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Obama to make statement in a few minutes. Blitzes said it is huge and won't say. Something is afoot.
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Just heard a UFO landed on the White House lawn!
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Blitzer looks Like oa ton of bricks fell on him.
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have they started? I'm at the office-- just seeing CNN banner headline.
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I bet it has to do with bin laden.
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I bet it has to do with bin laden.
i bet youre watching geraldo
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No. Scanning the web.
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rofl swell just swell.
long form released, osama dead , , , , ,
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Saying they have the body of bin laden.
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rofl swell just swell.
long form released, osama dead , , , , ,
wonder when his skin color is going to change, eh?
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The ct's on this are going to be wild.
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Wonder when and where they got this dirtbag?
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Obama still cleaning up Bush's mess I see.
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Obama still cleaning up Bush's mess I see.
::)
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Obama still cleaning up Bush's mess I see.
You mean the CIA?
Sounds like a drone attack did him in, too. A program started by Bush. LOL!
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crap, this means Obama will probably get re-elected
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crap, this means Obama will probably get re-elected
Hardly.
The economy/gas prices/any more wars will probably determine that.
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crap, this means Obama will probably get re-elected
it's 2011 foo'
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crap, this means Obama will probably get re-elected
Americans care about $5/gal gas a lot more than Bin Laden.
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240 is going to be spraying pro-Obama cum all over his monitor when he sees this.
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There was a massive drone attack a few days ago that killed dozens. I'll bet his ass was in that.
Obviously great job to our guys who got him.
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240 is going to be spraying pro-Obama cum all over his monitor when he sees this.
Actually , 240 has been talking about this for a long time.
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Actually , 240 has been talking about this for a long time.
Uh no. 240's been talking about the big CT when Obama unveils this news 2 weeks before his reelection.
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I agree. It will mean four more years for Obama.
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Uh no. 240's been talking about the big CT when Obama unveils this news 2 weeks before his reelection.
exactly funny this comes now after his bc release...guess he sprayed his load early ehh, 240?
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I agree. It will mean four more years for Obama.
Definitely a big plus for Obama, but if the economy is still in the shitter, he's going to be hurting come election time.
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Obama still cleaning up Bush's mess I see.
::)
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I agree. It will mean four more years for Obama.
If gas is at 5 dollars and food inflation skyrocketing this will be a distant memory. Don't get me wrong this is great news and so far the best thing bam a has ever done by far. However by 2012 this won't make or break the race.
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Obama homers, will he make it a hat trrick 333333?
I hope it turns back to the economy Skip.
4 more years >:(
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I agree. It will mean four more years for Obama.
LOL na, economy has been and will continue to be the first and foremost issue...
this will give him a bump i honestly would be suprised if it last more than a week or two.
1 and a half years from now this wont mean shit if the unemployment/underemployment level is still what it is or worse.
the ppl with no job or a job but not able to pay bills dont care about bin laden.
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exactly funny this comes now after his bc release...guess he sprayed his load early ehh, 240?
If they had the body for over a week, bam a definitely time the bc for this.
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exactly funny this comes now after his bc release...guess he sprayed his load early ehh, 240?
hahaha. Well, Tony you know how these big government conspiracys work - no rhyme, no reason, no logic - but somehow, masterfully executed.
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Hahahaha at all the asshole tinfoil hatters that claimed he's been dead for years. Where's your CT now, douche bags?
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There was a massive drone attack a week or so that killed dozens in Pakistan. I'll bet this was it.
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Good job, Coalition forces.
No 72 virgins for you, Osama, you grimy little rat bastard! :D ;D
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Hahahaha at all the asshole tinfoil hatters that claimed he's been dead for years. Where's your CT now, douche bags?
lolol...may as well predict the next CT:
Bin Laden = not really dead.
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I heard bin laden hosted a show on C-SPan every day.
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lolol...may as well predict the next CT:
Bin Laden = not really dead.
lol him tupac and elvis are drinking it up somewhere.
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This could be double the pleasure.
I think SAMSONJAG might off herself after hearing this news.
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This could be double the pleasure.
I think SAMSONJAG might off herself after hearing this news.
If only.
Pakistan's leaders and the ISI must be crying hard right now. After all, they spent the last 10 years protecting this guy.
