Author Topic: CT Shooting - Gun Control - Support or not?  (Read 23744 times)

tu_holmes

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Re: CT Shooting - Gun Control - Support or not?
« Reply #150 on: December 18, 2012, 05:28:22 PM »
The story's changed at least five times, so I'd have to check my scorecard.

Actually NONE of the stories had an assault rifle in them.

The Bushmaster XM-15 is not an assault rifle on any level. Nor were any of the guns at his house.

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Re: CT Shooting - Gun Control - Support or not?
« Reply #151 on: December 18, 2012, 05:31:22 PM »
What assault Rifle was used in CT?

I've got your answer for you... NONE.

There was not a single assault rifle used to commit any killing in Newton, CT.

Thats exactly what i thought.... Everywhere i read and heard , it was that he killed all the childeren with hand guns, and left the AR15 in the car

CNN is reporting today that what was left in the car was shotgun, and his Primary weapon to kill was the AR15  ??? ???


WHAT THE FUCK IS UP WITH THESE ASSHOLES  ??? ???  was it a gun or the ar15???/


http://www.cnn.com/2012/12/18/us/connecticut-lanza-guns/





Newtown shooter's guns: What we know



(CNN) -- Adam Lanza brought three weapons inside Sandy Hook Elementary school on December 14 and left a fourth in his car, police said. Those weapons were a Bushmaster AR-15 rifle and two handguns -- a Glock 10 mm and a Sig Sauer 9 mm.

In the car he left a shotgun, about which police have offered no details. Lanza used one of the handguns to take his own life, although police haven't said whether the gun was the Glock or the Sig Sauer.

In fact many details remain unknown about the weapons Lanza used that day to kill 20 children, his own mother, six other adults and then himself. Here's what is known so far:


The primary weapon used in the attack was a "Bushmaster AR-15 assault-type weapon," said Connecticut State Police Lt. Paul Vance. The rifle is a Bushmaster version of a widely made AR-15, the civilian version of the M-16 rifle used by the U.S. military. The original M-16 patent ran out years ago, and now the AR-15 is manufactured by several gunmakers. Unlike the military version, the AR-15 is a semiautomatic, firing one bullet per squeeze of the trigger. But like the M-16, ammunition is loaded through a magazine. In the school shooting, police say Lanza's rifle used numerous 30-round magazines.

An AR-15 is usually capable of firing a rate of 45 rounds per minute in semiautomatic mode.

Police didn't offer details about the specific model of the rifle Lanza used. A typical Bushmaster rifle, such as the M4 model, comes with a 30-round magazine but can use magazines of various capacities from five to 40 rounds. An M4 weighs about 6 ½ pounds and retails for about $1,300.

Under the 1994 federal ban on such weapons, buying new AR-15s was against the law. The ban expired in 2004.

Bushmaster is the No. 1 supplier of AR-15 rifles in the United States, according to the company website.

Their weapons are used by more than 100 police departments and by the militaries of 50 nations, according to Bushmaster. Private citizens use them for "hunting, recreation, competition and home defense and security," the website says.

Gun control: 'This one feels different'

Glock 10 mm handgun

Police haven't said what kind of Glock 10 mm handgun Lanza used. But Glock lists two types on its website, including the Glock 20 and Glock 29.

Lanza had "multiple magazines" for the Glock, Vance said. Such magazines are widely available.

The Glock 20 model has a 15-round magazine. Glock describes it as an ideal weapon for hunting because of its larger bullets, referred to as the ammunition's caliber.

The Glock 20 measures nearly 8 ¼ inches long and weighs about 2 ½ pounds when loaded, according to Glock's website.

Guns and Ammo magazine said of Glocks: "They point naturally, their triggers aren't too heavy ... but most importantly of all, they're reliable."

Sig Sauer 9 mm handgun

The other handgun police said Lanza had with him during the school massacre was a Sig Sauer. Authorities didn't say what kind, but possibilities include the P226, P229 or P250, P290, and if it was an older pistol, possibly the P220. The 9 mm P220 is no longer sold in the United States

Like the Glock, Lanza's Sig Sauer also allowed high-capacity ammunition, Vance said. Lanza used "multiple magazines" that are widely available to feed ammunition to the Sig Sauer, Vance said. Sig Sauer makes 9 mm pistol magazines with a maximum capacity of 20 bullets.

And like the Glock, Vance said the Sig Sauer handgun was a semiautomatic.

The P226 has a 15-round magazine, measures 7 ¾ inches and costs about $1,142, according to Sig Sauer's website. They can be found cheaper at some gun shops.

