Author Topic: Learning Thread *Satanism*  (Read 19019 times)

a_joker10

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Re: Learning Thread *Satanism*
« Reply #25 on: November 23, 2006, 07:43:59 AM »
Exactly.

The satanic bible is a must read, because it opens up your thought process. It is not
scripture.

Christians fail because ultimately no one can lead a true christian lifestyle as spelled out
in the good book. Of course they are forgived of all sins, if they've accepted jesus as their
lord and saviour.

The problem with this, is that todays christians interpret this as do whatever you please,
because you are forgiven in the end.

I have no problem in saying that probably 2/3 of christians actually adhere to a more stringent
following of LaVey's book as they do the bible. Probably a conservative estimate to!

I do not understand Satanism, it seems to be by your definition Satanism is some type of twisted combination of hedonism and spirit worship

Your understanding of Christianity is deeply flawed.

Christians try to emulate the decisions of Christ. The statement what would Jesus do? Implies this.
Christians know no one is perfect, however striving to be perfect is an award in itself.

Just because someone claims that they are Christian doesn't make it so.
Being a Christian is a contract with Christ.
The church is there to help you maintain your contract with Christ, through stewardship, prayer, and love.
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loco

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Re: Learning Thread *Satanism*
« Reply #26 on: November 23, 2006, 05:16:29 PM »
The problem with this, is that todays christians interpret this as do whatever you please,
because you are forgiven in the end.

Count,
Your knowledge of Satanism is very interesting, but your knowledge of Christianity is flawed.  I am a Christian, and I'm telling you that the statement above is false.  Any person who calls himself/herself a Christian and has this interpretation of salvation through faith in Jesus Christ is not a true a Christian and is not truly saved.

I have no problem in saying that probably 2/3 of christians actually adhere to a more stringent
following of LaVey's book as they do the bible. Probably a conservative estimate to!

This is false too.

sandycoosworth

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Re: Learning Thread *Satanism*
« Reply #27 on: November 23, 2006, 09:19:06 PM »
I think what the count ment was xtians know they are not supposed to sin, yet "jebus forgives sins" so they essentially do whatever the fuck they want and just guilt themselves to feel pius after :)

Count Grishnackh

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Re: Learning Thread *Satanism*
« Reply #28 on: November 23, 2006, 11:13:16 PM »
Count,
Your knowledge of Satanism is very interesting, but your knowledge of Christianity is flawed.  I am a Christian, and I'm telling you that the statement above is false.  Any person who calls himself/herself a Christian and has this interpretation of salvation through faith in Jesus Christ is not a true a Christian and is not truly saved.

loco and joker, I know the true definition of a christian and the lifestyle they should lead and the example they should set.

When I say "todays christians" I am not referring to everyone in a nutshell. I am referring to the fact that even though there are a lot of self-proclaimed christians, there ARE VERY FEW ACTUAL CHRISTIANS WHO LEAD A CHRISTIAN LIFESTYLE. 

The majority of these "christians" are quick to tell you they do though...

loco, you, joker, Stella and others on this board may actually be good christians and lead a true christian lifestyle. I'd be shocked if more than 1 or 2 of you, but it's possible. I am just saying in my life experience, which is very broad, I haven't come across many, if any true christians. Alot of lip service, but not alot of action.

I don't want to hear that someone is christian, I want to observe it !

The lady I work with is probably the closest I've personally met in my travels and you can re-read my definition of her and make your own conclusions. Great lady, proud to have as a friend, but by my definition, falls short, purposely so, of being a true christian person.







Count Grishnackh

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Re: Learning Thread *Satanism*
« Reply #29 on: November 23, 2006, 11:17:19 PM »
I think what the count ment was xtians know they are not supposed to sin, yet "jebus forgives sins" so they essentially do whatever the f**k they want and just guilt themselves to feel pius after :)

thanks for the interpretation   :)

loco, this is what I'm saying about 99% of "christians"...you know, the self-proclaimed kind that sit in church and think about how they'd like to have the "brother" sitting next to him's wife sit on his face kind.

Of course I'm not talking about a true christian person, but then again we are still looking for him or her.  Well, at least I am.

Count Grishnackh

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Re: Learning Thread *Satanism*
« Reply #30 on: November 23, 2006, 11:19:23 PM »
Just because someone claims that they are Christian doesn't make it so.

