Foreigners are dumping Treasuries......

[syntaxmachine]

As for "having value in and of itself" gold is just a metal. It's got no value "in and of itself" other than the value that we ascribe to it. So if that's a criterion for money, then gold fails.

We agree on much, but didn't you know that scientists have recently discovered a "value atom" that is necessarily coextensive with gold atoms? Gold has inherent value after all!

[avxo]

{sigh}  {giggle} You are such a bellicose little bastard brat!!!

Why? Because I busted your statements that only gold has certain properties that you chose providing up to a half a dozen elements that share those same attributes?

There is much I could address in your little diatribe, but I won't even bother. Your determination to nit-pick, twist, misconstrue & misinterpret my statements,  while you grasp at any possible straw is all too readily apparent, ...and wise counsel has long said one should never throw pearls in front of swine, so I shall preserve my pearls of wisdom for those with the eyes to see and the ears to hear.

If you could have addressed it, you would have. As for your "pearls of wisdom", by all means, don't waste them on me. Save them for the billionaires who are interested.

The bottom line is you think Aristotle was an idiot. You think debt backed by debt, based on debt, dependent on debt, and leveraged with debt makes good, sound, financial sense. That's your perogative I suppose. I simply don't agree.

I think Aristotle is an idiot because I disagree with you? That's rich.

Here are the facts: I don't agree that only gold meets the requirements you laid out; I don't think that those requirements and those alone are the sole basis for a monetary system; and no, I don't think that gold has value "in and of itself".

I will however clarify a previous analogy I gave using soap to illustrate the merit of smaller, transaction friendly weights of gold, and the advantages they provide over bulk purchases of larger weights.

OK.

Soap will be priced higher when you purchase it in the form of a 1 lb bar, than if you were to purchase it in the form of a 1000 lb bar.

Right. That makes sense.

Ya, you could probably get a significant discount for buying a 1000 lb  bar of soap in a bulk purchase, but good luck trying to take a shower with it. The same goes for GOLD. 1,000 individual grams will always be priced higher than a 1 kilo bar, ...but again, good luck buying a bag of groceries or filling up a fuel tank with 2 different merchants, with that same 1 kilo bar.

Yes, I could and would. If I needed to take a shower, I'd take a piece of wire and use it to cut off a small slice, to use for showering.

As for gold, why would I use it to buy groceries? First of all, no grocery store accepts it (whether in bullion form on in fancy plastic card format) and second, if I am stocking up on gold because it is a store of value and my concern is the imminent collapse of the entire financial system (something which you have been telling us is inevitable and a big concern to you) then why would I spend that gold anyways, instead of the worthless fiat in my pocket?

Oh, are you planning on how to spend your gold in the post-collapse market already? That's kind of silly. It would seem to me that you would want to stockpile as much of it as possible, at the best possible price. Then when the collapse comes, you can afford to hire someone to convert your large, "transaction unfriendly" bars into something more usable. Or you can just trade with someone who has something more usable already, such as ⅒ oz gold Maples.

The problem is that you insist that it makes FINANCIAL SENSE to ACCUMULATE gold in tiny fractions and to MASSIVELY OVERSPEND as a result. It does not.

You're all butthurt because someone on here is challenging your bullshit and, unfortunately for you, not only can rationally deconstruct your arguments and expose the flimsy foundations upon which they're built, but also knows more than you on the topic and can expose your ignorance.

You can keep pasting nonsense that you find online from the echo chamber that are the blogs and websites you rely on, which are written by people that are just as clueless. You can keep trying to come up with reasons why gold and only gold is the foundation for a monetary system. You can keep trying to pretend you are well-versed on the subject.

We will still see you for what you are: a clueless, uneducated fool who was swindled into buying tiny amounts of gold, encased in plastic cards, that now wants to get others buying so she can score affiliate points and get cheap, branded champagne.

I hope you enjoyed your breakfast bagel.

I did.

[avxo]

We agree on much, but didn't you know that scientists have recently discovered a "value atom" that is necessarily coextensive with gold atoms? Gold has inherent value after all!

SCIENCE! IT WORKS!

[24KT]

Why? Because I busted your statements that only gold has certain properties that you chose providing up to a half a dozen elements that share those same attributes?


If you could have addressed it, you would have. As for your "pearls of wisdom", by all means, don't waste them on me. Save them for the billionaires who are interested.


I think Aristotle is an idiot because I disagree with you? That's rich.

Here are the facts: I don't agree that only gold meets the requirements you laid out; I don't think that those requirements and those alone are the sole basis for a monetary system; and no, I don't think that gold has value "in and of itself".


OK.


Right. That makes sense.


Yes, I could and would. If I needed to take a shower, I'd take a piece of wire and use it to cut off a small slice, to use for showering.

See, ...that's my point. One needs transaction friendly weights for practical functionality.
YOU CANNOT SIMPLY TAKE A WIRE AND SLICE OFF A PIECE OF GOLD!
You can't very well shave a piece off to exchange for goods or services.

As for gold, why would I use it to buy groceries? First of all, no grocery store accepts it (whether in bullion form on in fancy plastic card format) and second, if I am stocking up on gold because it is a store of value and my concern is the imminent collapse of the entire financial system (something which you have been telling us is inevitable and a big concern to you) then why would I spend that gold anyways, instead of the worthless fiat in my pocket?

Actually, you wouldn't spend it... at this time. Most everyone I know acquiring Karatbars is in acquisition mode. As yes, it is wiser to part with the fiat paper rather than the gold. However, there may come a time when one may be required to exchange their gold for goods & services. We've seen situations around the world, where many could have benefited had they just had a little emergency gold on hand. Like Mark Dice I believe. He managed to get himself flown out of Mexico during the swine flu epidemic, simply because he had a little gold on him

Oh, are you planning on how to spend your gold in the post-collapse market already? That's kind of silly. It would seem to me that you would want to stockpile as much of it as possible, at the best possible price. Then when the collapse comes, you can afford to hire someone to convert your large, "transaction unfriendly" bars into something more usable. Or you can just trade with someone who has something more usable already, such as ⅒ oz gold Maples.

In a post collapse environment, I'd have enough pressing issues to worry about, no need to have to futz around trying to find someone to reduce my large bars into transaction friendly weights. And then... how to prove authenticity? In a post collapse environment, who in their right mind is going to trade transaction friendly weights of gold (and I would contend that in a post collapse environment, a 1 oz coin would hardly be considered transaction friendly) for one large bar? I don't need to be adding additional headaches in a post collapse environment. Just as the time to lift weights is BEFORE the burglar enters your home... the time to put your insurance in place is BEFORE you're diagnosed with an illness.

The problem is that you insist that it makes FINANCIAL SENSE to ACCUMULATE gold in tiny fractions and to MASSIVELY OVERSPEND as a result. It does not.

You are being pennies wise, ...and pounds foolish. It makes no sense to you because you are buying gold out of your own pocket rather than permitting a system to provide you with gold for no out-of-pocket cost.  A system that provides residual cash flow and free gold.

You're all butthurt because someone on here is challenging your bullshit and, unfortunately for you, not only can rationally deconstruct your arguments and expose the flimsy foundations upon which they're built, but also knows more than you on the topic and can expose your ignorance.

You can keep pasting nonsense that you find online from the echo chamber that are the blogs and websites you rely on, which are written by people that are just as clueless. You can keep trying to come up with reasons why gold and only gold is the foundation for a monetary system. You can keep trying to pretend you are well-versed on the subject.

We will still see you for what you are: a clueless, uneducated fool who was swindled into buying tiny amounts of gold, encased in plastic cards, that now wants to get others buying so she can score affiliate points and get cheap, branded champagne.


I did.

I'm not butthurt at all. Actually we can't get the champagne here in Ontario.
The Liquor Control Board of Ontario  has a monopoly on all alcohol sales in this province ...except beer.
They share the monopoly on beer sales with The Beer Store. Yes, we have a province wide retail chain called "The Beer Store", and the only thing it sells is beer.

[avxo]

See, ...that's my point. One needs transaction friendly weights for practical functionality.
YOU CANNOT SIMPLY TAKE A WIRE AND SLICE OFF A PIECE OF GOLD!
You can't very well shave a piece off to exchange for goods or services.

Which is exactly why gold as physical money is a bad idea. Even if we assume the issue of tinkering with the medium itself is solved (and I'm not convinced Karatbars has; their design certainly isn't tamperproof and is, at best tamper-evident; but even then there's still the problem of creating fake duplicates with no gold inside... oops!), Karatbars have a problem. You are limited in how small you can get without relying on fiat or some mechanism to arbitrarily divide gold in real time.

Money needs to be divisible in practical use. And gold isn't. Karatbars does little to change that - and only makes it worse by making that one gram of gold physically huge and about 5 times heavier!

Actually, you wouldn't spend it... at this time. Most everyone I know acquiring Karatbars is in acquisition mode. As yes, it is wiser to part with the fiat paper rather than the gold. However, there may come a time when one may be required to exchange their gold for goods & services. We've seen situations around the world, where many could have benefited had they just had a little emergency gold on hand. Like Mark Dice I believe. He managed to get himself flown out of Mexico during the swine flu epidemic, simply because he had a little gold on him

Most everyone acquiring Karatbars is stupid: if you're going to acquire gold at $1,300 per troy ounce, at least buy it as large a quantity as you can afford to maximize how much gold you're getting for the money you're spending. And if you can't afford to buy at least an ounce at a time, I'm sorry to say but gold isn't the proper investment for you to begin with.

