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Author Topic: To Christians: Since he doesn`t worship Jesus Romney is going to hell correct?  (Read 7267 times)
bigbobs
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« Reply #200 on: October 25, 2012, 03:33:07 PM »


Matthew 28:16-19
16 Then the eleven disciples went to Galilee, to the mountain where Jesus had told them to go. 17 When they saw him, they worshiped him; but some doubted. 18 Then Jesus came to them and said, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. 19 Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.”

I believe its "they worshipped him" phrase you're referring to here.  Peter was also "worshipped" in Acts 10:25 (http://bible.cc/acts/10-25.htm).  The word here is proskuneo, which also could mean bowing to.  Abigal also fell on her face before David and bowed in 1 Samuel 25:23 .

The true word of worship is latreuo, which appears 22 times in the New Testament but not once referring to Jesus.



Matthew 3:16-17
16 As soon as Jesus was baptized, he went up out of the water. At that moment heaven was opened, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove and alighting on him. 17 And a voice from heaven said, “This is my Son, whom I love; with him I am well pleased.”  


We've discussed a lot already over evidences that the "son" title in the Bible is metaphorical only.
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« Reply #201 on: October 25, 2012, 03:41:53 PM »

I believe its "they worshipped him" phrase you're referring to here.  Peter was also "worshipped" in Acts 10:25 (http://bible.cc/acts/10-25.htm).  The word here is proskuneo, which also could mean bowing to.  Abigal also fell on her face before David and bowed in 1 Samuel 25:23 .

The true word of worship is latreuo, which appears 22 times in the New Testament but not once referring to Jesus.


We've discussed a lot already over evidences that the "son" title in the Bible is metaphorical only.
I hate to burst your bubble but that was a one sided conversation on your behalf  Wink Smiley
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« Reply #202 on: October 26, 2012, 09:19:53 AM »

I believe its "they worshipped him" phrase you're referring to here.  Peter was also "worshipped" in Acts 10:25 (http://bible.cc/acts/10-25.htm).  The word here is proskuneo, which also could mean bowing to.  Abigal also fell on her face before David and bowed in 1 Samuel 25:23 .

The true word of worship is latreuo, which appears 22 times in the New Testament but not once referring to Jesus.


We've discussed a lot already over evidences that the "son" title in the Bible is metaphorical only.

I was referring to the father, son, spirit references.  One directly from Christ and the other Matthew's inspired description of the Christ's baptism....Son of God being baptized, Father God's voice from heaven affirming him and the Holy Spirit "descending like a dove and alighting on him".  

That's it.
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« Reply #203 on: October 26, 2012, 09:24:57 AM »

Here's a bit more scripture concerning the Trinity...straight from Christ:

John 14

Jesus the Way to the Father
5 Thomas said to him, “Lord, we don’t know where you are going, so how can we know the way?”

6 Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. 7 If you really know me, you will know my Father as well. From now on, you do know him and have seen him.”

8 Philip said, “Lord, show us the Father and that will be enough for us.”

9 Jesus answered: “Don’t you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? 10 Don’t you believe that I am in the Father, and that the Father is in me? The words I say to you I do not speak on my own authority. Rather, it is the Father, living in me, who is doing his work. 11 Believe me when I say that I am in the Father and the Father is in me; or at least believe on the evidence of the works themselves. 12 Very truly I tell you, whoever believes in me will do the works I have been doing, and they will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father. 13 And I will do whatever you ask in my name, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son. 14 You may ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it.

Jesus Promises the Holy Spirit
15 “If you love me, keep my commands. 16 And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another advocate to help you and be with you forever— 17 the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be in you. 18 I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you. 19 Before long, the world will not see me anymore, but you will see me. Because I live, you also will live. 20 On that day you will realize that I am in my Father, and you are in me, and I am in you. 21 Whoever has my commands and keeps them is the one who loves me. The one who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I too will love them and show myself to them.”

22 Then Judas (not Judas Iscariot) said, “But, Lord, why do you intend to show yourself to us and not to the world?”

23 Jesus replied, “Anyone who loves me will obey my teaching. My Father will love them, and we will come to them and make our home with them. 24 Anyone who does not love me will not obey my teaching. These words you hear are not my own; they belong to the Father who sent me.