The Handguns magazine website says of the P226: "Adopted by the [Navy] SEALs nonetheless, it has proven to be durable, reliable, accurate and adaptable. What it has not had a reputation for is compactness."

NarcissisticDeity

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Re: CT Shooting - Gun Control - Support or not?
« Reply #152 on: December 18, 2012, 05:34:28 PM »
The solution to the tragic events in Newtown is to pass a national assault weapons ban that will effectively punish all law-abiding citizens as if this will prevent this from happening again

The irony is...................... ..........CT already has an assault weapons ban in place  :-\ along with , laws against , murder , theft , etc

They want to ban magazines over 10 rounds , they've been making the M16/AR15 platform since 1959 and there are literally tens-of-millions of these magazines that were legal to obtain before the ban , so banning them will accomplish nothing

Even if they went off the deep end and out-right banned ALL new semi-autos , there are again literally tens-of-millions of these rifles that will be grandfathered in , so again this wont stop another mass-shooting

These laws are USELESS , they will NOT prevent another mass shooting , they only serve to restrict the rights of people who follow the law. They had their shot with the first assault weapons ban in 1994-2004 , it was never re-upped because it did NOT work , especially seeing these guns are used in less than 2% of crimes. It was a gigantic failure

As a law-abiding tax paying American citizen , with a flawless record STOP punishing me because of some lunatic. Whenever I buy a gun they call the F.B.I. on me right there to make sure my ' papers ' are in order.

Do I need an ' assault weapon ' ? yes , why does someone need a ' AR15 or AK47 ' ? to kill people who intend on doing me or my family harm. Do I need a car that does 150MPH when the speed limit is 65? need has nothing to do with it.

It's like saying your internet will now be restricted and no one will be able to look at ANY porn sites anymore because some creepy bastard filmed himself having sex with children and posted it on the internet , you're punishing the wrong people.

The most ignorant misguided people are making decisions on what you can and can't legally own based on appearances , hysteria and the acts of deranged people. Don't like guns? don't buy one , but fuck off already with punishing me for something I didn't do.

Steps off soap box 


chaos

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Re: CT Shooting - Gun Control - Support or not?
« Reply #153 on: December 18, 2012, 05:39:47 PM »
The solution to the tragic events in Newtown is to pass a national assault weapons ban that will effectively punish all law-abiding citizens as if this will prevent this from happening again

The irony is...................... ..........CT already has an assault weapons ban in place  :-\ along with , laws against , murder , theft , etc

They want to ban magazines over 10 rounds , they've been making the M16/AR15 platform since 1959 and there are literally tens-of-millions of these magazines that were legal to obtain before the ban , so banning them will accomplish nothing

Even if they went off the deep end and out-right banned ALL new semi-autos , there are again literally tens-of-millions of these rifles that will be grandfathered in , so again this wont stop another mass-shooting

These laws are USELESS , they will NOT prevent another mass shooting , they only serve to restrict the rights of people who follow the law. They had their shot with the first assault weapons ban in 1994-2004 , it was never re-upped because it did NOT work , especially seeing these guns are used in less than 2% of crimes. It was a gigantic failure

As a law-abiding tax paying American citizen , with a flawless record STOP punishing me because of some lunatic. Whenever I buy a gun they call the F.B.I. on me right there to make sure my ' papers ' are in order.

Do I need an ' assault weapon ' ? yes , why does someone need a ' AR15 or AK47 ' ? to kill people who intend on doing me or my family harm. Do I need a car that does 150MPH when the speed limit is 65? need has nothing to do with it.

It's like saying your internet will now be restricted and no one will be able to look at ANY porn sites anymore because some creepy bastard filmed himself having sex with children and posted it on the internet , you're punishing the wrong people.

The most ignorant misguided people are making decisions on what you can and can't legally own based on appearances , hysteria and the acts of deranged people. Don't like guns? don't buy one , but fuck off already with punishing me for something I didn't do.

Steps off soap box 


I see you've pulled Ronnie/Dorians dick out of your hands and made a decent post.
Liar!!!!Filt!!!!

BILL ANVIL

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Re: private guard at school should be armed, no more gunman vs unarmed mass
« Reply #154 on: December 18, 2012, 05:42:45 PM »
I didn't mean they would be working for the military,  these guys would be discharged.  Let's face it they would be ideal, battle hardened and know what to do when the shit goes down.

well sure, they'll get discharged and then immediately go join Xe/Academi services or whatever firm gets the contracts and earn 5 or 600 amercican tax dollars a day doing it  :-\  

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Re: CT Shooting - Gun Control - Support or not?
« Reply #155 on: December 18, 2012, 05:44:14 PM »
Under the 1994 federal ban on such weapons, buying new AR-15s was against the law. The ban expired in 2004.


