and-pounded. If we are talking about Tyson against top K-1 strikers, his chances are better but he would most likely be kneed to a coma. Stop being such a...Tyson fanboy.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
I agree , Tyson could get lucky with a punch but he would be dismantled in minutes by an expert , it's why the Gracie's wanted him they knew if it went to the ground he would be choked out or tapped
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I agree , Tyson could get lucky with a punch but he would be dismantled in minutes by an expert , it's why the Gracie's wanted him they knew if it went to the ground he would be choked out or tapped
Yeah, it's a pretty straight forward conclusion that Tyson wouldn't stand a chance against a top wrestler or grappler, especially since his takedown defenses are probably nil. And against top strikers, people think Tyson would win because his fists are so fast and powerful, but what they don't understand is that in MMA clinching is legal. A top striker would clinch with Tyson and knee him to a coma. The guy has almost no chance.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Yeah, it's a pretty straight forward conclusion that Tyson wouldn't stand a chance against a top wrestler or grappler, especially since his takedown defenses are probably nil. And against top strikers, people think Tyson would win because his fists are so fast and powerful, but what they don't underastand is that in MMA clinching is legal. A top striker would clinch with Tyson and knee him to a coma. The guy has almost no chance.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
It would be hopelessly overmatched , ironically like most of Tysons matches there is a very good reason a 176lbs Royce wanted to fight Mike Tyson ;D
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Everyone puts Ali and even Foreman on pedestals, but both of them had their share of bad fights and losses, something Tyson never had until he was hammered by Cus' death, Don King's influence and Robin Givens' heathen ways.
Ali got pounded by Frazier (who wasn't nearly the puncher Tyson was) in all three of their fights and didn't deserve the Norton victory- a fight in which he got his jaw broken. Jerry Quarry was doing great against Ali until a cut opened up over his eye - a common problem for Quarry. Ali also had trouble with Ron Lyle and Earnie Shavers. Ali's biggest asset was his speed, but then he never faced an opponent nearly as fast as Tyson until he hooked up with a young Larry Holmes.
Foreman got hammered by Ron Lyle and Ali and lost to the overrated Jimmy Young to end his "first" career.
All this is to say that it's impossible to say with any assurance that Ali or Foreman would have killed Tyson. I don't think either faced anything like Mike in their careers. Would have been interesting though.
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Typical arrogant dutchman.
That being said he should switch over to the sweet science and start making real money.
Klitschko's get payed more for one fight than Alistair in 5 years time.
you fucking dummy haha
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Ok. The Green, Smith's, and Tucker's of this world survived Mike in his prime. Someone with Ali's style, footwork and chin would be poison for Mike.
Foreman would physically push him back like Holyfield did and unload uppercuts and bombs at will, swarmers couldn't beat foreman.
Cus D'Amato said this himself, you know, Mike's trainer...
Prime Ali is faster than Mike, he isn't as explosive and doesn't carry his power but he is faster.
I'm a huge Tyson fan but he had weaknesses in his style like anybody else. Styles make fights. Knocking over cans is a touch different to dominating ATG's.
Very Good post, however 1 point you made im not as certain with, you have to remember Tyson had alot more tools than Frazier and Norton, both were Excellent Fighters @ their Peaks and both IMO had STRONGER MENTALITY'S than Tyson, however both of them (with the possible exception of Frazier's LEFT hook) did not have Tyson's Lightning fast FOOT-SPEED, Head-movement, Devastating Body-shots, Fast powerful right hand, uppercuts with ethier hand, hooks with BOTH hands....and the 1 thing he had over all the Top Fighters of Foreman's generation....De-fence...for every punch Foreman would of thrown....and missed... he would of received 2 back lighting fast and VERY HARD, yes he would of pushed Tyson...bullied him...however Foreman's DE-FENCE IMO would of left himself way to open and that would of Spelled BAD NEWS for him against a young hungry Tyson IMO....
Beaten Tyson in his PRIME??... id say the ONLY guy ive seen so far would of been LARRY HOLMES not Ali.....Larry in his Late 20s...Had the Speed, size, DE-FENCE, Fast long hard right hand, Powerful fast Jab, HEAD-MOVEMENT, CHIN, Ring craft and smarts and the main thing needed against Tyson @ his peak...THE Mentality to keep it together under pressure...Ali IMO would of gotten CAUGHT alot sooner than Frazier caught him in the 15th rd in there first fight as Tyson's Foot-speed and Hand-speed would of seen to that, and Yes Holyfeild "exposed Tyson" in the Head Smarts department in 1996-97 however Tyson was nearly a Decade past his absolute best, just my opinion but Larry Holmes in his Prime would be a real tough, frustrating, demoralizing fight for a 20-22 year old Tyson.
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This IS on eastsideboxing s lounge but the guy who posted it on there also offers no source. Tysons finished IMO the HW boxer out there now who could do some damage in MMA is David Haye, the guy trains MMA anyway and is so fast and hits so dam hard i think hed connect and KO Overeem before he knew what was coming.
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Ive seen an interview with Randy C where he says he would nt want to figth peak Tyson as it would be scary, great vid there no one btw
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Ok "pellius", ok "suckmymuscle" ok "jamie" ::) ::) ::) ::)
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1-2 kicks on the legs from Alister and tyson and every other boxer would be on the ground semi crying without managing to throw even one punch
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1-2 kicks on the legs from Alister and tyson and every other boxer would be on the ground semi crying without managing to throw even one punch
But if Mike bullrushed, like he would, and got inside the kicks......it's at least a 50/50 chance he would land an uppercut. A grappler would give him many more problems, but they would have to be able to take one of his punches and I don't think many could. think about it, every MMA fight both guys take some shots to the grill.....difference is they have NEVER been hit like he could hit in his prime....not even close.
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But if Mike bullrushed, like he would, and got inside the kicks......it's at least a 50/50 chance he would land an uppercut. A grappler would give him many more problems, but they would have to be able to take one of his punches and I don't think many could. think about it, every MMA fight both guys take some shots to the grill.....difference is they have NEVER been hit like he could hit in his prime....not even close.
alister would probably thai clinch and throw him around when he rushes him and then BAAAM legkick.. =) if alister didnt wanna take him down that is.. he hasn't been thrown around in a thai clinch either.. I give tyson less then 5% (lucky punch ) of beating alister in a standup and less then 1% in a mma. If alister kept in mind that tyson would rush, just one step to the side and legkick and tyson would be DOWN and IF he actually got up, he wouldn't be able to rush again and then next kick he wouldnt be able to stand up from.
