Getbig.com: American Bodybuilding, Fitness and Figure
Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: bigkubby on April 06, 2015, 06:48:18 PM
-
And why. They are both midgets , discuss!!!
-
And why. They are both midgets , discuss!!!
From who would you want to look like? Shawn , Who would beat who in a contest? Dexter would dominate Shawn's narrow ass
-
Shawn.
-
(http://musclemecca.com/imported-images/2010/03/34zd0eq-1.jpg)
-
I used to say shawn but def Dexter now, u can tell that with Dex when he stops competing he will still be lean cause he's naturally a lean guy. With shawn he's naturally a thicker guy and without training he's fat
-
I used to say shawn but def Dexter now, u can tell that with Dex when he stops competing he will still be lean cause he's naturally a lean guy. With shawn he's naturally a thicker guy and without training he's fat
whats does that even mean
-
Dex said he weighed 240 in recent contests. That's kinda hard to believe
-
whats does that even mean
It's actually in German
-
Had? Dexter still has a better physique than a prime Shawn Gay
-
Shawn never pushed it with regards to size. Would have been interesting to see what he would have looked like if he did.
-
Question is, who had the better abs & thigh?
-
Question is, who had the better abs & thigh?
Shawn looks insane there. I give that pose to Shawn.
-
Shawn never pushed it with regards to size. Would have been interesting to see what he would have looked like if he did.
No that's not true, he tried going 215 and his condition suffered , prob why he always competed at 210 to play it safe
-
No that's not true, he tried going 215 and his condition suffered , prob why he always competed at 210 to play it safe
Shawn ray from his early 20's till he retired was pretty much the same size on stage. He wasn't a heavy drug user compared to his contemporaries. Also his off season and pre contest diet renamed the same. He just increased his workout intensity pre contest.
If he was willing to push the boat out with drugs and upped the calories in his off season he could have easily packed on much more size.
-
(http://s1012.photobucket.com/user/BODYBUILDINGGOD/media/vlcsnap-1142567.jpg)
-
(http://i44.tinypic.com/sz8ljs.jpg)
-
Shawn
-
Shawn Ray...
No comparison really.
As he was getting ready for his show... damn... when they video taped him in front of the mirrors... I had never, and still have never seen anything like it....
This vid also:
Check out his vid (VHS ha!) "The Final Countdown" ~ so polished. Like I said, never saw anything like it ~
92' 94' 99' ~ Dexter has a different physique. Yeah, he's short, but he doesn't have the skin, the look, the symmetry.... naaaaahh...
(http://i183.photobucket.com/albums/x263/timeamajorova/shawn%20ray%20h_zpsclwpxnbk.jpg) (http://s183.photobucket.com/user/timeamajorova/media/shawn%20ray%20h_zpsclwpxnbk.jpg.html)
Dexter Jackson looks awesome and stands the test of time... but I can't compare the two. The only two guys I have ever been able to really compare with identical physiques were Eric Bui and Jesse Duque. Other than that... it's impossible for me.
Same with Zane. "Zane-like' yes... but someone close? NEVER!
-
Some reasons Shawn wins is he never had a turtle gut, he had good calves, very complete BB, and didn't have oil injected in his arms.
-
And why. They are both midgets , discuss!!!
Shawn by a country mile. Anyone who tells you differently clearly has a biased agenda.
What I find amazing is that Shawn has placed 2nd to Dorian Yates in his PRIME, who ND is infatuated with, yet, ND bashes Shawn whenever he gets the chance. Sorry to hurt your feelings ND, but Shawn was one of the best and most consistent bodybuilders during THE MOST competitive era we have ever seen. Dexter Jackson would not have broken the top 15 back then, while Shawn was runner up more than once to your love interest.
-
ND in 5...4....3....2....1
-
And why. They are both midgets , discuss!!!
Dexter has an Olympia title, and many more pro wins. Cased closed from a competitive standpoint. I used to be a fan of Shawn's physique years ago, but in looking back, he was way overrated. He had a pleasing physique, but no where near good enough to take home the big prize.
-
Shawn!!!
-
Dexter has an Olympia title, and many more pro wins. Cased closed from a competitive standpoint. I used to be a fan of Shawn's physique years ago, but in looking back, he was way overrated. He had a pleasing physique, but no where near good enough to take home the big prize.
Same here. Most would go with shawn but Dexter accomplished so much more and from a bbing stand point he is superior to shawn ever was
Shawn has a damn good physique but imo I think even chris cormier is better
-
No that's not true, he tried going 215 and his condition suffered , prob why he always competed at 210 to play it safe
Weird that all those years of competing and he was afraid of coming in too heavy. Retire for bodybuilding and he turns into a fat slob...
-
As time goes by, Shawn Ray and Rich Gaspari's physique's are looking less and less impressive...Shawn's total lack of quad sweep and his overall narrowness really shows as time goes by.
-
Dexter def wins all of the back poses against Shawn
-
Shawn Ray vs.Dexter Jackson head to head battles-3:0.Fact!
-
Shawn Ray vs.Dexter Jackson head to head battles-3:0.Fact!
True.
Dexter peaked way after Shawn Retired.
-
(http://i44.tinypic.com/sz8ljs.jpg)
shawn ray was the master of this pose ,kev looked great too but it showcased his delts/arms moreso,ray it was the whole balance,ray could also hit a good crab pose too ,dex does a great crab pose/and looks pretty good in the 'shawn'mm as well.
-
Chest - tie
Back - Dexter
Legs - shawn
Calves - shawn
Arms - Dexter
Shoulders - Dexter
Abs - tie
At thier primes Dexter is better
-
The blade
-
The blade
INSANE,ONLY DIFFERENCE IN THE FRONT DOUBI SHOT SHAWN HAS IS THE MIDSECTION 'SHAPE'.DEX ARMS ARE NUTS.
-
INSANE,ONLY DIFFERENCE IN THE FRONT DOUBI SHOT SHAWN HAS IS THE MIDSECTION 'SHAPE'.DEX ARMS ARE NUTS.
True
People always talk about phil and arms but they don't realize how good of arms Dex has. I've seen him in person and they are much better than shawns and I've seen shawn when he was training out of golds in fullerton
-
True.
Dexter peaked way after Shawn Retired.
Kind of like Dorian and Ronnie situation.
-
(http://i44.tinypic.com/sz8ljs.jpg)
Reality check
-
Dexter def wins all of the back poses against Shawn
Dexter is wider , heavier and just as shredded. Dexter's lat spreads blow Shawn's out of the water
-
Chest - tie
Back - Dexter
Legs - shawn
Calves - shawn
Arms - Dexter
Shoulders - Dexter
Abs - tie
At thier primes Dexter is better
Their chests are not tied. Shawn destroys Dexter. If you take them both at their best, I still have to go with Shawn. Obviously Dexter has had the better career but Shawn is the more complete bodybuilder.
-
I don't see how anyone can say Dexter over Shawn. No disrespect to Dex but Shawn was better and from a time period when bodybuilders were just better.
-
Shawn looked good in his posing routines
Shawn looked good alone
Shawn disappeared by the giants
Shawn's posing though... they say Ed Corney had that and still does, but Shawn has to have been one of the most copied posers of all time. He was very polished, fluid and graceful in his posing. He made himself look good in every pose.
When I saw other competitors try to emulate him, it was always horrid.
I suppose Shawn's qualities were just something that can't really be compared to another's... which is why he is where he is today.
If I had a physique to chose for myself back in that day, it would have been his over Flex Wheelers or any of the other guys.
Prior to that, it would have been Zane's ... regardless of his supposed lack of size.
Both of those guys were highly symmetrical and very successful.. even today.
As far as a favorite today? I like Flex Lewis. He has some awesomeness going on. They like to compare him to Lee, but again, I see it here and there, but Lee was also in a class of his own. Lee Priest could stand with the giants without a problem, as could Labrada.
Hmmmmmm.....
Labrada. Another favorite.
-
I don't see how anyone can say Dexter over Shawn. No disrespect to Dex but Shawn was better and from a time period when bodybuilders were just better.
Dexter kills him in more poses. Shawn isn't thouching Dexter in either latspread or back double biceps , or side chest , or most muscular. Dexter is bigger by far at about the same height
-
No that's not true, he tried going 215 and his condition suffered , prob why he always competed at 210 to play it safe
Dexter was bigger and WON every major title , Shawn didn't = no comparison, Dex for the win.
-
No that's not true, he tried going 215 and his condition suffered , prob why he always competed at 210 to play it safe
He was supposedly 205 not 210 and I bet he was probably 200. Shawn weighed 201lbs in 1988 at the Olympia I doubt he ever got higher than that , maybe 205lbs
-
Shawn competed in the most competitive era in bodybuilding. This is how he did in the biggest show.
Shawn Ray
1988 Mr. Olympia – 13th Place
1990 Mr. Olympia – 3rd Place
1991 Mr. Olympia – 5th Place
1992 Mr. Olympia – 4th Place
1993 Mr. Olympia – 3rd Place
1994 Mr. Olympia – 2nd Place
1995 Mr. Olympia – 4th Place
1996 Mr. Olympia – 2nd Place
1997 Mr. Olympia – 3rd Place
1998 Mr. Olympia – 5th Place
1999 Mr. Olympia – 5th Place
2000 Mr. Olympia – 4th Place
2001 Mr. Olympia – 4th Place
This is how Dexter did in a less competitive era in Olympias.
Dexter Jackson
1999 Mr. Olympia, 9th
2000 Mr. Olympia, 9th
2001 Mr. Olympia, 8th
2002 Mr. Olympia, 4th
2003 Mr. Olympia, 3rd
2004 Mr. Olympia, 4th
2006 Mr. Olympia, 4th
2007 Mr. Olympia, 3rd
2008 Mr. Olympia, 1st
2009 Mr. Olympia, 3rd
2010 Mr. Olympia, 4th
2011 Mr. Olympia, 6th
2012 Mr. Olympia, 4th
2013 Mr. Olympia, 5th
2014 Mr. Olympia, 5th
Though Dexter has the Olympia win and an overall better competition record. A valid argument can be made that Shawn was a better bodybuilder. He's more complete than Dexter. If you put them next to each other you begin to see the wholes in Dexter's physique. I'd rather look like Shawn Ray but have Dexter's record.
-
Shawn competed in the most competitive era in bodybuilding. This is how he did in the biggest show.
Shawn Ray
1988 Mr. Olympia – 13th Place
1990 Mr. Olympia – 3rd Place
1991 Mr. Olympia – 5th Place
1992 Mr. Olympia – 4th Place
1993 Mr. Olympia – 3rd Place
1994 Mr. Olympia – 2nd Place
1995 Mr. Olympia – 4th Place
1996 Mr. Olympia – 2nd Place
1997 Mr. Olympia – 3rd Place
1998 Mr. Olympia – 5th Place
1999 Mr. Olympia – 5th Place
2000 Mr. Olympia – 4th Place
2001 Mr. Olympia – 4th Place
This is how Dexter did in a less competitive era in Olympias.
Dexter Jackson
1999 Mr. Olympia, 9th
2000 Mr. Olympia, 9th
2001 Mr. Olympia, 8th
2002 Mr. Olympia, 4th
2003 Mr. Olympia, 3rd
2004 Mr. Olympia, 4th
2006 Mr. Olympia, 4th
2007 Mr. Olympia, 3rd
2008 Mr. Olympia, 1st
2009 Mr. Olympia, 3rd
2010 Mr. Olympia, 4th
2011 Mr. Olympia, 6th
2012 Mr. Olympia, 4th
2013 Mr. Olympia, 5th
2014 Mr. Olympia, 5th
Though Dexter has the Olympia win and an overall better competition record. A valid argument can be made that Shawn was a better bodybuilder. He's more complete than Dexter. If you put them next to each other you begin to see the wholes in Dexter's physique. I'd rather look like Shawn Ray but have Dexter's record.
13 TOP 5'S TO 11..CLOSE ,,DEX DID MORE OVERALL SHOWS THO,,,
-
Shawn competed in the most competitive era in bodybuilding. This is how he did in the biggest show.