In a post collapse environment, I'd have enough pressing issues to worry about, no need to have to futz around trying to find someone to reduce my large bars into transaction friendly weights. And then... how to prove authenticity? In a post collapse environment, who in their right mind is going to trade transaction friendly weights of gold (and I would contend that in a post collapse environment, a 1 oz coin would hardly be considered transaction friendly) for one large bar? I don't need to be adding additional headaches in a post collapse environment. Just as the time to lift weights is BEFORE the burglar enters your home... the time to put your insurance in place is BEFORE you're diagnosed with an illness.

In a post-collapse environment, you believe people will know about Karatbars? I told you already, I called a number of places here in Las Vegas which advertise that they buy gold; all of them would readily hand cash over to me in exchange for gold bullion in the form of coins (Canadian Maples and American Eagles) but none of them knew what the fuck a Karatbar was.

You see, that's the problem with proprietary formats: people need to be educated in what they are, and before they become useful a critical mass of adopters must be built up. Karatbars is known to you, your seven friends and that one guy down by the falafel shop.

I'll challenge you again: tell me the name of ONE business here in Las Vegas that will accept Karatbars today in exchange for cash on the spot.

You are being pennies wise, ...and pounds foolish. It makes no sense to you because you are buying gold out of your own pocket rather than permitting a system to provide you with gold for no out-of-pocket cost.  A system that provides residual cash flow and free gold.

I'll repeat what I said to you before since you are either dense or stupid. You aren't getting gold for free. If you were, that would mean that someone not only values that gold at zero, but is stupid enough to give away that commodity which others value in exchange for nothing.

If you mean that you're getting rewards in exchange for bringing people on board and selling Karatbars, I am forced to wonder: how many people must you sign up before you get one gram of gold? My bet is a few, but I might be wrong; after all there are plenty of suckers out there that are the perfect target for your pitch. You know the pitch I'm talking about. It goes something like this:

Gold has been on the rise. It's over $1,300 a pop so you should buy now, before it goes to like... over $5,000 which this guy on the Internet told me will happen anytime now. And as luck would have it, I have some gold to sell you. Look, it's here, inside this plastic.
Come on! This plastic is so great. It has one gram of gold inside and... yes, yes I know that's small, but you need it like that so you can buy stuff when the current economic system collapses which this guy on the Internet told me will happen anyday now.
So yeah, you buy this and you keep on buying it and you're safe and prudently invested. And nobody can take it from you and you get a MasterCard and everyone will be willing to exchange this little card on the spot because it has a hologram.
And, look here... if you're still not sold, I have this super-secret presentation from this guy, Joe who knows things and put it on YouTube for people to educate themselves. So yeah, if you look at what Joe says, IN THIS FANCY COMIC SANS FONT then you will be convinced too. I'm gonna talk in Comic Sans too from now on. And in different sizes! It will give my words gravitas and help you understand!

Gold
gold
GOLD!
gold
GoLd!
GoLd!
GoLd!
What? not sold yet!?
Well if that's not enough, listen to this. I can get you free gold - that's right, the gold I told you is very expensive, I can get it to you for free! I mean, you can't find a deal like this anywhere else. We're talking free gold. My friend, who has a kid but no degree in economics thinks this is juts great. And she's a Mom! I mean, you can't get a better recommendation than that! Mom!
I'll even throw in a bottle of champagne after you spend a few thousand bucks. How impressive is that. And did I mention the MasterCard? When I take mine out of my wallet, I'm literally the talk of the town. People just beg me to know how they can get it. It's very exclusive. Only the select few get it. You want to be one of the select few, right?
Look, I don't know why you're not sold on this. You're a smart guy, you know what's happening. I don't need to tell you all this. I mean, come on! All my billionaire friends are in on this and they are billionaires.
Well, OK, fine. Don't buy. You can't see the writing on the wall. You just can't. You'll regret it!

[24KT]

Which is exactly why gold as physical money is a bad idea. Even if we assume the issue of tinkering with the medium itself is solved (and I'm not convinced Karatbars has; their design certainly isn't tamperproof and is, at best tamper-evident; but even then there's still the problem of creating fake duplicates with no gold inside... oops!), Karatbars have a problem. You are limited in how small you can get without relying on fiat or some mechanism to arbitrarily divide gold in real time.

One is not dependent upon fiat. Yes, a mechanism may be required to arbitrarily divide gold in real time, but that's where our gold accounts come in.

Money needs to be divisible in practical use. And gold isn't. Karatbars does little to change that - and only makes it worse by making that one gram of gold physically huge and about 5 times heavier!

One can digitally transfer a mere fraction of a gram. Infact, gold in this form is far more divisible than coinage. Up here in Canada, as well as Brazil, and a few other countries, the smallest coinage available is a 5 cent piece. We've done away with the penny. Divisibility is provided through digital transfers of gold. the difference is, ...we're talking about something tangible, not digits created from thin air, but units of actual physical gold that exists.

Most everyone acquiring Karatbars is stupid: if you're going to acquire gold at $1,300 per troy ounce, at least buy it as large a quantity as you can afford to maximize how much gold you're getting for the money you're spending. And if you can't afford to buy at least an ounce at a time, I'm sorry to say but gold isn't the proper investment for you to begin with.

You're entitled to make arbirary judgement calls. That is your own perogative I suppose, but I can assure you, my colleagues are anything but stupid.

If someone cannot afford to buy at least an ounce at a time, are they not entitled to protect themselves too? Your argument is the equivalent of the elitist 1% who say 'since the middle class cannot afford to buy gold in palettes of 400oz bars... fuck 'em. Let's keep 'em out of the market" Let'em buy coins & jewellry, while we keep the good stuff to ourselves" It is those in the lower income brackets (relatively speaking) who need protection the most.

In a post-collapse environment, you believe people will know about Karatbars? I told you already, I called a number of places here in Las Vegas which advertise that they buy gold; all of them would readily hand cash over to me in exchange for gold bullion in the form of coins (Canadian Maples and American Eagles) but none of them knew what the fuck a gold bar was.

That's good news as far as I'm concerned... plenty of opportunity in Las Vegas. I'll make a note of that.

You see, that's the problem with proprietary formats: people need to be educated in what they are, and before they become useful a critical mass of adopters must be built up. Karatbars is known to you, your seven friends and that one guy down by the falafel shop.

Where you see problems, ...I see opportunity.
Making Karatbars a household name is the goal, and we are getting there.
We're currently operating in 89 countries I believe, and shipping to 78 of those.

I'll challenge you again: tell me the name of ONE business here in Las Vegas that will accept Karatbars today in exchange for cash on the spot.

I don't know of one at the moment, ...and I'm not going to busy myself asking around. The majority of USA K-Exchanges that I am aware of are concentrated in the states of Florida, California, Illinois, Washington,  Massachusettes, Missouri, Tennesse, DC, and Michigan. Infact, there's even a gym in Michigan that accepts Karatbars

I'll repeat what I said to you before since you are either dense or stupid. You aren't getting gold for free. If you were, that would mean that someone not only values that gold at zero, but is stupid enough to give away that commodity which others value in exchange for nothing.

If you mean that you're getting rewards in exchange for bringing people on board and selling Karatbars, I am forced to wonder: how many people must you sign up before you get one gram of gold? My bet is a few, but I might be wrong; after all there are plenty of suckers out there that are the perfect target for your pitch. You know the pitch I'm talking about. It goes something like this:

In an affiliate referral rewards program, one is rewarded for referring new customers to a company...
It's no different than my phone company which rewards me if I were to refer a new customer.
My cell phone company does the same. The difference here is simply the degree to which I am rewarded.
Karatbars does it better than all others, ...and the beauty about it, ...I'm paid to save money, ...not spend it. Ongoing residual cash flow, and the ability to accumulate gold. It doesn't get any better than that in my books, ...although Harald is always raising the bar, sweetening the honey pot all the time.

As for the number of people you have to refer in order to be able to acquire gold karatbars at no out-of-pocket cost... that could be as little as only one person.

We have however devised a SYSTEM, which when married to the Karatbars compensation plan compounds, magnifies, and multiplies the results one is able to achieve with only a minimum of 2 people.

www.ViewTheInfo.com

[24KT]

So you think that the people who issue this branded MasterCard don't have access to view that you made a purchase at Amazon.com? That's funny... are you really that naive?

No, it's not that at all. I don't have a problem with that, ...it's my local tellers I have the problem with.
Snooty, self-righteous little prisses. Think Dana Carvey's "The Church Lady"

Of course Federal Reserve Notes don't enjoy legal tender status. A nation (like the United States) cannot make its currency legal tender anywhere except for its own territory. Why is this surprising? The Euro isn't legal tender in Kentucky. The Yuan isn't legal tender in France. The Rupee isn't legal tender in Quebec. The Yen isn't legal tender in New Zealand.

You miss the point completely. It's not the fact that it is not legal tender,
...it is supposed to be the world's reserve currency, ...yet people all over the world don't want it.

Hence the very title of this thread: Foreigners are dumping Treasuries!

And you know the kicker? Gold isn't legal tender anywhere.