Pointless discussion either way lol
Tyson would beat him in a boxing match alister would beat him in eveyrthing else
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alister would probably thai clinch and throw him around when he rushes him and then BAAAM legkick.. =) if alister didnt wanna take him down that is.. he hasn't been thrown around in a thai clinch either.. I give tyson less then 5% (lucky punch ) of beating alister in a standup and less then 1% in a mma. If alister kept in mind that tyson would rush, just one step to the side and legkick and tyson would be DOWN and IF he actually got up, he wouldn't be able to rush again and then next kick he wouldnt be able to stand up from.
Pointless discussion either way lol
Tyson would beat him in a boxing match alister would beat him in eveyrthing else
lol.....aren't they all?
I just think that Tyson has a much better than 1-5% chance against this guy. Like I said, MMA guys ALWAYS get caught in the grill by far less polished punchers than Mike....and if he caught them, it would be over......
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lol.....aren't they all?
I just think that Tyson has a much better than 1-5% chance against this guy. Like I said, MMA guys ALWAYS get caught in the grill by far less polished punchers than Mike....and if he caught them, it would be over......
Couture always got caught? :P and alister striking isnt at tysons level ofc but hes no slouch so just because tyson comes close doesn't mean its over either (probably but not For sure) look at the vid I posted, It would look like that but would be over faster.
And If a mma guy Only goes for a TD on a boxer he wouldnt get caought, it would look like the TD on couture =)
(http://i34.tinypic.com/r7umf6.jpg)
and thats toney 9 months after only training for TD defence lol.
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Couture always got caught? :P and alister striking isnt at tysons level ofc but hes no slouch so just because tyson comes close doesn't mean its over either (probably but not For sure) look at the vid I posted, It would look like that but would be over faster.
And If a mma guy Only goes for a TD on a boxer he wouldnt get caought, it would look like the TD on couture =)
by using Couture as your ONLY example, it helps make my point....and even he almost always took a shot during a fight.....I just think that if that happens with the type of power Mike has, it's over. The question is only if Mike could avoid getting into a ground and pound situation long enough to throw that punch..... I have no doubt that Mike could take a couple of solid shots from Overreem, but not so sure about the reverse...
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by using Couture as your ONLY example, it helps make my point....and even he almost always took a shot during a fight.....I just think that if that happens with the type of power Mike has, it's over. The question is only if Mike could avoid getting into a ground and pound situation long enough to throw that punch..... I have no doubt that Mike could take a couple of solid shots from Overreem, but not so sure about the reverse...
I could use a million examples if a million boxers had a chance to fight in the ufc..
almost?!?! look at the gif how did he almost take a shot? lol
and No mike Couldn't avoid it.. There is no point in even discussiong it... he couldnt... he would have to train fro it about 5-6 years to even have a Slight chance of defending it, and to Defend it you cannot rhow a uppercut you have to hook the arms...
anyway Im done, I dont bother with this anymore, :P pointless, feel free to believe anything you want, the proof is above this post, Unless a mma guy decides to stand and boz (ala retarded tim sylvia) and even kimbo beat mercer after lol. the boxer has No chance. thats it =)
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I could use a million examples if a million boxers had a chance to fight in the ufc..
almost?!?! look at the gif how did he almost take a shot? lol
and No mike Couldn't avoid it.. There is no point in even discussiong it... he couldnt... he would have to train fro it about 5-6 years to even have a Slight chance of defending it, and to Defend it you cannot rhow a uppercut you have to hook the arms...
anyway Im done, I dont bother with this anymore, :P pointless
I said "almost always" big difference. And the guy throwing wasn't Tyson either... ;D
Oh, I know he couldn't avoid if for a whole fight or even a round.....but my point is, he probably wouldn't have to as after the first connection, Alister would be in no shape to do shit.
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I said "almost always" big difference. And the guy throwing wasn't Tyson either... ;D
Oh, I know he couldn't avoid if for a whole fight or even a round.....but my point is, he probably wouldn't have to as after the first connection, Alister would be in no shape to do shit.
as I said feel free to believe anything you want ;D (he couldnt avoid it for 10 sec or however long it took until alister Decided to go for it 5sec-10sec-15)
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as I said feel free to believe anything you want ;D (he couldnt avoid it for 10 sec or however long it took until alister Decided to go for it 5sec-10sec-15)
So, do you think Tyson could beat ANY mma fighter?
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So, do you think Tyson could beat ANY mma fighter?
Depends on what he mma figher is good at.. And at what level..
Any ufc fighter? no Every ufc fighter has good enough TD's to suprise a boxer/tyson or good enough kickboxing to stay on the outside and blast him with legkicks.. or they could just lay on their back straigh away and make tyson jump into guard lol. or pretend to be hurt ala werdum ;D
there is always the lucky punch ofc... but besides that? no
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Forget peak....the 3 year released from prison version of tyson would maul overeem.
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Depends on what he mma figher is good at.. And at what level..
Any ufc fighter? no Every ufc fighter has good enough TD's to suprise a boxer/tyson or good enough kickboxing to stay on the outside and blast him with legkicks.. or they could just lay on their back straigh away and make tyson jump into guard lol. or pretend to be hurt ala werdum ;D
there is always the lucky punch ofc... but besides that? no
NO UFC fighter? LOL.......give me a break......so he has no chance against any of them? Oh brother..... and wouldn't they make the guy get-up from the ground if Tyson didn't initiate anything?
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NO UFC fighter? LOL.......give me a break......so he has no chance against any of them? Oh brother..... and wouldn't they make the guy get-up from the ground if Tyson didn't initiate anything?
He only has a punchers chance again any ufc fighter yes. If they didnt go for the TD they would have good enough standup to stay on the outside and ruin his legs.. =)
listen. Im not claiming UFC fighters would come into boxing and kick everyones ass becuse it would be ludacris. Boxing fans doesn't seem the understand the other way around is Just as ludacris
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No standup vs boxing
(the whole issue was already proven at UFC 1 lol.
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No standup vs boxing
(the whole issue was already proven at UFC 1 lol.
So you are comparing the best UFC fighter at the time vs a complete nobody boxer vs Tyson vs ANY UFC fighter? C'mon....... ::)
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So you are comparing the best UFC fighter at the time vs a complete nobody boxer vs Tyson vs ANY UFC fighter? C'mon....... ::)
im comparing a boxer to someone who had No standup at all... :) just to prove how easy it would be for someone to take them down.. becusae tyson td defence isn't any better then that boxer and royce isn't even good at td's lol.