25 “All this I have spoken while still with you. 26 But the Advocate, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you. 27 Peace I leave with you; my peace I give you. I do not give to you as the world gives. Do not let your hearts be troubled and do not be afraid.

28 “You heard me say, ‘I am going away and I am coming back to you.’ If you loved me, you would be glad that I am going to the Father, for the Father is greater than I. 29 I have told you now before it happens, so that when it does happen you will believe. 30 I will not say much more to you, for the prince of this world is coming. He has no hold over me, 31 but he comes so that the world may learn that I love the Father and do exactly what my Father has commanded me.


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« Reply #204 on: October 26, 2012, 05:38:57 PM »

I was referring to the father, son, spirit references.  One directly from Christ and the other Matthew's inspired description of the Christ's baptism....Son of God being baptized, Father God's voice from heaven affirming him and the Holy Spirit "descending like a dove and alighting on him". 

That's it.

Okay, yes the verse does refer to father, son and holy spirit, but it's interpretation that determines whether one concludes all three are partners in divinity, or whether only the "father" term refers to God, with son being a human (since it's been shown countless times that many humans can bear this title based on righteousness), and holy spirit an angel or something else.

I've bolded some texts here that show support for a God/Prophet relationship than a God/God relationship, and one phrase which tells me the "holy spirit" is separate as well, just to show again that scripture does not make a strong case for the trinity:

Here's a bit more scripture concerning the Trinity...straight from Christ:

John 14

Jesus the Way to the Father
5 Thomas said to him, “Lord, we don’t know where you are going, so how can we know the way?”

6 Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. 7 If you really know me, you will know my Father as well. From now on, you do know him and have seen him.”

8 Philip said, “Lord, show us the Father and that will be enough for us.”

9 Jesus answered: “Don’t you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? 10 Don’t you believe that I am in the Father, and that the Father is in me? The words I say to you I do not speak on my own authority. Rather, it is the Father, living in me, who is doing his work. 11 Believe me when I say that I am in the Father and the Father is in me; or at least believe on the evidence of the works themselves. 12 Very truly I tell you, whoever believes in me will do the works I have been doing, and they will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father. 13 And I will do whatever you ask in my name, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son. 14 You may ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it.

Jesus Promises the Holy Spirit
15 “If you love me, keep my commands. 16 And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another advocate to help you and be with you forever— 17 the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be in you. 18 I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you. 19 Before long, the world will not see me anymore, but you will see me. Because I live, you also will live. 20 On that day you will realize that I am in my Father, and you are in me, and I am in you. (I bolded this because it shows that saying one is "in" the other does not mean literally, otherwise we would all be Jesus and God) 21 Whoever has my commands and keeps them is the one who loves me. The one who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I too will love them and show myself to them.”

22 Then Judas (not Judas Iscariot) said, “But, Lord, why do you intend to show yourself to us and not to the world?”

23 Jesus replied, “Anyone who loves me will obey my teaching. My Father will love them, and we will come to them and make our home with them. 24 Anyone who does not love me will not obey my teaching. These words you hear are not my own; they belong to the Father who sent me.
25 “All this I have spoken while still with you. 26 But the Advocate, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you. 27 Peace I leave with you; my peace I give you. I do not give to you as the world gives. Do not let your hearts be troubled and do not be afraid.

28 “You heard me say, ‘I am going away and I am coming back to you.’ If you loved me, you would be glad that I am going to the Father, for the Father is greater than I. 29 I have told you now before it happens, so that when it does happen you will believe. 30 I will not say much more to you, for the prince of this world is coming. He has no hold over me, 31 but he comes so that the world may learn that I love the Father and do exactly what my Father has commanded me.



This phenomen is summarized by the quote of William Blake in "The Everlasting Gospel":

Both read the Bible day and night,
But thou read'st black where I read white.
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« Reply #205 on: October 27, 2012, 05:30:50 AM »

Really?  Is that your argument?  

I am sure I have a picture of Jesus in my house somewhere in a magazine or what have you and I consider him completely worthless and useless.

