Author Topic: Is E-lie Wiesel A Fraud?? his story unravles.............  (Read 16795 times)

Parker

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Re: Is E-lie Wiesel A Fraud?? his story unravles.............
« Reply #125 on: December 10, 2011, 10:54:43 AM »
Patton was killed in a car accident... Check out Brad Metzlers decoded. There was an episode about a month ago discussing his entire life, including the oddity of his death.

It was quite interesting.
Is that the show that did the episode on Clark of Lewis and Clark fame?

pillowtalk

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Re: Is E-lie Wiesel A Fraud?? his story unravles.............
« Reply #126 on: December 10, 2011, 09:42:43 PM »

I concluded that the people or person putting this video together are pushing an agenda. I generally feel the truth of any matter lies somewhere in the middle between the extremes. The more vehement an argument, the more I find it suspicious.....but, that's just how I am wired.
I am not sure how you arrived at this conclusion when you didn't watch the entire file, but no matter.
The narrator (in the section dealing with the Nuremberg trails) is pointing out inconsistency in the whiteness testimony, if this is pushing an agenda then so be it.
I had no idea when it came to the details of the holohoax, I only knew what I was told at school. & like most things I was told at school I took it as gospel because it came from a teacher.

We will disagree on the point of the argument being vehement, the entire film is pointing out lies, inconsistency & half truths.
The only vehemence I see is from the side that is not only pushing this holohoax, horse shit, but will imprison/bankrupt people & slander their name in the news, for printing books that ask these questions. lest we forget that they are legitimate questions that would be considered in a (fair & just) court of law.
I think that section does a very good job of explaining what 99.99% of people have got no idea about. The Nuremberg trails, were a fucking sham & the people in charge (chief prosecutor/presiding judge, etc) were all in on it. Let's not even get into the Diesel engines from a Russian T24 tank/lack of bodies, etc etc....

Personally, picking apart the details of that time in history to either support or deny the Holocaust is not where I choose to spend a lot of energy. I believe I have been very clear that my position is that I feel it is time to move forward by devoting our energy instead to more current issues and problems.
That is why we shall choose to leave this subject altogether. You will never be able to look at any of the facts regarding this issue while remaining objective, you have very clearly outlined this while giving your opinions.  So you are yourself extremely biased. If you  can not see this, then perhaps you should look again. I have discussed this issue with others online who were of the "you are a holohoax denier" persuasion, & even they had to admit that when they looked a little closer at things they were not 100% on, or never even aware of, they find their ability to construct a counter argument leaves them, because they would have to leave their sense of logic at the door if they were to go any further. Thus they concede that even they can not see how you could burn bodies by stacking them 20 high/gas people by using a Diesel engine (considering it is extremely difficult to kill someone in this manner). We will leave this subject behind now. However, if you find another subject where people will be imprisoned/bankrupted & slandered in the news, for asking questions you be sure & let me know, yes??

On a more personal level, I don't believe in monetary retributions as a resolution for past or current affronts. There are some things that money just cannot buy. Money cannot buy back ones loss of life or the loss of a loved ones life, example.

Tell the Israelis (who have stolen Billions of Euros from the German people to build their own fascist, concentration camps, in Gaza/W.bank) & your government this ^^^^

PT
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Primemuscle

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Re: Is E-lie Wiesel A Fraud?? his story unravles.............
« Reply #127 on: December 10, 2011, 10:03:52 PM »
I am not sure how you arrived at this conclusion when you didn't watch the entire file, but no matter.
The narrator (in the section dealing with the Nuremberg trails) is pointing out inconsistency in the whiteness testimony, if this is pushing an agenda then so be it.
I had no idea when it came to the details of the holohoax, I only knew what I was told at school. & like most things I was told at school I took it as gospel because it came from a teacher.