Gold is legal tender in the state of Utah, ...and other states are quickly moving to make Gold & Silver legal tender in their states as well. Ironically though, while Gold is not only NOT legal tender in most parts of the world, ...and also not currently the reserve currency, ...still there is STILL such an incredible demand. What should that tell you?

Also: LOL @ HR77... you are a joker.

If you think HR77 is funny, ...you might actually pee your pants laughing when you get a peek at what the house passed on Halloween. The Swaps Regulatory Improvement Act Now there was a nasty little trick, ...'cause it sure wasn't a treat.  

You see "increased physical demand" where? Do you have some insight into the gold bullion market that others don't? The spot price of gold doesn't have anything to do with ETFs. It is the price for bullion.

I see increased demand ALL OVER THE WORLD!  Especially in Asia. I also see a lack of accurate reporting in the main stream media about the actual demand in these countries. It is quite literally pouring out of the vaults.

No I don't claim to possess any special insight into these markets that others don't have, ...I just simply follow it much closer than many, ...and I have a circle of friends who follow it even closer than I do. I gain insights and knowledge from many of these friends... some of whom are regularly called on to appear on national news programs around the world. Some of MY friends who advise me regarding gold are called on by CTV National news, CBC, King World, Bloomberg, Financial Times, BBC... infact, one just landed his own TV show on the BBC. He made headlines the world over for actually going on TV and telling the truth.

I hear JPM is expecting to take delivery in December, and if historical patterns prove consistent, we just might see a rise in the gold price. Don't know how much of an increase... but it could be substantial, ...but then again, ...who knows. The powers that be have been doing a heckuva job keeping it together against all odds.

You believe many things. But beliefs are, by and large, meaningless. Can you rationally defend your beliefs and substantiate them with facts? Don't worry about answering that... it was a rhetorical question.

I state my beliefs as such, because unlike YOU, I know the difference between a FACT and an OPINION.

I see no evidence that the country isn't allowing me to think. And please, be careful. Words have meaning.

Perhaps I could rephrase that. I feel sorry for you that you live in an environment that is not conducive to critical thinking. An environment filled with such propaganda, lies, untruth, and memes that simply do not reflect the current state of affairs in the world, and pumps you up with such false bravado, and hubris, that you eagerly dive over the face of a cliff, because you lack the ability to recognize a paradigmn shift happening right in front of your very eyes.

[avxo]

One is not dependent upon fiat. Yes, a mechanism may be required to arbitrarily divide gold in real time, but that's where our gold accounts come in.

Right, but I thought you are an advocate for the physical ownership of gold and you're not too keen on allowing someone else to hold the gold on your behalf.

One can digitally transfer a mere fraction of a gram. Infact, gold in this form is far more divisible than coinage. Up here in Canada, as well as Brazil, and a few other countries, the smallest coinage available is a 5 cent piece. We've done away with the penny. Divisibility is provided through digital transfers of gold. the difference is, ...we're talking about something tangible, not digits created from thin air, but units of actual physical gold that exists.

Let's pretend that this digital system exists. It's not in widespread use today, but let's also pretend it is. Who wrote the code? Has the code been audited and vetted to ensure that there are no gaping holes? How does the system protect my privacy when I need to get change and someone has to transfer gold to me?

You're entitled to make arbirary judgement calls. That is your own perogative I suppose, but I can assure you, my colleagues are anything but stupid.

You assured me that Karatbars were 999.9% gold too, post links to websites full of silly arguments and badly produced youtube videos and have demonstrated that you know little about economics... you can see why your assurances don't carry a lot of weight.

If someone cannot afford to buy at least an ounce at a time, are they not entitled to protect themselves too? Your argument is the equivalent of the elitist 1% who say 'since the middle class cannot afford to buy gold in palettes of 400oz bars... fuck 'em. Let's keep 'em out of the market" Let'em buy coins & jewellry, while we keep the good stuff to ourselves" It is those in the lower income brackets (relatively speaking) who need protection the most.

If someone cannot afford to buy half a troy ounce of gold, my point is two-fold: first, that they don't have assets that they need to protect and second that they can improve their situation a lot more by purchasing assets from other asset classes.

This has nothing to do with the 1% or the 99% and your attempt to make it into this reeks of desperation.

That's good news as far as I'm concerned... plenty of opportunity in Las Vegas. I'll make a note of that.

Yes... good news. You guys are, supposedly, growing and are, any day now, going to deploy a global hybrid payment network that will allow the use of plastic cards and digital transfers. And nobody even knows of your signature product. Good news indee... wait! That's not good news at all!
 

Where you see problems, ...I see opportunity.
Making Karatbars a household name is the goal, and we are getting there.
We're currently operating in 89 countries I believe, and shipping to 78 of those.

Get back to us when you are a household name. Because, until then, you're asking people to, at a ridiculous premium, convert cash to a proprietary format that is much less liquid and, potentially, only redeemable by the issuing company.

That totally doesn't seem like a bad idea!

I don't know of one at the moment, ...and I'm not going to busy myself asking around. The majority of USA K-Exchanges that I am aware of are concentrated in the states of Florida, California, Illinois, Washington,  Massachusettes, Missouri, Tennesse, DC, and Michigan. Infact, there's even a gym in Michigan that accepts Karatbars

Yes... Please don't busy yourself around by spending five minutes to find out the information needed to prove a critic wrong and undercut his argument. Not when there's other things to be done. Like have breakfast with your billionaire friends who are hanging on your every word.

In an affiliate referral rewards program, one is rewarded for referring new customers to a company...
It's no different than my phone company which rewards me if I were to refer a new customer.
My cell phone company does the same. The difference here is simply the degree to which I am rewarded.
Karatbars does it better than all others, ...and the beauty about it, ...I'm paid to save money, ...not spend it. Ongoing residual cash flow, and the ability to accumulate gold. It doesn't get any better than that in my books, ...although Harald is always raising the bar, sweetening the honey pot all the time.

Yes, Karatbars always does everything better. And that Harald! What a leader! It's a pity I won't be able to see your face when it finally dawns on you that you've been scammed.

We have however devised a SYSTEM, which when married to the Karatbars compensation plan compounds, magnifies, and multiplies the results one is able to achieve with only a minimum of 2 people.

Ooh.... A SYSTEM! This changes everything!

[24KT]

Right, but I thought you are an advocate for the physical ownership of gold and you're not too keen on allowing someone else to hold the gold on your behalf.

I do advocate the physical ownership of gold over a speculative ETF or "paper gold"

I've said that those who are not keen on allowing someone else to hold gold on their behalf are welcome to take delivery and store it themselves. As a general rule, I do not trust "banks" ...especially not those within the "Rothschilds banking system". I would never store my gold or any valuables within one of those banks or bank safety deposit boxes. I do however trust Harald and the private vaulting facilities he has put in place for us.

It's very similar to what we do and how we operate in day to day life with our paper money bank accounts. Not EVERYONE keeps ALL their money in a bank. Some keep only what they need to pay bills and function within the bank, while the rest of their money is elsewhere... either invested, ...or ready cash that they have on hand, or keep near by.

I can't help but to have gold in my account, because through our referral rewards program, it is automatically added to my account. If I don't want it in the account, ...I can simply request it be delivered to me. very simple. Just like those who get pay cheques automatically deposited into their bank accounts. When they want cash, they go to the bank and make a withdrawal. Same applies here. If you don't want it in your account, withdraw it, ...either as cash, or gold. Your choice.  

Let's pretend that this digital system exists.

No need to pretend.

It's not in widespread use today, but let's also pretend it is. Who wrote the code? Has the code been audited and vetted to ensure that there are no gaping holes? How does the system protect my privacy when I need to get change and someone has to transfer gold to me?

The top cybersecurity firm in the world.

Yes, it has been audited & vetted to ensure there are no gaping holes.
That's why it took us so gosh darned long for us to launch. It took years of auditting. That's how Germans do things... methodically, with forethought and precision. They don't slap stuff together in a half-baked way, ...unlike the USA {cough} ObamaCare {cough}

Do YOU know who wrote the code for your bank account, ...or do you just assume it has been audited & vetted for security? Most people just assume their online bank accounts are super secure, never once really questioning it's integrity, ...and of course the banks & the media complicitly permeate the myth, allowing a false sense of security to pervade among the public by diligently suppressing any news of security breaches.

You assured me that Karatbars were 999.9% gold too, post links to websites full of silly arguments and badly produced youtube videos and have demonstrated that you know little about economics... you can see why your assurances don't carry a lot of weight.

Piglet, you are soooo nit-pickety today. What gives? Did you neglect to buy some gold today?
You do know today is the day to honour the Hindu Goddess Lakshmi don't you?
If you buy gold today, she will visit your home.



Did the Goddess not visit your home today?  

 

If someone cannot afford to buy half a troy ounce of gold, my point is two-fold: first, that they don't have assets that they need to protect and second that they can improve their situation a lot more by purchasing assets from other asset classes.

You're assuming far too much. There are distinct advantages to smaller weight gold which I won't bother to rehash. That's why many of our affiliates who can and do acquire kilos at a time, are also actively accumulating smaller weights as well. The Karatbars system provides the residual cash flow one may use to acquire a one kilo bar if they want to buy it elsewhere. That's up to them. Most choose not to, prefering instead to continue to be paid to save.

This has nothing to do with the 1% or the 99% and your attempt to make it into this reeks of desperation.