Just like your own monotheistic cult?
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« Reply #206 on: October 30, 2012, 02:46:45 PM »


You know not all christians can agree on:

Jesus is a man?

Jesus is son of God?

Jesus is God?

Jesus is a man and son of God?

Jesus is a man and son of God and God?

Jesus is son of God AND God?

How do I know? Because I was a Christian and priests and pastors themselves would always giving contradicting and conflicting non-sense explanations. You are just demonstrating this.

Hence I spent my time reading the scriptures, studying history to come to the conclusion God is not a man, and even some rationalizing, philosophizing.


I had a recent experience that totally reminded me of this post of yours and got me thinking, "That post was sooo true."

I texted one of my Christian friends (who I hadn't previously talked about religion much to) saying that I've started reading the bible, and sent her the questions about why Jesus calls himself a prophet, why he prays, etc. if he's God.  She replied and said,

"I dont believe Jesus is God." 

First I'm surprised because I assumed most Christians believe Jesus is God, so I reply and ask

"Don't you believe that Jesus is God in the Trinity?"

She replies with, "No, Jesus and the Holy Spirit are both divine but they are not God."

So I ask, "I thought a divine human is an oxymoron?  What do you mean by this?"

She goes, "Divine means god like."

I reply, "So would that make Moses, David, Solomon, etc. divine as well?"

Her reply, "I'm not sure, I'm more of a New Testament person."

My last reply, "Okay, I was just trying to understand how you differentiate Jesus from other prophets or holy men with the characteristic of him being divine.  Also Jesus did teach the Old Testament law."

Silence since then, she may even be offended but more likely just she is just confused herself and doesn't know how to respond.
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« Reply #207 on: October 30, 2012, 02:55:22 PM »

Well that's what I was trying to say, having been a christian, getting a straight answer out of any chrisitan onto what their doctrine, dogma, fundementals of belief are is very confusing. Even priests, pastors, preachers, etc... everyone gives their own version and accord.

It's not based on evidence, but mere conjecture and blind faith... whatever they conjure up themselves from what they heard... yet most christians will not know what's in the bible.

My mother and I did not know that pork is forbidden in the bible and that alcohol is over what was it now.. like 70 times cursed and discouraged. Amongst other things. Until you actually start reading the bible for yourself.

If you read the bible without any church meddling or trinitarian preaching, you would conclude that Jesus was just a man sent by God doing God's will. And you would realize that the majority of the new testament is literlaly ramblings of one man's own writings about himself and what he tried to enforce, how he argued with people etc... (Paul and his letters)

When in surah al-fatiha Allah (swt) says:

"In the name of God, the Entirely Merciful, the Especially Merciful.

All praise and thanks is for to God, [The] Creator, Owner, Sustainer of the Worlds.

The Entirely Merciful, The Especially Merciful.

Owner of the Day of Recompense.

You alone do we worship and You alone we seek for help.

Guide us to the Straight Path.

The path of those whom Your blessings are upon, Not of those who You have cursed nor of those who have gone astray."

The part of those who are cursed refers to the Jews who have been given everything from God but had no faith and were haughty. The later part refers to Christians who have faith but have gone astray -- misguided.

It really made a lot of sense... if you look back at how Jews treated the prophets including Jesus and that they had God's law but they always tried to be tricky... and then the Christians who do not know who or what to follow and hence are misguided.. everyone just follows what they want.

It's common... even when I was back in school since there is no 'law' to be followed, everyone makes up their own rules and beliefs. The bible is just there for 'reference' and 'inspiration' but when it comes to the old testament it's like it's there for no other purpose as nothing is really folloowed from it except selectively.
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« Reply #208 on: October 31, 2012, 10:26:02 AM »

I had a recent experience that totally reminded me of this post of yours and got me thinking, "That post was sooo true."

I texted one of my Christian friends (who I hadn't previously talked about religion much to) saying that I've started reading the bible, and sent her the questions about why Jesus calls himself a prophet, why he prays, etc. if he's God.  She replied and said,

"I dont believe Jesus is God." 