Now add standup, Wrestling background and high level grappling and it wouldn't matter if the other person was tyson or a nobody =)
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1-2 kicks on the legs from Alister and tyson and every other boxer would be on the ground semi crying without managing to throw even one punch
Semi crying.
I know one ''man'' who cry's for real.
(http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/3071/lolfkc.jpg)
BENGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG GGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG GGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG
Whos the dummy now midget?
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So, do you think Tyson could beat ANY mma fighter?
Any=All. Yes
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Very Good post, however 1 point you made im not as certain with, you have to remember Tyson had alot more tools than Frazier and Norton, both were Excellent Fighters @ their Peaks and both IMO had STRONGER MENTALITY'S than Tyson, however both of them (with the possible exception of Frazier's LEFT hook) did not have Tyson's Lightning fast FOOT-SPEED, Head-movement, Devastating Body-shots, Fast powerful right hand, uppercuts with ethier hand, hooks with BOTH hands....and the 1 thing he had over all the Top Fighters of Foreman's generation....De-fence...for every punch Foreman would of thrown....and missed... he would of received 2 back lighting fast and VERY HARD, yes he would of pushed Tyson...bullied him...however Foreman's DE-FENCE IMO would of left himself way to open and that would of Spelled BAD NEWS for him against a young hungry Tyson IMO....
Beaten Tyson in his PRIME??... id say the ONLY guy ive seen so far would of been LARRY HOLMES not Ali.....Larry in his Late 20s...Had the Speed, size, DE-FENCE, Fast long hard right hand, Powerful fast Jab, HEAD-MOVEMENT, CHIN, Ring craft and smarts and the main thing needed against Tyson @ his peak...THE Mentality to keep it together under pressure...Ali IMO would of gotten CAUGHT alot sooner than Frazier caught him in the 15th rd in there first fight as Tyson's Foot-speed and Hand-speed would of seen to that, and Yes Holyfeild "exposed Tyson" in the Head Smarts department in 1996-97 however Tyson was nearly a Decade past his absolute best, just my opinion but Larry Holmes in his Prime would be a real tough, frustrating, demoralizing fight for a 20-22 year old Tyson.
Excellent point about Holmes, who may be the most underrated heavyweight in history. If it weren't for that bogus Spinks decision, Larry probably would have retired undefeated, like Marciano.
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Excellent point about Holmes, who may be the most underrated heavyweight in history. If it weren't for that bogus Spinks decision, Larry probably would have retired undefeated, like Marciano.
So Darren Avery has not backed up his claim? I'm surprised because I started gaining some respect for him when he admitted, after asking people himself, that more people were aware and interested in MMA than boxing. They knew Brock and but didn't know who the heavyweight boxing champ was. I know that revelation pained him but he still admitted it. It's beyond me why he would just make something like this up.
BTW, reading this thread makes me miss boxing back in those days. What happened? Only Manny interests me now.
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So, do you think Tyson could beat ANY mma fighter?
in less than 3 punches in any parking lot in the world.
(http://funnycrave.frsucrave.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/mitch-green-eye-2-ab-100509.jpg)
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i don;t know if he could or couldn't beat tyson but he is talking about kickboxing right? if so..i don;'t know he could have had chance
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So Darren Avery has not backed up his claim? I'm surprised because I started gaining some respect for him when he admitted, after asking people himself, that more people were aware and interested in MMA than boxing. They knew Brock and but didn't know who the heavyweight boxing champ was. I know that revelation pained him but he still admitted it. It's beyond me why he would just make something like this up.
BTW, reading this thread makes me miss boxing back in those days. What happened? Only Manny interests me now.
Its on eastside boxing!!In the lounge!!! You have to register as a poster therefore i cant put the link up. The posters name is Dave Junior, yes MMA is more exciting than boxing now and will blow it completley away soon.
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Its on eastside boxing!!In the lounge!!! You have to register as a poster therefore i cant put the link up. The posters name is Dave Junior, yes MMA is more exciting than boxing now and will blow it completley away soon.
so your source is a random poster on a random forum ...without a source?
lol
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in less than 3 punches in any parking lot in the world.
(http://funnycrave.frsucrave.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/mitch-green-eye-2-ab-100509.jpg)
Poor Mitch Green......you know that was one punch and with his left, if i remember correctly.......hope someone ran over to Green and yelled "You just got knocked the fuck out !!!!!!" ;D
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Poor Mitch Green......you know that was one punch and with his left, if i remember correctly.......hope someone ran over to Green and yelled "You just got knocked the fuck out !!!!!!" ;D
sometimes I wish I was a pro fighter that had a beef with someone and ko'd him IN THE OCTAGON baby just so I could do that.
Instant legend ;D
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so your source is a random poster on a random forum ...without a source?
lol
Yeh, i find the best sources are the people who post on youtube comments section,someone on the comments on a Mike Tyson video was saying that Tyson and Lenny Mclean were gonna have an organised street fight on a boat!!!
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in less than 3 punches in any parking lot in the world.
(http://funnycrave.frsucrave.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/mitch-green-eye-2-ab-100509.jpg)
Mitch 'shop 'til I'm dropped' Green. It was at a jacket store, or something, wasn't it, at 2:00 am!? ;D
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Yeh, i find the best sources are the people who post on youtube comments section,someone on the comments on a Mike Tyson video was saying that Tyson and Lenny Mclean were gonna have an organised street fight on a boat!!!
Mr t backed down from lenny ;D
lenny was a bad bad man. But not against tyson lol. would have been over quick lol.
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I doubt T backed down, T was a bad bad ass in his younger days, bouncer in South Side Chicago.Had a real mean reputation.
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I doubt T backed down, T was a bad bad ass in his younger days, bouncer in South Side Chicago.Had a real mean reputation.
probably due to movie roles. Didnt want him to risk getting hurt etc
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Thats the story even Lenny gave that T was getting into Rocky 3 and A Team and that and wanted to preserve himself,makes sense. Why try prove something in a street fight against some thug when you ve got a chance to be a star and a millionaire.
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Thats the story even Lenny gave that T was getting into Rocky 3 and A Team and that and wanted to preserve himself,makes sense. Why try prove something in a street fight against some thug when you ve got a chance to be a star and a millionaire.
Who do you think would win? I know lenny is fast and at least knows how to box to some extent. And I knew T has a notorious rep.. but lets say a organised stand up fight?
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Ive seen videos, some not online yet, of Mclean fighting,300+ lbs of rage, it would be hard to stop unless you re an elite all rounder like a Brock, Fedor type.
