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Author Topic: 2013 IFBB Toronto Pro - Full Results  (Read 8454 times)
timfogarty
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« Reply #75 on: June 04, 2013, 07:59:10 PM »

So it seems your proposal might make bodybuilding less fringe by having the market's desired body type engaging in it, but not affect the decline of pro bodybuilding -- which I thought was the point of your idea. Am I missing anything here?

I have no problem with the demise of contests where judges choose mass over all else.  I just want some other type of bodybuilding to replace it.  Physique stand and model is not bodybuilding.  Who has the best looking muscles while relaxed is not the same as who has the best muscles while flexed.  Classic bodybuilding might be a way to get contestants and judges to start paying attention to symmetry and proportionality.  And if we have a spectrum of classes, then there's still room for the mass monsters.  

Why are athletes choosing to go into Physique classes?  One part is they don't want to do the massive amounts of drugs necessary to compete even in amateur bodybuilding, though they're still doing more than most bodybuilders did in the 70s.  Another part is they don't like the physiques of the mass monsters, they don't want to be that massive.  There should be a way for these guys to compete in bodybuilding.

The underlying problem is the judging.  Compare the NPC Nationals and USA to the IFBB European Amateur Championships and World Amateur Championships.  The past few years the IFBB Amateurs (claims to be drug free but no one believes it) have far superior physiques, massive but still symmetrical and proportional, V taper.  All drugs are available everywhere, so if athletes outside the US are avoiding certain ones, such as hgh and insulin, it's because they know the resulting physiques don't win contests over there.  

Physique is not bodybuilding because of the stand and model and the board shorts.  But Physique is already outdrawing bodybuilding because the fans can relate to the contestants.  Clearly there is a demand for such physiques on stage.  But the powers that be are doing it in a way that will kill off bodybuilding. The promotors are going to go where the money is.  Endorsement contracts will go where the fans are.  As long as they are different sports, the rise of Physique will be the demise of bodybuilding.
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« Reply #76 on: June 04, 2013, 08:03:27 PM »

This guy in my opinion looked better, if a judge wanted to give jose the nod then thats fine, but all of them??

And the week before.  Sami had the much more aesthetically pleasing physique: mass, symmetry, and proportionality.  Jose was "drier" but why is that a measurement of a better physique?  Shouldn't being too dry cause a deduction of points?  Protruding stomachs?  Split abs?
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« Reply #77 on: June 04, 2013, 10:11:30 PM »

And the week before.  Sami had the much more aesthetically pleasing physique: mass, symmetry, and proportionality.  Jose was "drier" but why is that a measurement of a better physique?  Shouldn't being too dry cause a deduction of points?  Protruding stomachs?  Split abs?
I do not disagree with you about the NY Pro- Sammi and Aaron, I thought, looked better than Jose.  But Dugdale... I dunno, this is definitely the best he's looked in quite some time,  but I find his physique soooooo boring.  If you don't have anything special going on, unless everyone else sucks, I dont think you should win a show. I actually would've given the Toronto show to Al Auguste,  who didn't even place top three.





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« Reply #78 on: June 04, 2013, 10:32:22 PM »

I do not disagree with you about the NY Pro- Sammi and Aaron, I thought, looked better than Jose.  But Dugdale... I dunno, this is definitely the best he's looked in quite some time,  but I find his physique soooooo boring.  If you don't have anything special going on, unless everyone else sucks, I dont think you should win a show. I actually would've given the Toronto show to Al Auguste,  who didn't even place top three.







what?!

look at him- thats bodybuilding to you!? jesus christ no wonder this 'sport' is in the shitter.

lol wtf.
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« Reply #79 on: June 04, 2013, 11:36:47 PM »

what?!

look at him- thats bodybuilding to you!? jesus christ no wonder this 'sport' is in the shitter.

lol wtf.
As far as the 212 guys went AT THE TORONTO PRO, yeah, I thought Al was the best. Fact is, Toronto was a weak ass show. Do I think Al is the best 212 guy out there? no. But at Toronto, yes I liked him best.
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« Reply #80 on: June 05, 2013, 02:53:24 AM »

As far as the 212 guys went AT THE TORONTO PRO, yeah, I thought Al was the best. Fact is, Toronto was a weak ass show. Do I think Al is the best 212 guy out there? no. But at Toronto, yes I liked him best.
lol, not even close, This guy looks like crap sorry, ''no one' is right. Look at his square delts, there is almost a 90 degree angle on them wtf. bloat in the love handles, massive scar tissue protruding at the top of his glutes,. high calf insertions (genetics), not much he can do there. A massive pec tear, wow, just horrendous.

Dugdale was crisp, polished, looked amazing and although I am not a fan of Jose, in person and up close he looks fucken massive and that is why he won, he simply out muscled everyone. Fair decision on the judges.
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« Reply #81 on: June 05, 2013, 09:19:18 AM »

lol, not even close, This guy looks like crap sorry, ''no one' is right. Look at his square delts, there is almost a 90 degree angle on them wtf. bloat in the love handles, massive scar tissue protruding at the top of his glutes,. high calf insertions (genetics), not much he can do there. A massive pec tear, wow, just horrendous.