Now you are following me here joker. This encapsulates about 99% unfortunately   :-\

Reminds me of what AAA says about biker's and the 1%'ers   lol

Dos Equis

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Re: Learning Thread *Satanism*
« Reply #31 on: November 23, 2006, 11:21:53 PM »
hahaha, good analogy   :D

beachbum, you never lied to someone, even trivial, as to spare their feelings, or make them feel better about themselves or a situation? I don't know if anyone hasn't, that would be the true find !

Yes I have.  But I'm not talking about the rare instances where white lies are told to spare someone's feelings, I'm talking about the lies told to cheat someone out of money, to steal, etc.  Those kinds of lies always eventually lead to trouble, not physical, mental, or emotional gratification.

Dos Equis

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Re: Learning Thread *Satanism*
« Reply #32 on: November 23, 2006, 11:22:35 PM »
Dont think of Satan as a being, thats the same type of childish thought process that leads to prayer, eating jesus crackers, fucking up this life for the next (which aint happening).

Think of Satan as a word to describe the points count laid out in his post.

Anyone who takes any book as "gospel" is a fucking idiot, the Satanic bible included.

Absurd.

Count Grishnackh

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Re: Learning Thread *Satanism*
« Reply #33 on: November 23, 2006, 11:51:52 PM »
I'm talking about the lies told to cheat someone out of money, to steal, etc.  Those kinds of lies always eventually lead to trouble, not physical, mental, or emotional gratification.

I agree 100%.

Would I lie, cheat or steal from an honest, hard working, "good" person? Not on my life.

Would I lie, cheat or steal from a criminal or someone who has done myself, my friends
or family wrong? Absolutely.

This is not a christian way, a christian would forgive and turn the other cheek. I would not.

Statements #4 and 5.


Dos Equis

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Re: Learning Thread *Satanism*
« Reply #34 on: November 24, 2006, 12:01:54 AM »
I agree 100%.

Would I lie, cheat or steal from an honest, hard working, "good" person? Not on my life.

Would I lie, cheat or steal from a criminal or someone who has done myself, my friends
or family wrong? Absolutely.

This is not a christian way, a christian would forgive and turn the other cheek. I would not.

Statements #4 and 5.



Actually, a Christian, like me, would seek justice without lying, cheating, or stealing.  I would call the police, press charges, testify, seek restitution, etc.  And I'd pray for the person who committed the crime.  That's the Christian way. 

Count Grishnackh

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Re: Learning Thread *Satanism*
« Reply #35 on: November 24, 2006, 12:29:07 AM »
Actually, a Christian, like me, would seek justice without lying, cheating, or stealing.  I would call the police, press charges, testify, seek restitution, etc.  And I'd pray for the person who committed the crime.  That's the Christian way. 

Ok, no problem. But you are talking alot of legal situations here.

People fucking others over most of the time doesn't fall under any legal umbrella.

But I get your point.   ;)


Butterbean

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Re: Learning Thread *Satanism*
« Reply #36 on: November 24, 2006, 07:51:43 AM »
loco and joker, I know the true definition of a christian and the lifestyle they should lead and the example they should set.


Really, the biblical definition of a Christian is (abbreviated version) someone who recognizes their need for a savior and has accepted Jesus Christ as such.

It's all over the bible that doing good works or following the law do not get you into heaven. 

Does God want us to live in a specific way?  Yes.  Does any Christian  on earth live up to 100% the way we are supposed to live?  No.  Do some Christians try to live that way 100% of the time?  Probably yes.  Do most Christians try?  Not in my opinion (me included :( )


ARE VERY FEW ACTUAL CHRISTIANS WHO LEAD A CHRISTIAN LIFESTYLE. 


 

Your conception of a "Christian LIfestyle," I believe, is unattainable by anyone.  To reiterate, we are saved by grace through faith, and not of works, so that no one can boast. (Eph 2:8,9).     Someone saved by grace is a Christian.  If Mother Theresa didn't accept Christ as Savior, she was not a Christian as described by the bible.

ARE VERY FEW ACTUAL CHRISTIANS WHO LEAD A CHRISTIAN LIFESTYLE. 

The majority of these "christians" are quick to tell you they do though...


I know a few people like this.  Although I believe they are saved, they seem pretty judgemental and pious and holier-than-thou.  They are aquaintances as I could not bring myself to spend enough time w/them to call them friends.  One even tried to tell me she never sinned after she got saved!  OH BROTHER! 



loco, you, joker, Stella and others on this board may actually be good christians and lead a true christian lifestyle. I'd be shocked if more than 1 or 2 of you, but it's possible.