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You are completely delusional if you think that Tyson would stand more than a puncher's chance against a top MMA fighter. He would be taken to the ground and either submitted or ground-and-pounded. If we are talking about Tyson against top K-1 strikers, his chances are better but he would most likely be kneed to a coma. Stop being such a...Tyson fanboy.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
You understand differences in formats you ape loving fuckwit?
First of all the original post alludes to boxing. Overeem would get destroyed in boxing in less than a round.
Secondly k-1 is a limited format, not full muay thai, no thai clinch, so no knees. k-1 is becoming a refuge of shitty boxing with some kicks added. The heavyweight division is paper thin. If any of these guys could crossover to boxing they would.
Basically he would have to learn to check leg kicks.
In mma he gets taken down and subbed if he doesn't land straight away.
If you got second rate strikers like Carwin, Cain et cetera trying to work out of the clinch standing in mma they get knocked out.
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1-2 kicks on the legs from Alister and tyson and every other boxer would be on the ground semi crying without managing to throw even one punch
Haha yeah ok little one. When does this ever happen?
Checking leg kicks is about the easiest thing you learn in striking.
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some people make themselves into legends. tyson is one of them. while he's immortalized forever, these fly by night assholes who claim they can kick his ass will come and go.
"i'll fuck you til you love me, f.aggot" is what mike tyson would say to anyone who got in his face, even today.
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Haha yeah ok little one. When does this ever happen?
Checking leg kicks is about the easiest thing you learn in striking.
didnt know boxers learnt that haha
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some people make themselves into legends. tyson is one of them. while he's immortalized forever, these fly by night assholes who claim they can kick his ass will come and go.
"i'll fuck you til you love me, f.aggot" is what mike tyson would say to anyone who got in his face, even today.
is he close to crying? ;D
getbig would have been usefull to tyson. Would have built his mental strenght ;D
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didnt know boxers learnt that haha
I would assume that if he is making a run at the k-1 championship he would learn.
lol at you thinking anyone in ufc has good enough Muay thai to keep Tyson at range.
There is not one single half decent Muay Thai fighter in UFC at heavyweight.
Kicks are a bad idea against someone with great footwork and handspeed, you open yourself up for the counter, especially against a swarmer.
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I would assume that if he is making a run at the k-1 championship he would learn.
lol at you thinking anyone in ufc has good enough Muay thai to keep Tyson at range.
There is not one single half decent Muay Thai fighter in UFC at heavyweight.
Kicks are a bad idea against someone with great footwork and handspeed, you open yourself up for the counter, especially against a swarmer.
So it went from tyson facing alister to tyson training for k-1 for years haha.
Both in their prime. tyson wouldnt stand a chance in hell =)
and now all of a sudden tyson has great footwork for k1? haha my god hes a fast learner ;D
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I give darren his props though, a 5 page troll thread is a good one lol.
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So it went from tyson facing alister to tyson training for k-1 for years haha.
Both in their prime. tyson wouldnt stand a chance in hell =)
and now all of a sudden tyson has great footwork for k1? haha my god hes a fast learner ;D
Years? Try a few months.
Tyson rapes any version of Overeem under any striking rules. He can't deal with pressure and has a glass jaw.
Yeah he is a fast learner, youngest heavyweight champ in history.
Even that hillbilly crying coward Brock could learn to check leg kicks in a few months.
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Years? Try a few months.
Tyson rapes any version of Overeem under any striking rules. He can't deal with pressure and has a glass jaw.
Yeah he is a fast learner, youngest heavyweight champ in history.
Even that hillbilly crying coward Brock could learn to check leg kicks in a few months.
haha. Okay, Im not gonna bother then because you know :o ;D
Im probably gonna start a thread later on how brock would win the HW belt in boxingj after a few months of training haha. Just to show how stupid you guys look lol.
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So you are comparing the best UFC fighter at the time vs a complete nobody boxer vs Tyson vs ANY UFC fighter? C'mon....... ::)
I can tell you based on personal experience and eye witness account that Royce was by far NOT the best Gracie let alone the best fighter representing Jiu-Jitsu at the time. As far as the brothers that were living and teaching in Cali at the time, as well as their cousins the Machados, Royce would have been ranked dead last. He was chosen by Rorion by default. Royler, who was better than Royce, was considered too small (about 135 lbs) and his English was practically non existent at the time. Royce, was Rorion's right hand man at the time as he brought him out to America when he was just 18 to help with teaching and was more like a son to Rorion than a brother due to the huge difference in age. Rickson, easily the family champion who would literally toy with Royce, would not have been so easily controlled by Rorion.
When Rorion asked his cousins, the Machado's, specifically Rigan and Jean-Jacques, to help Royce train for his fight with Kerr, and this was when Royce was already a season fighter and considered one of the best in the world, both Rigan and Jean-Jacques, who I was training with at time, mentioned how surprised they were at the low level of Royce's Jiu-Jitsu. When I asked if he wasn't a Gracie but just one of the members of their academy how would they rank him. Rigan said he would consider him a high level purple belt. So, that boxer is at a far more higher level in his discipline than Royce was in his. That boxer was rated in the top ten and I doubt Royce would have even placed as a Black Belt in a major tournament considering how easily he got choked unconscious by Wallid Ismael when Royce was already a famous UFC champ.
That guy you see being introduced at .29 sec is Carlson Gracie, son of the founder of Gracie Jiu-Jitsu, Carlos Gracie. Carlos was also the older brother of Helio, Rorion's father. Wallid is from Carlson's school. A bit, if not a lot, of bad blood between those two camps. Carlson comes from that generation of Vale Tudo fighters where there were no rules, no time limits and no weight classes. Compared to how they competed in those days makes today's UFC seem like child's play. Carlson was also was the one who avenged Helio's lost (Helio was 43 at the time) to his former student, Valdemar Santana, after going at it for around 3 hours and 45 minutes straight! When they say no time limits in Vale Tudo they mean it!
Royce vs. Wallid
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x27qoe_rare-royce-gracie-vs-wallid-ismail_sport
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haha. Okay, Im not gonna bother then because you know :o ;D
Im probably gonna start a thread later on how brock would win the HW belt in boxingj after a few months of training haha. Just to show how stupid you guys look lol.
Brock Lesnar won the UFC HW title after a few month of training .