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I hope bam a has pics of the body. I personally would douse it in pigs blood and set it on fire.
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bring it back to NYC and have a triumph - roman style. get tanks, drones, everything in the street. It will only be symbolic, but it would be cool. Although all the pc geeks would have a fit. ;D
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I hope bam a has pics of the body. I personally would douse it in pigs blood and set it on fire.
fuck yes
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lolol...may as well predict the next CT:
Bin Laden = not really dead.
LOL!!!!
Will the CTers claim the death certificate is fake too?
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bring it back to NYC and have a triumph - roman style. get tanks, drones, everything in the street. It will only be symbolic, but it would be cool. Although all the pc geeks would have a fit. ;D
He'll yeah. I'm game for that!
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I expect AQ to attempt something big in response to this.
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LOL!!!!
Will the CTers claim the death certificate is fake too?
or perhaps the bush's put a body double in his place and are all chilling in venezula at their ranch?
hmmm....
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I expect AQ to attempt something big in response to this.
without a doubt
hopefully we are able to foil these fucktards
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I expect AQ to attempt something big in response to this.
Hope not. I have to be in downtown NYC tomorrow.
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Obama homers, will he make it a hat trrick 333333?
I hope it turns back to the economy Skip.
4 more years >:(
It's assumed it was predator drones but we still don't know. Could this boost the war sentiment for situations like Lybia, etc.
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Gadaffi probably has his hours numbered too.
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Gadaffi probably has his hours numbered too.
LOL since the beginning...who ever thought we were just going there to keep the peace? lmao
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LOL since the beginning...who ever thought we were just going there to keep the peace? lmao
pretty lame that we pick off the ones that are somewhat sympathetic to us. How about an Ayatollah instead?
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pretty lame that we pick off the ones that are somewhat sympathetic to us. How about an Ayatollah instead?
we had to keep the peace with the UN
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pretty lame that we pick off the ones that are somewhat sympathetic to us. How about an Ayatollah instead?
Obama is complicit in Iranian brutality. Much easier to beat up small Libya.
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Something is strange though. We had the body for a week and he makes the announcement on a Sunday night a week later at midnight. Strange.
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Damn. ABC just said that it was a ground attack on a mansion in Pakistan that did it. JSOC operation on a compound they were monitoring for months.
Must have been pretty badass to be one of the guys on that mission.
The ISI was definitely hiding this scumbag. A mansion. ::)
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They definitely knew where this asshole was. Either way, I'm thrilled they got him.
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Americans care about $5/gal gas a lot more than Bin Laden.
lmao..that was fast
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They definitely knew where this asshole was. Either way, I'm thrilled they got him.
that is very big of you 333
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Wonder when and where they got this dirtbag?
You can't be this dumb!!!!! You actually believe this CRAPOLLA????
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lmao..that was fast
its true mal and whether you know it or not, you will in a few weeks broham
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Something is strange though. We had the body for a week and he makes the announcement on a Sunday night a week later at midnight. Strange.
Confirming DNA results... It takes a few days.
Plus, Obama wanted to interrupt the Apprentice on the West Coast. :)
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Just heard a UFO landed on the White House lawn!
I just discovered ATLANTIS
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lmao..that was fast
Deep in your heart, you know it's true.
But big props to Barry on this one, no doubt.
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lmao..that was fast
This really has nothing to do with Obama and everything to do with America. We've been tracking him through Pakistan for 10 years now and finally caught up to him.
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You can't be this dumb!!!!! You actually believe this CRAPOLLA????
So he's not dead? Or he is dead?
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Confirming DNA results... It takes a few days.
Plus, Obama wanted to interrupt the Apprentice on the West Coast. :)
hahahhaha, at the trump dig...LMAO hahahah
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Samson must be crying right now. She's spent years forcing that CT down our throats. Her world is shattered. I wouldn't be surprised if she commits suicid as a result of this.
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hahahhaha, at the trump dig...LMAO hahahah
;D
Samson must be crying right now. She's spent years forcing that CT down our throats. Her world is shattered. I wouldn't be surprised if she commits suicid as a result of this.
We could only be so lucky...
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This guy was in a compound near the Pakistani capital. There is no fucking way in hell that the ISI and the Pakistani govt. wasn't fully aware of where he was and most likely active in helping him move around the country.