We will disagree on the point of the argument being vehement, the entire film is pointing out lies, inconsistency & half truths.
The only vehemence I see is from the side that is not only pushing this holohoax, horse shit, but will imprison/bankrupt people & slander their name in the news, for printing books that ask these questions. lest we forget that they are legitimate questions that would be considered in a (fair & just) court of law.
I think that section does a very good job of explaining what 99.99% of people have got no idea about. The Nuremberg trails, were a fucking sham & the people in charge (chief prosecutor/presiding judge, etc) were all in on it. Let's not even get into the Diesel engines from a Russian T24 tank/lack of bodies, etc etc....
That is why we shall choose to leave this subject altogether. You will never be able to look at any of the facts regarding this issue while remaining objective, you have very clearly outlined this while giving your opinions.  So you are yourself extremely biased. If you  can not see this, then perhaps you should look again. I have discussed this issue with other online who were of the "you are a holohoax denier" persuasion, & even they had to admit that when they looked a little closer at things they were not 100% on, or never even knew about, they find their ability to construct a counter argument leaves them, because they would have to leave their sense of logic at the door if they were to go any further. Thus they concede that even they can not see how you could burn bodies by stacking them 20 high/gas people by using a Diesel engine (considering it is extremely difficult to kill someone in this manner). We will leave this subject behind now. However, if you find another subject where people will be imprisoned/bankrupted & slandered in the news, for asking questions you be sure & let me know, yes??
Tell the Israelis (who have stolen Billions of Euros from the German people to build their own fascist, concentration camps, in Gaza/W.bank) & your government this ^^^^

PT

I agree we (you and I) should probably "leave this subject" because, it seems one or the other of us isn't communicating very well at this point.

As I pointed out, I watched exactly what you instructed me to watch in that video. It seems now like you are suggesting I failed in some way by not watching the whole thing. My perception is that the narrator had an agenda. I am wary of anyone who pushes their own agenda too hard, regardless of which side of an issue they are on.

Tell me this; if I somehow completely embraced what you have shown and told me, how would it change anything for either one of us? What I think or what you think is of little consequence either way, when all is said and done. Frankly, I am more comfortable remaining something of a skeptic when it comes to the details of the Holocaust. There was a war and people died. Unfortunately, many of those folks were innocent citizens.  Whether their numbers were 6,000,000 or 6,000 what happend to them was wrong, IMO. If this makes me biased, I don't see it.

pillowtalk

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Re: Is E-lie Wiesel A Fraud?? his story unravles.............
« Reply #128 on: December 10, 2011, 11:42:27 PM »
I agree we (you and I) should probably "leave this subject" because, it seems one or the other of us isn't communicating very well at this point.

As I pointed out, I watched exactly what you instructed me to watch in that video. It seems now like you are suggesting I failed in some way by not watching the whole thing. My perception is that the narrator had an agenda. I am wary of anyone who pushes their own agenda too hard, regardless of which side of an issue they are on.
Allow me to present you with what was posted.
I concluded that the people or person putting this video together are pushing an agenda. I generally feel the truth of any matter lies somewhere in the middle between the extremes. The more vehement an argument, the more I find it suspicious.....but, that's just how I am wired.
I am not sure how you arrived at this conclusion when you didn't watch the entire file, but no matter.
The narrator (in the section dealing with the Nuremberg trails) is pointing out inconsistency in the whiteness testimony, if this is pushing an agenda then so be it.

Let me rephrase. You did not watch the entire film so to say the narrator is pushing an agenda based upon 15 min is ridiculous, especially when we look at what was said in the 15 mins!! You are overly concerning yourself with who is/isn't pushing an agenda. Facts that are presented should be just that. trying to STOP people from getting access to these fact is pushing an agenda.

Our communication skills are perfect, we both have a very good command of the English language. It is misinterpretation of what is said that is the problem. I have posted this information for all who read the thread to see, with the hope that it will make some question the paradigms/self perpetuating memes, they have been handed, as has been the case with Andreisdaman.

Tell me this; if I somehow completely embraced what you have shown and told me, how would it change anything for either one of us? What I think or what you think is of little consequence either way, when all is said and done. Frankly, I am more comfortable remaining something of a skeptic when it comes to the details of the Holocaust. There was a war and people died. Unfortunately, many of those folks were innocent citizens.  Whether their numbers were 6,000,000 or 6,000 what happend to them was wrong, IMO. If this makes me biased, I don't see it.

I have not tried to convince you of anything, as a guy I know once said "not only do I NOT care what you do with this information, but it is NONE of my fucking business" - You have clearly outlined the obvious: my life remains the same irrespective of what you believe, I still have the keys to my apartment, I still own my own company (that will be feature on www.bodybuilding.com next month) I still have a beautiful wife, money is not an issue, etc etc............

What you have said here is that you are going to perpetually sit on the fence when looking at politics. Do you vote at all?? I will be shocked to hear that you do, I mean come on, they are all lying kunts that are pushing their own agenda.
You will listen to both arguments & then sit on the fence, because they all protesteth to much ("the lady doth protest too much me thinks") & they all have an agenda, LMFAO.
It's a good job that the majority have not taken that approach during the last 500 years of European history, we would still be in the fucking dark ages.