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That guy you see being introduced at .29 sec is Carlson Gracie, son of the founder of Gracie Jiu-Jitsu, Carlos Gracie. Carlos was also the older brother of Helio, Rorion's father. Wallid is from Carlson's school. A bit, if not a lot, of bad blood between those two camps. Carlson comes from that generation of Vale Tudo fighters where there were no rules, no time limits and no weight classes. Compared to how they competed in those days makes today's UFC seem like child's play. Carlson was also was the one who avenged Helio's lost (Helio was 43 at the time) to his former student, Valdemar Santana, after going at it for around 3 hours and 45 minutes straight! When they say no time limits in Vale Tudo they mean it!
Royce vs. Wallid
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x27qoe_rare-royce-gracie-vs-wallid-ismail_sport
also seems to be the problem why some dudes cant get their BJJ to work good in mma. they're used to Waiting for misstakes for too long. And with 5 min rounds thats hard. (correct me if im wrong) and besides the obvious basing your tencique and sweeps etc on a guy with a GI on.
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Brock Lesnar won the UFC HW title after a few month of training .
after a "lifetime" of training the best background there is to have in mma...
Im sure tyson could stop brock's tds after a few months of training right? haha.
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haha. Okay, Im not gonna bother then because you know :o ;D
Im probably gonna start a thread later on how brock would win the HW belt in boxingj after a few months of training haha. Just to show how stupid you guys look lol.
Boxing Tyson, less than a round
K-1, no clinch, no knees, leg kicks allowed. Tyson, less than a round.
Full Muay Thai, which Overeem has never fought under. Both train 3 months, Tyson under a round.
Brock has zero striking ability, Tyson is one of the best boxers of all time. Overeem is a guy that has been knocked the fuck out about 15 times. He doesn't have the speed or chin to survive a fast, big puncher. Especially a pressure fighter.
End of.
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Boxing Tyson, less than a round
K-1, no clinch, no knees, leg kicks allowed. Tyson, less than a round.
Full Muay Thai, which Overeem has never fought under. Both train 3 months, Tyson under a round.
well you got one of three at least. Not too bad!
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after a "lifetime" of training the best background there is to have in mma...
Im sure tyson could stop brock's tds after a few months of training right? haha.
Depends on how good he is at wrestling. Learning rate is dictated by natural proficiency. Tyson was never a good clincher though, so i doubt he would be a great wrestler.
Brocks takedowns are a ufc marketing gimmick in any event. Slow and telegraphed. Couture, Carwin, Cain all instantly got up or stopped the takedown.
GSP's takedowns make Brock look like an amateur.
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Depends on how good he is at wrestling. Learning rate is dictated by natural proficiency. Tyson was never a good clincher though, so i doubt he would be a great wrestler.
Brocks takedowns are a ufc marketing gimmick in any event. Slow and telegraphed. Couture, Carwin, Cain all instantly got up or stopped the takedown.
GSP's takedowns make Brock look like an amateur.
no one in the World could stop brocks td's after 3 months of training. you are one retarded ####. and I know he doesnt even have the best ones..
And Cain proves what exactly? you know cains background yes?
Brock would out jab tyson!!!!!!!
There is littarly too much stupidity in your posts I dont know where to start. So Im not gonna bother. Go ahead and believe whatever you want lol :P
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after a "lifetime" of training the best background there is to have in mma...
I see ,haha
(http://h-4.abload.de/img/cain-lesnarfspt.gif)
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I see ,haha
(http://h-4.abload.de/img/cain-lesnarfspt.gif)
Tyson has as good td defence as cain? haha. Just that td, even though he slipped would take down Any boxer in the world With ease..
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Tyson has as good td defence as cain? haha. Just that td, even though he slipped would take down Any boxer in the world With ease..
There is not TD defense in that GIF,Haha
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There is not TD defense in that GIF,Haha
cains keeps left arm on lesnar chest after the punch and circles and the circle is what caused lesnar to slip a boxer would circle.. =)
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cains keeps left arm on lesnar chest after the punch and circles =)
Hahaa,OK
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no one in the World could stop brocks td's after 3 months of training. you are one retarded ####. and I know he doesnt even have the best ones..
And Cain proves what exactly? you know cains background yes?
Brock would out jab tyson!!!!!!!
There is littarly too much stupidity in your posts I dont know where to start. So Im not gonna bother. Go ahead and believe whatever you want lol :P
I would bet a million pounds that Karelin would stop a takedown from Lesnar in mma after 6 months.
You think that Overeem who has been knocked the fuck out about 15 times against c level strikers would beat Tyson in a striking match.
You are one dumb fucking lilliputian.
The best wrestlers in highschool don't lose for years before they become good, it's called natural aptitude.
There are thousands of very athletic people in this world with a natural aptitude for wrestling. Mix that in with a guy who is slow as fuck, telegraphs his takedowns a mile off and is completely hesitant due to the fear of getting punched in the face and you have a lot of scope.
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also seems to be the problem why some dudes cant get their BJJ to work good in mma. they're used to Waiting for misstakes for too long. And with 5 min rounds thats hard. (correct me if im wrong) and besides the obvious basing your tencique and sweeps etc on a guy with a GI on.
No time limits, which Rorion insisted upon and one of the reason why he sold off the UFC (I wonder how ofter he kicks himself in the balls for that), was considered necessary if you had no weight classes. When your opponent is a lot bigger and stronger than you, you are not going to take him out in a few minutes. You had to "cook him" (which was the term often used). Rorion seem to not want to accept that UFC had to be a "sport" to survive. TV, Pay per View, and whatever, are not going sacrifice valuable broad casting time watching two guys laying on top of each other. Neither are the audience as witness by the laborious display of Royce and Shamrock in their last fight.
Tournament Jiu-Jitsu is indeed a lot like a chess game. Despite what most people see, it can get very technical and there is a lot of dead time. You have to hope and wait that your opponent makes a mistake that you can capitalize on. Things change exponentially when you take off the gi and allow punches and kicks. Though I believe Jiu-Jitsu submission techniques are vastly superior to any other submission art, in my opinion wrestlers have more of a MMA mindset and way better conditioning. There's very little dead time in wrestling as you don't have a gi to hold on to and they instinctively know how to position their body weight and fight for the top position. In BJJ, most of the advance techniques stem from the guard position but 85% of that is useless when you are not wearing a gi and your opponent is dropping bombs on you. Even Rickson use to say that in a fight you don't want to be on your back no matter how good your "guard" is.
That being said, if you don't know BJJ and how to defend it you have no chance in MMA. You can be sure that Liddell and Shogun, great stand up fighters, trained a lot on the ground. But the days of BJJ dominance is long past.