The ISI = terrorist organization.
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This really has nothing to do with Obama and everything to do with America. We've been tracking him through Pakistan for 10 years now and finally caught up to him.
exactly we were going to get him sooner or later...
happier than fuck this shit head is dead I hope the guys that got him pissed on his body and took pictures for his fuck tard followers
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Not a drone attack then. Impressive.
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Ding dong the assholes dead!
And apparently, there is a God after all. And God's not muslim. ;D ;D ;D
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This guy was in a compound near the Pakistani capital. There is no fucking way in hell that the ISI and the Pakistani govt. wasn't fully aware of where he was and most likely active in helping him move around the country.
Agreed... We should nuke the goddamn country for aiding his ass.
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This is great news. But to think this will matter in a year and a half is crazy considering how much else can happen.
But I won't lessen this night for Obama or the country. It's a great day. Now - will this change the afghani war?
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exactly we were going to get him sooner or later...
happier than fuck this shit head is dead I hope the guys that got him pissed on his body and took pictures for his fuck tard followers
Lucky guys that got to be in on that mission. Definitely one they'll remember.
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So he's not dead? Or he is dead?
Benazzir Bhutto announced his dead years ago and who killed him. It was because of her commentary on that fact that the CIA killed her.
2:15 seconds into this vid she makes announcement of death and who did it
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Great news. Glad he's dead. We need to get Zawahiri too.
This will definitely help Obama. I don't think it gives him four more years, but it will help.
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Where is the long form death certificate? ;D
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Great news. Glad he's dead. We need to get Zawahiri too.
This will definitely help Obama. I don't think it gives him four more years, but it will help.
So you love Obama after all!!!
This will be a shoe in for 2012 for him
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Benazzir Bhutto announced his dead years ago and who killed him. It was because of her commentary on that fact that the CIA killed her.
2:15 seconds into this vid she makes announcement of death and who did it
Haha... right, The US is doing DNA analysis, but are apparently the ones who are lying?
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I thought the CT was that osama was dead and we were continuing to press for empire/oil...
can you speak to this jagson?
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ABC just showed a huge crowd gathering outside the White House singing the anthem and chanting "USA". Fucking awesome sight.
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Sources: Al-Qaida head bin Laden dead
(http://l.yimg.com/a/p/us/news/editorial/b/2c/b2ccedd42ec737bf075a1d8e60ef26ec.jpeg)
BIN LADEN AP – FILE - In this 1998 file photo, al Qaida leader Osama bin Laden is shown in Afghanistan. A person familiar …
By JULIE PACE and MATT APUZZO, Associated Press Julie Pace And Matt Apuzzo, Associated Press – 7 mins ago
WASHINGTON – Osama bin Laden, the glowering mastermind behind the Sept. 11, 2001, terror attacks that killed thousands of Americans, was killed in an operation led by the United States, President Barack Obama said Sunday
A small team of Americans carried out the attack and took custody of bin Laden's remains, the president said in a dramatic late-night statement at the White House.
A jubilant crowd gathered outside the White House as word spread of bin Laden's death after a global manhunt that lasted nearly a decade.
"Justice has been done," the president said.
The development comes just months before the tenth anniversary of the Sept. 11 attacks on the World Trade Centers and Pentagon, orchestrated by bin Laden's al-Qaida organization, that killed more than 3,000 people.
The attacks set off a chain of events that led the United States into wars in Afghanistan, and then Iraq, and America's entire intelligence apparatus was overhauled to counter the threat of more terror attacks at home.
Al-Qaida organization was also blamed for the 1998 bombings of two U.S. embassies in Africa that killed 231 people and the 2000 attack on the USS Cole that killed 17 American sailors in Yemen, as well as countless other plots, some successful and some foiled.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110502/ap_on_re_us/us_bin_laden
________________________ ________________________ ________________________
So does this mean the ILLEGAL WAR on Afghanistan and Iraq is now over, or will martyrs magically appear with a Bin Laden tape claiming they are going to avenge their leaders death...When does the bullshit end.
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Let's not forget The Cole attack either that bin laden conducted as well.
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Why did you feel the need to start your own thread when there's a 4 page one going right now? Are you that desperate for attention, you pathetic sack of shit?