This is NOT true , you could buy them in a ban configuration. The state I live in ( Ma ) we still have a assault weapons ban and all that means is , you can't not have a bayonet lug to hold a bayonet ( stupid I know ) instead of a flash-suppressor you have to have a pinned on or weld muzzle device , no retractable stock and no new magazines over 10 rounds. but you can buy dozens of magazines made before the ban ( pre-ban ) and use them in a post-ban gun , 20 , 30 , 40 and yes even 100 round magazines

This is my AR15 under the ' assault weapons ban ' they will in all probability bringing this back national wide , if that ass-hole lunatic had this weapon NOTHING would have been different ( the 30 round magazine inside is a preban )

tu_holmes

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Re: CT Shooting - Gun Control - Support or not?
« Reply #156 on: December 18, 2012, 05:44:33 PM »
Thats exactly what i thought.... Everywhere i read and heard , it was that he killed all the childeren with hand guns, and left the AR15 in the car

CNN is reporting today that what was left in the car was shotgun, and his Primary weapon to kill was the AR15  ??? ???


WHAT THE FUCK IS UP WITH THESE ASSHOLES  ??? ???  was it a gun or the ar15???/


http://www.cnn.com/2012/12/18/us/connecticut-lanza-guns/





Newtown shooter's guns: What we know



(CNN) -- Adam Lanza brought three weapons inside Sandy Hook Elementary school on December 14 and left a fourth in his car, police said. Those weapons were a Bushmaster AR-15 rifle and two handguns -- a Glock 10 mm and a Sig Sauer 9 mm.

In the car he left a shotgun, about which police have offered no details. Lanza used one of the handguns to take his own life, although police haven't said whether the gun was the Glock or the Sig Sauer.

In fact many details remain unknown about the weapons Lanza used that day to kill 20 children, his own mother, six other adults and then himself. Here's what is known so far:


The primary weapon used in the attack was a "Bushmaster AR-15 assault-type weapon," said Connecticut State Police Lt. Paul Vance. The rifle is a Bushmaster version of a widely made AR-15, the civilian version of the M-16 rifle used by the U.S. military. The original M-16 patent ran out years ago, and now the AR-15 is manufactured by several gunmakers. Unlike the military version, the AR-15 is a semiautomatic, firing one bullet per squeeze of the trigger. But like the M-16, ammunition is loaded through a magazine. In the school shooting, police say Lanza's rifle used numerous 30-round magazines.

An AR-15 is usually capable of firing a rate of 45 rounds per minute in semiautomatic mode.



See how they use "Assault-type" as a description?

It's because it's NOT an assault rifle... It does not do automatic or 3 burst semi-auto.... You have to pull the  trigger EVERY time.

It is a fast repeating single shot rifle... And it is NOT easy to convert to Auto.

My Uncle has done it a few times and it's a bitch!

The True Adonis

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Re: CT Shooting - Gun Control - Support or not?
« Reply #157 on: December 18, 2012, 05:45:01 PM »
The solution to the tragic events in Newtown is to pass a national assault weapons ban that will effectively punish all law-abiding citizens as if this will prevent this from happening again

The irony is...................... ..........CT already has an assault weapons ban in place  :-\ along with , laws against , murder , theft , etc

They want to ban magazines over 10 rounds , they've been making the M16/AR15 platform since 1959 and there are literally tens-of-millions of these magazines that were legal to obtain before the ban , so banning them will accomplish nothing

Even if they went off the deep end and out-right banned ALL new semi-autos , there are again literally tens-of-millions of these rifles that will be grandfathered in , so again this wont stop another mass-shooting

These laws are USELESS , they will NOT prevent another mass shooting , they only serve to restrict the rights of people who follow the law. They had their shot with the first assault weapons ban in 1994-2004 , it was never re-upped because it did NOT work , especially seeing these guns are used in less than 2% of crimes. It was a gigantic failure

As a law-abiding tax paying American citizen , with a flawless record STOP punishing me because of some lunatic. Whenever I buy a gun they call the F.B.I. on me right there to make sure my ' papers ' are in order.

Do I need an ' assault weapon ' ? yes , why does someone need a ' AR15 or AK47 ' ? to kill people who intend on doing me or my family harm. Do I need a car that does 150MPH when the speed limit is 65? need has nothing to do with it.