It has everything to do with the 99%. This is exactly who our system was designed for. With the price of gold flopping around everyday, ...when it's on an upward trend... by the time Joe lunch box has enough saved up for an ounce... the price has gone up. By exchanging for smaller weights, Joe lunch box has the ability to dollar cost average, AND reap the residual cash flow to facilitate his gold acquisitions that much faster.

Yes... good news. You guys are, supposedly, growing and are, any day now, going to deploy a global hybrid payment network that will allow the use of plastic cards and digital transfers. And nobody even knows of your signature product. Good news indee... wait! That's not good news at all!

I guess it all depends on what side of the paradigmn shift you're sitting.

Get back to us when you are a household name.

One can choose to involve themselves with Karatbars only AFTER it is a household name, ...or one can choose to participate in the process of making Karatbars a household name. It's up to you, however, one should keep in mind that the majority of those who made the biggest gains on Microsoft where those visionaries who saw where Microsoft was going, prior to it getting there. Mark Twain once said (at least I think it was Mark Twain) The way to get rich is to find out where everyone is going, ...and get there first."

Just take a peek at the Exeter chart aka the FDIC's own proposal for the future of gold.



It will be used to prop up EVERYTHING.



Personally, I'm of the opinion that the time to stock the ship with life boats is BEFORE it has struck the iceberg

Because, until then, you're asking people to, at a ridiculous premium, convert cash to a proprietary format that is much less liquid and, potentially, only redeemable by the issuing company.

That totally doesn't seem like a bad idea!

If that's what you see, ...then that's what it is. As someone from the film industry, I am well aware that unfortunately "Perception is Reality" ...regardless of how inaccurate that perception is. Just like Henry Ford once said "If you think you can, or if you think you can't, ...either way, you're correct" One thing I do know for sure, "The value of Karatbars is not diminished simply by your failure to recognize their worth." You can attribute that last quote to me.

 

Yes... Please don't busy yourself around by spending five minutes to find out the information needed to prove a critic wrong and undercut his argument. Not when there's other things to be done. Like have breakfast with your billionaire friends who are hanging on your every word.

No breakfast dates lined up in the immediate future, ...but I do have a tentative meeting penciled in with a British hedge fund mgr. I gotta check my schedule, and do a bit more work before I ink it into my calendar.

Yes, Karatbars always does everything better. And that Harald! What a leader! It's a pity I won't be able to see your face when it finally dawns on you that you've been scammed.

He's an incredible visionary leader... oozing with charm, charisma, character & integrity!  

Ooh.... A SYSTEM! This changes everything!

Absolutely it does, my facetious little piglet. So what's on your breakfast menu for today?

[avxo]

No need to pretend.

No? You mean I can use this system today, here in Las Vegas?

The top cybersecurity firm in the world.

Oooh, fun. We're in my area of expertise now. What firm is that?

Yes, it has been audited & vetted to ensure there are no gaping holes.
That's why it took us so gosh darned long for us to launch. It took years of auditting. That's how Germans do things... methodically, with forethought and precision. They don't slap stuff together in a half-baked way, ...unlike the USA {cough} ObamaCare {cough}

Let's start from that last bit. I find it amusing that you would use the ObamaCare fiasco in a debate with me. I'm not involved with the development of the website, and support neither the implementation or the theory behind the Affordable Care Act.

Now, as for what the Germans do or don't do... you're talking out of your league again. You know nothing about computer programming, software development, security analysis or threat modeling. So you aren't in a position to judge how the Germans design, model, implement, test and deploy software. And you wouldn't know a slapped-together website from an impasto style painting.

Do YOU know who wrote the code for your bank account, ...or do you just assume it has been audited & vetted for security? Most people just assume their online bank accounts are super secure, never once really questioning it's integrity, ...and of course the banks & the media complicitly permeate the myth, allowing a false sense of security to pervade among the public by diligently suppressing any news of security breaches.

As a matter of fact, I do know. One of my consulting projects was to audit the codebase for a big U.S. bank and integrated improved encryption algorithms. During that project got to interview some members of the original teams and the teams currently maintaining the code. Not only that but I also walked away quite impressed with the quality of the code and the competency of their inhouse software R&D and their IT departments. So I moved my accounts there.

It was a good dig to try to make. Sorry it didn't work

Piglet, you are soooo nit-pickety today. What gives? Did you neglect to buy some gold today?
You do know today is the day to honour the Hindu Goddess Laksmi don't you?
If you buy gold today, she will visit your home.

I'm sure she's way too busy visiting yours.

More nonsense content by an idiot who cannot argue on the merits of her position.

You're assuming far too much. There are distinct advantages to smaller weight gold which I won't bother to rehash. That's why many of our affiliates who can and do acquire kilos at a time, are also actively accumulating smaller weights as well. The Karatbars system provides the residual cash flow one may use to acquire a one kilo bar if they want to buy it elsewhere. That's up to them. Most choose not to, prefering instead to continue to be paid to save.

A one kilogram bar is around $42,000 at current prices. You are claiming, with a straight face that affiliate income from the "buy gold by the gram inside a fancy plastic card" people is enough to buy a one kilogram bar? You realize that nobody believe this bullshit you peddle, right?

It has everything to do with the 99%. This is exactly who our system was designed for. With the price of gold flopping around everyday, ...when it's on an upward trend... by the time Joe lunch box has enough saved up for an ounce... the price has gone up. By exchanging for smaller weights, Joe lunch box has the ability to dollar cost average, AND reap the residual cash flow to facilitate his gold acquisitions that much faster.

If Joe Lunchbox chooses to buy gold but has to save to do so (i.e. he's not buying gold with existing savings or disposable income), he's making poor investment decisions. To the extent that Karatbars empowers him to make bad decisions, it's a bad system.

I guess it all depends on what side of the paradigmn shift you're sitting.

How about you stop talking to us about a paradigm shift that hasn't happened yet? Get back to us after it's a reality.

One can choose to involve themselves with Karatbars only AFTER it is a household name, ...or one can choose to participate in the process of making Karatbars a household name. It's up to you, however, one should keep in mind that the majority of those who made the biggest gains on Microsoft where those visionaries who saw where Microsoft was going, prior to it getting there. Mark Twain once said (at least I think it was Mark Twain) The way to get rich is to find out where everyone is going, ...and get there first."

There's a slight difference between Karatbars and Microsoft. Early Microsoft investors invested in the company. Early Karatbars "affiliates" just buy plastic cards. To-may-toes, to-mah-toes.

Just take a peek at the Exeter chart aka the FDIC's own proposal for the future of gold.



It will be used to prop up EVERYTHING.

An image from a blog? Really? That's your argument? Well, in that case:

I know you think a picture is worth a thousand words, but the ones you're finding are speech-impaired.

Personally, I'm of the opinion that the time to stock the ship with life boats is BEFORE it has struck the iceberg

You know what they say about opinions and assholes. Why should anyone pay attention to anything you say or give any weight to your opinions? You have no education on the subject on which you purport to speak and are unable to rationally defend your position. Your opinion isn't worth a single flying fuck.

If that's what you see, ...then that's what it is. As someone from the film industry, I am well aware that unfortunately "Perception is Reality" ...regardless of how inaccurate that perception is. Just like Henry Ford once said "If you think you can, or if you think you can't, ...either way, you're correct" One thing I do know for sure, "The value of Karatbars is not diminished simply by your failure to recognize their worth." You can attribute that last quote to me.

No, but the value of Karatbars, whatever it might, intrinsically be, is actually diminished by you, because you can't defend the company and the product you're shilling.

 

No breakfast dates lined up in the immediate future, ...but I do have a tentative meeting penciled in with a British hedge fund mgr. I gotta check my schedule, and do a bit more work before I ink it into my calendar.

Did you ever watch the movie "A Beautiful Mind"?

He's an incredible visionary leader... oozing with charm, charisma, character & integrity!  

Yes, I'm sure he is.  Why, if you just Google his name you'll see what comes back: a video posted by him (announcing a fantastic announcement to be made in September to give his "dearest partners" a new income source...) and page after page after page of people wondering if Karatbars is a scam or people who worked with him before and are warning people away.

You'd imagine the CEO of a serious business would be featured on interviews with serious newspapers, with respected financial magazines and so on. But no... Harald is just content to post videos of himself in an empty office.

I feel pity for you 24KT. You're being swindled and not only are you oblivious, but you're an active participant. I hope you're at least getting the plastic cards delivered, so you have something when this thing goes belly up and disappears. Not that I think the cards have any gold. I don't think they do; but at least, with a card in hand, you'll have a memento.

[24KT]

ok, 2 can play that game.

No? You mean I can use this system today, here in Las Vegas?


Oooh, fun. We're in my area of expertise now. What firm is that?

I've said far too much as it is. I am quite comfortable, impressed even with what they've done, and how they've done it.

Let's start from that last bit. I find it amusing that you would use the ObamaCare fiasco in a debate with me. I'm not involved with the development of the website, and support neither the implementation or the theory behind the Affordable Care Act.

Yet still you're stuck with a system that is not responsive to your needs, wants or desires,
...while eagerly bucking trashing a system responsive to the needs of so many? lol.

I used that as an example to illustrate how some companies or even countries slap things together. Germany is a highly regulated environment in which to do business. They don't play fast & loose like they do on this side of the Atlantic. Companies cannot simply skirt the rules and get away with it, the way they do here in North America.