Yeah it was war & people died, get over it. I tell you what: when the fucking Joos STOP building holohox museums in every city that they can get the PUBLIC to fund them. When people are NO longer charged (& imprisoned) with hate crimes/incitement to racial hatred for daring to print a book that asks serious questions. When school children are NO longer having LIES (that can be disproved) pushed down their necks in the guise of education.
When.................... .
Oh fuck it you get the idea. Bottom line is: when X/Y/Z is stopped I WILL GET OVER IT, KAY??

PT
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Spicoli

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Re: Is E-lie Wiesel A Fraud?? his story unravles.............
« Reply #129 on: December 10, 2011, 11:46:11 PM »
Hold the phone!
Are you saying a jew is profiting off of others miseries?
Call CNN we got breaking news.
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pillowtalk

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Re: Is E-lie Wiesel A Fraud?? his story unravles.............
« Reply #130 on: December 11, 2011, 02:01:56 AM »
In Israel, 'fascist' is not a rude word
The silence of Yad Vashem and other Holocaust memorial institutes to the recent rash of anti-democratic legislation is deafening.

"Every certificate issued by the state will oblige [the recipient] to sign a document with a clause declaring loyalty to the State of Israel."An explanation was offered by Arutz Sheva, the settlers' news website: No declaration - then no driver's license, no identity card, no passport. Speaking to Razi Barka'i on Army Radio, Danon explained that this was indeed not enough for - watch out!! - "the total solution." Even Barka'i almost choked at the phrase.

The media, dizzy from these bills that make Jean-Marie Le Pen and his daughter look like amateurs, has stopped noticing the difference between an old bill and an amended one. Since the current bill is targetted at Arabs, it is not causing a stir. But what about the Jewish History departments at the universities, the Yad Vashem Holocaust memorial institute, or the museum at Kibbutz Lohamei Hageta'ot? Their silence is no different from the general disregard of the issue, but it is deafening.

http://www.haaretz.com/print-edition/opinion/in-israel-fascist-is-not-a-rude-word-1.400445

PT
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pillowtalk

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Re: Is E-lie Wiesel A Fraud?? his story unravles.............
« Reply #131 on: December 11, 2011, 02:10:14 AM »
This thread was started on October the 20'th (over x6 weeks ago) - this leads me to believe that Ron has not deleted it because he is not unhappy with the content.
perhaps even Ron (if he has read it all) being jewish himself, does not find this a taboo subject?? I would like to think so, as all that has been asked here are questions regarding the claims of E-lie being being at Auschwitz (thus "Night" being a factual account) & the credibility of the Nuremberg trails (where the vast majority of the evidence for the holohoax was presented to the world).

As I have stated "if you know that an event is historical FACT why do you fear questions/investigation??"

PT
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Primemuscle

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Re: Is E-lie Wiesel A Fraud?? his story unravles.............
« Reply #132 on: December 11, 2011, 02:16:54 PM »
Allow me to present you with what was posted.I am not sure how you arrived at this conclusion when you didn't watch the entire file, but no matter.
The narrator (in the section dealing with the Nuremberg trails) is pointing out inconsistency in the whiteness testimony, if this is pushing an agenda then so be it.


I WATCHED EXACTLY WHAT YOU TOLD ME TO WATCH. Why do you keep ignoring this?

Can you honestly tell me you find the narrator's tone neutral; as if he is simply telling the facts? Of course most all narrators do what I feel he is doing here, which is adding some dramatic intonations to make his point more interesting.

As for me, I prefer to draw my own conclusions and not have it done for me. However in order to accurately do that in this scenario, I would have to actually read the transcripts of this portion of the Nuremberg trail.

If you look into who posted this video on Youtube, which you probably have, you should see as I did that it appears there is some agenda here with this group.

Let me rephrase. You did not watch the entire film so to say the narrator is pushing an agenda based upon 15 min is ridiculous, especially when we look at what was said in the 15 mins!! You are overly concerning yourself with who is/isn't pushing an agenda. Facts that are presented should be just that. trying to STOP people from getting access to these fact is pushing an agenda.

Thanks for rephrasing....I guess. I'm not going to bother doing that because, my response above stands.

What you see as facts, I don't. Facts are easy to distort. We've seen this throughout time, haven't we. Note: I am not suggesting that I think it is a fact that 6,000,000 Jews died in the Holocaust either. As I said, innocent folks died; how many or how few is not so much an issue for me. That this kind of shit happens is wrong, period.