Shawn Ray
1988 Mr. Olympia – 13th Place
1990 Mr. Olympia – 3rd Place
1991 Mr. Olympia – 5th Place
1992 Mr. Olympia – 4th Place
1993 Mr. Olympia – 3rd Place
1994 Mr. Olympia – 2nd Place
1995 Mr. Olympia – 4th Place
1996 Mr. Olympia – 2nd Place
1997 Mr. Olympia – 3rd Place
1998 Mr. Olympia – 5th Place
1999 Mr. Olympia – 5th Place
2000 Mr. Olympia – 4th Place
2001 Mr. Olympia – 4th Place
This is how Dexter did in a less competitive era in Olympias.
Dexter Jackson
1999 Mr. Olympia, 9th
2000 Mr. Olympia, 9th
2001 Mr. Olympia, 8th
2002 Mr. Olympia, 4th
2003 Mr. Olympia, 3rd
2004 Mr. Olympia, 4th
2006 Mr. Olympia, 4th
2007 Mr. Olympia, 3rd
2008 Mr. Olympia, 1st
2009 Mr. Olympia, 3rd
2010 Mr. Olympia, 4th
2011 Mr. Olympia, 6th
2012 Mr. Olympia, 4th
2013 Mr. Olympia, 5th
2014 Mr. Olympia, 5th
Though Dexter has the Olympia win and an overall better competition record. A valid argument can be made that Shawn was a better bodybuilder. He's more complete than Dexter. If you put them next to each other you begin to see the wholes in Dexter's physique.
No valid argument can be made that Shawn was a better bodybuilder NONE Dexter has more pro wins and has an Olympia , Shawn isn't more ' complete ' either. You keep asserting this and never proved it.
Dexter 21 pro victories including the big one
Shawn 2 pro victories
There is NO way in HELL Shawn is on Dexter's level.
-
Dexter is the better bodybuilder overall but I would rather look more like Shawn any day.
-
13 TOP 5'S TO 11..CLOSE ,,DEX DID MORE OVERALL SHOWS THO,,,
I agree. Dex is cool I just prefer Shawn's look over Dexter. Shawn was more complete. Dexter has high lats, no calves and a weak chest. His BDB lacks detail compared to the greats also. Shawn was a little narrow but not Phil Heath narrow and his back lacked density. One could argue he could use more quad sweep as well. Shawn appears to have thinner skin and his skin tone, vascularity, and separation was better than Dex. Dex has thicker skin but is still shredded.
-
Would rather look like Shawn too.
Dex is good but he competed in a pretty shitty era, just ronnie was good.
Plus he looks like a turtle, has high lats and zero calves.
Shawn competed against many greats and was more complete.
-
No valid argument can be made that Shawn was a better bodybuilder NONE Dexter has more pro wins and has an Olympia , Shawn isn't more ' complete ' either. You keep asserting this and never proved it.
Dexter 21 pro victories including the big one
Shawn 2 pro victories
There is NO way in HELL Shawn is on Dexter's level.
Aint gettin' into it with you today. Keep it movin. You talk that shit about Dexter and Shawn with pro victories but if I point out that Ronnie has more Olympias than Dorian then you'll change the argument to winning percentage. You change arguments to fit your agenda I've been over this with you for several years. LOL Shawn not on Dexter's level and Shawn beat him every time they competed against each other, yeah, ok bro ::). Let me guess, not a prime Dex right? Kinda like not a prime Coleman against Dorian. Get outta here. I destroy your logic and reasoning everytime we do this. You've had a hardon against Shawn for the last month. Shawn Ray was not overrated He was right where he belongs.
-
Would rather look like Shawn too.
Dex is good but he competed in a pretty shitty era, just ronnie was good.
Plus he looks like a turtle, has high lats and zero calves.
Shawn competed against many greats and was more complete.
WIGGS AND CALFZILLA GOOD POINTS,,,THERE IS 2 S RAYS ,,1988 TO 94 PRETTY BOY SHAWN ,HOLDING ON TO HIS FLAT TOP ,HAD SICK FULL MUSCLE/GREAT SHAPE AND RIPPED ...95 DONS WEAVE FOR 1 SHOW 'ARNOLD',,96 SHAVED HEAD VERSION ON UP BUILD GETS DIFFERENT LOOK SOME PRETTY CRAZY CONDITION MORE PEELED AT TIMES.. BRINGS LEGS DOWN A BIT TO MATCH UPPER BODY ..GREAT RUN..
-
Would rather look like Shawn too.
Dex is good but he competed in a pretty shitty era, just ronnie was good.
Plus he looks like a turtle, has high lats and zero calves.
Shawn competed against many greats and was more complete.
Someone please point this out to ND. I know he'll ignore it but we should at least try.
-
(http://musclemecca.com/imported-images/2010/03/34zd0eq-1.jpg)
right bicep looks oiled up.
-
1994 was his best in my opinion................
-
1994 was his best in my opinion................
pretty wicked.
-
Aint gettin' into it with you today. Keep it movin. You talk that shit about Dexter and Shawn with pro victories but if I point out that Ronnie has more Olympias than Dorian then you'll change the argument to winning percentage. You change arguments to fit your agenda I've been over this with you for several years. LOL Shawn not on Dexter's level and Shawn beat him every time they competed against each other, yeah, ok bro ::). Let me guess, not a prime Dex right? Kinda like not a prime Coleman against Dorian. Get outta here. I destroy your logic and reasoning everytime we do this. You've had a hardon against Shawn for the last month. Shawn Ray was not overrated He was right where he belongs.
Typical Wiggs when confronted with facts , just keep on trucking regardless. let me simplify this for you
Mr Olympia Dexter Jackson 21 pro victories Mr
Shawn 2
cased closed.
Dexter kicks Shawns ass as a competitive bodybuilder it's not open for discussion.
Now we can play the " What If " game but facts are facts Wiggs and facts aren't your friend.
-
1994 was his best in my opinion................
That's what the consensus was. He looked great that year and still was behind Levrone after the prejudging lol
-
:)
-
Typical Wiggs when confronted with facts , just keep on trucking regardless. let me simplify this for you
Mr Olympia Dexter Jackson 21 pro victories Mr
Shawn 2
cased closed.
Dexter kicks Shawns ass as a competitive bodybuilder it's not open for discussion.
Now we can play the " What If " game but facts are facts Wiggs and facts aren't your friend.
No one's arguing who has more victories. That's very evident. What is a fact is that EVERY TIME Dexter competed against Shawn, DEXTER LOST.
3-0. That is not open for discussion. There is no what ifs. Dexter has never beaten Shawn Ray. FACT Dexter has the better record. Shawn is more complete. Having a better record doesn't make you the better bodybuilder. You argue this point all the time with Ronnie and Dorian.
Facts aren't your friend.
-
No one's arguing who has more victories. That's very evident. What is a fact is that EVERY TIME Dexter competed against Shawn, DEXTER LOST.
3-0. That is not open for discussion. There is no what ifs. Dexter has never beaten Shawn Ray. FACT Dexter has the better record. Shawn is the better bodybuilder. Having a better record doesn't make you the better bodybuilder. You argue this point all the time with Ronnie and Dorian.
Facts aren't your friend.
Same logic applies to Ronnie , never beat Dorian , etc , etc , etc Now if you say Ronnie wasn't Ronnie when Dorian beat him you have to concede Dexter wasn't Dexter when Shawn beat him. You can't have it both ways.
Who has a better physique at their best? That's subjective and in my opinion it's Dexter. Who is a better competitive bodybuilder? No question Dexter
-
Mr Olympia Dexter Jackson 21 pro victories Mr
Shawn 2
cased closed.
Dexter kicks Shawns ass as a competitive bodybuilder it's not open for discussion.
Now we can play the " What If " game but facts are facts Wiggs and facts aren't your friend.
So according to your argumentation:
Ronnie Coleman 8 sandows, Dorian Yates 6 sandwos
Ronnie kicks Dorians ass as a competitive bodybuilder it's not open for discussion.
Now we can play the " What If " game but facts are facts.... ;D
-
So according to your argumentation:
Ronnie Coleman 8 sandows, Dorian Yates 6 sandwos
Ronnie kicks Dorians ass as a competitive bodybuilder it's not open for discussion.
Now we can play the " What If " game but facts are facts.... ;D
technically yes , Ronnie is the best competitive bodybuilder he has the most Olympias and the most pro victories.
However he NEVER beat Dorian in a contest ;) they faced each other I believe 8 times and Ronnie lost all 8 ;D
Facts-are-Facts Dorian always beat Ronnie
-
Same logic applies to Ronnie , never beat Dorian , etc , etc , etc Now if you say Ronnie wasn't Ronnie when Dorian beat him you have to concede Dexter wasn't Dexter when Shawn beat him. You can't have it both ways.
Who has a better physique at their best? That's subjective and in my opinion it's Dexter. Who is a better competitive bodybuilder? No question Dexter
Bro, do you read? How many times do I have to type Dexter has a better competitive record before it sinks in? I started a thread on this last month giving Dexter all the props in the world. Dexter is an all time great because of his consistency, and his Olympia win. Shawn is an all time great because of his completeness.
This is you changing arguments not me. I'm using your words against you. Shawns best is better than Dexters. Why? Because Shawn is more complete. Dexter can't touch Shawn and has never come close.
-
Had? Dexter still has a better physique than a prime Shawn Gay
NO
-
technically yes , Ronnie is the best competitive bodybuilder he has the most Olympias and the most pro victories.
However he NEVER beat Dorian in a contest ;) they faced each other I believe 8 times and Ronnie lost all 8 ;D
Facts-are-Facts Dorian always beat Ronnie
That's fine. Then with that logic which I use against you every time and it's true, Haney has 8 Mr. Os to Dorian's 6 AND he's beaten him head to head.
Facts are facts. Haney beat Dorian and has more Olympias. :-*
Haney is the better man. The best man.
-
No one's arguing who has more victories. That's very evident. What is a fact is that EVERY TIME Dexter competed against Shawn, DEXTER LOST.
3-0. That is not open for discussion. There is no what ifs. Dexter has never beaten Shawn Ray. FACT Dexter has the better record. Shawn is more complete. Having a better record doesn't make you the better bodybuilder. You argue this point all the time with Ronnie and Dorian.
Facts aren't your friend.
no taking sides but Shawn competed against MUCH MUCH better competetion
-
That's fine. Then with that logic which I use against you every time and it's true, Haney has 8 Mr. Os to Dorian's 6 AND he's beaten him head to head.
Facts are facts. Haney beat Dorian and has more Olympias. :-*
Haney is the better man. The best man.
Haney was better than Dorian. Dorian forced him into retirement lol ;D
-
Haney was better than Dorian. Dorian forced him into retirement lol ;D
And Ronnie forced Dorian into retirement 8)
-
Haney was better than Dorian. Dorian forced him into retirement lol ;D
Yes, he forced him into retirement with his zero wins and zero sandows against him. Seems legit.
-
no taking sides but Shawn competed against MUCH MUCH better competetion
Agreed my friend.
-
And Ronnie forced Dorian into retirement 8)
No stop it lol Ronnie was 9th in 97
Yes, he forced him into retirement with his zero wins and zero sandows against him. Seems legit.
He beat a career best Haney in the muscularity round ;) in his acceptance speech after winning the Olympia in 91 Haney when asked if he was going to retired said he just learned how to peak on the day of the contest and said he may be around for more wins lol he never returned why? ;)
-
I gotta give Dexter the edge in the mass department
-
No stop it lol Ronnie was 9th in 97
He beat a career best Haney in the muscularity round ;) in his acceptance speech after winning the Olympia in 91 Haney when asked if he was going to retired said he just learned how to peak on the day of the contest and said he may be around for more wins lol he never returned why? ;)
Because he beat Arnold's record and Yates ushered in an era of drug abuse Haney didn't want any part of. That's why. Dorian ruined bodybuilding. FACT.