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well at least you raised a legit question for once, ;)
this will undoubtedly raise more shit from his fuck tard followers but hopefully we can limit it to attacks off our mainland...
hopefully this will spur US and others to put more pressure on the idiocy that is radical islam and call it out when we see it whether it be in our own backyard or in the middle east.
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Why did you feel the need to start your own thread when there's a 4 page one going right now? Are you that desperate for attention, you pathetic sack of shit?
Too many idiots like yourself are on that thread.
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Too many idiots like yourself are on that thread.
(http://www.funnyforumpics.com/forums/attention-whore/2/Attention-Whore_Beach.jpg)
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I love the part where Amandinejad says Osama is in DC...Priceless
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(http://tvrecappersanonymous.files.wordpress.com/2010/11/obama-dancing-on-ellen_o_gifsoup-com.gif)
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(http://tvrecappersanonymous.files.wordpress.com/2010/11/obama-dancing-on-ellen_o_gifsoup-com.gif)
hahahhaha nice
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Navy seals!
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Pakistan's ISI = terrorist organization.
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Pakistan's ISI = terrorist organization.
Truth.
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Great news that we got this scumbag. Send the right message that we will always hunt these animals down.
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This must kill SATAN 123
He has been preaching that OBL has been dead for years already ;D
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Even though I spit on the ground Obama walks on, I congraduate him on this. It's disappointing that some people here have decided to make this into a Bush v. Obama deal. Let's remember that Bush killed or captured atleast a third of the leadership, including the number 3 man and mastermind of the attack itself. He captured him and used him to get valuable intelligence that prevented other terrorist attacks. Bush also killed the number 1 Al Quaida man in Iraq.
And as great as this is, it doesnt make up for two major non- goverment prevented terrorist attacks that occured within a year.
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I guess George Bush was right when he too said he did not care about Bin Laden and had other concerns outside of worrying about where he supposedly was
Why Bin Laden's Death No Longer Really Matter
(http://l.yimg.com/a/i/us/nws/p/time_logo_101.jpg)
(http://d.yimg.com/a/p/rids/20110502/i/r2269921292.jpg?x=315&y=345&q=85&sig=bAmhM3JhMPhvHB21Dc4VYw--)
By TONY KARON Tony Karon – 1 hr 10 mins ago
Before leaving for a vacation in South Africa in December of 2001, my editor asked me to prepare an obituary for Osama bin Laden for TIME.com on the assumption that he might well be killed in Afghanistan while I was on the beach in Cape Town. Almost ten years later there was finally a reason to call up the old file: President Barack Obama said late Sunday that the al-Qaeda leader had been killed in a U.S. raid in the Pakistani town of Abbottabad, and that the U.S. was in possession of his body.
But where killing or capturing Bin Laden might once have been imagined to be a decisive turning point in a struggle between the U.S. and its challengers in the Muslim world, today, the death of America's erst while nemesis is little more than an historical footnote - a settling of accounts for a spree of ugly crimes and the elimination of a symbol of global Jihadist nihilism, perhaps, offering justice and closure for the victims of 9/11 and other atrocities. But it does little to alter the challenges facing the U.S. and its allies in Afghanistan, Iraq, Egypt, Iran, Pakistan or any other major country in the Muslim world. That's because much to his chagrin, Bin Laden and his movement have achieved only marginal relevance to power struggles throughout the Muslim world. The strategy of spectacular acts of a terror had briefly allowed a band of a few hundred desperadoes to dominate America's headlines and its nightmares, but on the ground in the Muslim world AL-Qaeda had largely been a sideshow, failing miserably in its goal of rallying the Islamic world behind its banners and finding itself eclipsed by such despised rivals in the battle for Islamist leadership as Iran, Hizballah, Hamas and the Muslim Brotherhood. (See pictures of Osama Bin Laden.)
Here's some of what I wrote in December 2001:
We can say with relative certainty that Osama bin Laden is not right now enjoying the attentions of 70 virgins in paradise. But with the same certainty we can predict that he will live on, years and even decades from now, on the T-shirts, key-chains and calendars of the Muslim world's malcontents. Indeed, in the rarefied climes of rebel icons, Bin Laden has become the Islamist Che Guevara.
