For those of you familiar w/the Qu'ran/Koran...

[Deicide]

I wish I could just squeeeezzzze all the fat out of yer head.

Well all joking aside when I read the Koran I have not the slightest impression or inkling of divine origin. Indeed it seems thoroughly written by mortal men, at least in content since I do not know Arabic.

[haider]

Well all joking aside when I read the Koran I have not the slightest impression or inkling of divine origin. Indeed it seems thoroughly written by mortal men, at least in content since I do not know Arabic.

ahan..

[Deicide]

ahan..

Haider, you are beginning to seem like many a liberal theist I know, using common tactics such as: do not engage in real debate, use mysterious oneliners, regard concrete questions as silly, stupid or irrelevant and a general bobbing and weaving.

As I said earlier, either the Koran is a magic book or as it claims itself the Final and True Word of the Creator of the Universe or it is (the more likely possibility) a book cobbled together in the early Middle Ages from various sources, Jewish, Syriac, Persian and local, thereafter having been used to legitimate a religion with a foundational text. This would be nothing new. The ancient Jews did this with the Old Testament. Based on what you have written you believe the Koran to be divinely inspired. Can you provide evidence for this belief such as why and examples supporting the divine origin?

[haider]

You're too quick to judge, Mister. This is a difficult territory, where the "theist" -like I- and the "atheist"- like Fatassdude82- meet. They both have different approaches and basically speak a different tongue, some times each one as dogmatic as the other. I'm having difficulty here with the communication- the frequencies don't quite match and I'm not expert enough to be able to deal with this, nor do I really care to defend myself in a manner that is suited to you.

Basically I'm just in a piss poor position to deal with the issue at hand, which isn't as simple as proving to you how magical the Qur'an is. We're dealing with different mindsets here, and radically different approaches to the subject matter.

[Deicide]

You're too quick to judge, Mister. This is a difficult territory, where the "theist" -like I- and the "atheist"- like Fatassdude82- meet. They both have different approaches and basically speak a different tongue, some times each one as dogmatic as the other. I'm having difficulty here with the communication- the frequencies don't quite match and I'm not expert enough to be able to deal with this, nor do I really care to defend myself in a manner that is suited to you.

Basically I'm just in a piss poor position to deal with the issue at hand, which isn't as simple as proving to you how magical the Qur'an is. We're dealing with different mindsets here, and radically different approaches to the subject matter.

You want to keep your beliefs private and to yourself? That's great. That's the way it's supposed to be.

[haider]

You want to keep your beliefs private and to yourself? That's great. That's the way it's supposed to be.

Whatever you wish to make of that 

[Deicide]

Whatever you wish to make of that 

I could make much of it but the phrase 'you just don't get it' on your part comes to mind...and it is a real shame...

[haider]

I could make much of it but the phrase 'you just don't get it' on your part comes to mind...and it is a real shame...

Very impressive, honestly didn't think you would catch that

[haider]

A bit too blunt though, I have to add 

[Deicide]

Very impressive, honestly didn't think you would catch that

What's there to not catch? This is typical liberal religious rhetoric. 'I know something special that you don't understand.' It's silly and immature to say the least.

[haider]

What's there to not catch? This is typical liberal religious rhetoric. 'I know something special that you don't understand.' It's silly and immature to say the least.

what am I supposed to tell u, that your approach is the right way? Too arrogant to think that you have the understanding of something you have no experience of.

[Deicide]

what am I supposed to tell u, that your approach is the right way? Too arrogant to think that you have the understanding of something you have no experience of.

No, you ought to describe your experience and provide what you consider evidence for this experience. If you believe the Koran is of divine origin then provide evidence for this.

In all seriousness you are beginning to come across as the arrogant believer who has the experience that no one else can comprehend...

[haider]

You are completely wrong, perhaps you're offended by my comments. Does sound like you really don't like theists though; your perceptions of them and biases also seem to affect the way you judge me, and view me as a person I'm sorry but it is clear how preconceptions/biases (that stem from your background) add to the difficulty here... the best that comes of this is that you can kinda see my point of view, and the worst that we just walk away like we never knew talked about this.. I've already told you about my unwillingness and incapability as it pertains to handling the subject well.

[chaos]

You are completely wrong, perhaps you're offended by my comments. Does sound like you really don't like theists though; your perceptions of them and biases also seem to affect the way you judge me, and view me as a person I'm sorry but it is clear how preconceptions/biases (that stem from your background) add to the difficulty here... the best that comes of this is that you can kinda see my point of view, and the worst that we just walk away like we never knew talked about this.. I've already told you about my unwillingness and incapability as it pertains to handling the subject well.

Do you get along with anyone?

[haider]

Do you get along with anyone?

doesn't help being brown and muslim a the same time, aprreciatte the concern though 

[Deicide]

You are completely wrong, perhaps you're offended by my comments. Does sound like you really don't like theists though; your perceptions of them and biases also seem to affect the way you judge me, and view me as a person I'm sorry but it is clear how preconceptions/biases (that stem from your background) add to the difficulty here... the best that comes of this is that you can kinda see my point of view, and the worst that we just walk away like we never knew talked about this.. I've already told you about my unwillingness and incapability as it pertains to handling the subject well.

That's fine. I am going to go eat some bacon. 

[Nordic Superman]

hey you said she ws 9..prove it

or prove to me that he actually fucked her ater he married her at 9...

cause a LOT of muslim men at the time married young slaves to free em...

either way...mate..you're argueging with a guy that believes that islam..christianity and the jewish faith are all bullshit...

the egyptian pyramids point EXACTLY to true N S E and W...a task that to this day costs millions if done as precisely as the pyramids..

get it?