Dugdale was crisp, polished, looked amazing and although I am not a fan of Jose, in person and up close he looks fucken massive and that is why he won, he simply out muscled everyone. Fair decision on the judges.
AGUSTE doesn't look horrible per say,looked great as amateur with pro potential 'tag'i guess adding size has not totally worked,his back looks pretty good there .dugdale boring maybe personality but build is dead on,thickest chest you will see and shape on 212 guy there is,zippered quads is his trademark,and delts are great too,always conditioned,fell off for few yrs trying to get bodyweight right to fit in 212,202 was tougher on him he looked light /small.when he won usa as lightheavy he had same look but smaller but as amateur it was enough.i think 212 he could win a few or top 3 for most part.212 o will be tough with david henry 'sick'flex lewis 'great'and jose 'the chosen one lol'and of course weinbergers boy,,,
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« Reply #82 on: June 05, 2013, 10:19:23 AM »

AGUSTE doesn't look horrible per say,looked great as amateur with pro potential 'tag'i guess adding size has not totally worked,his back looks pretty good there .dugdale boring maybe personality but build is dead on,thickest chest you will see and shape on 212 guy there is,zippered quads is his trademark,and delts are great too,always conditioned,fell off for few yrs trying to get bodyweight right to fit in 212,202 was tougher on him he looked light /small.when he won usa as lightheavy he had same look but smaller but as amateur it was enough.i think 212 he could win a few or top 3 for most part.212 o will be tough with david henry 'sick'flex lewis 'great'and jose 'the chosen one lol'and of course weinbergers boy,,,
Bro it was literally night and day between Dugdale and Aguste, I stood 4 feet in front of them while standing together and Dugdale looked like a statue compared to Aguste, no one in their right mind would have placed Auguste in front of Dugdale on that night. Now if anyone was overlooked it was Mboya, he was  very crisp (no homo)
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« Reply #83 on: June 05, 2013, 11:01:25 AM »

Bro it was literally night and day between Dugdale and Aguste, I stood 4 feet in front of them while standing together and Dugdale looked like a statue compared to Aguste, no one in their right mind would have placed Auguste in front of Dugdale on that night. Now if anyone was overlooked it was Mboya, he was  very crisp (no homo)
GREAT BUILD PERIOD...TAD NARROW FOR THE STRUCTURE 'FANS'LOL,,,BUT GREAT LINES,CRISP LOOK ALWAYS.PRO'S PRO,,,
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« Reply #84 on: June 05, 2013, 11:44:33 AM »

Bro it was literally night and day between Dugdale and Aguste, I stood 4 feet in front of them while standing together and Dugdale looked like a statue compared to Aguste, no one in their right mind would have placed Auguste in front of Dugdale on that night. Now if anyone was overlooked it was Mboya, he was  very crisp (no homo)
I have  a girl boner  for Mboya.  I'm biased
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« Reply #85 on: June 05, 2013, 11:53:54 AM »

I have  a girl boner  for Mboya.  I'm biased

Mboya was very overlooked.  Easily top 3 in my opinion.  And I do prefer Dugdale over Raymond.  Raymond has sick conditioning but I hate his structure.  Apples and oranges I guess?
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« Reply #86 on: June 05, 2013, 11:57:33 AM »

I have  a girl boner  for Mboya.  I'm biased
Mboya easily the most under rated of the 212 class, he is aesthetic as they come.
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« Reply #87 on: June 05, 2013, 02:16:29 PM »

Mboya easily the most under rated of the 212 class, he is aesthetic as they come.
no arguments from this crustacean.  wish he would come in shredded so the judges could argue about it,  hash it out,  and give it to Raymond anyway.  wait,  no,  that's not what I meant.
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« Reply #88 on: June 06, 2013, 07:59:56 AM »

Second place Fouad Abiad:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iiyUWTjnOUg" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iiyUWTjnOUg</a>
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« Reply #89 on: June 06, 2013, 01:18:32 PM »

Figure, Women's Physique and Bikini, being different sports, has already cut into women's pro bodybuilding.  Fewer and fewer women's pro bodybuilding contests each year. Pretty soon it will be just Ms International and Ms Olympia.  

I spoke too soon.  Ms International is no more
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« Reply #90 on: June 07, 2013, 07:43:58 AM »

Posedown:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NPqgru8BSWM" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NPqgru8BSWM</a>
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« Reply #91 on: June 07, 2013, 08:49:31 PM »


Physique is not bodybuilding because of the stand and model and the board shorts.  But Physique is already outdrawing bodybuilding because the fans can relate to the contestants.  Clearly there is a demand for such physiques on stage.  But the powers that be are doing it in a way that will kill off bodybuilding. The promotors are going to go where the money is.  Endorsement contracts will go where the fans are.  As long as they are different sports, the rise of Physique will be the demise of bodybuilding.