It's like saying your internet will now be restricted and no one will be able to look at ANY porn sites anymore because some creepy bastard filmed himself having sex with children and posted it on the internet , you're punishing the wrong people.

The most ignorant misguided people are making decisions on what you can and can't legally own based on appearances , hysteria and the acts of deranged people. Don't like guns? don't buy one , but fuck off already with punishing me for something I didn't do.

Steps off soap box 


:o

x2

Jack T. Cross

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Re: CT Shooting - Gun Control - Support or not?
« Reply #158 on: December 18, 2012, 05:46:32 PM »
Actually NONE of the stories had an assault rifle in them.

The Bushmaster XM-15 is not an assault rifle on any level. Nor were any of the guns at his house.


Does anyone challenge this post?

tu_holmes

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Re: CT Shooting - Gun Control - Support or not?
« Reply #159 on: December 18, 2012, 05:47:22 PM »
Does anyone challenge this post?

Nothing to challenge... My statement is FACT.

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Re: CT Shooting - Gun Control - Support or not?
« Reply #160 on: December 18, 2012, 05:51:19 PM »
The 4 weapons were the Glock, the Sig, the AR-15, and a Saiga shotgun that was left in the trunk.

This whole "wow scary machine gun assault rifle available anywhere" silliness is used to work people up into a lather that don't actually understand the laws or firearms mechanics.
The average person hasn't been able to cheaply or easily obtain a true assault weapon since the NFA of 1934, which was further strengthened by the GCA of 1968, and FOPA of 1986.


The actual guns we are talking about operate like any other semi-automatic hunting or target gun.

By many accounts we'll probably see another law offered up in the vein of the 94 AWB, which was -

Semi-automatic rifles able to accept detachable magazines and two or more of the following:
Folding or telescoping stock
Pistol grip
Bayonet mount
Flash suppressor, or threaded barrel designed to accommodate one
Grenade launcher (more precisely, a muzzle device that enables launching or firing rifle grenades, though this applies only to muzzle mounted grenade launchers and not those mounted externally).

Semi-automatic pistols with detachable magazines and two or more of the following:
Magazine that attaches outside the pistol grip
Threaded barrel to attach barrel extender, flash suppressor, handgrip, or suppressor
Barrel shroud that can be used as a hand-hold
Unloaded weight of 50 oz (1.4 kg) or more
A semi-automatic version of a fully automatic firearm.

Semi-automatic shotguns with two or more of the following:
Folding or telescoping stock
Pistol grip
Fixed capacity of more than 5 rounds
Detachable magazine.

Additionally a federal limit of 10 rounds per magazine.


Seriously, other that the capacity ban which might have a sliver of merit, does any of that stuff actually look important?

It's not, and it will stop nothing. It's just feel good glad handing and dick pulling for the masses.

Jack T. Cross

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Re: CT Shooting - Gun Control - Support or not?
« Reply #161 on: December 18, 2012, 05:54:37 PM »
Nothing to challenge... My statement is FACT.

Sounds like it's time to put up for some of the 'gun control' fags, then.

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Re: CT Shooting - Gun Control - Support or not?
« Reply #162 on: December 18, 2012, 06:02:47 PM »
Im still skeptical of the every-evolving story. Originally the AR was locked in the car, he was let into the school (sounds more likely than the new story) and he shot the kids with a glock and a sig. This was accepted for several days.

Then all the sudden the narrative changed and he used the AR and blasted his way past the new security system (a door that you have to be buzzed by, probably metal with shatterproof glas) and layed everyone out with the AR. Next thing you know, AWB ban bill being introduced (which they've been wanting to do for a while).

I'm not one to be highly skeptical of reporters... but seriously, wtf.

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Re: CT Shooting - Gun Control - Support or not?
« Reply #163 on: December 18, 2012, 06:11:16 PM »
So the difference between 'AR-15', and 'XM-15' that Tu Holmes mentioned...one is civilian, the other military, or what? Does anyone know?

BB

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Re: CT Shooting - Gun Control - Support or not?
« Reply #164 on: December 18, 2012, 06:11:39 PM »
Im still skeptical of the every-evolving story. Originally the AR was locked in the car, he was let into the school (sounds more likely than the new story) and he shot the kids with a glock and a sig. This was accepted for several days.

Then all the sudden the narrative changed and he used the AR and blasted his way past the new security system (a door that you have to be buzzed by, probably metal with shatterproof glas) and layed everyone out with the AR. Next thing you know, AWB ban bill being introduced (which they've been wanting to do for a while).

I'm not one to be highly skeptical of reporters... but seriously, wtf.