Now, as for what the Germans do or don't do... you're talking out of your league again. You know nothing about computer programming, software development, security analysis or threat modeling. So you aren't in a position to judge how the Germans design, model, implement, test and deploy software. And you wouldn't know a slapped-together website from an impasto style painting.

Now you're just trying to be nasty.  

As a matter of fact, I do know. One of my consulting projects was to audit the codebase for a big U.S. bank and integrated improved encryption algorithms. During that project got to interview some members of the original teams and the teams currently maintaining the code. Not only that but I also walked away quite impressed with the quality of the code and the competency of their inhouse software R&D and their IT departments. So I moved my accounts there.

It was a good dig to try to make. Sorry it didn't work

       Dang!  ROTFLOL  Not nearly as sorry as I am, I can assure you      

I'm sure she's way too busy visiting yours.

I won't complain

More nonsense content by an idiot who cannot argue on the merits of her position.

Now there's no need to call names. that's just rude.

A one kilogram bar is around $42,000 at current prices. You are claiming, with a straight face that affiliate income from the "buy gold by the gram inside a fancy plastic card" people is enough to buy a one kilogram bar?

We have some people making $40,000 a month, and some of us making $40,000 a WEEK or more!

You realize that nobody believe this bullshit you peddle, right?

It's not BS, ...and whether you or anyone else believes me or not, doesn't matter to me. I'm part of this movement, and my MasterCard still gets loaded, and has never been declined for either a purchase, or a cash withdrawal through an ATM machine.Whether you believe it or not, we're still getting paid, and paid extremely well to save money.

If Joe Lunchbox chooses to buy gold but has to save to do so (i.e. he's not buying gold with existing savings or disposable income), he's making poor investment decisions. To the extent that Karatbars empowers him to make bad decisions, it's a bad system.

Joe Lunchbox may be required to save up to buy an ounce or more at a time in a lesser asset class, however when Joe lunchbox acquires Karatbars, he doesn't have to "save up" to do it, because Karatbars empowers him to save the value of his labour in smaller increments that he can afford. He's not "investing" he is preserving the value of his labour, and getting away from the debt & counter-party risk that is associated and attached to his fiat paper.

How about you stop talking to us about a paradigm shift that hasn't happened yet? Get back to us after it's a reality.

The paradigmn shift is occuring as I type. Why should I wait until AFTER the shift is complete? By then, it's too late for people to protect themselves. The time to lift weights is BEFORE the burglar enters your home.

There's a slight difference between Karatbars and Microsoft. Early Microsoft investors invested in the company. Early Karatbars "affiliates" just buy plastic cards. To-may-toes, to-mah-toes.

My reference was not to Microsoft "investors". I was refering to the Microsoft 'Founders"
The four who had the vision to understand what they were working on. It was that knowledge and clear vision that was the fuel they required to keep going through the development & implementation of a system slightly ahead of it's time, until it's time had come.  

An image from a blog? Really? That's your argument? Well, in that case:

Nice graphic. I wish I could slice cucumbers as thinly. They don't look very juicy though.  

Actually, the image represents the FDIC's proposal for the future of currency grade gold. I wasn't going to go back to search for the original image link on the FDIC site when so many other sites have the same image.

I know you think a picture is worth a thousand words, but the ones you're finding are speech-impaired.

 You're funny. Too bad you attempt to use your humour for such destructive purposes.

You know what they say about opinions

Ya, ...everyone's got one.

and assholes.

Ya, ...everyone's got one of those as well. In my case I have two. The one I was born with, ...and YOU.

Why should anyone pay attention to anything you say or give any weight to your opinions? You have no education on the subject on which you purport to speak and are unable to rationally defend your position. Your opinion isn't worth a single flying fuck.

The fact that I'm in Karatbars and making money with it, and getting gold for free.
I have all the education I need to understand what we're facing, and how Karatbars can provide the solution.
I have all the education I need to exchange my fiat paper for gold Karatbars,
...and I sure as heck have all the education I need to spend the money that gets loaded onto my MasterCard

You on the other hand are simply an ignorant individual who likes to nit-pick about something he has no experience with. That's not to insult you, or call you stupid, I'm simply describing your state regarding Karatbars. I'm ignorant about what goes on in your household. That doesn't make me stupid, ...it just means I don't know. There are plenty of things we don't know in life. What's really challenging is when people don't know, ...and they don't even know they don't know. But they dare speak with such bravado claiming to know, and in the process dissuade others who may want to know, ...others who infact were in need of just that very thing, ...but were dissuaded from even taking a look because of someone like ...YOU. Truly sad.

No, but the value of Karatbars, whatever it might, intrinsically be, is actually diminished by you, because you can't defend the company and the product you're shilling.

Now that was just intentionally mean. I shouldn't have to defend it.
Maybe you should stop attacking something you know so little about.

Did you ever watch the movie "A Beautiful Mind"?

Ya I saw it, ...ya little brat. You'd be surprised who I am friends with.
Being in the film industry has a tendency to open up many circles one might not otherwise gain entrance to.

Yes, I'm sure he is.  Why, if you just Google his name you'll see what comes back: a video posted by him (announcing a fantastic announcement to be made in September to give his "dearest partners" a new income source...) and page after page after page of people wondering if Karatbars is a scam or people who worked with him before and are warning people away.

Because he did provide an additional income source in September, ...in fact he provided a SIGNIFICANT new income source after having made that announcement.

Of course there are pages upon pages upon pages of people wondering if it's a scam... for many, Karatbars just sounds too good to be true, so they question it. I could hardly believe it myself when I first discovered Karatbars. It's human nature...

You'd imagine the CEO of a serious business would be featured on interviews with serious newspapers, with respected financial magazines and so on. But no... Harald is just content to post videos of himself in an empty office.

One can imagine alot of things. One could even imagine that a great nation like the USA would NEVER in a million years shred the Constitution, NEVER try to do away with the 2nd Amendment, and NEVER fund terrorists who kill Americans. One could even imagine the greatest creditor nation could NEVER become the greatest debtor nation and run out of enough money to pay it's bills, ...but there you have it. What one may imagine, based on an obsolete paradigmn, may not necessarily be applicable.
  
Harald is not like Donald Trump. He has no ego to feed. Our business model is such that we don't advertise. Instead, affiliates are compensated with the budget that otherwise would go to advertising. In an age full of controlled media, and propaganda, if you need the approval of a newspaper or magazine to form an opinion, perhaps my earlier statement that you're not allowed to think was appropriate.

I feel pity for you 24KT.

No need to pity me.

You're being swindled and not only are you oblivious, but you're an active participant.

Funny, ...that's precisely what I think about those who continue to rely on fiat paper money and it's derivatives.

I hope you're at least getting the plastic cards delivered, so you have something when this thing goes belly up and disappears. Not that I think the cards have any gold. I don't think they do; but at least, with a card in hand, you'll have a memento.

I treat Karatbars GOLD like I do fiat paper money. I have some held in storage in my account, and some I have delivered and keep close by.

[avxo]

ok, 2 can play that game.

The only one playing "games" here is you... keep playing if you must, but don't pretend you're anything other than a joke.

I've said far too much as it is. I am quite comfortable, impressed even with what they've done, and how they've done it.

You have no credentials by which to judge what they've done and how they've done it. You know jackshit about computers, programming, security, risk analysis, social engineering, or any of the other attack vectors that a system like then one you claim Karatbars has in place must be analyzed against. So, with respect, that you're comfortable with and impressed by the word means exactly nothing.

Yet still you're stuck with a system that is not responsive to your needs, wants or desires,
...while eagerly bucking trashing a system responsive to the needs of so many? lol.

First of all you don't know my "needs, wants or desires" or my current healthcare coverage, so it's impossible for you to know what I am or am not stuck with.  Secondly, I'm arguing against a system that is, in the long term, unsustainable and based on nothing but feel-good kumbayah nonsense... everybody will get free coverage, yay! Bullshit - whether of the Karatbars of the socialized medicine variety must be challenged.

I used that as an example to illustrate how some companies or even countries slap things together. Germany is a highly regulated environment in which to do business. They don't play fast & loose like they do on this side of the Atlantic. Companies cannot simply skirt the rules and get away with it, the way they do here in North America.

Siemens skirted the rules and got away with it by paying kickbacks, and that's just one example off the top of my head. Have you ever been to Germany? Have you ever owned a business in Germany? What qualifies you to make grandiose pronouncements about the business environment there?

Now you're just trying to be nasty.  

I am? Why? You are not a security expert and you don't know those things, so the opinions you expressed are nonsensical.
 

Now there's no need to call names. that's just rude.

You post idiotic content, I can only conclude you're an idiot.

We have some people making $40,000 a month, and some of us making $40,000 a WEEK or more!

LOL... the joke of the fucking century. God, I laughed for a good ten minutes.

It's not BS

It is.

, ...and whether you or anyone else believes me or not, doesn't matter to me. I'm part of this movement, and my MasterCard still gets loaded, and has never been declined for either a purchase, or a cash withdrawal through an ATM machine.Whether you believe it or not, we're still getting paid, and paid extremely well to save money.

It clearly does matter, because you keep coming back here for spankings.