HOW???  and WHY BOTHER???

or why does and apple kept inside the great pyramid degrade much much slower than one outside..

or why cant one even slide a blade in between the great stones of the pyramids?  cause aren;'t they hand made??

The amount of nonsense that comes out of your mouth is ridiculous.

I gave my evidence, see my previous posts in this thread.

There's a huge error in your responce here: "or prove to me that he actually fucked her ater he married her at 9"

He didn't fuck her after they got married. They wed when she was 6. The marriage was consumated when she was 9. So he abstained sex with her until she was 9. See my sources.

I asked simply for your sources regarding her age being 16. Still yet to see these materialise.

After that statement your post goes into drivel, I really don't know what to make of it.

Lay off the coke.

[Hedgehog]

my mum has never worn a viel and considers herself a good muslim...hey those snakehandlers and polygmists also consider themselves christians right?

from what i know all the koran says is " to cover up in a manner so as not to entice sexual thought from the opposite sex" and that goes for men AND women.....nowhere does it say ya gotta cover up as the taliban woman do..



ayesha ws what 16?  ok so..if you consider him a pedo you r just being ethnocentric in time...

it ws prolly general custom in that time for girls to marry that young..soo EVERYONE in that time according 2 u ws a pedo..


you listen to nord too much...who time n again has proven himself to be a fuck tard..look at it this way....i never post in 99.9% of his threads..he shows up in every one of mine..

You can consider Nordic a fcuktard how much you want.

It doesn't change the facts that are in the Qu'ran.

And your mother considers herself a good muslim? Doesn't matter what she believes TBH. The only thing that matters is the Qu'ran. Why? Because it is uninterpretable. It is the direct words of Allah.

And in any other case, this would probably been good enough for your scientifically scholared  mind to discard Islam and anyone who believed in that hogwash. But  for some reason,  you won't let go.

Look past what Nordic is. And instead look at the fact he states. What of it is not true?

[Hedgehog]

It has depths of meaning, certainly there's the literal one but you are hugely mistaken in saying that there's only as much as u see on the surface. I advise you to stay shut on this topic, thanks 

My wording was incorrect, sorry about that.

What I meant was that the Qu'ran is infallible.

What is written in the Qu'ran is the truth, and Islam can never change.

Comparison:

In Christianity, homosexuality has for years been considered a big  sin. Not so  anymore, at least  parts  of the Christian Community is accepting homosexuality.

They do so because "Jesus loves everyone", and tolerance and acceptance are key words to these Christians.

And these Christians interprets this to be more important, and even making the Leviticus 18:22 anti-gay phrase "you shall not lie with a man, as one lays with a woman" obsolete (there are plenty of others in the old testament).

This would not have been possible, if the Bible were the direct words of God. Then, Christians would've been bound to  be anti-Gay, whether they liked it or not.

In other words: If you think the Qu'ran is wrong in one single issue:, you cannot , you should not , be a Muslim.

You can't "just" believe in Allah, but not in the Qu'ran either, (comparison: lots of Christians claims they believe in God and Jesus but don't believe the Bible).

[Nordic Superman]

Look past what Nordic is.

Erm, expand on this...

In other words: If you think the Qu'ran is wrong in one single issue:, you cannot , you should not , be a Muslim.

There are actually verse in the koran covering this exact topic.

[ToxicAvenger]

You can consider Nordic a fcuktard how much you want.

It doesn't change the facts that are in the Qu'ran.

And your mother considers herself a good muslim? Doesn't matter what she believes TBH. The only thing that matters is the Qu'ran. Why? Because it is uninterpretable. It is the direct words of Allah.

And in any other case, this would probably been good enough for your scientifically scholared  mind to discard Islam and anyone who believed in that hogwash. But  for some reason,  you won't let go.

Look past what Nordic is. And instead look at the fact he states. What of it is not true?

have u read the koran?

yeesh now ya sound as bad as nord...


the koran is a religion of eeeeeevaaaal...

yeah lemme play your game and totally believe all swedes are pussies eh!  no army!


see that works both ways...look mate on days i actually dont drink...you aint gonna win..

just be thankfull i'm a drunk and for the most part i post drunk and dont make sence...

[Nordic Superman]

You are a loser.

[Hedgehog]

have u read the koran?

Yes I have.

Question is, what have you read of the Qu'ran?

yeesh now ya sound as bad as nord...

the koran is a religion of eeeeeevaaaal...

I would be very interested and happy to see you intellectually counter any of my arguments.

yeah lemme play your game and totally believe all swedes are pussies eh!  no army!


see that works both ways...look mate on days i actually dont drink...you aint gonna win..

just be thankfull i'm a drunk and for the most part i post drunk and dont make sence...

Hopefully, you can kick your habit.

[Nordic Superman]

Toxic has NEVER read the koran.

His basic knowledge in matters such as Aisha are evidence of this.

I still await your evidence she was 16. Why is it so hard to find this evidence? Why is it so easy for my to find evidence solidifying my statements (direct from well respected islamic literature, INCLUDING THE KORAN).

[Parker]

Yes I have.

Question is, what have you read of the Qu'ran?
I would be very interested and happy to see you intellectually counter any of my arguments.

Hopefully, you can kick your habit.

He went to University of Maryland, they all drink 

I do want to see him sober up, though.