-
No stop it lol Ronnie was 9th in 97
Sorry, my fault. It was Nasser the beautiful man with glasses who butt-raped Dorian in front of the eyes of the entire "industry" and forced him into retirement ;D
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=219693.0;attach=257461)
-
Because he beat Arnold's record and Yates ushered in an era of drug abuse Haney didn't want any part of. That's why. Dorian ruined bodybuilding. FACT.
Wrong again ;) Momo did that
-
Sorry, my fault. It was Nasser the beautiful man with glasses who butt-raped Dorian in front of the eyes of the entire "industry" and forced him into retirement ;D
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=219693.0;attach=257461)
he raped Dorian from the front but from the back he was the one who was getting raped ;D
-
Shawn Ray end of story. ;)
-
Shawn Ray end of story. ;)
Agreed X2...lets move on...thread ended
-
Agreed X2...lets move on...thread ended
;)
-
i would rather look like shawn but he never deserved better than 5th at the olympia
E
-
Shawn
-
Wrong again ;) Momo did that
No, you're wrong. Momo didn't have the influence Dorian did. People were chasing Dorian, not Momo.
-
No, you're wrong. Momo didn't have the influence Dorian did. People were chasing Dorian, not Momo.
Has nothing to do with Dorian , Kevin was chasing Dorian he never had a gut , Flex was chasing Dorian he never had a gut , same with Vince Taylor , Dillett , Shawn , etc , etc
You can make a case for Shawn being better than Dexter just because he never had a gut
-
Has nothing to do with Dorian , Kevin was chasing Dorian he never had a gut , Flex was chasing Dorian he never had a gut , same with Vince Taylor , Dillett , Shawn , etc , etc
You can make a case for Shawn being better than Dexter just because he never had a gut
Meaning he Dorian changed the look to larger and more extreme. Then Coleman continued it. It started with Dorian. He and the judges that voted for him ruined bodybuilding.
-
Shawn. Let me explain my opinion.
Dexter has an Olympia, so does Dickerson. Does that mean at his peak he was better? Not at all. Dexter has more wins than Shawn, so does Branch. Does that mean at his peak he was better? Absolutely not.
Shaun was obsessed with aesthetics and held true to the bodybuilding ideal, Dex went for size. He has no calves and had a very noticeable difference between his arm sizes. Sure hes bigger, and yes he has comparable conditioning (prime for prime not as good IMO) but Shawn had a more complete physique that was better balanced. Everyone bitches and moans that "size ruined bodybuilding" but its the same people that are the first to say, "...but X is bigger".
The era's say it all, when Dex was competing in Shawn's era he called him out saying he was gonna kick his ass. Never happened. Dex was getting top 3 in GP shows when Shawn was competing EXCLUSIVELY in the O. How many wins would he have had if he decided to do the tour and compete 4-5 times per year? How many Arnold's? I have no idea, but i can only guess it would be ALOT more than he finished his career with.
I like Dex, i think his physique is exceptional but i think Shawn has him at his very best. Just my opinion.
-
When Dexter won the 2008 Mr O, he beat Jay Cutler & Phil Heath. That is a very impressive feat.
-
Dex.
p[ut the one pose where weaknesses cant be hidden, FDB.
Dex destroys shawn in it.
Shawn's FDB looks horrible. Dex's looks amazing.
shawn got ripped. his chest dissapears in FDB. his Front lat spread also. his legs were blocky, and he appeared narrow from the front.
his arms were also lacking in the FDB. and FLS.
he carried far less mass than dex and his lower body didnt flow.
dex's mass flowed from top to bottom and popped out towards you.
his x frame flowed like a cartoon character. Dex shouldve won more O's.
shawn got the placings he deserved.
-
I have always preferred Ray's physique over everyone.
-
Dex.
p[ut the one pose where weaknesses cant be hidden, FDB.
Dex destroys shawn in it.
Shawn's FDB looks horrible. Dex's looks amazing.
shawn got ripped. his chest dissapears in FDB. his Front lat spread also. his legs were blocky, and he appeared narrow from the front.
his arms were also lacking in the FDB. and FLS.
he carried far less mass than dex and his lower body didnt flow.
dex's mass flowed from top to bottom and popped out towards you.
his x frame flowed like a cartoon character. Dex shouldve won more O's.
shawn got the placings he deserved.
Obviously, this post was written by a homosexual, nevertheless, it tells the truth
-
Bro, do you read? How many times do I have to type Dexter has a better competitive record before it sinks in? I started a thread on this last month giving Dexter all the props in the world. Dexter is an all time great because of his consistency, and his Olympia win. Shawn is an all time great because of his completeness.
This is you changing arguments not me. I'm using your words against you. Shawns best is better than Dexters. Why? Because Shawn is more complete. Dexter can't touch Shawn and has never come close.
I don't know Wiggs
If both shawn and Dexter were at thier best (dex is still at his best) I'm afraid Dex is just too big for shawn and just as conditioned
Of course at this point we can only speculate
I've seen both in person and shawn while he was still competing and Dex is a lot bigger, Dex looks at least 20 pds heavier imo
-
Shawn. Let me explain my opinion.
Dexter has an Olympia, so does Dickerson. Does that mean at his peak he was better? Not at all. Dexter has more wins than Shawn, so does Branch. Does that mean at his peak he was better? Absolutely not.
Shaun was obsessed with aesthetics and held true to the bodybuilding ideal, Dex went for size. He has no calves and had a very noticeable difference between his arm sizes. Sure hes bigger, and yes he has comparable conditioning (prime for prime not as good IMO) but Shawn had a more complete physique that was better balanced. Everyone bitches and moans that "size ruined bodybuilding" but its the same people that are the first to say, "...but X is bigger".
The era's say it all, when Dex was competing in Shawn's era he called him out saying he was gonna kick his ass. Never happened. Dex was getting top 3 in GP shows when Shawn was competing EXCLUSIVELY in the O. How many wins would he have hadif he decided to do the tour and compete 4-5 times per year? How many Arnold's? I have no idea, but i can only guess it would be ALOT more than he finished his career with.
I like Dex, i think his physique is exceptional but i think Shawn has him at his very best. Just my opinion.
This is absurd , flex, and kevin would have made sure Shawn would never win
Aside from his early arnold win Shawn did compete in another arnold and didn't do too good, he did the O exclusively prob cause he knows he couldn't hold his condition. Shawn is a smart guy, all business
-
I don't know Wiggs
If both shawn and Dexter were at thier best (dex is still at his best) I'm afraid Dex is just too big for shawn and just as conditioned
Of course at this point we can only speculate
I've seen both in person and shawn while he was still competing and Dex is a lot bigger, Dex looks at least 20 pds heavier imo
Everyone Shawn placed ahead of was bigger. Shawn completeness puts him ahead.
-
whats does that even mean
Are you retarded?? Was that seriously a difficult post for you to comprehend??
-
Everyone Shawn placed ahead of was bigger. Shawn completeness puts him ahead.
Shawn only beat the other guys when they were off , he had the luxury of competing once a year while the other guys did more shows , when they were off he would place ahead of them. He was a second tier bodybuilder at best ( and no Bay second tier no homo )
-
Might as well start arguing about music.
Both are equally subjective.
Each to his own.
Nothing will be solved here.
Those who like Shawn better won't end up changing their minds because of this thread.... duuuuuuuuuhhhhhh....
-
Might as well start arguing about music.
Both are equally subjective.
Each to his own.
Nothing will be solved here.
Those who like Shawn better won't end up changing their minds because of this thread.... duuuuuuuuuhhhhhh....
There is a way to determine who is better they use it all the time in contests. ;D
-
Shawn only beat the other guys when they were off , he had the luxury of competing once a year while the other guys did more shows , when they were off he would place ahead of them. He was a second tier bodybuilder at best ( and no Bay second tier no homo )
Shawn didn't have to compete because he had a Weider contract...Weider took good care of him...he didn't really need the money......and didn't Shawn get gypped out of a win due to drug testing?
-
Shawn didn't have to compete because he had a Weider contract...Weider took good care of him...he didn't really need the money......and didn't Shawn get gypped out of a win due to drug testing?
Shawn put all his eggs in one basket in the Olympia , yeah 1990 Arnold Classic
-
Vince Taylor beat Shawn a couple times.... 1991 Olympia and the 1996 Arnold
Lee Labrada beat Shawn a few times too... 1988 Olympia, 1990 Olympia, 1991 Olympia, 1992 Olympia
I bet that a prime Dexter could've beaten Shawn a couple times too.
Hard to say.
-
Onstage by himself and in photos Shawn looks unbeatable. Put him in a lineup and he is narrower than Heath.
-
Onstage by himself and in photos Shawn looks unbeatable. Put him in a lineup and he is narrower than Heath.
-
Dexter
-
right bicep looks oiled up.
You can't honestly be that stupid..
-
Shawn does have one of the best leg tear drop ever
-
Both are great. That said, I still can't see that Dex is 35 lbs bigger at the same height????!!!!!! Proof by these two pics of Shawn. I'm sorry, but if Dex weighs what he says he does. Wouldn't 35 pounds over shawn be very noticeable? That's a lot of weight, for 2 guys that Were the same height. Better vascularity on Shawn, and quad separation and striations. But the same can be said for some of Dexters body parts . Shoulders on Dex were as shredded as Munzers at times. Lets call them even! Both have equally but different strengths!
-
Both are great. That said, I still can't see that Dex is 35 lbs bigger at the same height????!!!!!! Proof by these two pics of Shawn. I'm sorry, but if Dex weighs what he says he does. Wouldn't 35 pounds over shawn be very noticeable? That's a lot of weight, for 2 guys that Were the same height. Better vascularity on Shawn, and quad depredation and striations. But the same can be said for some of Dexters body parts . Shoulders on Dex were as shredded as Munzers at times. Lets call them even! Both have equally but different strengths!
Ah put the side-by-side and the size discrepancy would be clearly evident
-
Too late for that, and pictures are deceiving!
-
This thread is STILL going???...I thought we settled it that Shawn was better
-
Still, side by side, 35 pounds or more in contest condition at the same height would be huge, and I don't see it ever!
-
Still, side by side, 35 pounds or more in contest condition at the same height would be huge, and I don't see it ever!
Shawn was much more cut and vascular
-
Is Dexter really 240 lbs as he says he is?
-
No way!
-
Ok , I'll amend that.... If Dex weighs whatever he says, then shawn was only 10 to 15 pounds lighter at best. Dex looks real small onstage next to Phil and Kai, and in Shawn's case it was the same with Dorian, Kevin, Nasser. A much different, bigger, more shredded field.
-
And this pose of Shawn's is hard to look good in unless you are full, diced, and complete!
-
Is Dexter really 240 lbs as he says he is?
I thought he was 230-235?
-
No F-n way Dex is ever 40 lbs bigger than Shawn here! C'mon! Maybe Shawn did not lie about his weight? Just saying!!! I don't see 35-40 pounds ever!!!!
-
Shawn would be a great 212 competitor today....
-
I thought he was 230-235?
I've read and seen a few videos of Dexter where he says he is 240 contest weight. I call BS. He's probably more like 230-235 like you said.
-
shawn ray was the master of this pose ,kev looked great too but it showcased his delts/arms moreso,ray it was the whole balance,ray could also hit a good crab pose too ,dex does a great crab pose/and looks pretty good in the 'shawn'mm as well.
I think shawn had the best hands clasped most muscular of all time:
no one can top him in this pose:
ps he kills Dex too.
-
I see Dexter being around 220. He's lying about his weight.
-
220 sounds more about right!
-
Sorry, my fault. It was Nasser the beautiful man with glasses who butt-raped Dorian in front of the eyes of the entire "industry" and forced him into retirement ;D
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=219693.0;attach=257461)
perhaps - but that image is photoshopped
-
Especially here! The biggest, I've seen Dex. Legs are way up. This years Arnold classic. Looks insane here. Better than Phil Heath. IMO.