Joe Lunchbox may be required to save up to buy an ounce or more at a time in a lesser asset class, however when Joe lunchbox acquires Karatbars, he doesn't have to "save up" to do it, because Karatbars empowers him to save the value of his labour in some increments as he can afford to do so. He is not "investing" he is preserving the value of his labour, and getting away from the debt & counter party risk that is associated and attached to his paper money.

Yes, it "empowers" him to overpay to buy a plastic card with a gram of gold at outrageous prices.

The paradigmn shift is occuring as I type. Why should I wait until AFTER the shift is complete? By then, it's too late for people to protect themselves. The time to lift weights is BEFORE the burglar enters your home.

My reference was not to Microsoft "investors". I was refering to the Microsoft 'Founders"

First of all, the Microsoft "founders" were, themselves, investors: they invested their time and their energy. Second of all, you aren't a Karatbars founder. You are an affiliate, and, if we define the term loosely, an investor.

The four who had the vision to understand what they were working on. It was that knowledge and clear vision that was the fuel they required to keep going through the development & implementation of a system slightly ahead of it's time, until it's time had come.

Slightly ahead of its time? Do you even know any of the history behind the early founding of Microsoft? They lucked out when the company that had an operating system called CP/M failed to return a document to IBM in time, and IBM turned to Microsoft, who at the time didn't even have an operating system at all, and had to rush out and buy a piece of shit software called QDOS. Ahead of its time? Are you fucking kidding me? What a bunch of baloney.

Actually, the image represents the FDIC's proposal for the future of currency grade gold. I wasn't going to go back to search for the original image link on the FDIC site when so many other sites have the same image.

It's an image that represents nothing. Like the sliced cucumber. Can you provide a reference to the FDIC saying anything about "currency-grade gold" that's from an official source? I'll bet you can't.

Ya, ...everyone's got one of those as well. In my case I have two. The one I was born with, ...and YOU.

If you stop with the bullshit, at least you can rid yourself of one

The fact that I'm in Karatbars and making money with it, and getting gold for free.

Yes... you're getting gold for free...

I have all the education I need to understand what we're facing, and how Karatbars can provide the solution.

No, see... that's the problem. You have enough education to think you understand what's going on. But the problem is you don't. You don't know basic economics, you couldn't explain how a system based a gold-backed currency or even a system in which gold is traded, could improve anything at all. All you can do is copy-paste stuff and give half-ass

I have all the education I need to exchange my fiat paper for gold Karatbars,
...and I sure as heck have all the education I need to spend the money that gets loaded onto my MasterCard

It doesn't take a lot of education to spend money foolishly. That much should be obvious even to you.

You on the other hand are simply an ignorant individual who likes to nit-pick about something he has no experience with.

Yes... I'm the ignorant one... Because I haven't been able to speak intelligently on this matter, demolish every single one of your arguments and expose you for the uneducated buffoon that you are.

That's not to insult you, or call you stupid, I'm simply describing your state regarding Karatbars.

I don't have to understand the finer points of a shell game to know it's a con.

What's really challenging is when people don't know, ...and they don't even know they don't know.

People like you, perhaps? Remember, you insisted that the gold you peddle was 999.9% pure and continued to insist that it was after I proved to you that you were wrong.

But they dare speak with such bravado claiming to know

Oh boy... you're describing yourself to a tee!

Now that was just intentionally mean. I shouldn't have to defend it.
Maybe you should stop attacking something you know so little about.

Why is it mean? You are advertising (spamming is more like it) a product whose merits you cannot defend and espousing ideas and positions which you cannot rationally justify. It's mean to point that out?

Ya I saw it, ...ya little brat. You'd be surprised who I am friends with.
Being in the film industry has a tendency to open up many circles one might not otherwise gain entrance to.

Yes, of course. For an A-list actresses, such as yourself, an international star who has headlined multiple blockbusters, I'm sure the film industry opens up many circles. Why, I bet all the power-players there are just begging you to review scripts and involved in their projects. Even if it means having to come and sit down to listen to your 30 minute presentation about Karatbars at the Denny's on the corner of Sunset & Gower.

Because he did provide an additional income source in September, ...in fact he provided a SIGNIFICANT new income source after having made that announcement.

Ah yes... the $40,000 per month. Selling a gram of gold at a time to Joe Lunchbox who, you will remember, can't afford to buy gold in any other way.

Of course there are pages upon pages upon pages of people wondering if it's a scam... for many, Karatbars just sounds too good to be true, so they question it. I could hardly believe it myself when I first discovered Karatbars. It's human nature...

It is too good to be true. And in those many pages, not once has a credible defence of the system been presented by anyone who claims to be affiliated with it. They all follow your pattern: copy-pasting stuff from blogs and repeating the same bullshit ad-infinitum.

One can imagine alot of things. One could even imagine that a great nation like the USA would NEVER in a million years shred the Constitution, NEVER try to do away with the 2nd Amendment, and NEVER fund terrorists who kill Americans. One could even imagine the greatest creditor nation could NEVER become the greatest debtor nation and run out of enough money to pay it's bills, ...but there you have it. What what may imagine, based on an obsolete paradigmn, may not necessarily be applicable.

Oh god...  
  

Harald is not like Donald Trump. He has no ego to feed. Our business model is such that we don't advertise. Instead, affiliates are compensated with the budget that otherwise would go to advertising. If you need the approval of a newspaper or magazine to form an opinion, perhaps my earlier statement that you're not allowed to think was appropriate.

No. He's just a benevolent man, who wishes to spread happiness and cheer and gold dust across the entire globe.

And it's not about the approval of a newspaper or magazine. It's about credibility. Karatbars is, supposedly, a large, successful company that's growing; a company that's paying tens of thousands of dollars per month to some of its "affiliates." And yet, nowhere does this company appear. Even their website is a shitty affair, and professional looking websites can be had for a couple of hundred bucks these days.

Funny, ...that's precisely what I think about those who continue to rely on fiat paper money and it's derivatives.

The question is whether you can justify your thinking... and, of course, you can't.

[24KT]

The only one playing "games" here is you... keep playing if you must, but don't pretend you're anything other than a joke.


You have no credentials by which to judge what they've done and how they've done it. You know jackshit about computers, programming, security, risk analysis, social engineering, or any of the other attack vectors that a system like then one you claim Karatbars has in place must be analyzed against. So, with respect, that you're comfortable with and impressed by the word means exactly nothing.


First of all you don't know my "needs, wants or desires" or my current healthcare coverage, so it's impossible for you to know what I am or am not stuck with.  Secondly, I'm arguing against a system that is, in the long term, unsustainable and based on nothing but feel-good kumbayah nonsense... everybody will get free coverage, yay! Bullshit - whether of the Karatbars of the socialized medicine variety must be challenged.


Siemens skirted the rules and got away with it by paying kickbacks, and that's just one example off the top of my head. Have you ever been to Germany? Have you ever owned a business in Germany? What qualifies you to make grandiose pronouncements about the business environment there?


I am? Why? You are not a security expert and you don't know those things, so the opinions you expressed are nonsensical.
 

You post idiotic content, I can only conclude you're an idiot.


LOL... the joke of the fucking century. God, I laughed for a good ten minutes.


It is.


It clearly does matter, because you keep coming back here for spankings.


Yes, it "empowers" him to overpay to buy a plastic card with a gram of gold at outrageous prices.




First of all, the Microsoft "founders" were, themselves, investors: they invested their time and their energy. Second of all, you aren't a Karatbars founder. You are an affiliate, and, if we define the term loosely, an investor.


Slightly ahead of its time? Do you even know any of the history behind the early founding of Microsoft? They lucked out when the company that had an operating system called CP/M failed to return a document to IBM in time, and IBM turned to Microsoft, who at the time didn't even have an operating system at all, and had to rush out and buy a piece of shit software called QDOS. Ahead of its time? Are you fucking kidding me? What a bunch of baloney.


It's an image that represents nothing. Like the sliced cucumber. Can you provide a reference to the FDIC saying anything about "currency-grade gold" that's from an official source? I'll bet you can't.

If you stop with the bullshit, at least you can rid yourself of one


Yes... you're getting gold for free...

No, see... that's the problem. You have enough education to think you understand what's going on. But the problem is you don't. You don't know basic economics, you couldn't explain how a system based a gold-backed currency or even a system in which gold is traded, could improve anything at all. All you can do is copy-paste stuff and give half-ass


It doesn't take a lot of education to spend money foolishly. That much should be obvious even to you.


Yes... I'm the ignorant one... Because I haven't been able to speak intelligently on this matter, demolish every single one of your arguments and expose you for the uneducated buffoon that you are.


I don't have to understand the finer points of a shell game to know it's a con.


People like you, perhaps? Remember, you insisted that the gold you peddle was 999.9% pure and continued to insist that it was after I proved to you that you were wrong.


Oh boy... you're describing yourself to a tee!


Why is it mean? You are advertising (spamming is more like it) a product whose merits you cannot defend and espousing ideas and positions which you cannot rationally justify. It's mean to point that out?


Yes, of course. For an A-list actresses, such as yourself, an international star who has headlined multiple blockbusters, I'm sure the film industry opens up many circles. Why, I bet all the power-players there are just begging you to review scripts and involved in their projects. Even if it means having to come and sit down to listen to your 30 minute presentation about Karatbars at the Denny's on the corner of Sunset & Gower.


Ah yes... the $40,000 per month. Selling a gram of gold at a time to Joe Lunchbox who, you will remember, can't afford to buy gold in any other way.