Our communication skills are perfect, we both have a very good command of the English language. It is misinterpretation of what is said that is the problem. I have posted this information for all who read the thread to see, with the hope that it will make some question the paradigms/self perpetuating memes, they have been handed, as has been the case with Andreisdaman.


While I agree that you and I mostly communicate with some degree of intelligence and skill, we do have different perspectives on certain topics, which by the way, is not a bad thing at all. That being said, you continuing to ignore that I followed your directions in watching the video makes me think you are like a professor who makes an assignment to their students and then gets annoyed when the students actually follows their directions. -Something like saying, "I told you to read chapter 7, but I expected you'd read the whole book, so I am failing you now."

I have not tried to convince you of anything, as a guy I know once said "not only do I NOT care what you do with this information, but it is NONE of my fucking business" - You have clearly outlined the obvious: my life remains the same irrespective of what you believe, I still have the keys to my apartment, I still own my own company (that will be feature on www.bodybuilding.com next month) I still have a beautiful wife, money is not an issue, etc etc............

Thank you for this. My life is not changed either, although I will credit you with getting me to look as some things I probably would not have bothered myself with otherwise. And that's a good thing. Being retired, I have more time than some others to delve into different topics and philosophies. I would like to think I am still open to learning new things....even at my age.

What you have said here is that you are going to perpetually sit on the fence when looking at politics. Do you vote at all?? I will be shocked to hear that you do, I mean come on, they are all lying kunts that are pushing their own agenda.

You will listen to both arguments & then sit on the fence, because they all protesteth to much ("the lady doth protest too much me thinks") & they all have an agenda, LMFAO.

It's a good job that the majority have not taken that approach during the last 500 years of European history, we would still be in the fucking dark ages.

Yeah it was war & people died, get over it. I tell you what: when the fucking Joos STOP building holohox museums in every city that they can get the PUBLIC to fund them. When people are NO longer charged (& imprisoned) with hate crimes/incitement to racial hatred for daring to print a book that asks serious questions. When school children are NO longer having LIES (that can be disproved) pushed down their necks in the guise of education.
When.................... .

Oh fuck it you get the idea. Bottom line is: when X/Y/Z is stopped I WILL GET OVER IT, KAY??

PT

Perhaps I do my share of fence sitting in some areas. But I am willing to get off the fence when I believe I have a really clear picture of a situation. In this case though, whether I sit on the fence forever or not changes nothing. It's all ancient history. What I believe or what you believe happened or did not happen during that period in time means nothing in the big scheme of things....because our beliefs will change nothing.

Actually, my voting record is excellent. I don't believe I have missed voting in any election, large or small, in the past thirty or forty years. I am a registered Democrat. However, I vote for candidates and issues as I see them and not necessarily along party lines. It is annoying to a "fence sitter" like me that getting the truth out of political campaigns is so fucking difficult today. But, one way or the other, I do get off the fence on election day.  Sometimes, it seems as if truth and honor are completely lost.

In Oregon we've had mail in ballots for some years now....voting couldn't be easier. Yet, only a small percentage of folks actually take the time to do this. But then, this is a whole other soapbox for me; folks like to complain about everything while they sit back on their lazy asses and can't even bother to vote.

PM

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Re: Is E-lie Wiesel A Fraud?? his story unravles.............
« Reply #133 on: December 12, 2011, 06:04:36 AM »
lolz, PT getting destroyed again, poor gimmick/troll/copy-paste Dim Witt.
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Re: Is E-lie Wiesel A Fraud?? his story unravles.............
« Reply #134 on: December 12, 2011, 06:42:13 AM »
lolz, PT getting destroyed again, poor gimmick/troll/copy-paste Dim Witt.

Do fuck off, no one likes you.

PT
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pillowtalk

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Re: Is E-lie Wiesel A Fraud?? his story unravles.............
« Reply #135 on: December 13, 2011, 12:27:53 AM »
I WATCHED EXACTLY WHAT YOU TOLD ME TO WATCH. Why do you keep ignoring this?

Can you honestly tell me you find the narrator's tone neutral; as if he is simply telling the facts? Of course most all narrators do what I feel he is doing here, which is adding some dramatic intonations to make his point more interesting.


If you look into who posted this video on Youtube, which you probably have, you should see as I did that it appears there is some agenda here with this group.


PM

I stated a fact. Not once did I ask you to watch the entire film!! I only told you that concluding anything about the film when you have not watched it all is ridiculous. Read the posts again & tell me where I told you to watch the entire film.
You watched 15 mins, there fore you are ONLY qualified to comment on that 15 mins.

As for the person/group who posted it  ??? they did not make the film, nor did they offer any content, so they are 100% irrelevant to the equation.
 