-
Just missing calves..😞
-
No stop it lol Ronnie was 9th in 97
He beat a career best Haney in the muscularity round ;) in his acceptance speech after winning the Olympia in 91 Haney when asked if he was going to retired said he just learned how to peak on the day of the contest and said he may be around for more wins lol he never returned why? ;)
And Dorian didn't retire on the day he won his last Olympia either.He announced his retirement a year later at the 98 Olympia,Ronnie's first win.By that time he was well aware of the vast improvements made by Coleman.Ronnie won the 97 Russian Grand Prix and since then he was on a roll,much improved at the 98 NOC and even more improved at the Olympia.And here was someone who could rival Dorian from the back(unlike Nasser). So theoretically it is possible that Dorian retired because of Ronnie.
-
Gotta give it to Shawn. Just better shape and flow overall to his physique. Always been one of my favorites. Dex is great as well, but his physique just doesn't really flow. Shawn's aesthetics and shape are hard to beat. If he was a little wider and had better thigh sweep, he'd be damn near perfect.
-
And Dorian didn't retire on the day he won his last Olympia either.He announced his retirement a year later at the 98 Olympia,Ronnie's first win.By that time he was well aware of the vast improvements made by Coleman.Ronnie won the 97 Russian Grand Prix and since then he was on a roll,much improved at the 98 NOC and even more improved at the Olympia.And here was someone who could rival Dorian from the back(unlike Nasser). So theoretically it is possible that Dorian retired because of Ronnie.
Rubbish. Dorian never feared any competitor, let alone one he always defeated handily. He always stated he was competing against himself. He retired due to his triceps tear not healing adequately for him to continue to compete. A 249 pound Coleman, although more impressive than previous incarnations, was no threat to Dorian.
-
Rubbish. Dorian never feared any competitor, let alone one he always defeated handily. He always stated he was competing against himself. He retired to due his triceps tear not healing adequately for him to continue to compete. A 249 pound Coleman, although more impressive than previous incarnations, was no threat to Dorian.
252 at the night show. And yes, 97 Dorian compares to 98 Coleman. Dorian would have been blown out.
-
which one prolapsed the most anuses?
-
252 at the night show. And yes, 97 Dorian compares to 98 Coleman. Dorian would have been blown out.
Not sure about that, but who says Dorian would have returned in his 1997 shape? Where did Ronnie place in 97 again? Well back in 9th. Dorian had more than enough room to win again if in good form.
-
Reality check
shawn still looked better
-
Not sure about that, but who says Dorian would have returned in his 1997 shape? Where did Ronnie place in 97 again? Well back in 9th. Dorian had more than enough room to win again if in good form.
I'm 100% sure about it. Ronnie was 252 for the evening show. Anyway. Dorian was getting progressively worse, not better. Would not have won in 98. Coleman was too fresh.
-
shawn still looked better
I agree, I'd rather have Shawn's physique, but in bodybuilding terms, Shawn isn't in Dexter's league. Shawn was a mid-carder trying to be a main-eventer.
-
I'm 100% sure about it. Ronnie was 252 for the evening show. Anyway. Dorian was getting progressively worse, not better. Would not have won in 98. Coleman was too fresh.
Yet, he barely beat an off Flex Wheeler. You're not sure about anything. Even off his best, Yates got straight firsts in 97.
-
I agree, I'd rather have Shawn's physique, but in bodybuilding terms, Shawn isn't in Dexter's league. Shawn was a mid-carder trying to be a main-eventer.
If bodybuilding was judged that way it's written, Shawn would beat Dexter every time. Shawn's physique flows, Dexter's doesn't compared to Shawn.
-
Yet, he barely beat an off Flex Wheeler. You're not sure about anything. Even off his best, Yates got straight firsts in 97.
Ronnie went from 9th to 1st. That is an absolutely insane jump. I'm very sure. Coleman would have stomped Yates.
Yeah, thanks to the fair and impartial judging right? Get outta here.
-
If bodybuilding was judged that way it's written, Shawn would beat Dexter every time. Shawn's physique flows, Dexter's doesn't compared to Shawn.
And if being a narrow midget were the criteria, Shawn would have won more than 2 contests in his entire career.
-
Ronnie went from 9th to 1st. That is an absolutely insane jump. I'm very sure. Coleman would have stomped Yates.
Yeah, thanks to the fair and impartial judging right? Get outta here.
Contests are based on judging, whether you agree with it or not. You'd rather it be based on your personal subjective preference, but that's not how it works. Coleman barely beat an off Flex, never mind tangling with Yates. Had Flex been on, Ronnie would have lost. Based on judging history, Coleman would have lost to a remotely in shape Dorian. Even Ronnie stated that Yates would have kept winning. Ronnie couldn't cut the mustard until Yates abdicated his throne. A 1997 Yates would still have been too much for Ronnie in 1998, never mind if Dorian were closer to his top form.
(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_mC1TEdZ4gks/Suy3xoN-yxI/AAAAAAAABbI/9zmP4_suero/s400/000+Mr+Olympia+1997.JPG)
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=544405.0;attach=573543;image)
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=544405.0;attach=573544;image)
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=544405.0;attach=573545;image)
-
Dexter all the way
-
Shawn Ray.
Woooshhhhhh TA NA KA
-
Yates crushed Lee Priest right there
-
Contests are based on judging, whether you agree with it or not. You'd rather it be based on your personal subjective preference, but that's not how it works. Coleman barely beat an off Flex, never mind tangling with Yates. Had Flex been on, Ronnie would have lost. Based on judging history, Coleman would have lost to a remotely in shape Dorian. Even Ronnie stated that Yates would have kept winning. Ronnie couldn't cut the mustard until Yates abdicated his throne. A 1997 Yates would still have been too much for Ronnie in 1998, never mind if Dorian were closer to his top form.
(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_mC1TEdZ4gks/Suy3xoN-yxI/AAAAAAAABbI/9zmP4_suero/s400/000+Mr+Olympia+1997.JPG)
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=544405.0;attach=573543;image)
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=544405.0;attach=573544;image)
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=544405.0;attach=573545;image)
proof that back, calves, & conditioning can win 6 sandows
-
Ronnie was shredded in 1998. Here, he makes Shawn look small & smooth
-
Ronnie was shredded in 1998. Here, he makes Shawn look small & smooth
Looks like that pic comparing Kai to Brandon...
-
Yates crushed Lee Priest right there
So much for Lee priest being the giant killer hahaha
-
for those talking about ronnie vs dorian 97, compare how Ronnie looked in 1997 to how he looked in 1999: look at the jump in size and cuts.
dorian was so far behind this level of development (ronnie 99) it was insane (even at his 93 best). his time was up and he knew it.
-
If Dorian kept competing, Coleman would have supplanted him so the argument is pointless. If Dorian won in 98, it would have been a huge gift and a robbery due to judging methods of the time, and he would have surely lost from 99 on.
-
Gotta give it to Shawn. Just better shape and flow overall to his physique. Always been one of my favorites. Dex is great as well, but his physique just doesn't really flow. Shawn's aesthetics and shape are hard to beat. If he was a little wider and had better thigh sweep, he'd be damn near perfect.
Shawn knew deep down he got cursed with those fat black genetics and its obvious when you look at his physique now...... not your gifted black guy who could stay 6% eating mcdonalds and donuts and stays lean while pounding the slin like dex, thats the REAL reason Shawn never chased more size IMO, he knew his physique would go to shit the moment he started pushing it. The fact that dex is much bigger and still being compared to shawn in the aesthetic department shows you how good dexter is... Any guy who knows anything about drugs and bbing will tell you Dexter's response to hormones is just incredible.
-
Until I see Dexter hit a vacuum pose.. he will never be better than Shawn.
Dex had(s) a turtle stomach and (minus) zero athletism, walked slower than 9month pregnat women.
(http://i.imgur.com/QIdqSzE.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/FQMQR59.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/mevDClh.png)
-
Rubbish. Dorian never feared any competitor, let alone one he always defeated handily. He always stated he was competing against himself. He retired due to his triceps tear not healing adequately for him to continue to compete. A 249 pound Coleman, although more impressive than previous incarnations, was no threat to Dorian.
Haney never said he retired because of Dorian either.Probably the main reason for Dorian's retirement was the injury.But there can always be more than one reason.After all he kept competing after the biceps tear and in 98 he originally stated that he is taking a year off,but coming back in 99.Then suddenly he changed his mind.
-
Not sure about that, but who says Dorian would have returned in his 1997 shape? Where did Ronnie place in 97 again? Well back in 9th. Dorian had more than enough room to win again if in good form.
Dorian is a smart guy.Don't underestimate his intelligence!He knew he stand no chance,otherwise he would have kept competing.
-
The real reason Yates retired.....
He is human, and all the pro-level drugs took toll on his body. He got out before he did himself any more harm.
He probably already had some health issues by '97-'98.
Ronnie was at that point in '06-'07
-
They both looked insane but Dexter has won way more shows plus he has a sandow plus what 5 Arnold Classic titles? Dexter is the best bodybuikder ever-IMO
-
that tri shot of shawn is incredible but what the fuck is with those glasses lol
remind me of 70's shots of John Denver lol
-
even in 93/94/96 shawn never got "hard and grainy" he always seemed to have a 'glaze' over him.
conditioning wins shows and dex is hard and dry at 9/10 shows he does.. actually, I don't recall ever seeing dex not dry.
look at dex's delt. they're hard, crisp, and striated. shawns never were.
I'd say shawn does beat dex on quads however. but compare the deep etch in the tthigh/hamstring in all dex's side shots (side chest/tricep, etc...) shawn ever had that.
all that being said, to determine who's 'better', you'd have to compare pose for pose.... something I do't have time or patience to do at the moment. I will say that dex's front dbl bi pose is about as close to perfection as you'll ever find (2nd to flex wheeler in that pose, IMO)
-
And why. They are both midgets , discuss!!!
Shawn Ray is definitely a midget. I saw him at a restaurant near where I live several years ago. I was surprised at how short and squat he was. He was there with quite the entourage though.
-
Shawn Ray is definitely a midget. I saw him at a restaurant near where I live several years ago. I was surprised at how short and squat he was. He was there with quite the entourage though.
U probably saw kevin hart
-
U probably saw kevin hart
Funny! It was definitely Shawn Ray. He's supposedly 5'8" but I find this difficult to believe. That would have made me only three inches taller then him. He seemed a lot shorter than that.
-
Funny! It was definitely Shawn Ray. He's supposedly 5'8" but I find this difficult to believe. That would have made me only three inches taller then him. He seemed a lot shorter than that.
Shawns around 5'6
-
Shawn is 5'7.
-
Shawn is 5'7.
Maybe in shoes lol
So you've seen him as much as I have in his bbing days :D
A koala bear is taller than shawn
-
Maybe in shoes lol
So you've seen him as much as I have in his bbing days :D
A koala bear is taller than shawn
No that's Lee the koala. Shawn is 5'7 without shoes. I am 5'4 and he's 3 Inches taller than me.
-
I remember when Nasser, aka "the beautiful man with glasses", used to call Shawn "a chihuahua"... ;D
-
Shawn Ray, Dexter Jackson, Flex Lewis, Lee Labrada, Lee Priest and Paul De Mayo...
Comparing them....
is a total waste of time.
Nobody's mind is gonna change.
Compare Dorian to Ronnie.... why again?
-
isn't Lee Priest also a midget ?
-
Dorian is a smart guy.Don't underestimate his intelligence!He knew he stand no chance,otherwise he would have kept competing.
This Dorian would have smashed 98/99 Ronnie. Dorian retired due to injury, and injury alone. He had no reason to fear anyone in competition, after dominating in the manner he had.
-
isn't Lee Priest also a midget ?
Yes, but you gotta remember, us midgets gain muscle so much faster. Less area to fill (don't take that out of context) more Mesomorphic, muscle bellies usually meet the joint (don't take that out of context... puff, puff, give...)
Short guys can build a shitload of muscle. Just look at Flex Wheeler. That guy has to be pound for pound the biggest bodybuilder at that height.. in the world.
I believe he is.
Jose Raymond also has a ton of muscle, but he has to stay shredded for it to be displayed properly. He has a strange thing with muscle fullness and separation, but when he gets shredded, it's beyond belief.