It is too good to be true. And in those many pages, not once has a credible defence of the system been presented by anyone who claims to be affiliated with it. They all follow your pattern: copy-pasting stuff from blogs and repeating the same bullshit ad-infinitum.


Oh god...  
  

No. He's just a benevolent man, who wishes to spread happiness and cheer and gold dust across the entire globe.

And it's not about the approval of a newspaper or magazine. It's about credibility. Karatbars is, supposedly, a large, successful company that's growing; a company that's paying tens of thousands of dollars per month to some of its "affiliates." And yet, nowhere does this company appear. Even their website is a shitty affair, and professional looking websites can be had for a couple of hundred bucks these days.



The question is whether you can justify your thinking... and, of course, you can't.

If I'm an ignorant idiot, ...I guess I'm in good company!

I'd rather be an ignorant idiot like Jim Sinclair, than smart & articulate like you.

If you look on his wall in the upper right, it seems Goddess Lakshmi found her way to Jim's home as well 

[avxo]

If I'm an ignorant idiot, ...I guess I'm in good company!

I'd rather be an ignorant idiot like Jim Sinclair, than smart & articulate like you.

Yeah... no answer. Just another YouTube video. You're unable to rationally debate in support of the shitty product you peddle. Not all that surprising really.

As for linking Jim Sinclair, it's not unexpected; but it is funny. A lot of people who are in the gold community believe the crap that he spits out. It's a perfect demonstration of confirmation bias in action. Jim Sinclair says what you believe and want to hear, so that means he's credible and quoteworthy and listening to him makes you feel all better about your unsubstantiated beliefs.

Wake up dumbass... you're engaged in a circle-jerk. Jim Sinclair is no different from someone who writes books about thetans and Xenu: scientologists will buy the book and believe the crap that's printed in it; rational people won't.

I'll challenge you outright: are you willing to bet that the price of gold will break $3,000 in the next twenty four months? I'll bet $3,000 that it won't and I will happily leave the money in escrow with a getbigger we both trust. As a matter of fact, I'll make the pot even sweeter: I'll bet $6,000 to your $3,000. Are you going to take this bet?

Something tells me you won't.

[24KT]

Yeah... no answer. Just another YouTube video. You're unable to rationally debate in support of the shitty product you peddle. Not all that surprising really.

There's a difference between can't & won't. Why would I bother to type it out when there's an interview that sums up my position exactly? Ruin my manicure for you? Hardly! Like I've said before, ...whether you or anyone else believes in the concept of Karatbars makes no difference to me. I know where I'm going and what I'm doing.

As for linking Jim Sinclair, it's not unexpected; but it is funny. A lot of people who are in the gold community believe the crap that he spits out. It's a perfect demonstration of confirmation bias in action. Jim Sinclair says what you believe and want to hear, so that means he's credible and quoteworthy and listening to him makes you feel all better about your unsubstantiated beliefs.

Wake up dumbass... you're engaged in a circle-jerk. Jim Sinclair is no different from someone who writes books about thetans and Xenu: scientologists will buy the book and believe the crap that's printed in it; rational people won't.

I'll challenge you outright: are you willing to bet that the price of gold will break $3,000 in the next twenty four months? I'll bet $3,000 that it won't and I will happily leave the money in escrow with a getbigger we both trust. As a matter of fact, I'll make the pot even sweeter: I'll bet $6,000 to your $3,000. Are you going to take this bet?

Something tells me you won't.

Actually Jim Sinclair's track record is pretty damn good.

I'll trust his analysis, along with Jim Willie's, Eric Sprott's, John Embry's, Alessio Rastani's over Krugman and Bernanke's anyday.

Will I bet? ...nope, I told you before I don't bet. I'll leave the gambling to you and the Fed.

[avxo]

There's a difference between can't & won't. Why would I bother to type it out when there's an interview that sums up my position exactly? Ruin my manicure for you? Hardly! Like I've said before, ...whether you or anyone else believes in the concept of Karatbars makes no difference to me. I know where I'm going and what I'm doing.

You know where you want to end up. But what you're doing won't take you there.

Actually Jim Sinclair's track record is pretty damn good.

I'll trust his analysis, along with Jim Willie's, Eric Sprott's, John Embry's, Alessio Rastani's over Krugman and Bernanke's anyday.

Yeah, because a leap of 3,450% is happening any day now... better buy more gold fast! Why, perhaps you should consider buying gold in larger quantities, you know? Do they make a extra-large novelty-sized Karatbar perhaps? They could sell it along with one of those big foam fingers.

Will I bet? ...nope, I told you before I don't bet. I'll leave the gambling to you and the Fed.
[/quote]

[24KT]

You know where you want to end up. But what you're doing won't take you there.

Like you even care?    

I know exactly where I'll be when the poop hits the fan,
...a heckuva a lot better off than those who continued to rely on fiat paper and made no preparations

Yeah, because a leap of 3,450% is happening any day now... better buy more gold fast! Why, perhaps you should consider buying gold in larger quantities, you know? Do they make a extra-large novelty-sized gold bar perhaps? They could sell it along with one of those big foam fingers.

I do buy it in larger quantities.
These larger quantities are simply in smaller weights. I have no issue with that,
or any desire to "get more bang for the buck" with less transaction friendly larger weights.
The larger weights leave me less flexible, ...and besides, I not acquiring gold out-of-pocket.
I'm getting it with passive windfall money, so I'm not concerned about pinching pennies over premiums.
.
I can't imagine how truly unhappy your life must be.

[avxo]

I do buy it in larger quantities.
These larger quantities are simply in smaller weights. I have no issue with that,
or any desire to "get more bang for the buck" with less transaction friendly larger weights.
The larger weights leave me less flexible, ...and besides, I not acquiring gold out-of-pocket.
I'm getting it with passive windfall money, so I'm not concerned about pinching pennies over premiums.

Fuck... I don't think I've ever seen this much idiocy condensed in so few words.

[24KT]

Yeah... no answer. Just another YouTube video. You're unable to rationally debate in support of the shitty product you peddle. Not all that surprising really.

As for linking Jim Sinclair, it's not unexpected; but it is funny. A lot of people who are in the gold community believe the crap that he spits out. It's a perfect demonstration of confirmation bias in action. Jim Sinclair says what you believe and want to hear, so that means he's credible and quoteworthy and listening to him makes you feel all better about your unsubstantiated beliefs.

Wake up dumbass... you're engaged in a circle-jerk. Jim Sinclair is no different from someone who writes books about thetans and Xenu: scientologists will buy the book and believe the crap that's printed in it; rational people won't.

I'll challenge you outright: are you willing to bet that the price of gold will break $3,000 in the next twenty four months? I'll bet $3,000 that it won't and I will happily leave the money in escrow with a getbigger we both trust. As a matter of fact, I'll make the pot even sweeter: I'll bet $6,000 to your $3,000. Are you going to take this bet?

Something tells me you won't.

There's a difference between can't & won't. Why would I bother to type it out when there's an interview that sums up my position exactly? Ruin my manicure for you? Hardly! Like I've said before, ...whether you or anyone else believes in the concept of Karatbars makes no difference to me. I know where I'm going and what I'm doing.

Actually Jim Sinclair's track record is pretty damn good.

I'll trust his analysis, along with Jim Willie's, Eric Sprott's, John Embry's, Alessio Rastani's over Krugman and Bernanke's anyday.

Will I bet? ...nope, I told you before I don't bet. I'll leave the gambling to you and the Fed.

http://akaratbars.com

[avxo]

http://akaratbars.com

Very professional site, and very reassuring. And so modern and crisp - if only it had a couple of <BLINK> tags and, maybe, a <MARQUEE> for good measure... Perhaps I need to open it in Nestcape Navigator or NCSA Mozaic to get the full effect?

But yeah, this site has totally convinced me that Karatbars is in no way, shape or form a Multi-Level Marketing Scam that peddles tiny amounts of gold at ridiculous markup to idiots with lies about free gold (hint: no such thing), no-limit "gold" Mastercards (hint: it's a prepaid, kitschy card) and promises of unbounded financial prosperity (hint: you will prosper more if you're the mark in three-card monte).

[24KT]

Very professional site, and very reassuring. And so modern and crisp - if only it had a couple of <BLINK> tags and, maybe, a <MARQUEE> for good measure... Perhaps I need to open it in Nestcape Navigator or NCSA Mozaic to get the full effect?

BRAT!!!

Nice job in altering FORGING the link NOT!
If you're going to forge a link, at least have enough decency not to attribute it to me.

But yeah, this site has totally convinced me that Karatbars is in no way, shape or form a Multi-Level Marketing Scam that peddles tiny amounts of gold at ridiculous markup to idiots with lies about free gold (hint: no such thing), no-limit "gold" Mastercards (hint: it's a prepaid, kitschy card) and promises of unbounded financial prosperity (hint: you will prosper more if you're the mark in three-card monte).

You clearly don't get it.

Our program is NOT FOR INVESTORS

The world economy has been financed as debt, backed by debt, collateralized by debt into leveraged speculation.

The weight of this money in the gold markets currently overwhelms the non-leveraged money from hard working people just looking for safety (collecting physical). It is from the leveraged gold market that the "spot price" is derived, and it is what is currently setting the prices.