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Tyson has as good td defence as cain? haha. Just that td, even though he slipped would take down Any boxer in the world With ease..
That isn't a takedown, that is someone falling about like a drunk.
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That being said, if you don't know BJJ and how to defend it you have no chance in MMA. You can be sure that Liddell and Shogun, great stand up fighters, trained a lot on the ground. But the days of BJJ dominance is long past.
Ofc, lidell is a purple I think
this was beautiful
people were like ..what? ;D
(http://www3.pic-upload.de/08.08.10/g3xt69s9e9ri.gif)
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No time limits, which Rorion insisted upon and one of the reason why he sold off the UFC (I wonder how ofter he kicks himself in the balls for that), was considered necessary if you had no weight classes. When your opponent is a lot bigger and stronger than you, you are not going to take him out in a few minutes. You had to "cook him" (which was the term often used). Rorion seem to not want to accept that UFC had to be a "sport" to survive. TV, Pay per View, and whatever, are not going sacrifice valuable broad casting time watching two guys laying on top of each other. Neither are the audience as witness by the laborious display of Royce and Shamrock in their last fight.
Tournament Jiu-Jitsu is indeed a lot like a chess game. Despite what most people see, it can get very technical and there is a lot of dead time. You have to hope and wait that your opponent makes a mistake that you can capitalize on. Things change exponentially when you take off the gi and allow punches and kicks. Though I believe Jiu-Jitsu submission techniques are vastly superior to any other submission art, in my opinion wrestlers have more of a MMA mindset and way better conditioning. There's very little dead time in wrestling as you don't have a gi to hold on to and they instinctively know how to position their body weight and fight for the top position. In BJJ, most of the advance techniques stem from the guard position but 85% of that is useless when you are not wearing a gi and your opponent is dropping bombs on you. Even Rickson use to say that in a fight you don't want to be on your back no matter how good your "guard" is.
That being said, if you don't know BJJ and how to defend it you have no chance in MMA. You can be sure that Liddell and Shogun, great stand up fighters, trained a lot on the ground. But the days of BJJ dominance is long past.
Pellius,do you compete in BJJ or submission grappling tournaments ?
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Mitch 'shop 'til I'm dropped' Green. It was at a jacket store, or something, wasn't it, at 2:00 am!? ;D
Dapper Dan's All Night Leather Boutique!
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=30171729503&v=wall
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ill knock them both out 8)
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Ahh Mike Tyson... one of the biggest hyped up sports legends of the 20th century, dominated tomato cans of the 1980's (except buster douglas) and then wasted his prime in prison and now talks to pigeons.
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Ahh Mike Tyson... one of the biggest hyped up sports legends of the 20th century, dominated tomato cans of the 1980's (except buster douglas) and then wasted his prime in prison and now talks to pigeons.
Im sure you ve achieved a lot more in life than he ever did "FREAKgeek"
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Mike Tyson could be 65-80 yrs old and some young idiot (read fighter, MMA, toughguy, brawler, thug, soldier of fortune, merc, sailor, Russian, Serbian, African, other third worlder, German, martial artist, hunter, etc) will say, "I could beat Mike Tyson."
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That isn't a takedown, that is someone falling about like a drunk.
After seeing Chuck Liddell on strictly come dancing Brock thought he'd audition with Cain
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Mike Tyson could be 65-80 yrs old and some young idiot (read fighter, MMA, toughguy, brawler, thug, soldier of fortune, merc, sailor, Russian, Serbian, African, other third worlder, German, martial artist, hunter, etc) will say, "I could beat Mike Tyson."
just a testament to how feared the guy truly was - 20+ plus years after the fact he is still the standard every supposed hardass wants to be measured against
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(http://images2-telegraaf.nl/multimedia/archive/00783/Benedictus_783122d.jpg)
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Tyson is the man
and was the baddest man on the planet.
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Ali and Foreman to name two would have given Mike huge problems. By huge problems i mean would have broke him down and stopped him.
You clearly know jack about boxing.
Mike was always known to be mentally frail, it was his biggest weakness. Fastest handspeed at heavy goes to Ali, although Mike obviously had more power.
Overeem wouldn't do anthing against Tyson, it would be domination. However Alistair has said nothing of the kind.
Darren talking like a #girl like normal. ;)
absolutely correct. he was still a force when douglas took him down.
the hyper over mike is the real tragedy here. yes he was good, but he didnt fight anyone really worthy..they came later or were already out of their prime. thats just the way it was. AND, still, a average boxer beat him down.
an exceptional- but LHW really- boxer beat him twice. schooled him in fact.
and finally he got smashed by a tall guy who could actually box.
stop nuthugging and be objective.
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I can tell you based on personal experience and eye witness account that Royce was by far NOT the best Gracie let alone the best fighter representing Jiu-Jitsu at the time. As far as the brothers that were living and teaching in Cali at the time, as well as their cousins the Machados, Royce would have been ranked dead last. He was chosen by Rorion by default. Royler, who was better than Royce, was considered too small (about 135 lbs) and his English was practically non existent at the time. Royce, was Rorion's right hand man at the time as he brought him out to America when he was just 18 to help with teaching and was more like a son to Rorion than a brother due to the huge difference in age. Rickson, easily the family champion who would literally toy with Royce, would not have been so easily controlled by Rorion.
When Rorion asked his cousins, the Machado's, specifically Rigan and Jean-Jacques, to help Royce train for his fight with Kerr, and this was when Royce was already a season fighter and considered one of the best in the world, both Rigan and Jean-Jacques, who I was training with at time, mentioned how surprised they were at the low level of Royce's Jiu-Jitsu. When I asked if he wasn't a Gracie but just one of the members of their academy how would they rank him. Rigan said he would consider him a high level purple belt. So, that boxer is at a far more higher level in his discipline than Royce was in his. That boxer was rated in the top ten and I doubt Royce would have even placed as a Black Belt in a major tournament considering how easily he got choked unconscious by Wallid Ismael when Royce was already a famous UFC champ.
That guy you see being introduced at .29 sec is Carlson Gracie, son of the founder of Gracie Jiu-Jitsu, Carlos Gracie. Carlos was also the older brother of Helio, Rorion's father. Wallid is from Carlson's school. A bit, if not a lot, of bad blood between those two camps. Carlson comes from that generation of Vale Tudo fighters where there were no rules, no time limits and no weight classes. Compared to how they competed in those days makes today's UFC seem like child's play. Carlson was also was the one who avenged Helio's lost (Helio was 43 at the time) to his former student, Valdemar Santana, after going at it for around 3 hours and 45 minutes straight! When they say no time limits in Vale Tudo they mean it!