It was long before September 11 that Osama bin Laden first chose to die. Authoring the most dramatic terror attack in history had simply compressed the timeframe of the inevitable 'martyrdom' he first envisaged two decades earlier in the same mountains of southeastern Afghanistan where a simple TKTKTK ended his life on TKTK. The video spectacle of bin Laden cackling ghoulishly over the number of innocents his human bombs had killed in the World Trade Center will underscore the grim satisfaction in the West and among its allies in the east, near and far, at the Saudi terrorist's ignominious end. But the story of Bin Laden's rise is a cautionary tale of perils that persist despite the elimination of a man who had, of late, come to personify them.
Bin Laden's decision to sacrifice his life in service of an implacable pan-Islamic nationalism would likely have been taken two decades earlier, when the pious young Saudi multimillionaire first ventured into Afghanistan.
Back then, of course, he was an American ally, selflessly putting his fortune, his career and even his body on the line to rally Islamic firebrands from all over the world to help wage jihad against the Soviet infidels who had invaded Muslim lands. That effort, covertly backed and orchestrated by the U.S. as well as Saudi Arabia, Egypt and Pakistan, saw an improbable triumph, as lightly-armed guerrilla forces put to flight the world's largest conventional army. But it had other, unintended consequences. The Afghan jihad had drawn together Muslim radicals from all over the world, and trained and organized them into an International Brigade of Islamist fighters, feeding off each other's extremism, their victory feeding fevered dreams of reviving the long-lost Islamic empire of old - or at least of being able to roll back contemporary foes in conflicts around the globe. (Had the Republican cause prevailed in Spain in the 1930, the Communist International would have found itself with a similar cadre of battle-hardened veterans ready for deployment in the world's sharpest class wars.)
The somewhat naÏve but highly motivated bin Laden found himself in the orbit of hardened Islamist zealots from all over the world, his own views growing increasingly hard-line as he found himself assiduously courted particularly by the Egyptian radicals who saw his potential as a global terrorist leader in his wealth, his connections with Arab elites and his charisma.
For bin Laden and those around him, the message of the Soviet retreat was simple: armed with unshakable faith that they are soldiers of god and a willingness to die fighting, jihadists could prevail over 'infidels.' The "Afghan Arabs" were not men who could easily return their own countries - Egypt, Saudi Arabia and other pro-Western Arab regimes had used the Afghan jihad as an opportunity to "export" their domestic Islamist nuisances, and weren't about to allow them back as combat-hardened warriors to renew their seditious efforts. Bin Laden shared their predicament. Afghanistan had hardened his opposition to the Saudi royal family, which failed to measure up to his measure of Islamic legitimacy. And when the king invited U.S. troops onto Saudi soil to defend the kingdom against any threat from Iraq, Bin Laden was outraged - a new set of infidels were being invited onto the sacred ground of Islam's birthplace. Bin Laden was now on a collision course with the House of Saud, and despite his family's deep-rooted ties to the royal family, he found himself expelled.
For Bin Laden, that was simply confirmation of the analysis he'd developed in Afghanistan: The undemocratic, un-Islamic regimes of the Arab world were but servants of the United States, whose presence and influence in the Arab and Muslim world was the prime obstacle to his dream of a pan-Islamic political revival. At bases in Afghanistan, and in the Sudan where an Islamist regime made room for him after his expulsion by the Saudis, bin Laden kept his Afghan Arabs together in his al-Qaeda organization. They were sent to fight in Chechnya, Bosnia and other places Muslims were under fire or waging separatist battles, spreading their example of selfless sacrifice to spread the tentacles of a global network whose ultimate confrontation would pit it against its supreme 'infidel' enemy, the United States. (See pictures of the 9/11 attack.)
Bin Laden believed America could be beaten. His objective, after all, was not to conquer the U.S. but rather to end its presence and pervasive influence in the lands of Islam. Exhibit A was the U.S. withdrawal from Beirut in 1985, after Hizbollah blew up a Marine barracks there killing more than 200 U.S. troops. The bloody carnage of Mogadishu in 1993, in which 17 U.S. soldiers were killed in an abortive raid on a local warlord, also led to a hasty retreat - today U.S. officials believe operatives linked with bin Laden helped train the Somali gunmen who ambushed the Americans. And in his propaganda, bin Laden certainly claimed the incident as further proof of his basic thesis - that the U.S. would withdraw from Muslim countries if the cost of staying was rendered too high.