First I'm surprised because I assumed most Christians believe Jesus is God, so I reply and ask

"Don't you believe that Jesus is God in the Trinity?"

She replies with, "No, Jesus and the Holy Spirit are both divine but they are not God."

So I ask, "I thought a divine human is an oxymoron?  What do you mean by this?"

She goes, "Divine means god like."

I reply, "So would that make Moses, David, Solomon, etc. divine as well?"

Her reply, "I'm not sure, I'm more of a New Testament person."

My last reply, "Okay, I was just trying to understand how you differentiate Jesus from other prophets or holy men with the characteristic of him being divine.  Also Jesus did teach the Old Testament law."

Silence since then, she may even be offended but more likely just she is just confused herself and doesn't know how to respond.

We've gone over this before....

And here'd the answer: because according to the Christian view, the Bible is written by men whose written words are inspired by God and the Holy Spirit.
The Bible declares Jesus as the Son of God and therefore just as in all other religions where people follow the words of the holy men who have written the texts and rely on faith, so too is it the same in Christianity.

There are many different religions existing on this planet, many different holy texts and many different interpretations. They all have their own claims and counter-claims on why they are right.

And if there's one things I've learned from studying history is that metaphysical debates are a complete waste of time as no-one's views are ever changed.

A person's religion is mostly determined on which part of the world they were born, their ethnicity, culture, background etc.

If you were an Asian from South-East Asia, you'd probably be Buddhist.....if you were a Black African from the Caribbean, you'd probably be Christian with a small hint of local 'voodoo' culture thrown in, if you were an Indian you'd probably be Hindu etc.
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« Reply #209 on: October 31, 2012, 12:42:20 PM »



A person's religion is mostly determined on which part of the world they were born, their ethnicity, culture, background etc.

If you were an Asian from South-East Asia, you'd probably be Buddhist.....if you were a Black African from the Caribbean, you'd probably be Christian with a small hint of local 'voodoo' culture thrown in, if you were an Indian you'd probably be Hindu etc.


So...... it isn't a matter of the holy spirit and Jesus coming into your heart and saving you? It has more to do with where and whom you were born to? Well that is a let down...
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« Reply #210 on: October 31, 2012, 01:46:00 PM »

We've gone over this before....

And here'd the answer: because according to the Christian view, the Bible is written by men whose written words are inspired by God and the Holy Spirit.
The Bible declares Jesus as the Son of God and therefore just as in all other religions where people follow the words of the holy men who have written the texts and rely on faith, so too is it the same in Christianity.

There are many different religions existing on this planet, many different holy texts and many different interpretations. They all have their own claims and counter-claims on why they are right.

And if there's one things I've learned from studying history is that metaphysical debates are a complete waste of time as no-one's views are ever changed.

A person's religion is mostly determined on which part of the world they were born, their ethnicity, culture, background etc.

If you were an Asian from South-East Asia, you'd probably be Buddhist.....if you were a Black African from the Caribbean, you'd probably be Christian with a small hint of local 'voodoo' culture thrown in, if you were an Indian you'd probably be Hindu etc.


It's also been discussed many times that while you're correct in saying that all religions have different interpretations, the matters of difference within Islam are not on the fundamental beliefs (ex. it's clear that God is God, Muhammad is a human, Jesus is a human, and there's no "two in one" or "three in one" only differences of opinion are over certain rulings, what is permissible or not, etc.)  The reason Christianity has this Trinity concept which everyone interprets differently while still claiming to be under the "Christian" banner is because the Bible contradicts itself by implying (although not directly stating) that Jesus is God and at the same time stating in numerous places that he prayed to God, was a prophet, etc.  Instead of admitting that there are contradictions in this man-written book, Christians try to pick and choose which verses they believe in or come up with interpetations that try to satisfy the contradiction of Jesus being both prophet and God (such as the Trinity) that don't make any sense at all.  And when questioned about these contradictions, instead of realizing their scripture has been corrupted they resort to "you just have to have faith and then it will make sense to you" line. Therefore the difference in interpretation of the Bible is not in any way similar to the differences of interpretation of the Quran.