There is huge volatility in this leveraged market as large "investors" still borrow money at little cost and leverage up small amounts to buy more gold. The consequence of that leverage is that it only takes a small change in price to result in quick, rapid, and forced liquidations that threaten to wipe all their capital out.


The demand for physical gold bullion is evidenced by a phenomenom referred to as Gold Backwardation and a negative GOFO rate. (Going Forward)

Typically, gold contracts are leveraged and rolled forward. But not now. A lot of larger institutional investors are saying give me the gold NOW, rather than going forward. Furthermore, people are actually taking delivery rather than rolling forward.
 
Instead, We are seeing higher prices for gold deliverable today, than we see for gold to be delivered sometime in the future. Meaning, people would rather pay a premium for physical gold that they can get in their hands today, rather than purchase at a lower price for future delivery.

That exists all across the board. When you compare apples to apples, you will find Karatbars consistently provides the consumer the lowest price for this asset class of gold. More customers, in more countries every single day.

NO, Karatbars is NOT a Multi-level.

Karatbars is an off-shore e-commerce company with an optional affiliate marketing program. It is not governed by the USA or Canada. It is on the same level of trade existence that the US or Canadian governments use when dealing with any other country. Karatbars falls under the International Bullion Laws set forth by the World Trade Organization under the Harmonious Tax Code.

You don't believe it? Don't join. It doesn't matter. We'll keep doing what we're doing, helping individuals, families and business entities around the world to continue acquiring the highest asset class of gold there is, in smaller, more affordable, transaction friendly weights, ...AND or system will help them acquire the residual cash flow to do it.

[avxo]

BRAT!!!

Nice job in altering FORGING the link NOT!
If you're going to forge a link, at least have enough decency not to attribute it to me.

Forging? LOL... I thought I was doing everyone a service - people will get a lot more out of zombo.com - where you can do anything and the only limit is yourself - than from the stupid spam-page you linked to.

You clearly don't get it.

You're right. I don't get why you keep spamming these boards with your bullshit, and I don't get how anyone can be stupid enough to fall for the fool's gold you're peddling.

Our program is NOT FOR INVESTORS

Your "program" - and let's be clear about this - is to separate gullible fools from their money.

The weight of this money in the gold markets currently overwhelms the non-leveraged money from hard working people just looking for safety (collecting physical). It is from the leveraged gold market that the "spot price" is derived, and it is what is currently setting the prices.

Do you even understand any of this, or did you just copy-paste it? Let's see... a quick Google search and what have we here amd here? "[...] That is why SGE's larger physical deliveries don't matter, as the ZIRP free money drives leveraged speculation in all markets, gold included. Simply the weight of this money in the gold market overwhelms the non-leverage money from the “good natured and hard working” just looking for safety."

Man, this reads like your bullshit almost word-for-word.

There is huge volatility in this leveraged market as large "investors" still borrow money at little cost and leverage up small amounts to buy more gold. The consequence of that leverage is that it only takes a small change in price to result in quick, rapid, and forced liquidations that threaten to wipe all their capital out.

And the solution is to "hoard" gold in plastic-card form, a gram at a time?

The demand for physical gold bullion is evidenced by a phenomenom referred to as Gold Backwardation and a negative GOFO rate. (Going Forward)

For future reference, please don't use terms whose meaning is unclear only to appear smart and knowledgeable - you'll only appear stupid. And if you're going to explain an acronym, explain it correctly.

Instead, We are seeing higher prices for gold deliverable today, than we see for gold to be delivered sometime in the future. Meaning, people would rather pay a premium for physical gold that they can get in their hands today, rather than purchase at a lower price for future delivery.

So the fact that gold futures trade lower proves to you that people want gold today? As opposed to.. oh, I don't know... people think that gold today is still terribly overpriced?

That exists all across the board. When you compare apples to apples, you will find Karatbars consistently provides the consumer the lowest price for this asset class of gold.

The "asset class" (and I use the term loosely) being plastic cards? Right?

More customers, in more countries every single day.

And I'll bet that they're all as knowledgeable about gold, economics and investing as you are.

NO, Karatbars is NOT a Multi-level.

Of course it is. You get incentives for everyone you bring on board and for everyone they, then, bring on board. That's the textbook definition of multi-level marketing.

Karatbars is an off-shore e-commerce company with an optional affiliate marketing program. It is not governed by the USA or Canada. It is on the same level of trade existence that the US or Canadian governments use when dealing with any other country.

You're joking right? You claim that the "off-shore e-commerce" company in question (which claims to be headquartered in Germany) has some sort of semi-sovereign status? Do you even believe this bullshit, or are you just buying whatever your upline sells you, hook, line and sinker without even bothering to fact-check it?

Karatbars falls under the International Bullion Laws set forth by the World Trade Organization under the Harmonious Tax Code.

Karatbars is a scam and there's no such thing as "The Harmonious Tax Code". Prove me wrong if you can: provide a SINGLE link to such a tax code on the WTO website that member states are obligated to follow in lieu of national taxation. Please note, the Harmonized Commodity Description and Coding System, frequently referred to as the "Harmonized Tariff System", isn't a tax code.

As for the "International Bullion Laws" nonsense, please explain to us specifically how the International Bullion Master Agreement applies to Karatbars, and why it is important for someone buying plastic cards from you?

You don't believe it?

I don't.

Don't join.

I won't.

We'll keep doing what we're doing

Until you finally give up and move to selling shittens or somesuch.

helping individuals, families and business entities around the world

I don't think that giving people bad advice and urging them to buy the shit you peddle and join your network qualifies as helping.

to continue acquiring the highest asset class of gold there is, in smaller, more affordable, transaction friendly weights, ...AND or system will help them acquire the residual cash flow to do it.

Yes... the famed cash flows of $40,000 a week, and the ounces upon ounces of free gold.

Tell me something, do you really believe the shit you're peddling, or are you just lying through your teeth?

[24KT]

Forging? LOL... I thought I was doing everyone a service - people will get a lot more out of zombo.com - where you can do anything and the only limit is yourself - than from the stupid spam-page you linked to.


You're right. I don't get why you keep spamming these boards with your bullshit, and I don't get how anyone can be stupid enough to fall for the fool's gold you're peddling.


Your "program" - and let's be clear about this - is to separate gullible fools from their money.


Do you even understand any of this, or did you just copy-paste it? Let's see... a quick Google search and what have we here amd here? "[...] That is why SGE's larger physical deliveries don't matter, as the ZIRP free money drives leveraged speculation in all markets, gold included. Simply the weight of this money in the gold market overwhelms the non-leverage money from the “good natured and hard working” just looking for safety."

Man, this reads like your bullshit almost word-for-word.


And the solution is to "hoard" gold in plastic-card form, a gram at a time?


For future reference, please don't use terms whose meaning is unclear only to appear smart and knowledgeable - you'll only appear stupid. And if you're going to explain an acronym, explain it correctly.


So the fact that gold futures trade lower proves to you that people want gold today? As opposed to.. oh, I don't know... people think that gold today is still terribly overpriced?


The "asset class" (and I use the term loosely) being plastic cards? Right?


And I'll bet that they're all as knowledgeable about gold, economics and investing as you are.


Of course it is. You get incentives for everyone you bring on board and for everyone they, then, bring on board. That's the textbook definition of multi-level marketing.


You're joking right? You claim that the "off-shore e-commerce" company in question (which claims to be headquartered in Germany) has some sort of semi-sovereign status? Do you even believe this bullshit, or are you just buying whatever your upline sells you, hook, line and sinker without even bothering to fact-check it?


Karatbars is a scam and there's no such thing as "The Harmonious Tax Code". Prove me wrong if you can: provide a SINGLE link to such a tax code on the WTO website that member states are obligated to follow in lieu of national taxation. Please note, the Harmonized Commodity Description and Coding System, frequently referred to as the "Harmonized Tariff System", isn't a tax code.

As for the "International Bullion Laws" nonsense, please explain to us specifically how the International Bullion Master Agreement applies to Karatbars, and why it is important for someone buying plastic cards from you?


I don't.


I won't.


Until you finally give up and move to selling shittens or somesuch.


I don't think that giving people bad advice and urging them to buy the shit you peddle and join your network qualifies as helping.


Yes... the famed cash flows of $40,000 a week, and the ounces upon ounces of free gold.

Tell me something, do you really believe the shit you're peddling, or are you just lying through your teeth?

You're too funny for words.

Let's get this straight, ...YOU bring up MY business, ...then accuse ME of spamming? Right.     

As for the similarities in my earlier post... what can I say. It wasn't a cut & paste job. I hadn't read the two articles you linked, prior to your linking them, however, I do read a lot of syndicated blogs, and international news sites to gain greater perspective. It's quite possible my memory retained those sentences from elsewhere. Nevertheless, it does describe the current situation we're dealing with.

[avxo]

You're too funny for words.

Let's get this straight, ...YOU bring up MY business, ...then accuse ME of spamming? Right.     

As for the similarities in my earlier post... what can I say. It wasn't a cut & paste job. I hadn't read the two articles you linked, prior to your linking them, however, I do read a lot of syndicated blogs, and international news sites to gain greater perspective. It's quite possible my memory retained those sentences from elsewhere. Nevertheless, it does describe the current situation we're dealing with.

So... you can't provide a link to the "Harmonious Tax Code" then?

[OzmO]

LMAO......