It's almost like 10% makes him fat or something. Lack of fullness in his muscle bellies.
So, yeah... midgets... they get their GH prescribed...
All midgets seem to have an overly-muscular build... and big-ass mugs. Whatevah
-
Yes, but you gotta remember, us midgets gain muscle so much faster. Less area to fill (don't take that out of context) more Mesomorphic, muscle bellies usually meet the joint (don't take that out of context... puff, puff, give...)
Short guys can build a shitload of muscle. Just look at Flex Wheeler. That guy has to be pound for pound the biggest bodybuilder at that height.. in the world.
I believe he is.
Jose Raymond also has a ton of muscle, but he has to stay shredded for it to be displayed properly. He has a strange thing with muscle fullness and separation, but when he gets shredded, it's beyond belief.
It's almost like 10% makes him fat or something. Lack of fullness in his muscle bellies.
So, yeah... midgets... they get their GH prescribed...
All midgets seem to have an overly-muscular build... and big-ass mugs. Whatevah
well said
good on ya
-
This Dorian would have smashed 98/99 Ronnie. Dorian retired due to injury, and injury alone. He had no reason to fear anyone in competition, after dominating in the manner he had.
No.He would not have looked like that and would not have beaten 98/98 Ronnie.
-
No.He would not have looked like that and would not have beaten 98/98 Ronnie.
dorian didn't dominate the way Ronnie did he outsized everyone that stood next to him. Dorian yes but no so much plus he always looked 6mos preggo
-
Yes, but you gotta remember, us midgets gain muscle so much faster. Less area to fill (don't take that out of context) more Mesomorphic, muscle bellies usually meet the joint (don't take that out of context... puff, puff, give...)
Short guys can build a shitload of muscle. Just look at Flex Wheeler. That guy has to be pound for pound the biggest bodybuilder at that height.. in the world.
I believe he is.
Jose Raymond also has a ton of muscle, but he has to stay shredded for it to be displayed properly. He has a strange thing with muscle fullness and separation, but when he gets shredded, it's beyond belief.
It's almost like 10% makes him fat or something. Lack of fullness in his muscle bellies.
So, yeah... midgets... they get their GH prescribed...
All midgets seem to have an overly-muscular build... and big-ass mugs. Whatevah
I wouldn't consider flex wheeler a midget unless u are 6'5 plus
He's 5'10/5'11
-
This Dorian would have smashed 98/99 Ronnie.
Not with those arms.
-
Not with those arms.
He kicked Ronnie's ass for years on end with those arms. Ronnie 98 is Ronnie 97 dry & hard sprinkled with bitch-tits , and we all know Dorian wrote the book on dry & hard , The only difference between 97 & 98 is conditioning. He's not bigger , he's not more balanced , he didn't bring up any weak points , he's the same just in shape. Ronnie 97 was 9th against a career worst Dorian , you think with improved conditioning he's gonna beat a career best Dorian? NOT going to happen.
Everyone supposedly had better arms them him and he still beat them.
-
This Dorian would have smashed 98/99 Ronnie. Dorian retired due to injury, and injury alone. He had no reason to fear anyone in competition, after dominating in the manner he had.
Funny...
Two years later also at a Grand Prix show, here comes Ronnie, smaller waist, flatter abs, better arms, better chest, and most importantly, a back that can complete with Dorian's. Ronnie owns the back double bicep pose. His is the all time best in his prime. Dorian doesn't have the bicep peaks to pull the pose off better and his arms are at least an inch or two smaller that Coleman's. While Dorian is in better condition, Coleman has more detailed with a smaller waist and better proportion. Guys like to go off on different arguments about this saying he barely beat Flex. All these arguments have nothing to do with what we're talking about. Throwing Dorian in there being a 6 time Mr. O would have changed the dynamic of the show. Flex more than likely would have been a clear 3rd. The focus would have been on Coleman and his ginormous improvements and riding the wave of his Night of Champions win. Dorian peaked in 93. In some form or another he got progressively worse each year with 97 looking his worse. His waist was wide he wasn't as sharp as previous years and his arms looked like twigs on an huge back. We saw the best of Dorian 4 years previous. Coleman's 98 was his prime. He would have absolutely embarrassed Dorian. Flex and Ronnie compared better back then when Ronnie was smaller. That wasn't the first time Ronnie had beaten Flex. Ronnie did what Flex couldn't put more mass on and come in condition. Flex had the prettier frame but Coleman had the better constitution, will, ability to put on size and get shredded where Flex couldn't (hams and glutes). They compared alot better when Ronnie was smaller. Ronnie and Dorian is a different animal. Ronnie in 98 makes Dorian look really bad and he doesn't even have to match his conditioning to do it. He came in his best condition which was really dry and had everything Dorian didn't have. Ronnie would have won in 98. Like styles make fights in boxing it's the same way in bodybuilding. Just because A beats B and B beats C doesn't mean A beats C. 98 Ronnie makes 97,96,95,94 Dorian look like Dave Palumbo. 98 Ronnie is too good even with gyno.
-
Dorian peaked in 93. In some form or another he got progressively worse each year with 97 looking his worse.
This is incorrect. He did not get progressively worse, as his 95 was much better than 94.
-
This is incorrect. He did not get progressively worse, as his 95 was much better than 94.
You're correct. He looked better in 95. 96 he was good but flat and by then his biceps were horrid. 97 He was atrocious.
-
Funny...
Two years later also at a Grand Prix show, here comes Ronnie, smaller waist, flatter abs, better arms, better chest, and most importantly, a back that can complete with Dorians. Ronnie owns the back double bicep pose. His is the all times best in his prime. Dorian doesn't have the bicep peaks to pull the pose off better and his arms are at least an inch or two smaller that Colemans. While Dorian is in better condition, Coleman his more detailed with a smaller waist. Guys like to go off on different arguments about this saying he barely beat Flex. All these arguments have nothing to do with what we're talking about. Throwing Dorian in there being a 6 time Mr. O would have changed the dynamic of the show. Flex more than likely would have been a clear 3rd. The focus would have been on Coleman and his ginormous improvements and riding the wave of his Night of Champions win. Dorian peaked in 93. In some form or another he got progressively worse each year with 97 looking his worse. His waist was wide he wasn't as sharp as previous years and his arms looked like twigs on an huge back. He had seen the best of Dorian 4 years ago. Colemans 98 was his prime. He would have absolutely embarrassed Dorians. Flex and Ronnie compared better back then when Ronnie was smaller. That wasn't the first time Ronnie had beaten Flex. Ronnie did what Flex couldn't put more mass on and come in condition. Flex had the prettier frame but Coleman had the better constitution, will, ability to put on size and get shredded where Flex couldn't (Hams and Glutes). They compared alot better when Ronnie was smaller. Ronnie and Dorian is a different animal. Ronnie in 98 makes Dorian look really bad and he doesn't even have to match his conditioning to do it. He came in his best condition which was really dry and had everything Dorian didn't have. Ronnie would have won in 98.
Funny...
Two years later also at a Grand Prix show, here comes Ronnie, smaller waist, flatter abs, better arms, better chest, and most importantly, a back that can complete with Dorians. Ronnie owns the back double bicep pose.
Ronnie always had a smaller waist , flatter abs ,and better arms and a ' better chest ' and a excellent back , and he still lost time-in-time-out. Where did Ronnie 98 improve over 97? conditioning only and his conditioning is NOT in Dorian's league. And Flex has a smaller waist , flatter abs , better arms , and a back that was fantastic and always lost .
Ronnie owned the back double biceps pose compared to those he competed with , not against Dorian , you think an advantage in biceps peak makes up for nothing below the knees? Claves are just as important as biceps in this pose and Ronnie's calves are a fuck of a lot worse than Dorian's biceps
Guys like to go off on different arguments about this saying he barely beat Flex. All these arguments have nothing to do with what we're talking about.
Wrong , it's a clear indication on how things would go. A career best Ronnie in 1998 just barely beats Flex Wheeler who wasn't even close to his best which was 1993 which Dorian trounced yet he's supposed to beat Dorian? Not happening , especially not with bitch-tits
The focus would have been on Coleman and his ginormous improvements and riding the wave of his Night of Champions win.
What improvements? the ONLY thing he improved on was density & dryness , Dorian wrote the book on that. What improvements did Ronnie make over 97? For once he came in dialed in , He didn't bring up any lagging bodyparts , he didn't come in bigger while being in shape in fact he came in lighter , what improvements? ???
Ronnie 98 isn't touching Dorian ever just not happening. And that's his best shape or one of them.
-
Ronnie 97-98
WOW you improved your conditioning and barely beat Flex lol you're now supposed to beat Dorian? lol ::)
Da fuck Outta here
Dorian would man handle little Ronnie , he has ZERO advantages , not in muscular bulk , not in density , not in dryness , not in posing , not in presentation , he's not as complete
-
He kicked Ronnie's ass for years on end with those arms. Ronnie 98 is Ronnie 97 dry & hard sprinkled with bitch-tits , and we all know Dorian wrote the book on dry & hard , The only difference between 97 & 98 is conditioning. He's not bigger , he's not more balanced , he didn't bring up any weak points , he's the same just in shape. Ronnie 97 was 9th against a career worst Dorian , you think with improved conditioning he's gonna beat a career best Dorian? NOT going to happen.
Everyone supposedly had better arms them him and he still beat them.
;D
From a not competitive bbing point of view I think Ronnie had the better physique as far as round muscle bellies go
If u had to pick between the two physiques as far as being "attainable" which would u pick?
-
;D
From a not competitive bbing point of view I think Ronnie had the better physique as far as round muscle bellies go
If u had to pick between the two physiques as far as being "attainable" which would u pick?
Neither are " attainable " I wouldn't want to look like either of them.
Dorian's not my favorite either I would rather look like Samir Bannout or Steve Reeves or Frank Zane or Bob Paris , eons before looking like Dorian , but Dorian is a winning machine and Ronnie wouldn't beat him and statistically couldn't beat him. Especially not 1998 bitch-tits 249lbs
-
Ronnie 97-98
WOW you improved your conditioning and barely beat Flex lol you're now supposed to beat Dorian? lol ::)
Da fuck Outta here
Dorian would man handle little Ronnie , he has ZERO advantages , not in muscular bulk , not in density , not in dryness , not in posing , not in presentation , he's not as complete
Calm down, you're wrong. You're whole argument is now around that he barely beat Flex as if the margin of victory determines whether or not he compares to Dorian. That is incorrect. Lets try using our eyes and using some logic. I don't respect your irrelevant arguments. That's in your world. I'm looking at two videos, 98 Ronnie Coleman in which he himself said he was his best, and 93 Dorian in which he was his best. If I look at those two videos and any and all pics, Ronnie is the winner. Why? It comes down to what the IFBB embodies and what they're looking for. I believe 98 Ronnie embodies that more than Dorian. I don't care what past placings say. I'm going off what I see with my two eyes. The difference between the two that makes me go with Coleman is that his structure is better. I like that he has a smaller waist which gives for a dramatic taper. His shape is better. I'll take that over being grainy any day of the week. I also believe that in a show, Coleman would have the edge it all depends on who the judges are. In all that, I still like 1991 Lee Haney's physique better.
-
Calm down, you're wrong. You're whole argument is now around that he barely beat Flex as if the margin of victory determines whether or not he compares to Dorian. That is incorrect. Lets try using our eyes and using some logic. I don't respect your irrelevant arguments. That's in your world. I'm looking at two videos, 98 Ronnie Coleman in which he himself said he was his best, and 93 Dorian in which he was his best. If I look at those two videos and any and all pics, Ronnie is the winner. Why? It comes down to what the IFBB embodies and what they're looking for. I believe 98 Ronnie embodies that more than Dorian. I don't care what past placings say. I'm going off what I see with my two eyes. The difference between the two that makes me go with Coleman is that his structure is better. I like that he has a smaller waist which gives for a dramatic taper. His shape is better. I'll take that over being grainy any day of the week. I also believe that in a show, Coleman would have the edge it all depends on who the judges are
Contests aren't judged on what you like better.