Also true that generally people keep the religious identity they are born with, because most people don't care enough to question what they have been taught to either find inconsistencies or something that makes sense.  So a Christian who honestly critiques his religion will likely leave it (as many have), some Muslims may leave Islam as well but in much much smaller quantity.  Practically ever Muslim personally knows several Christian converts to Islam, yet when you ask a Christian if they know a Muslim who converted to Christianity its almost unheard of.  Islam has the most converts of any other religion in the world (confirmed by Guiness Book of World Records) and is fastest growing.
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« Reply #211 on: October 31, 2012, 05:04:23 PM »

Bro how many times do we have to explain it to you bro^^^^^^
God in the human form can pray to God outside of the realm of physiques cause he does not require Time space and matter, that is not a problem for us to believe that Jesus prayed to God and that they are one in the same, sure it is a little hocus pocus, but so is the beginning of time, so is the creation of mankind, so is your entire Koran, so is the Bible (talking snake, talking donkey, parting of the seas, stick turning into a serpent, walking on water etc.  so stop being a hypocrite and acting like the hocus pocus in your book is more credible then the hocus pocus in my book, at least Christians can admit it.
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« Reply #212 on: October 31, 2012, 05:08:02 PM »

=
God in the human form can pray to God outside of the realm of physiques cause he does not require Time space and matter,

Where is this "God in human form". Time and space matter mentioned in the bible? Outside of the realm of physiques (lol physics?) God in the human form can pray to God outside of the realm of video games? what?!?!

Your own concoctions!! out of thin air!

Much like tbombz, 'love your enemy let them kill you'. Complete concoction in beliefs.

Quote
that is not a problem for us to believe that Jesus prayed to God and that they are one in the same, sure it is a little hocus pocus,

Yes its ALOT of hocus pocus, your conjecture.

Quote
but so is the beginning of time, so is the creation of mankind, so is your entire Koran, so is the Bible (talking snake, talking donkey, parting of the seas, stick turning into a serpent, walking on water etc.  so stop being a hypocrite and acting like the hocus pocus in your book is more credible then the hocus pocus in my book, at least Christians can admit it.

What? What does any of what you just said even mean?

You are calling it all 'hocus pocus'? WHAT? What faith do you have?



The difference between what we believe and what you are conjuring up and mixing up as your beliefs is that we know who God is, and we know who Jesus is. THere is no hocus pocus.
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« Reply #213 on: October 31, 2012, 05:18:15 PM »

What faith do I have.? so you can logically explain the beginning of time in scientific terms, logically, and withen the confounds of physiques? No you can't so don't act stupid there is no logical explanation of Moses splitting waters, it had to involve a power we can not understand outside of the laws of physiques, wow bonehead  Grin
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« Reply #214 on: October 31, 2012, 05:42:47 PM »

What faith do I have.? so you can logically explain the beginning of time in scientific terms, logically, and withen the confounds of physiques? No you can't so don't act stupid there is no logical explanation of Moses splitting waters, it had to involve a power we can not understand outside of the laws of physiques, wow bonehead  Grin

Wow so you yourself mock the bible?

We don't see the stories told to us by the prophets and messengers as 'hocus pocus'.

Apparently as many christians believe the miracles Jesus did make him "God",, now you are calling that hocus pocus too. Even though the scriptures say he did what he did through the power granted to him by God (as the qur'an says too).

Certain things you call 'hocus pocus' or 'magic' if you will, may be not understood by our lack of knowledge, yet we bolster about our 'technological advancements'.

The qur'an speaks about people hearing/seeing what they did, their lives and actions being shown again to them. This was 'outrageous' and madness for arabs to believe. Yet we have invented today cameras/televisions and microphones/speakers. How outrageous is it now?
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« Reply #215 on: October 31, 2012, 07:40:39 PM »

 Now you are arguing over a stupid term, `hocus pocus`is just a term used to describe something that defies the laws of physics, you can not compare that to TV`s and other technologies bro.