Well, the 1 or 2 doesn't include me because I screw up everyday. :-[





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sandycoosworth

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Re: Learning Thread *Satanism*
« Reply #37 on: November 24, 2006, 08:03:54 AM »
thanks for the interpretation   :)

loco, this is what I'm saying about 99% of "christians"...you know, the self-proclaimed kind that sit in church and think about how they'd like to have the "brother" sitting next to him's wife sit on his face kind.

Of course I'm not talking about a true christian person, but then again we are still looking for him or her.  Well, at least I am.

I dont know any xtians who embrace the scum of the earth, which is exactly what Jesus did. They look down upon prostitutes, porn stars, drug addicts etc. and bend over backwards trying to be a moral comapss, but none of them practice one of the most central tennants of xtianity, which is judge not.

jebus was actually a progressive shit distrubing f**cker who gave everyone the time of day (I should say the stories of jebus), too bad everyone who followed in his footsteps is a knob :(

a_joker10

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Re: Learning Thread *Satanism*
« Reply #38 on: November 24, 2006, 09:22:14 AM »
Quote
Well, the 1 or 2 doesn't include me because I screw up everyday. Embarrassed
I don't claim to be a good Christian.
My relationship is with Jesus alone.
He alone knows all the sins I have done or will do.

But this is about Satanism.
Do Satanist congregate anywhere,
are there Satanic services,
do Satanists have special days of remembrance,
do Satanist have their own Calender,
are the special rites that must be performed before you are considered a Satanist,
How long has the Satanic movement been around for,
Why would sinning be considered a good thing.





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a_joker10

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Re: Learning Thread *Satanism*
« Reply #39 on: November 24, 2006, 09:48:09 AM »
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satanism

Fundamental individualism

Satanism is often mistaken as being a religion that encourages cruelty and irresponsible behaviour, but LaVey's brand is very different. Central is the idea inherited from Nietzsche that an individual must enforce his own meaning on life and rise above the perceived conformity of the masses. The Satanist is seen as equivalent to Nietzsche's Übermensch; LaVey claimed "Satanists are born, not made" and that "[Satanists] have a disease called independence that needs to be recognised just like alcoholism." There is a libertarian element here; diversity is encouraged, everyone is expected to discover their own sexuality, chart their own personality, and decide their own ambitions in life. In this stress on individuality, Satanism is considered a "Left-Hand Path" religion.

God in Satanism

The Satanist does not believe in either the Judeo-Christian or Islamic ideas of God; the function of God is performed and satisfied by the Satanist him/herself. That is, the needs of worship, ritual, and religious/spiritual focus are directed, effectively, inwards towards the Satanist, as opposed to outwards, towards God.

LaVey proposes instead that as all gods are creations of man, worship of an external deity is worship of its creator by proxy. He suggests, then, that the rational Satanist should instead internalize his god, and therefore worship himself; hence the Satanic maxim, "I am my own god."

It follows that Satanism shuns the idea of belief in all other deities as well, including, to the surprise of many, Satan. Satan is viewed as a literary archetype, along the lines of John Milton's epic hero. This archetype is viewed not as a negative figure, but as a positive image of pride and mastery in opposition to servitude, faith, and humility.

Belief in any such externalized deities is generally considered grounds for excluding someone as a Satanist, and devil worship in particular is considered nothing more than a misguided inversion of Christianity.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Existentialism#Major_concepts_in_existentialism

Major concepts in existentialism

Existentialism differentiates itself from the modern Western rationalist tradition of philosophers such as Descartes and Husserl in rejecting the idea that the most certain and primary reality is rational consciousness. Descartes believed humans could doubt all existence, but could not will away or doubt the thinking consciousness, whose reality is therefore more certain than any other reality. Existentialism decisively rejects this argument, asserting instead that as conscious beings, humans would always find themselves already in a world, a prior context and a history that is given to consciousness, and that humans cannot think away that world. It is inherent and indubitably linked to consciousness. In other words, the ultimate, certain, indubitable reality is not thinking consciousness but, according to Heidegger, "being in the world". This is a radicalization of the notion of intentionality that comes from Brentano and Husserl, which asserts that, even in its barest form, consciousness is always conscious of something.