The argument isn't only on how he had a hard time with Flex , it's also based on the fact that he never beat Dorian , he didn't really improve in over 1997 other than conditioning and it's also based on the fact that Dorian statistically would beat him , Dorian simply satisfies the criteria better than Ronnie.
You like what you like , you think it would beat Dorian , cool. Statistically he couldn't and in all probability he couldn't. he doesn't touch Dorian in the criteria he doesn't carry more muscle bulk 257lbs vs 249lbs and Dorian's an inch shorter. He doesn't touch Dorian in density & dryness , he's not a better poser and presenter , he's not more complete. And he's got bitch-tits
Dorian 1993 was so far and beyond everyone else he didn't even need to be included in the muscularity round. That didn't even happen to Ronnie 2003 , Ronnie 98 beat a sub-par Flex by 3 points lol and he's supposed to beat Dorian? That makes sense to you?
-
Calm down, you're wrong. You're whole argument is now around that he barely beat Flex as if the margin of victory determines whether or not he compares to Dorian. That is incorrect. Lets try using our eyes and using some logic. I don't respect your irrelevant arguments. That's in your world. I'm looking at two videos, 98 Ronnie Coleman in which he himself said he was his best, and 93 Dorian in which he was his best. If I look at those two videos and any and all pics, Ronnie is the winner. Why? It comes down to what the IFBB embodies and what they're looking for. I believe 98 Ronnie embodies that more than Dorian. I don't care what past placings say. I'm going off what I see with my two eyes. The difference between the two that makes me go with Coleman is that his structure is better. I like that he has a smaller waist which gives for a dramatic taper. His shape is better. I'll take that over being grainy any day of the week. I also believe that in a show, Coleman would have the edge it all depends on who the judges are. In all that, I still like 1991 Lee Haney's physique better.
HANEY went out with a bang,gets in his alltime best shape after 90 drug tested year .looked insane that yr...
-
Contests aren't judged on what you like better.
The argument isn't only on how he had a hard time with Flex , it's also based on the fact that he never beat Dorian , he didn't really improve in over 1997 other than conditioning and it's also based on the fact that Dorian statistically would beat him , Dorian simply satisfies the criteria better than Ronnie.
You like what you like , you think it would beat Dorian , cool. Statistically he couldn't and in all probability he couldn't. he doesn't touch Dorian in the criteria he doesn't carry more muscle bulk 257lbs vs 249lbs and Dorian's an inch shorter. He doesn't touch Dorian in density & dryness , he's not a better poser and presenter , he's not more complete. And he's got bitch-tits
Dorian 1993 was so far and beyond everyone else he didn't even need to be included in the muscularity round. That didn't even happen to Ronnie 2003 , Ronnie 98 beat a sub-par Flex by 3 points lol and he's supposed to beat Dorian? That makes sense to you?
No offense, but I don't care. What does it matter statistically? I'm going on what I see in front of me. You can't do that because you'd lose the argument. I'm done.
-
No offense, but I don't care. What does it matter statistically? I'm going on what I see in front of me. You can't do that because you'd lose the argument. I'm done.
lol Of course you don't care. You've mad up your mind. I'm going by what I see in front of me. And Dorian mops the floor with bitch-tits
-
lol Of course you don't care. You've mad up your mind. I'm going by what I see in front of me. And Dorian mops the floor with bitch-tits
Arguing Dorian would beat Ronnie in 98 is like arguing Branch Warren placing ahead of Cedric McMillan at the AC this year...did Cedric get screwed? Yes. Would Coleman have got screwed? Yes. And whats the common factor? The judging. Like I said earlier, Dorian may have beat Ronnie in 98 if he competed due to how the judging works in the IFBB. That doesn't mean he would have deserved it, and Ronnie surely was a better bodybuiler in 98 than 97. Without a doubt Dorian would have been supplanted by 99.
-
Arguing Dorian would beat Ronnie in 98 is like arguing Branch Warren placing ahead of Cedric McMillan at the AC this year...did Cedric get screwed? Yes. Would Coleman have got screwed? Yes. And whats the common factor? The judging. Like I said earlier, Dorian may have beat Ronnie in 98 if he competed due to how the judging works in the IFBB. That doesn't mean he would have deserved it, and Ronnie surely was a better bodybuiler in 98 than 97. Without a doubt Dorian would have been supplanted by 99, and Ronnie would still have ended up with more Olympia titles.
Comparing Branch to Dorian , great logic ::)
Coleman wouldn't get ' screwed ' he would be beaten. Ronnie was better in 98 than 97 and the only reason he was better was due to conditioning. And Dorian would trample Ronnie 99 as well , Ronnie 98 was better than Ronnie 99 , Why? Same reason he was better in 98 than 97 , conditioning.
And I'm talking at their bests , I don't think Dorian 97 would've beaten Ronnie 98
-
Comparing Branch to Dorian , great logic ::)
Coleman wouldn't get ' screwed ' he would be beaten. Ronnie was better in 98 than 97 and the only reason he was better was due to conditioning. And Dorian would trample Ronnie 99 as well , Ronnie 98 was better than Ronnie 99 , Why? Same reason he was better in 98 than 97 , conditioning.
And I'm talking at their bests , I don't think Dorian 97 would've beaten Ronnie 98
Well at least you concede that Dorian 97 would not have beaten Ronnie 98. I can respect and understand that you think Dorian 93 is better than Ronnie 98. What about Coleman 01 ASC? Conditioning to rival 98 and size too.
-
You know ND is a gigantic schmoe when he makes a Shawn vs Dex thread into a Ronnie vs Dorian thread. ;D ;D ;D
-
You know ND is a gigantic schmoe when he makes a Shawn vs Dex thread into a Ronnie vs Dorian thread. ;D ;D ;D
HA!....what ever happened to that thread???...was it deleted?..went on and on for years...definitely a GetBig Hall of Fame thread
-
HA!....what ever happened to that thread???...was it deleted?..went on and on for years...definitely a GetBig Hall of Fame thread
I tried to locate it a few days back and could not find it. That thread will definitely go down in GB history.
I hope it was not deleted. Perhaps ND may be able to locate it.
-
You know ND is a gigantic schmoe when he makes a Shawn vs Dex thread into a Ronnie vs Dorian thread. ;D ;D ;D
In my defense I never start this nonsense it's trolls like you ;D
Dex would MURDER Ray still
-
In my defense I never start this nonsense it's trolls like you ;D
Dex would MURDER Ray still
I don't think I was responsible for bring up Dorian vs Ronnie in this thread!
-
I don't think I was responsible for bring up Dorian vs Ronnie in this thread!
Wiggs did lol I apologize , troll on ;D
-
In my defense I never start this nonsense it's trolls like you ;D
Dex would MURDER Ray still
Yes, Dexter would murder Shawn like he did all 3 times he placed lower than him every time he competed. 0-3.
Right.
-
Yes, Dexter would murder Shawn like he did all 3 times he placed lower than him every time he competed. 0-3.
Right.
Yes , Ronnie would murder Dorian like he did all 8 times he placed lower than him every time he competed. 0-8.
Right. ;)
-
Yes , Ronnie would murder Dorian like he did all 8 times he placed lower than him every time he competed. 0-8.
Right. ;)
I'm not talking bout Ronnie or Dorian anymore. I told you, "I'm done". I'm talking about Dexter and Shawn, try to stay on topic, I understand it may be difficult. One has nothing to do with the other,quit trying to make it so.
-
I'm not talking bout Ronnie or Dorian anymore. I told you, "I'm done". I'm talking about Dexter and Shawn, try to stay on topic, I understand it may be difficult. One has nothing to do with the other,quit trying to make it so.
And I'm talking about YOUR warped ' logic ' that brings you to these loony conclusions. You don't like your own logic when it's used against you.
Dexter would kick Shawn's ass because he carries more muscular bulk , equal if not better conditioning , just as complete and no where near as narrow.
-
Sorry Shawn always a bride's maid and never the bride ;D
http://www.flexonline.com/general-news/olympia-clash-titans-jackson-vs-ray
The 2009 Mr. Olympia on September 25-26 is shaping up to be the most competitive in history. Loaded with star power that hasn't been seen since the explosion of talent that populated the lineups of the nineties and into the new millennium, it sparks the timeless debate: Who was better, the champions of yesterday or the champions of today? To answer that, we've pitted the class of '09 against legendary names from the past, each in a one on one battle to determine once and for all, who will reign supreme. The seventh in our Olympia Clash of the Titans series features reigning Mr. Olympia Dexter Jackson facing Shawn Ray.
GO HERE FOR A COMPLETE LIST AND PROFILES OF ALL QUALIFIED OLYMPIA COMPETITORS!
TALE OF THE TAPE
NAME: Dexter Jackson
HEIGHT: 5'7"
WEIGHT: 235 pounds
OLYMPIA HISTORY: 1999, 9th; 2000, 9th; 2001, 8th; 2002, 4th; 2003, 3rd; 2004, 4th; 2006, 4th; 2007, 3rd; 2008, 1st NAME: Shawn Ray
HEIGHT: 5'7"
WEIGHT: 205 pounds
OLYMPIA HISTORY: 1988, 13th; 1990, 3rd; 1991, 5th; 1992, 4th; 1993, 3rd; 1994, 2nd; 1995, 4th; 1996, 2nd; 1997, 3rd; 1998, 5th; 1999, 5th; 2000, 4th; 2001, 4th
SCOUTING REPORT: JACKSON
Jackson is the smallest man to wear the Olympia crown since Samir Bannout was bodybuilding's king back in 1983. Nevertheless, it's a testament to the excellence of his physique that Jackson was able to buck a 24-year trend. From neck to knee "The Blade" displays no weaknesses, and while his calves aren't quite up to the standards of the rest of his body, they do little to detract from his overall impressiveness.
SCOUTING REPORT: RAY
Shawn Ray is roundly considered one of the most proportioned bodybuilders in the sport's history. Although he never won an Olympia title, Ray made the top six an unprecedented 12 times, taking 2nd twice and 3rd three times. Although at just 205 pounds Ray couldn't dominate with size, he did routinely beat guys 50-70 pounds heavier with a near-perfect combination of mass, shape, proportion and definition.
FRONT VIEW:
This is almost too close to call. Jackson is crisper and has slightly fuller muscles. Ray's almost concave midsection and proportioned calves show a more complete look. Jackson has the wider shoulder structure.
SIDE VIEW:
Again, a very close call. Jackson's lagging calves are less noticeable here, evening things out. Ray's stellar serratus are on full display.
REAR VIEW:
Jackson's superior width gives pause, although Ray accounts well of himself in the rear double biceps shot, which highlights his great detail.
THE WINNER: JACKSON
By an eyelash. Even despite his calf deficit, Jackson's superior width and ultra-conditioning give him the edge. Were Ray to have been pressed to achieve the dryness that's de rigeur of Olympia competitors circa 2009 the outcome could be different
-
And I'm talking about YOUR warped ' logic ' that brings you to these loony conclusions. You don't like your own logic when it's used against you.
Dexter would kick Shawn's ass because he carries more muscular bulk , equal if not better conditioning , just as complete and no where near as narrow.
Then why has he never done the 3 times they competed against each other? ::)
-
Then why has he never done the 3 times they competed against each other? ::)
Same reason Ronnie didn't to it the 8 times he competed with Dorian , he wasn't at his best.
-
Sorry Shawn always a bride's maid and never the bride ;D
http://www.flexonline.com/general-news/olympia-clash-titans-jackson-vs-ray
The 2009 Mr. Olympia on September 25-26 is shaping up to be the most competitive in history. Loaded with star power that hasn't been seen since the explosion of talent that populated the lineups of the nineties and into the new millennium, it sparks the timeless debate: Who was better, the champions of yesterday or the champions of today? To answer that, we've pitted the class of '09 against legendary names from the past, each in a one on one battle to determine once and for all, who will reign supreme. The seventh in our Olympia Clash of the Titans series features reigning Mr. Olympia Dexter Jackson facing Shawn Ray.