Certain things you call 'hocus pocus' or 'magic' if you will, may be not understood by our lack of knowledge

The above quote from you I agree with 100%. Now Jesus praying to God and being one falls into the above statement you made, but your interpretation of
it is that it has to follow the laws of physics or it does not make sense right?
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« Reply #216 on: November 01, 2012, 12:43:32 AM »

It's also been discussed many times that while you're correct in saying that all religions have different interpretations, the matters of difference within Islam are not on the fundamental beliefs (ex. it's clear that God is God, Muhammad is a human, Jesus is a human, and there's no "two in one" or "three in one" only differences of opinion are over certain rulings, what is permissible or not, etc.)  The reason Christianity has this Trinity concept which everyone interprets differently while still claiming to be under the "Christian" banner is because the Bible contradicts itself by implying (although not directly stating) that Jesus is God and at the same time stating in numerous places that he prayed to God, was a prophet, etc.  Instead of admitting that there are contradictions in this man-written book, Christians try to pick and choose which verses they believe in or come up with interpetations that try to satisfy the contradiction of Jesus being both prophet and God (such as the Trinity) that don't make any sense at all.  And when questioned about these contradictions, instead of realizing their scripture has been corrupted they resort to "you just have to have faith and then it will make sense to you" line. Therefore the difference in interpretation of the Bible is not in any way similar to the differences of interpretation of the Quran.

Also true that generally people keep the religious identity they are born with, because most people don't care enough to question what they have been taught to either find inconsistencies or something that makes sense.  So a Christian who honestly critiques his religion will likely leave it (as many have), some Muslims may leave Islam as well but in much much smaller quantity.  Practically ever Muslim personally knows several Christian converts to Islam, yet when you ask a Christian if they know a Muslim who converted to Christianity its almost unheard of.  Islam has the most converts of any other religion in the world (confirmed by Guiness Book of World Records) and is fastest growing.

I thought you were an intelligent person but you sound like just another typical Moslem who tries to convince himself that his cult is the 'right' one by trying to disprove Christianity and all other groups instead of looking at the gaping holes and inconsistencies of his own sect.

You're Moslem because you're from a Middle-Eastern/Arabic background so of course you will say the 'truth' is there for all other to accept. But if you were born a Thai person in Thailand and part of that culture and mentality....you would be Buddhist.

If you were born as an Indian and part of that culture and sharing in that heritage.....you would be Hindu.

The reason Westerners question more etc is because they are generally from more advanced societies which are also more 'liberal' in that they promote more critical thinking.
In contrast most Moslems are less educated and poorer and living in a more primitive society. One day when they develop further, they will probably think more critically like Westerners.

With regards to the 'fastest' growing cult aspect, it's because like most non-developed and backwards societies their populations breed like rabbits even though they're poor and won't be able to properly support their children. Which in turn leads to more poverty, less education and continues the cycle of being part of a backwards society.

Just look at the countries of these 'Moslem converts', they're mostly very poor.

Anyway about the inconsistencies of Islam:
Your cult offers SEX as reward in the afterlife with an ORGY of 50 'virgins' in a surrounding which looks suspiciously like the setting of an Oasis in Arabia.
What kind of demented mind offers such vices as 'rewards' in the afterlife yet frowns on even showing a small piece of flesh on Earth and shuns anything sexual?

Not to mention the fact that your people pray to a METEORITE which was used for Pagan worship by Arab tribes and was included in the religion in order to unite the various religious sensibilities of these pagan tribes and as serve as a culturally unifying factor.

Also, the fact of covering the body makes sense in a DESERT and Middle East and Christians would have dressed similarly at about the same time in scorching heat of the sun.
Lack of fresh water also means women would anyway have covered their hair in all cultures.
To dress the same way in moderate climates is ridiculous.

The Koran merely took local Arabian traditions and fused it with elements of Judaism and Christianity.....and then called it Islam.
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bigbobs
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Islam, Nasser and Corvettes.


« Reply #217 on: November 01, 2012, 01:54:45 AM »

I thought you were an intelligent person but you sound like just another typical Moslem who tries to convince himself that his cult is the 'right' one by trying to disprove Christianity and all other groups instead of looking at the gaping holes and inconsistencies of his own sect.