Royce vs. Wallid
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x27qoe_rare-royce-gracie-vs-wallid-ismail_sport
Royce said during the early UFC's that Rickson was 100X better than he was , Rickson was probably the best at traditional BBJ
Man I remember when Wallid beat Royce that was an insanely huge deal in the BBJ world and look what happened to Wallid in the UFC :-\ I thought he'd do better
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Im sure you ve achieved a lot more in life than he ever did "FREAKgeek"
I love you, "Darren Avery".
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Pellius,do you compete in BJJ or submission grappling tournaments ?
Yes, for about ten years. Very active during the mid 1990s to early 2000. I started straying away from gi training and competing with gi by around 1998. I started at the Gracie academy in Torrance when they first opened up in 1991. My first lesson, a one on one introductory lesson, was with Royce. I remember thinking how skinny he was. Especially his arms. From his wrist to his shoulder it was all one size. We knew he would submit every one in the UFC because no one knew Jiu-Jitsu at the time and no one knew how to defend take downs. Out biggest worry, and it was big, was Shamrock. Shamrock was fighting in Japan and knew the ground game and physically he was vastly superior to Royce in every way.
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Oh for fuck sake, are you people still debating this? Who won UFC 1 back in 1993? A skinny 170 lbs Brazilian named Royce Gracie. How did he beat boxers and brawlers that outweighted him by over 100 lbs? By taking them down and using leverage on their limbs to force them to submit and give up. Tyson would have a puncher's chance against a top MMA fighter. If Overeem decides to stand with Tyson, the latter does stand a chance simply because he is so fast and powerful with his fists. But Overeem would simply clinch with Tyson and knee Tyson's head until Tyson went into coma. But Overeem wouldn't risk standing with Tyson, even though he could since he uses his legs and knees with devastating effectiveness whilst Tyson only uses his fists. Overeem would clinch with Tyson, throw him to the ground and submit him there. Game over.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Royce said during the early UFC's that Rickson was 100X better than he was , Rickson was probably the best at traditional BBJ
Man I remember when Wallid beat Royce that was an insanely huge deal in the BBJ world and look what happened to Wallid in the UFC :-\ I thought he'd do better
I was training with the Machados (Gracie's cousins) at the time. Rorion's school was getting pretty political and there was a lot of tension and in fighting. Things were more open at the Machados and they had top guys from Brasil visiting the school which you didn't have at Gracie's. None of the Machado brothers were surprise at Royce's loss. They even made jokes about it. There was one funny one about a clock and how long Royce lasted (Wallid submitted him with a clock choke). Jean-Jacques said that Royce held the record as the fastest person ever to go from a Purple belt to a Black belt. And it wasn't meant as a compliment. When Rorion brought Royce over from Brasil, Royce was only 18 and still a purple belt. And untested one at that because he didn't compete much. Rorion just gave him his Black belt so he could teach. He figured Brasil was far, far away and nobody here could tell the difference -- which was true.
Having said that Royce evolved into a tough warrior simply out of necessity. I didn't really start to appreciate him until he beat Yoshida twice in Japan (I thought Royce won the first fight and really school him the second time around.
The Gracies lived about a half a mile from me in Torrance. It was Rorion with his family and Royce in one house and Rickson with his family down the street in another house. Good times then.
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What annoys me about MMA, is that it attracts all of the try-hards.
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Oh for fuck sake, are you people still debating this? Who won UFC 1 back in 1993? A skinny 170 lbs Brazilian named Royce Gracie. How did he beat boxers and brawlers that outweighted him by over 100 lbs? By taking them down and using leverage on their limbs to force them to submit and give up. Tyson would have a puncher's chance against a top MMA fighter. If Overeem decides to stand with Tyson, the latter does stand a chance simply because he is so fast and powerful with his fists. But Overeem would simply clinch with Tyson and knee Tyson's head until Tyson went into coma. But Overeem wouldn't risk standing with Tyson, even though he could since he uses his legs and knees with devastating effectiveness whilst Tyson only uses his fists. Overeem would clinch with Tyson, throw him to the ground and submit him there. Game over.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
I explained the rulesets to you earlier moron. Thai clinch isn't permissable in K-1. Overeem hasn't got the chin or the technique to survive a power punching swarmer. Kicking is all well and good against flat footed plodders. But unless your timing is perfect, someone with good footwork is going to get inside of you and counter.
Royce fought against complete cans, no top Judokai, boxers, Ju Jitsu guys. Grappling is more effective than striking though no argument, Mike gets put on his back in mma.
Bottom line is the title says in boxing....Any type of striking and Overeem is finished in under a round.
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Royce said during the early UFC's that Rickson was 100X better than he was , Rickson was probably the best at traditional BBJ
Man I remember when Wallid beat Royce that was an insanely huge deal in the BBJ world and look what happened to Wallid in the UFC :-\ I thought he'd do better
Rickson is the best of the gracie fighters....its a fact
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I explained the rulesets to you earlier moron. Thai clinch isn't permissable in K-1.
Ready to get owned again, bitch? This is irrelevant because TYSON AND OVEREEM WOULDN'T FIGHT IN K-1. Dumbass. They would fight in a no-holds-barred fight and Overeem would clinch with Tyson and knee his head to a coma.
Let me ask you a question, dumbass: Do you really think that Tyson would stand any chance against a top MMA fighter ??? If you do, then you are even stupider than I thought you were.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Ready to get owned again, bitch? This is irrelevant because TYSON AND OVEREEM WOULDN'T FIGHT IN K-1. Dumbass. They would fight in a no-holds-barred fight and Overeem would clinch with Tyson and knee his head to a coma.
Let me ask you a question, dumbass: Do you really think that Tyson would stand any chance against a top MMA fighter ??? If you do, then you are even stupider than I thought you were.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
Read the thread title you chimp loving filth, hence most of the discourse in this thread. In any event in a no holds barred enviroment, Overeem would get his fucking face chewed off most likely.
MMA is not no holds barred.
Go and snap some Dobermans necks super soldier. ::)
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Read the thread title you chimp loving filth, hence most of the discourse in this thread. In any event in a no holds barred enviroment, Overeem would get his fucking face chewed off most likely.
MMA is not no holds barred.