GO HERE FOR A COMPLETE LIST AND PROFILES OF ALL QUALIFIED OLYMPIA COMPETITORS!
TALE OF THE TAPE
NAME: Dexter Jackson
HEIGHT: 5'7"
WEIGHT: 235 pounds
OLYMPIA HISTORY: 1999, 9th; 2000, 9th; 2001, 8th; 2002, 4th; 2003, 3rd; 2004, 4th; 2006, 4th; 2007, 3rd; 2008, 1st NAME: Shawn Ray
HEIGHT: 5'7"
WEIGHT: 205 pounds
OLYMPIA HISTORY: 1988, 13th; 1990, 3rd; 1991, 5th; 1992, 4th; 1993, 3rd; 1994, 2nd; 1995, 4th; 1996, 2nd; 1997, 3rd; 1998, 5th; 1999, 5th; 2000, 4th; 2001, 4th
SCOUTING REPORT: JACKSON
Jackson is the smallest man to wear the Olympia crown since Samir Bannout was bodybuilding's king back in 1983. Nevertheless, it's a testament to the excellence of his physique that Jackson was able to buck a 24-year trend. From neck to knee "The Blade" displays no weaknesses, and while his calves aren't quite up to the standards of the rest of his body, they do little to detract from his overall impressiveness.
SCOUTING REPORT: RAY
Shawn Ray is roundly considered one of the most proportioned bodybuilders in the sport's history. Although he never won an Olympia title, Ray made the top six an unprecedented 12 times, taking 2nd twice and 3rd three times. Although at just 205 pounds Ray couldn't dominate with size, he did routinely beat guys 50-70 pounds heavier with a near-perfect combination of mass, shape, proportion and definition.
FRONT VIEW:
This is almost too close to call. Jackson is crisper and has slightly fuller muscles. Ray's almost concave midsection and proportioned calves show a more complete look. Jackson has the wider shoulder structure.
SIDE VIEW:
Again, a very close call. Jackson's lagging calves are less noticeable here, evening things out. Ray's stellar serratus are on full display.
REAR VIEW:
Jackson's superior width gives pause, although Ray accounts well of himself in the rear double biceps shot, which highlights his great detail.
THE WINNER: JACKSON
By an eyelash. Even despite his calf deficit, Jackson's superior width and ultra-conditioning give him the edge. Were Ray to have been pressed to achieve the dryness that's de rigeur of Olympia competitors circa 2009 the outcome could be different
So you post an article about a what if and ignore the actual 3 times they were onstage together in which Shawn won. Makes sense ::)
-
Same reason Ronnie didn't to it the 8 times he competed with Dorian , he wasn't at his best.
This has nothing to do with Ronnie or Dorian shut the fuck up about them.
-
This has nothing to do with Ronnie or Dorian shut the fuck up about them.
Stop it , yes it does and it's the same reason you used it in favor of Ronnie , now it's no longer applicable ::) stop cherry picking.
-
So you post an article about a what if and ignore the actual 3 times they were onstage together in which Shawn won. Makes sense ::)
In the long run, if Shawn kept competing, I think that Dexter and Shawn would've traded victories back and forth. Kind of like Levrone and Wheeler did. Every show would have be close.
-
So you post an article about a what if and ignore the actual 3 times they were onstage together in which Shawn won. Makes sense ::)
Was Dexter his best? NO so we can compare Dexter to his best to Shawn at his and Shawn would lose. Why would he lose? Dexter is bigger , Shawn did beat much bigger guys but that was when they were off and he had the edge in conditioning. He has no edge in conditioning over Dexter , and Dexter would just pick up more mandatory poses , I would give the edge in posing to Shawn though , but Dex has to many advantages.
And look at why Shawn beat Dexter those 3 times , Shawn competed ONCE and Dexter 5-6 times each year. Dexter was worn out from all the spring shows and Shawn was fresh doing one contest a year. It's not as black & white as it appears Wiggs
-
Ronnie was better in 98 than 97 and the only reason he was better was due to conditioning. And Dorian would trample Ronnie 99 as well , Ronnie 98 was better than Ronnie 99 , Why? Same reason he was better in 98 than 97 , conditioning.
for the record, ronnie put on a ton of size between 97 and 99:
check the quads, chest, lats everything: it wasn't simply conditioning.
Ronnie himself said he put on about 5 pounds of solid muscle per year around that time (flex mag interview), which means he was about 10 pounds heavier from 97 to 99, which based on the visuals, looks about right:
-
for the record, ronnie put on a ton of size between 97 and 99:
check the quads, chest, lats everything: it wasn't simply conditioning.
Ronnie himself said he put on about 5 pounds of solid muscle per year around that time (flex mag interview), which means he was about 10 pounds heavier from 97 to 99, which based on the visuals, looks about right:
No he wasn't he was 255lbs in 1997 and 257lbs in 1999 get your bullshit right. And we're comparing 1997 to 1998 in which Ronnie HIMSELF said was his best Olympia
-
This is Ronnie 97 ;)
255lbs
-
:)
98 he dropped all the water weight and came in dry & hard grew some tits and beat everyone \
This was fucking NINTH in 1997 and a year later a lighter albeit harder & drier Ronnie is supposed top beat Dorian at his best? , never mind his worse in 1997
get the fuck outta here
-
ND, why are you so obsessed with proving people wrong about bodybuilding contests? You call me a troll. However, you either: (a) must be trolling or (b) care way too much about bodybuilding contests.
Which one is it?
-
ND, why are you so obsessed with proving people wrong about bodybuilding contests? You call me a troll. However, you either: (a) must be trolling or (b) care way too much about bodybuilding contests.
Which one is it?
I'm not obsessed I'm giving my opinion. I think I'm a little more informed than most and it's like explaining things to children , some just never get it though their heads and isn't that what these boards are for? ???
-
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1eyvt_ronnie-coleman-1997-olympia_sport
if you think Ronnie is 255 in this video with quads that look like toothpicks (compared to 99) then I am fucking Santa Claus... ::)
if his weight was listed as 255 anywhere at that contest it was clearly not correct.
see for yourself.
Helen Keller could see he was way bigger in 99 vs 97, not just 2 pounds..
-
Dexter beats Ray all day...better conditioning...better structure. Only place Ray win is calves. Thats it.
-
Can you imagine a Panel of Judges at the Mr. O with all Getbiggers?
They would have to extend the show for a couple of weeks just for the arguing to die down.
Score cards would be irrelevant.... lmao
-
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1eyvt_ronnie-coleman-1997-olympia_sport
if you think Ronnie is 255 in this video with quads that look like toothpicks (compared to 99) then I am fucking Santa Claus... ::)
if his weight was listed as 255 anywhere at that contest it was clearly not correct.
see for yourself.
Helen Keller could see he was way bigger in 99 vs 97, not just 2 pounds..
Oh boy , after all these years still in denial. Yeah he was much bigger in 99 much bigger gut ;)
-
He kicked Ronnie's ass for years on end with those arms. Ronnie 98 is Ronnie 97 dry & hard sprinkled with bitch-tits , and we all know Dorian wrote the book on dry & hard , The only difference between 97 & 98 is conditioning. He's not bigger , he's not more balanced , he didn't bring up any weak points , he's the same just in shape. Ronnie 97 was 9th against a career worst Dorian , you think with improved conditioning he's gonna beat a career best Dorian? NOT going to happen.
Everyone supposedly had better arms them him and he still beat them.
Mr.1derful mentioned 98/99. No where 1997 was mentioned. So, what are you babbling on about? You actually think 1998 Ronnie is a "same just in shape" as a 1997 Ronnie? I think you've lost it. I've never heard any bodybuilding experts, writers, photographers etc even compare a 1997 Ronnie to a 1998 Ronnie and say what you just said above^^^^^^. If you're comparing 1997 Ronnie to a 1998 Ronnie then there is really no point in debating with you. It's just a joke to read what you're typing if you actually believe what you're saying.
-
Dexter beats Ray all day...better conditioning...better structure. Only place Ray win is calves. Thats it.
This is why BB won't change for the better. Even the some of the experts on getbig prefer the turtle shell and oil filled Dexter over a prime great BB Shawn.
-
for the record, ronnie put on a ton of size between 97 and 99:
check the quads, chest, lats everything: it wasn't simply conditioning.
Ronnie himself said he put on about 5 pounds of solid muscle per year around that time (flex mag interview), which means he was about 10 pounds heavier from 97 to 99, which based on the visuals, looks about right:
Those pics Cormier looks the best imo , the most ideal physique
-
Always endup with Dorian vs Ronnie... :-\
-
This is why BB won't change for the better. Even the some of the experts on getbig prefer the turtle shell and oil filled Dexter over a prime great BB Shawn.
8)
-
Those pics Cormier looks the best imo , the most ideal physique
you know I was thinking same thing ,I was going to quote that with the picture as reference,milos doesn't look too shabby either there,,its like the huge guy in the middle with blown out bodyparts/shape so/so relaxed there,,and 2 guys in the corners looking like a bber should ..
-
Mr.1derful mentioned 98/99. No where 1997 was mentioned. So, what are you babbling on about? You actually think 1998 Ronnie is a "same just in shape" as a 1997 Ronnie? I think you've lost it. I've never heard any bodybuilding experts, writers, photographers etc even compare a 1997 Ronnie to a 1998 Ronnie and say what you just said above^^^^^^. If you're comparing 1997 Ronnie to a 1998 Ronnie then there is really no point in debating with you. It's just a joke to read what you're typing if you actually believe what you're saying.
Tell me where Ronnie improved on from 97 to 98. Tell me. Where? did he pack on more muscular size in 98? NO , did his back get wider? NO , did he improve his calves? NO , did he improve any weak areas? NO. Where are these improvements other than getting totally dry & hard? Where? Did his delts get bigger? Better? Every ' improvement ' was due to the fact his conditioning was dead-on. except the bitch-tits of course ;D
Instead of just throwing your hands up in the air , address the questions. Ronnie was 255lbs at the 1997 Mr Olympia , admittedly he wasn't in fantastic shape , you think it's coincidence he went down to 249lbs in 1998 and was dry & hard as nails?
-
ND, I usually agree with most of your arguments. But not regarding Ronnie 97 vs 98. For those of us that were at both shows, it was obvious that Ronnie was ‘transformed’ (as is obvious when studying pics and movies). He was bigger, fuller and sharper. I think the comparison picture you provided only underscores this. It shows improvements almost all over, that is sum is significant. His delts and traps were clearly bigger. So was his back and thighs (and stomach). Look at the chest as well, fuller and thus slightly improved. It was almost felt like Yates 92 vs 93 (I said almost).
The numbers regarding bodyweight are clearly misleading as ‘evidence’ (and not the least because they are seldom trustworthy). Take Lee Haney 90 vs 91 as an example. In 90 he said his weight was approximately 259, and in 91 it was around 248. Take a look at pics and movies, or ask those being there. It is clear that he looked smaller and almost ‘skinny-fat and flat’ in 90 as compared to 91, where his condition made him appear much bigger even though he weighed less. Same goes with Ronnie. More muscles/thickness in the right places despite a (slightly) lighter weight.
That aside, I strongly agree with you that if Ronnie 98 showed up in 93 or 95, he would not have beaten Yates. One legacy that Ronnie has provided to judging is the neglecting of calf developments. Back in the late 80s and early 90s, you were damned if you totally lacked calf development. I remember many good bodybuilders that were (perhaps rightfully) overlooked and held back for that reason. I also remember comments on Ronnie; that he had great bodyparts but that he would not reach the top due to lacking calves. If calves were weak it was worse than if other bodyparts were weak. It was considered to throw off the balance and symmetry (which is totally correct). After Ronnie’s reign this is aalmost not an issue anymore. It is clearly much more tolerance among judges and some fans for weak calves.
Had Ronnie showed up in 93 with his 98 version, he would not be good enough to dethrone an improved Yates. If you put both out of context though, it could have gone both ways. With the judging criteria of the early 90s, I think Yates would have won. With the judging criteria of the 2000s, Ronnie would perhaps have won. The judging criteria (how it is interpreted and used) have ‘evolved’ to the worse.