On the existence of God, Sartre, unlike Kierkegaard, denies the existence of God. Sartre argues that without God, there is no higher power to define man. However, there are versions of existentialism that are religious. Theological existentialism as advocated by philosophers and theologians like Paul Tillich, Gabriel Marcel, and Martin Buber posits God's existence, as well as accepting many tenets of atheistic existentialism. Belief in God is a personal choice made on the basis of a passion, of faith, an observation or experience. Just as atheistic existentialists can freely choose not to believe, theistic existentialists can freely choose to believe in God and could, despite one's doubt, have faith that God exists and that God is good.

A third type of existentialism is agnostic. Again, it is a matter of choice to be agnostic. The agnostic existentialist makes no claim to know, or not know, if there is a "greater picture" in play; rather, he simply recognizes that the greatest truth is that which he chooses to act upon. The agnostic existentialist feels that to know the "greater picture", whether there is one or not, is impossible for human minds--or if it is not impossible, that at least he has not found it yet. Like Christian existentialists, the agnostic believes existence is subjective. However one feels about the issue, through the agnostic existentialist's perspective, the act of finding knowledge of the existence of God often has little value because he feels it to be impossible, and/or believes it to be useless.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_existentialism


The Bible as an existential writing

An existential reading of the Bible demands that the reader recognize that he is an existing subject studying the words God is communicating to him personally. This is in contrast to looking at a collection of "truths" which are outside and unrelated to the reader.[3] Such a reader is not obligated to follow the commandments as if an external agent is forcing them upon him, but as though they are inside him and guiding him from inside. This is the task Kierkegaard takes up when he asks: "Who has the more difficult task: the teacher who lectures on earnest things a meteor's distance from everyday life-or the learner who should put it to use?"[4]. Existentially speaking, the Bible doesn't become an authority in a person's life until they authorize the Bible to be their personal authority.



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loco

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Re: Learning Thread *Satanism*
« Reply #40 on: November 24, 2006, 12:07:55 PM »
loco, this is what I'm saying about 99% of "christians"...you know, the self-proclaimed kind that sit in church and think about how they'd like to have the "brother" sitting next to him's wife sit on his face kind.
Of course I'm not talking about a true christian person, but then again we are still looking for him or her.  Well, at least I am.

Count,
Then I apologize for saying that your knowledge of Christianity is flawed, and I do agree with you...

...click where it says "Quote from: loco" and read this if you have not read it yet:

Not everyone who claims to be a Christian really is one

Dos Equis

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Re: Learning Thread *Satanism*
« Reply #41 on: November 24, 2006, 12:48:39 PM »
"Not everyone who claims to be a Christian really is one."  True.  And I think genuine Christians don't have to go around telling people.  Their words and actions on a day-to-day basis speak volumes. 

loco

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Re: Learning Thread *Satanism*
« Reply #42 on: November 24, 2006, 01:45:15 PM »
"Not everyone who claims to be a Christian really is one."  True.  And I think genuine Christians don't have to go around telling people.  Their words and actions on a day-to-day basis speak volumes. 

Very true.  This is why I don't have the bumper sticker or the t-shirt...not that I'm condemning those who do have these.    ;D

Count Grishnackh

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Re: Learning Thread *Satanism*
« Reply #43 on: November 24, 2006, 11:37:26 PM »
Very true.  This is why I don't have the bumper sticker or the t-shirt...not that I'm condemning those who do have these.    ;D

Or the "fish" on the bumper  hahaha

Count Grishnackh

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Re: Learning Thread *Satanism*
« Reply #44 on: November 24, 2006, 11:40:24 PM »
Does God want us to live in a specific way?  Yes.  Does any Christian  on earth live up to 100% the way we are supposed to live?  No.  Do some Christians try to live that way 100% of the time?  Probably yes.  Do most Christians try?  Not in my opinion (me included :( )

Why don't you try Stella?

Count Grishnackh

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Re: Learning Thread *Satanism*
« Reply #45 on: November 24, 2006, 11:44:03 PM »
Your conception of a "Christian LIfestyle," I believe, is unattainable by anyone. 

Well, I'm not so sure that it is unattainable as much as it is extremely difficult (as it was probably intended). It's human nature to want to do what you want to do, to self-gratify, so I guess it is what it is....pretty much unattainable to a mere mortal.