The below video is what caused the confusion, in their rush to be first, the Saiga was reported as an AR-15 by some reporters -

.

Here was the medical examiner and the rifle being used -



Heywood

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Re: CT Shooting - Gun Control - Support or not?
« Reply #165 on: December 18, 2012, 06:12:44 PM »
Actually NONE of the stories had an assault rifle in them.

The Bushmaster XM-15 is not an assault rifle on any level. Nor were any of the guns at his house.


yeah, the bushmaster is just a bb gun.  

murdering 20 children is not an assault, it's just a very long recess.

Please, feel free go on.........



Heywood

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Re: CT Shooting - Gun Control - Support or not?
« Reply #166 on: December 18, 2012, 06:14:13 PM »
Sounds like it's time to put up for some of the 'gun control' fags, then.

lets face it, without their guns, a lot of guys don't have their peckers.


Nails

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Re: CT Shooting - Gun Control - Support or not?
« Reply #167 on: December 18, 2012, 06:14:55 PM »
So the difference between 'AR-15', and 'XM-15' that Tu Holmes mentioned...one is civilian, the other military, or what? Does anyone know?


the AR-15 is a civilian Version of the M16


i think TUholmes misstyped xm-1

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Re: CT Shooting - Gun Control - Support or not?
« Reply #168 on: December 18, 2012, 06:16:25 PM »
So the difference between 'AR-15', and 'XM-15' that Tu Holmes mentioned...one is civilian, the other military, or what? Does anyone know?
The AR-15 family of weapons are nothing more than a semi-automatic .223 or 5.56m shoulder fired civilian version of the M16/M4 family of military assault weapons. The M16/M4 are select fire weapons, meaning they can either select semi-automatic and 3 round burst (or full automatic depending on the model).

We rarely ever used anything other than semi when I was in, as it was a waste of ammunition and it was less accurate.

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Re: CT Shooting - Gun Control - Support or not?
« Reply #169 on: December 18, 2012, 06:18:42 PM »
The below video is what caused the confusion, in their rush to be first, the Saiga was reported as an AR-15 by some reporters -

.

Here was the medical examiner and the rifle being used -



I'm wondering more about the way they're claiming he entered... A shotgun is a breaching weapon. Why was it in the the car if he had to shoot his way through a metal door with shatterproof fire glass? You'd struggle to do that with a .223 round IMHO.

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Re: CT Shooting - Gun Control - Support or not?
« Reply #170 on: December 18, 2012, 06:19:36 PM »

the AR-15 is a civilian Version of the M16


i think TUholmes misstyped xm-1

That's good, because my scorecard is full.  I can't believe any of this shit anymore.

BB

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Re: CT Shooting - Gun Control - Support or not?
« Reply #171 on: December 18, 2012, 06:21:02 PM »
So the difference between 'AR-15', and 'XM-15' that Tu Holmes mentioned...one is civilian, the other military, or what? Does anyone know?

Trade names- Colt is AR-15, Bushmaster's Tradename is XM-15. AR-15 has become like Kleenex, it's more or less a common trade name, internally they're the same.

Now Sear design is what separates the miltary versions from the civilan versions, full auto vs. Semi auto.

Shockwave

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Re: CT Shooting - Gun Control - Support or not?
« Reply #172 on: December 18, 2012, 06:21:48 PM »
Now Sear design is what separates the miltary versions from the civilan versions, full auto vs. Semi auto.
Hey, someone that knows what they're talking about.

Jack T. Cross

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Re: CT Shooting - Gun Control - Support or not?
« Reply #173 on: December 18, 2012, 06:28:57 PM »
The AR-15 family of weapons are nothing more than a semi-automatic .223 or 5.56m shoulder fired civilian version of the M16/M4 family of military assault weapons. The M16/M4 are select fire weapons, meaning they can either select semi-automatic and 3 round burst (or full automatic depending on the model).

We rarely ever used anything other than semi when I was in, as it was a waste of ammunition and it was less accurate.

So would you challenge Tu's statement that there was absolutely no presence of an assault weapon?    Or is it simply quibbling over definitions?  I suppose it is.

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Re: CT Shooting - Gun Control - Support or not?
« Reply #174 on: December 18, 2012, 06:31:19 PM »
So would you challenge Tu's statement that there was absolutely no presence of an assault weapon?    Or is it simply quibbling over definitions?  I suppose it is.
Option Bravo.

It's really a cosmetic thing, some people classify all military looking rifles as "assault weapons" regardless of the actual implications of that word. There is no real difference between a .223 hunting rifle and a .223 Ar-15 aside from cosmetics.