-
I'm not obsessed I'm giving my opinion. I think I'm a little more informed than most and it's like explaining things to children , some just never get it though their heads and isn't that what these boards are for? ???
::) :D ;D ::) :-\ ;D :-\ ::) ;D ::) ;D
-
::) :D ;D ::) :-\ ;D :-\ ::) ;D ::) ;D
U FORGOT :-*.. :P.. :-X
-
ND, I usually agree with most of your arguments. But not regarding Ronnie 97 vs 98. For those of us that were at both shows, it was obvious that Ronnie was ‘transformed’ (as is obvious when studying pics and movies). He was bigger, fuller and sharper. I think the comparison picture you provided only underscores this. It shows improvements almost all over, that is sum is significant. His delts and traps were clearly bigger. So was his back and thighs (and stomach). Look at the chest as well, fuller and thus slightly improved. It was almost felt like Yates 92 vs 93 (I said almost).
The numbers regarding bodyweight are clearly misleading as ‘evidence’ (and not the least because they are seldom trustworthy). Take Lee Haney 90 vs 91 as an example. In 90 he said his weight was approximately 259, and in 91 it was around 248. Take a look at pics and movies, or ask those being there. It is clear that he looked smaller and almost ‘skinny-fat and flat’ in 90 as compared to 91, where his condition made him appear much bigger even though he weighed less. Same goes with Ronnie. More muscles/thickness in the right places despite a (slightly) lighter weight.
That aside, I strongly agree with you that if Ronnie 98 showed up in 93 or 95, he would not have beaten Yates. One legacy that Ronnie has provided to judging is the neglecting of calf developments. Back in the late 80s and early 90s, you were damned if you totally lacked calf development. I remember many good bodybuilders that were (perhaps rightfully) overlooked and held back for that reason. I also remember comments on Ronnie; that he had great bodyparts but that he would not reach the top due to lacking calves. If calves were weak it was worse than if other bodyparts were weak. It was considered to throw off the balance and symmetry (which is totally correct). After Ronnie’s reign this is aalmost not an issue anymore. It is clearly much more tolerance among judges and some fans for weak calves.
Had Ronnie showed up in 93 with his 98 version, he would not be good enough to dethrone an improved Yates. If you put both out of context though, it could have gone both ways. With the judging criteria of the early 90s, I think Yates would have won. With the judging criteria of the 2000s, Ronnie would perhaps have won. The judging criteria (how it is interpreted and used) have ‘evolved’ to the worse.
ND, I usually agree with most of your arguments. But not regarding Ronnie 97 vs 98. For those of us that were at both shows, it was obvious that Ronnie was ‘transformed’ (as is obvious when studying pics and movies). He was bigger, fuller and sharper. I think the comparison picture you provided only underscores this. It shows improvements almost all over, that is sum is significant. His delts and traps were clearly bigger. So was his back and thighs (and stomach). Look at the chest as well, fuller and thus slightly improved. It was almost felt like Yates 92 vs 93 (I said almost).
Nothing is ' bigger ' it only appears that way. The comparison pic I made was hastily made and not scaled etc , it was just slapped side-by-side. He's not bigger anywhere , his dimensions didn't change
Dorian 92 was 242lbs and Dorian 93 was 257lbs that was noticeable and clearly evident. Ronnie 97 was 255lbs and 98 249lbs . you don't get bigger by losing weight that's an oxymoron , he could appear bigger but dimensionaly he's not going to be
In 90 he said his weight was approximately 259, and in 91 it was around 248. Take a look at pics and movies, or ask those being there. It is clear that he looked smaller and almost ‘skinny-fat and flat’ in 90 as compared to 91, where his condition made him appear much bigger even though he weighed less.
He wasn't 259 in 1990 , that was in 1989 in Italy and he said he was off and way to heavy. In fact I believe he was just 240 in 1990 and in 1991 he was his all-time best at 249lbs. Hell everyone was down in size in 1990
-
Regarding Haney, I meant 89. He was heavy but looked flat and 'small' compared to 91
You can look bigger with less weight. and, you can look bigger because the dimensions have changed. In 98 Ronnie clearly had more mass in many of the right places. His 'shape' around the traps and delts were different dimension-wise. So was his thigh sweep. Though small separately, in sum it was very evident. We will probably never agree on that...
On a side note. I do not believe that Ronnies weight was 255 in 97. There is/was a lot of lying in that regard, and that goes for Ronnie as well.
-
Bevo not saying Dexter looks bad in those shots, but have you ever seen him is person, their guts are horriable. Dexter shots stuff in his arms and calves. I perfer the look of the guys back then, like Shawn without oil and guts.
-
Regarding Haney, I meant 89. He was heavy but looked flat and 'small' compared to 91
You can look bigger with less weight. and, you can look bigger because the dimensions have changed. In 98 Ronnie clearly had more mass in many of the right places. His 'shape' around the traps and delts were different dimension-wise. So was his thigh sweep. Though small separately, in sum it was very evident. We will probably never agree on that...
On a side note. I do not believe that Ronnies weight was 255 in 97. There is/was a lot of lying in that regard, and that goes for Ronnie as well.
It's an illusion , that's what being bone dry & rock hard does it gives you the illusion of being bigger. I absolutely believe Ronnie was 255lbs in 97 , he was bigger and softer than he was in 1996 where he placed better no coincidence
-
Bevo not saying Dexter looks bad in those shots, but have you ever seen him is person, their guts are horriable. Dexter shots stuff in his arms and calves. I perfer the look of the guys back then, like Shawn without oil and guts.
Yes I've seen them both and when I'm back home in Cali I see dex on a reg basis since he's getting ready for the Olympia at the time, seen Shawn train too around 2000/2001
Dex prob shoots stuff but in close ups they don't look noticeable
Dexter is a lot bigger in person than Shawn, just or more conditioned and I've seen both!
Flex wheeler shot a shitload of stuff and he's still considered to be one of the greatest, levrone shot up his delts and who knows what other parts
-
you know I was thinking same thing ,I was going to quote that with the picture as reference,milos doesn't look too shabby either there,,its like the huge guy in the middle with blown out bodyparts/shape so/so relaxed there,,and 2 guys in the corners looking like a bber should ..
Cormier should have beaten flex at the 99 O
-
By comparison, these pics show it clearly. 1) Ronnie was bigger in the delt/traps and in the thighs (from 97 -98). These improvements gave him a totally new look. Check out the FDB from 1997. His legs are skinny there compared to a year later. As is his delts in the most muscular from 1997. All in all, his torso is tiny compared to 1998, and even more so to 1999.. His shape/dimensions are clearly not the same in 1998. In 1999 he was even bigger in those same areas. All of that change did not occur between 98 and 99 - some of the progress came between 97 and 98.
From my viewpoint, Ronnie made steady progress from 94 and onwards. The improvements from 97-98 gave him a new muscular look (not only because of condition).
-
The 'transformation' was ongoing and evident from 1997 onwards
-
Another comparison.
Change is evident. Not revolutionary, but enough and in (some of)the right places. He was thicker in the torso/lats. As said, in the delts and traps. And, evidently thighs. And, also evidently in his waist and nipples. Luckily for Ronnie, he had such a tiny waist/hips in 1997 that some added thickness did not destroy his aesthetics.
I disagree with ND that the 97 version of Ronnie was 255. His torso was tiny compared to later (not that it matter)
-
By comparison, these pics show it clearly. 1) Ronnie was bigger in the delt/traps and in the thighs (from 97 -98). These improvements gave him a totally new look. Check out the FDB from 1997. His legs are skinny there compared to a year later. As is his delts in the most muscular from 1997. All in all, his torso is tiny compared to 1998, and even more so to 1999.. His shape/dimensions are clearly not the same in 1998. In 1999 he was even bigger in those same areas. All of that change did not occur between 98 and 99 - some of the progress came between 97 and 98.
From my viewpoint, Ronnie made steady progress from 94 and onwards. The improvements from 97-98 gave him a new muscular look (not only because of condition).
I think you're seeing what you want and using select pictures to ' prove ' it , all of these pics are from 97. Does he look better in 1998? Absolutely is he dimensionally bigger , wider , thicker? absolutely not
-
:)
-
Notice the contest weight
-
:)
-
great comparison getbiggers crushing ND's belief that the erroneous weight of 255 was NOT correct in 1997:
fuck, he probably added 5 pounds of muscle to each QUAD, never mind everywhere else:
97 vs 99:
-
is he dimensionally bigger , wider , thicker? absolutely not
yes, he is, thats what everyone is showing you: ::)
-
At the end of the day, a prime Ronnie beats a prime Dorian. When Ronnie was in his prime, no one can touch him. I bet even Dorian would agree with this.
-
^check the size difference there folks.
note the quads, chest, arms and lats.
serious muscle added.
either 255 pounds is wrong in 97 or 257 is wrong in 99 and he was more like 260 something.
take your pick.
-
^check the size difference there folks.
note the quads, chest, arms and lats.
serious muscle added.
either 255 pounds is wrong in 97 or 257 is wrong in 99 and he was more like 260 something.
take your pick.
No one is comparing 97 to 99 you moron. he was 255 in 97 and he was soft and he was 257 in 99 obviously he got bigger than 97. No one's debating that try and stick to the subject.
-
yes, he is, thats what everyone is showing you: ::)
Fuck you are retarded , I said compared to 98 , you know this as usual but you're just posting nonsense.
-
This thread.... ::)
Geez
-
^check the size difference there folks.
note the quads, chest, arms and lats.
serious muscle added.
either 255 pounds is wrong in 97 or 257 is wrong in 99 and he was more like 260 something.
take your pick.
How much did Ronnie weigh when he got his ass kicked by Gunter?
-
This thread.... ::)
Geez
If ND and Hulkster met in real life, what do you think would happen? :D :D
-
If ND and Hulkster met in real life, what do you think would happen? :D :D
probably would be some loving going on...the Ronnie vs Dorian thread was only foreplay
-
probably would be some loving going on...the Ronnie vs Dorian thread was only foreplay
x2. I have a feeling they would be best buddies.
-
No one is comparing 97 to 99 you moron. he was 255 in 97 and he was soft and he was 257 in 99 obviously he got bigger than 97. No one's debating that try and stick to the subject.
you're not getting it:
you are insisting that Ronnie was actually 255 in 97 but we show you he has toothpick quads, smaller chest, arms lats compared to 99 etc.
yet you agree he was 257 in 99 (but way bigger)
that difference is NOT only 2 pounds.
so he was NOT 255 in 1997.
understand now?
-
you're not getting it:
you are insisting that Ronnie was actually 255 in 97 but we show you he has toothpick quads, smaller chest, arms lats compared to 99 etc.
yet you agree he was 257 in 99 (but way bigger)
that difference is NOT only 2 pounds.
so he was NOT 255 in 1997.
understand now?
He also had a much smaller waist too in 97 ;) and let's say he's 250lbs in 1997 who cares?? the only real area he improved in from 97-98 was conditioning , you're playing semantics games.
-
You can't even put Dorian in the same class as Ronnie. Dorian had shitty arms and a guy. 98 Ronnie smashes Dorian all day long
-
You can't even put Dorian in the same class as Ronnie. Dorian had shitty arms and a guy. 98 Ronnie smashes Dorian all day long
Ronnie had a gut in 98 , no calves and bitch-tits
-
Total body dysmorphia.
-
Dorian had bitch tits and torn up biceps that's worse in my opinion and he won his final sand ow with one arm lol
-
Dorian had bitch tits and torn up biceps that's worse in my opinion and he won his final sand ow with one arm lol
He never had bitch-tits , Ronnie did for years :-\
-
You can't even put Dorian in the same class as Ronnie. Dorian had shitty arms and a guy. 98 Ronnie smashes Dorian all day long
In individual photos, Coleman looks much larger. In reality, 93 Yates vs 98 Coleman would not present that case. I think a lot of people miss that point.