The last local contest I went to here in L.A., there were well over a 100 physique guys in it. I counted a total of 18 guys in the Open Mens category.  And the Open Mens was the last category in the contest.  It was nearly midnight by the time it started.  Needless to write, nearly all the audience was gone by then.
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« Reply #92 on: June 07, 2013, 08:58:21 PM »

The last local contest I went to here in L.A., there were well over a 100 physique guys in it. I counted a total of 18 guys in the Open Mens category.  And the Open Mens was the last category in the contest.  It was nearly midnight by the time it started.  Needless to write, nearly all the audience was gone by then.
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« Reply #93 on: June 07, 2013, 11:20:59 PM »

Under 212 champion Jose Raymond:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mwxwi15DxaM" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mwxwi15DxaM</a>

Champion Victor Martinez:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lTdEV0ACZNw" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lTdEV0ACZNw</a>
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« Reply #94 on: June 07, 2013, 11:28:17 PM »

Under 212 champion Jose Raymond:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mwxwi15DxaM" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mwxwi15DxaM</a>

Champion Victor Martinez:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lTdEV0ACZNw" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lTdEV0ACZNw</a>

Midgets win sometimes.
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« Reply #95 on: June 08, 2013, 10:56:21 PM »

Mboya was very overlooked.  Easily top 3 in my opinion.  And I do prefer Dugdale over Raymond.  Raymond has sick conditioning but I hate his structure.  Apples and oranges I guess?
Mboya easily the most under rated of the 212 class, he is aesthetic as they come.

HOLY SHIT, I forgot I posted this on facebook almost exactly a year ago. Also forgot I couldn't spell Mboya's name a year ago. Oops.


* mboya....jpg (97.41 KB, 1185x490 - viewed 499 times.)
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« Reply #96 on: June 08, 2013, 11:17:24 PM »

HOLY SHIT, I forgot I posted this on facebook almost exactly a year ago. Also forgot I couldn't spell Mboya's name a year ago. Oops.

LOL.

That fbook post, that's like solid stand up comedy material there. Are you a professional comedian/muscle worshiper?
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« Reply #97 on: June 09, 2013, 01:03:35 AM »

LOL.

That fbook post, that's like solid stand up comedy material there. Are you a professional comedian/muscle worshiper?
I'm a professional teenage girl asshole trapped in an adult asshole's body. I crush on dudes like they're all in Menudo or something, and I hold a special place in my heart for chocolate calves, which are like black unicorns - rare and magical. My dad has them and I don't. I am possibly just trying to fill the genetic gap?
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« Reply #98 on: June 09, 2013, 02:32:05 AM »

Aguste looked weeks out...
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« Reply #99 on: June 18, 2013, 07:19:13 PM »

Interesting comments from Grant, Tim Fogerty, and One More Rep regarding Men’s Physique competitions.

I think that each of you guys have offered valid points but if I had to take a stand, I would tend to agree with Tim and OMR a bit more than agreeing with Grant.

It’s difficult to ‘pinpoint’ whose opinion is the most correct due to the fact that Men’s Physique is so darn new and is still ‘finding its way’ (so to speak).

The big question among the physique competitors is , “When is too much muscle, too much muscle ... to b e ranked higher in a physique event?”

At a recent contest in California one physique contestant resembled a very impressive, but lean competitive bodybuilder who most people felt should have entered the bodybuiling contest instead of the physique event..

He did not get a top ten physique call-out which was not much of a surprise due to the fact that he was apparently too muscular to be placed well as a physique competitor. (But in my opinion he would have been a major threat in the bodybuilding contest.)

CONFUSING??!

Definitely!!!  And I think the reason for that confusion is because there is a very fine line between a great physique competitor  and a great amateur bodybuilder who is lean and ripped.

For many amateur competitors …. It’s a difficult task to make the right decision …. “Should I enter the bodybuilding contest or should I enter the physique event?”

And so far in most contests you have to choose one event or the other because you can not enter both.

AND ..... In my opinion the present physique winners appear to be what the judges were looking for back in the 60 and eatly 70  amateur bodybuilding contests.

ANd it could possibly be that ..... that's exactly what the NPC official decision makers wanted.

And......

I think the term “Classic Bodybuilding” would have been a more descriptive term for Men’s Physique contests.

BUT ….. Whrn it comes to making decisions about what to call a new event and even more decisions on how to judge that new event …… Those decisions are made by a group of individuals after long discussions (and often heated arguments) and there are usually damn good reasons why those decisions are made and regimented.

The decision makers are not as stupid as you may think!

And to end this …. I also believe that this relatively  new event will become more popular with the general public and competitors as well … more so than the bodybuilding events.

And it’s possible that the ‘uniform’ could be changed.

Thanks for listening…..  STUNT
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