Count Grishnackh

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Re: Learning Thread *Satanism*
« Reply #46 on: November 24, 2006, 11:45:20 PM »
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satanism

Fundamental individualism

Satanism is often mistaken as being a religion that encourages cruelty and irresponsible behaviour, but LaVey's brand is very different. Central is the idea inherited from Nietzsche that an individual must enforce his own meaning on life and rise above the perceived conformity of the masses. The Satanist is seen as equivalent to Nietzsche's Übermensch; LaVey claimed "Satanists are born, not made" and that "[Satanists] have a disease called independence that needs to be recognised just like alcoholism." There is a libertarian element here; diversity is encouraged, everyone is expected to discover their own sexuality, chart their own personality, and decide their own ambitions in life. In this stress on individuality, Satanism is considered a "Left-Hand Path" religion.

God in Satanism

The Satanist does not believe in either the Judeo-Christian or Islamic ideas of God; the function of God is performed and satisfied by the Satanist him/herself. That is, the needs of worship, ritual, and religious/spiritual focus are directed, effectively, inwards towards the Satanist, as opposed to outwards, towards God.

LaVey proposes instead that as all gods are creations of man, worship of an external deity is worship of its creator by proxy. He suggests, then, that the rational Satanist should instead internalize his god, and therefore worship himself; hence the Satanic maxim, "I am my own god."

It follows that Satanism shuns the idea of belief in all other deities as well, including, to the surprise of many, Satan. Satan is viewed as a literary archetype, along the lines of John Milton's epic hero. This archetype is viewed not as a negative figure, but as a positive image of pride and mastery in opposition to servitude, faith, and humility.

Belief in any such externalized deities is generally considered grounds for excluding someone as a Satanist, and devil worship in particular is considered nothing more than a misguided inversion of Christianity.

This is very well written

Count Grishnackh

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Re: Learning Thread *Satanism*
« Reply #47 on: November 24, 2006, 11:51:01 PM »
I know a few people like this.  Although I believe they are saved, they seem pretty judgemental and pious and holier-than-thou.  They are aquaintances as I could not bring myself to spend enough time w/them to call them friends.  One even tried to tell me she never sinned after she got saved!  OH BROTHER! 


Well, the 1 or 2 doesn't include me because I screw up everyday. :-[


Oh yes, acquaintance is a VERY big word with me also as I hold "friend" in extremely high regard.

Screwup?  Hmm, well there is always room for a convert. You know Stella, most would've taken Darth Vader up on his offer to rule the galaxy, unlike that sniveling Skywalker !   :D

Count Grishnackh

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Re: Learning Thread *Satanism*
« Reply #48 on: November 25, 2006, 12:02:45 AM »
Joker is right, on with Satanism:

The Eleven Satanic Rules of the Earth

1. Do not give opinions or advice unless you are asked.

2. Do not tell your troubles to others unless you are sure they want to hear them.

3. When in another’s lair, show him respect or else do not go there.

4. If a guest in your lair annoys you, treat him cruelly and without mercy.

5. Do not make sexual advances unless you are given the mating signal.

6. Do not take that which does not belong to you unless it is a burden to the other person and he cries out to be relieved.

7. Acknowledge the power of magic if you have employed it successfully to obtain your desires. If you deny the power of magic after having called upon it with success, you will lose all you have obtained.

8. Do not complain about anything to which you need not subject yourself.

9. Do not harm little children.

10. Do not kill non-human animals unless you are attacked or for your food.

11. When walking in open territory, bother no one. If someone bothers you, ask him to stop. If he does not stop, destroy him.



Butterbean

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Re: Learning Thread *Satanism*
« Reply #49 on: November 25, 2006, 10:58:28 AM »
Do some Christians try to live that way 100% of the time?  Probably yes.  Do most Christians try?  Not in my opinion (me included :( )






Why don't you try Stella?

I do try, but not 100% of the time.   Maybe it because I'm lazy, or unfocused, or any number or other reasons.  :-\



Screwup?  Hmm, well there is always room for a convert.


You know Stella, most would've taken Darth Vader up on his offer to rule the galaxy, unlike that sniveling Skywalker !   :D
Thanks for the offer but I'm going to have to decline ;D


I'm too lazy to rule the galaxy :'(



4. If a guest in your lair annoys you, treat him cruelly and without mercy.





I don't know why this made me laugh (maybe because I just hosted the family Thanksgiving dinner :-\ ). 



5. Do not make sexual advances unless you are given the mating signal.





What is the "mating signal?"
R