Go and snap some Dobermans necks super soldier. ::)
Idiot, when I mean no-holds-barred I mean a typical MMA fight. Going by your logic, a 120 lbs female would just shoot Tyson and kill him. This is about a non-boxing fight, retard. A fight where you can use not only your fists but also your legs, knees, wrestling and submissions. Of course eye poking, biting and hitting at the back of the neck won't be allowed. For fuck sake, man, you are so fucking stupid. You obviously love Tyson because you are a boxer. It shows because only someone who took so many blows to the head can be this stupid.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Rickson is the best of the gracie fighters....its a fact
Well, that may be true. He certainly was head and tails above the rest of his family and the champs that came from Brasil in Jiu-Jitsu. I saw it first hand and nobody came close to him on the mat. Although I started at Rorion's academy in Torrance I only stayed there for around six months and left to train with Rickson when he left the Torrance school to start his own school in West LA. Rorion was difficult to work with and wanted to control everything. Jiu-Jitsu wasn't big at all in those days and though Rickson was famous in Brasil he was a nobody here so in addition to the group classes I got to take one hour private lessons with him once a week for $50.00/hr. It usually lasted a lot longer because I would show up early to watch his private lessons with Eric Paulson who I recently found out is Brock Lesnar's Jiu-Jitsu teacher. He would use me to be Eric's dummy to help with his instruction. I stayed with Rickson for several years until he got so busy that he didn't teach as much anymore and left the duties to Limao (Luis Heredia) who was a purple/brown at the time which is why I went to the Machado's where all the brothers were there: Carlos, Rigan, Jean-Jacques, Roger and John. Along with these Black Belts there also was a steady stream of Black Belts coming in and out from Brasil. Rickson was the only Black Belt at his school.
I never will understand why Rickson didn't fight Sakuraba when it matter. When Saku was one by one handing Gracie their asses. If for no other reason then to defend his family honor as his father, Helio, would have done and as all the Gracie's before him had done. If he fought Saku and won, and I believe he would have, then his legacy would have been sealed. Just by that one fight. But he didn't and he is, rightly so, forever questioned. He never really tested himself and that will always remain an eternal mystery to me. I don't believe he was afraid of losing. He was utterly fearless when it came to fighting. There was one time when a fighter from Japan showed up at our school with a camera crew and some of his students and challenge Rickson to fight right there and then. This guy was a professional fighter and felt Rickson ducked him when he was competing in Japan. This guy had obviously been training and preparing for this big show down. Rickson was not there at the time because he had just arrived home from Japan the night before. But Limao called him and, jet lag and all, having no preparation to fight this guy, he drove right down to the school. When he arrived we shut the doors of that old warehouse adjacent to an auto shop and they went at it. Rickson beat the living shit out of the Jap. He like to end tournament/professional/competition fights with submissions because he did not want to hurt his opponent (so he said) but this was a street fight. When Rickson got the mount he just pounded that guy into a bloody mess. His posse tired to stop it but we would not allow it. "You came here. You interrupted our class. You issued the challenge. It goes to the end."
The Japanese came back some time later dressed in traditional grab and presented a scroll of apology. I've always love the Japanese warrior spirit and sense of honor. Well, at least the traditional ones.
Having known, trained and spent time with Rickson I had no doubt that he would fight Saku. When people at the time would ask me if Rickson would ever step up and defend the family honor I would tell them it was destiny. I truly believe that.
I was wrong. Rickson legacy, if you can even call it that, will forever be tainted. He did not live up to the Gracie code of fighting anybody, anytime, anywhere. Not like that fearless, kind and gentle warrior that is his cousin, Renzo Gracie. Renzo may have not been the best MMA fighter in the world, or even the best Gracie, but more than any other of his generation of Gracies, he exemplified the warrior spirit more than any other.
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Read the thread title you chimp loving filth, hence most of the discourse in this thread. In any event in a no holds barred enviroment, Overeem would get his fucking face chewed off most likely.MMA is not no holds barred.
Go and snap some Dobermans necks super soldier. ::)
Thats a fact, Overeem in a street brawl with Tyson wouldnt know what to do against a snarling maniac trying to bite his face off.
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Thats a fact, Overeem in a street brawl with Tyson wouldnt know what to do against a snarling maniac trying to bite his face off.
Can you please post a link to the claim that you made when you started this thread? Either that or admit you just made it up or took it out of context and posted it here to garner attention to yuorself or that it was some kind of inside joke. As I mentioned before, you earn some respect from me (not that it matters to you I confess) when you admitted as a result of your own personal survey that you found that more people followed and were more familiar with MMA than boxing. I'm sure that was something you didn't want to admit but it showed good character and a bit of class that you did. It takes a man to admit when he's wrong and being a man is not always about who can kick who's ass. Why would you tarnish your credibility by starting a thread like this?
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Its on eastsideboxing.com!! In the lounge section, you have to be a member to see the lounge though therefore a link on here wouldnt work as it ll tell you to register.
Yes MMA is more popular than boxing, mainly in under 30s.
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I think MMA has peaked, or rather UFC has, easy to get the two mixed up.
The PPV's this year have been complete dross, They keep churning more and more out and down goes the quality.
It's stagnating, it's a shame really but the UFC just sees the dollar signs and it is just a product now.
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Very true
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I think MMA has peaked, or rather UFC has, easy to get the two mixed up.
The PPV's this year have been complete dross, They keep churning more and more out and down goes the quality.
It's stagnating, it's a shame really but the UFC just sees the dollar signs and it is just a product now.
proof? :)
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UFC 100 1,600,000
UFC 101 850,000
UFC 102 435,000
UFC 103 375,000
UFC 104 500,000
UFC 106 375,000
UFC 107 620,000
UFC 108 300,000
UFC 109 275,000
UFC 110 240,000
the card in other countries and lame cards are suffering a bit yes lol. far from "going down the drain though.
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proof? :)
No big ppv stars have been developed, it's all the old guard that draw numbers.
The quality of product has nosedived, which is apparent when talking to people/forums/journalism.
The two biggest numbers guys were a handfull of fights rookie, who has been exposed and a streetfighter who is now off the radar. The fact that guys like that are getting the numbers and not the elite fighters goes to show you how casual the majority of fans are. Casual fans go through peaks and valleys, they are not assured.
The recession of the sport in Japan, which apart from America was one of it's only strongholds. Lack of expansion anywhere else. I live in london and it is never in the press at all over here, really England should be one of the first country's that the sport established itself in, given all of the factors involved.
If you can't see that the product has slipped and want to buy shitty overpriced PPV's then fine. Who am i kidding, you have never bought a ppv. ;)
UFC needs to get it's shit togeather basically.