Bin Laden and the Egyptian Islamic Jihad leaders at the helm of his movement had global ambitions quite unlike any terrorist organization that had gone before them. Previous terrorist luminaries such as the Palestinian Abu Nidal had generally led organizations drawn from a single country, and had been entirely dependent on state sponsors for sanctuary and survival - states such as Libya, Syria and Iran had all used such groups to send bloody political messages to their foes. Al Qaeda was different: its members were drawn from all over the Muslim world, their core cemented during the Afghan jihad; and they operated entirely independently of any state sponsorship. Indeed, far from such authoritarian precincts as Tripoli, Tehran and Damascus, al Qaeda preferred to establish its bases in locales where state authority had all but collapsed - Sudan, Somalia and Afghanistan.
And rather than slowly grow their organization from the ground up, bin Laden and his henchmen saw mergers-and-acquisitions as the way to go. The model, unconsciously, may have been the Communist International - Lenin in 1921 had managed to reproduce his Bolshevik party on a global scale by simply absorbing preexisting, ideologically compatible leftist parties from almost every country into a global umbrella organization.
Bin Laden set out the ideological basis for his Islamist International in his February 1998 statement declaring a "World Islamic Front for Jihad Against Crusaders and Jews." It cited three key issues of universal concern to Muslims - the presence of American troops in Saudi Arabia, the ongoing U.S. campaign against Iraq and the Israeli-Palestinian situation - and used these as a basis to call for a global war of terror against America and its allies. "To kill the Americans and their allies - civilians and military - is an individual duty for every Muslim who can do it in any country in which it is possible to do it, in order to liberate the al-Aqsa Mosque (in Jerusalem) and the holy mosque (in Mecca) from their grip, and in order for their armies to move out of all the lands of Islam, defeated and unable to threaten any Muslim."
Back then, of course, bin Laden was a relative nobody in the Islamic world, and the only co-signatories of his jihad declaration were his Egyptian Islamic Jihad sidekick and/or mentor Dr. Ayman al-Zawahiri, and representatives of three even smaller groups from Egypt, Pakistan and Bangladesh. The Russian Revolution had communists from all over the planet rushing to join Lenin's international; bin Laden had yet to convince the world's radical Islamists of his own leadership credentials. That changed six months later, when bin Laden operatives blew up two U.S. embassies in East Africa. And the factor that made bin Laden the undisputed champion of the world's most radical lslamists was less the fact of the carnage he'd wrought simultaneously in Kenya and Tanzania, than the U.S. response. By firing off a slew of cruise missiles onto two continents in a vain bid to kill bin Laden and destroy his assets, the Clinton administration succeeded only in creating a fireworks display that heralded bin Laden's ordination as America's nemesis. For many Islamists skeptical of bin Laden's preposterous sounding claim to be leading a global jihad against America, Washington's response gave pause for thought - a man that hated and feared by the U.S. had unrivaled claim to lead the Islamists. (At least that was what he was hoping.)
It was not Bin Laden's own actions, but the U.S. response to them, that had put him on the map, back in 1998. And that process was to be amplified in the years to come.
Well, yes, but only briefly. The U.S. invasions of Afghanistan and then Iraq put it in conflict with nationalist insurgencies in which al-Qaeda adherents had a limited role. By the middle of the past decade, already, the U.S. was talking of its prime adversary in the region as being an "Axis of Resistance" led by Iran and comprising Syria and non-state but nonetheless popular nationalist actors such as Hizballah in Lebanon and Hamas in the Palestinian territories. And that "resistance" front had little time for al-Qaeda, while Bin Laden's spokesmen reserved some of their most venomous rhetoric for Iran, Hizballah and Hamas.