Confusion & serious misinterpretation are now what is going on here the.
I am finished posting replies to you on this subject. Your constant playing Devils advocate is getting boring.

Jesus I pray we never end up on the same jury!! If you sit on a jury, you have to review a lot of evidence & make you mind up beyond reasonable doubt.
I watched that film & decided that the allegations made by the alleged survivors were beyond stupid. Agreed, I already knew a lot about the subject before I saw that film (which was made in 2006) so most of it was not news to me, as it was to you. However, the points stand.
Burning bodies stacked 20 high = impossible - Killing people by using a Diesel engine = virtually impossible. The bodies of the 1.5 Million people from the x3 camps have vanished into thin air = impossible.The list goes on & on.

I also find the fact that you can get put into prison/demonised in the media & raped of all your holdings, for asking these questions fucking disgusting. & when you consider that the people behind this - ARE AS WE SPEAK - committing GENOCIDE   right in front of the eyes of every member state in the UN, you just have to admit that you are now in an episode of the 'twilight zone'  & things have just gotten beyond fucking bizarre. I live in India & can, thankfully, publish a book on this subject with-out fear of being publicly raped. & you know, I might just do that  ;)

I have made a very clear case in this thread. Shit, even people who did not want to believe that there are some questions to be asked had to look again. With that much I am happy.  

PT
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Re: Is E-lie Wiesel A Fraud?? his story unravles.............
« Reply #136 on: December 13, 2011, 01:12:43 AM »
I stated a fact. Not once did I ask you to watch the entire film!! I only told you that concluding anything about the film when you have not watched it all is ridiculous. Read the posts again & tell me where I told you to watch the entire film.
You watched 15 mins, there fore you are ONLY qualified to comment on that 15 mins.

As for the person/group who posted it  ??? they did not make the film, nor did they offer any content, so they are 100% irrelevant to the equation.
 
Confusion & serious misinterpretation are now what is going on here the.
I am finished posting replies to you on this subject. Your constant playing Devils advocate is getting boring.

Jesus I pray we never end up on the same jury!! If you sit on a jury, you have to review a lot of evidence & make you mind up beyond reasonable doubt.
I watched that film & decided that the allegations made by the alleged survivors were beyond stupid. Agreed, I already knew a lot about the subject before I saw that film (which was made in 2006) so most of it was not news to me, as it was to you. However, the points stand.
Burning bodies stacked 20 high = impossible - Killing people by using a Diesel engine = virtually impossible. The bodies of the 1.5 Million people from the x3 camps have vanished into thin air = impossible.The list goes on & on.

I also find the fact that you can get put into prison/demonised in the media & raped of all your holdings, for asking these questions fucking disgusting. & when you consider that the people behind this - ARE AS WE SPEAK - committing GENOCIDE   right in front of the eyes of every member state in the UN, you just have to admit that you are now in an episode of the 'twilight zone'  & things have just gotten beyond fucking bizarre. I live in India & can, thankfully, publish a book on this subject with-out fear of being publicly raped. & you know, I might just do that  ;)

I have made a very clear case in this thread. Shit, even people who did not want to believe that there are some questions to be asked had to look again. With that much I am happy.  

PT


Glad to know you are happy.

You are as anal about some things as I am, it appears. It is probably a good idea, as you suggested, that we end this particular discussion before one of us gets pissed off at the other. Not to mention that we are both going in circles at this point.

I have served on jury duty a few different times. One time a tax evader/protester was on trial and we found him guilty. Another time the defendant was woman charged with a DUII. The prosecution failed to prove their case against her, so we had to find the woman not guilty. However, we all thought she probably did drive under the influence of intoxicants.  

I nearly was selected to sit on serial killer, Dayton Leroy Rogers most recent death sentence appeal http://www.crimezzz.net/serialkiller_news/R/ROGERS_dayton_leroy.php which would have been interesting to say the least. Unfortunately, to be a juror one had to have no prior knowledge of his crimes or sentencing. I'm not sure how they found twelve jurors plus alternates that didn't know who he was and what he'd done. That trial probably lasted six months.

Our governor, John Kitzhaber just recently imposed a moratorium on any executions while he is governor. He's a former doctor, so I suppose he's conflicted because of the Hippocratic oath. http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/

You will note that I have already made it quite clear that I don't agree with the Israelis aggressive tactics towards the Palestinians. So with respect to this, you are "preaching to the choir" as it were.

I think you should write a book about this situation as you view it. You write well. You might be able to get it published.