You're Moslem because you're from a Middle-Eastern/Arabic background so of course you will say the 'truth' is there for all other to accept. But if you were born a Thai person in Thailand and part of that culture and mentality....you would be Buddhist.

If you were born as an Indian and part of that culture and sharing in that heritage.....you would be Hindu.

Wrong, for most of my adult life I did not follow any religion and did not have much knowledge of any religion either.  Just look at my post history and you will find since the time I registered on getbig until a few months ago I hardly ever posted on religious topics.  This past summer I felt I should start seeking the truth and learn various religions, and from stepping back and doing self study I came to realize Islam made most sense to me.  This would have been the case regardless of which religion my parents followed. 


With regards to the 'fastest' growing cult aspect, it's because like most non-developed and backwards societies their populations breed like rabbits even though they're poor and won't be able to properly support their children. Which in turn leads to more poverty, less education and continues the cycle of being part of a backwards society.

Just look at the countries of these 'Moslem converts', they're mostly very poor.

Wrong again, note I pointed out that Islam has the most # of converts as confirmed by the Guiness Book of World Records, not the most # of reproductions. 


Anyway about the inconsistencies of Islam:
Your cult offers SEX as reward in the afterlife with an ORGY of 50 'virgins' in a surrounding which looks suspiciously like the setting of an Oasis in Arabia.
What kind of demented mind offers such vices as 'rewards' in the afterlife yet frowns on even showing a small piece of flesh on Earth and shuns anything sexual?

Sex gives rise to a pleasure which God programmed in us, there's nothing evil or morally wrong about enjoying it in the afterlife.  How is that an "inconsistency?"  Just shows how weak your logic and reasoning is to discuss sex in the afterlife as an "inconsistency."

Once I started reading the rest of your post regarding meteorite I stopped reading and typing as I realized you're on a low level of intellect and not worth my time anymore.
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Griffith
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....


« Reply #218 on: November 01, 2012, 05:01:59 AM »

Wrong, for most of my adult life I did not follow any religion and did not have much knowledge of any religion either.  Just look at my post history and you will find since the time I registered on getbig until a few months ago I hardly ever posted on religious topics.  This past summer I felt I should start seeking the truth and learn various religions, and from stepping back and doing self study I came to realize Islam made most sense to me.  This would have been the case regardless of which religion my parents followed. 

Wrong again, note I pointed out that Islam has the most # of converts as confirmed by the Guiness Book of World Records, not the most # of reproductions. 

Sex gives rise to a pleasure which God programmed in us, there's nothing evil or morally wrong about enjoying it in the afterlife.  How is that an "inconsistency?"  Just shows how weak your logic and reasoning is to discuss sex in the afterlife as an "inconsistency."

Once I started reading the rest of your post regarding meteorite I stopped reading and typing as I realized you're on a low level of intellect and not worth my time anymore.

You look of Middle Eastern/Arabic descent to me, so I was not wrong in my conclusions. Culturally you feel more comfortable with a religion coming from a people who are more similar to you or have more in common with you as you might be able to relate to them better.

The reason you didn't want to read further is that you know it's true.......the people before Mohammed were PAGAN and worshiped that rock, which is pitch black and well, a meteorite.

ALL the pagan tribes worshiped that stone, this is a historical fact and can be confirmed by historians. And everything else I said about the clothing is also accurate and experts could back me up on this too.

I'm not making anything up here, you're merely getting offended by historical facts. You accuse me of a 'low level of intellect' when I'm using the arguments of historians, anthropologists, archaeologists and even basic sociology?

I'm basing my arguments on history, science and experts in their fields........and you?

With regard to your argument of sex in the afterlife, it's not just sex but a completely depraved ORGY and those promised 'virgins' are essentially sex SLAVES created by this 'Allah' who is supposed to be good and merciful.

What about women? They get 50 guys to gang-bang them?
What kind of demented 'afterlife' is this.......?
Every other religion except maybe some PAGAN cults might not view this as twisted.

And about the 'converts', as I said earlier: poor people +poor county + violence + lack of education + little hope + coercion = 'converts'
This merely highlights the fact of poverty and lack of education in much of Northern Africa.
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