Those groups remain far more powerful than al-Qaeda ever was because they're rooted in national movements and conditions, and have built popular support bases over many years. Just as Lenin's Comintern proved an unworkable model for global revolution, so did al-Qaeda prove to be a chimera. The center of gravity of opposition to the U.S. and its allies in the Muslim world remains with nationally-based movements who are confronting a specific enemy around a clear set of grievances and goals that are at least conceivably attainable. Hamas or Hezbollah are not much interested in restoring a Caliphate to rule from Spain to Indonesia; their goals are far more specific and localized. And in the end, while Bin Laden's movement could blow things up, it failed to ignite any sustainable forms of struggle - like Che Guevara (also remembered more as a T-shirt icon of rebellion than for his rather unfortunate ideas of how it should be pursued), Bin Laden found that simply taking spectacular military action against even a hated foe would not necessarily rally the masses to join him in struggle or confront their own local tyrants. (Indeed, as much as they hated the U.S., many Arabs seemed unable to "own" 9/11, instead blaming it on the CIA or the Mossad, insisting that "Arabs could not have done this.")
No decent people will grieve at Bin Laden's passing. But nor will his elimination alter the challenges facing Washington in an Arab world that has found its own ways - quite different from Bin Laden's - for challenging the writ of the U.S. and its allies in the Muslim world. Bin Laden may have desperately sought the mantle of champion of Muslim resistance to the West, and a traumatized American media culture may have briefly granted him that role in the months that followed the horror of 9/11, but where it mattered most, among his own people, Bin Laden was an epic failure.
As I wrote last September,
Bin Laden's problem from the very beginning was that while (polls show) a majority of Muslims around the world might have agreed with his charge of U.S. malfeasance in its dealings in the Middle East, only a tiny minority identified with terrorism as a response. Despite the virulently anti-American attitudes revealed in opinion surveys in parts of the Muslim world after 9/11, very few people were prepared to condone attacks on innocent civilians. That's why so many people in Egypt and Pakistan bought into conspiracy theories about the CIA or Israel's Mossad being behind the attacks.
The ubiquity of bin Laden's image in the wake of the attacks suggested that he might become a kind of jihadist Che Guevara, destined to live on long after his death on an endless stream of T-shirts and tchotchkes. (Of course, he'd first have to be killed to test that theory.) But there's another connection: Like the Saudi jihadist, the Argentinian revolutionary had mistakenly assumed that simply demonstrating through violence that a hated enemy was not invulnerable would automatically rouse the masses to rebellion.
While the 9/11 attacks made bin Laden the focus of American fear and rage, his "global jihad" failed to either eclipse or enlist its more localized Islamist rivals. Hamas confined itself to striking Israeli targets, and to competing with Fatah for local political power at the ballot box and on the streets; Hizballah continued to lock horns with Israel on its northern border and to engage in the complexities of Lebanese politics; Iran actually helped the initial U.S. military campaign in Afghanistan, although it soon resumed its struggle with Washington and its allies for influence throughout the Middle East. Al-Qaeda may still figure in U.S. debate, but it no longer garners any attention in the Arab political conversation - prompting it to issue increasingly hysterical denunciations of Hamas, Hizballah and Iran.
The only al-Qaeda "chapter" to gain any traction was the one that came into existence in Iraq in response to the U.S. invasion, and thrived while its presence was tolerated as a force multiplier by mainstream Sunni insurgents. But the group's ideology and propensity for vicious sectarian murder of Shi'ites turned the insurgents against them, and eventually the bulk of the insurgency turned on al-Qaeda, with many Sunni insurgents going onto the U.S. payroll under the rubric of the "Awakening" movement. (The uptick of al-Qaeda attacks in Iraq in recent months has coincided with the growing alienation of Sunnis, particularly in the "Awakening" movement, from the Shi'ite-led government. And a political solution to Iraq's political conflict will no doubt once again shut it out.)
A similar fate almost certainly awaits the movement in Afghanistan, where its erstwhile Taliban ally is fighting a nationalist campaign against foreign armies, which will inevitably end in a power-sharing political settlement. And even Taliban leaders have indicated they won't allow their territory to be used as a base to export terrorism.
If anything, hostility towards the U.S. in the Muslim world has actually escalated over the past nine years, because of the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq and Israel's conflicts with its neighbors. But al-Qaeda, ironically, remains on the margins. It's not inconceivable that bin Laden's men will get lucky again at some point in the future, but not even another major terror strike would change the basic calculus of al-Qaeda's demise.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/time/20110502/wl_time/httpglobalspinblogstimecom20110501whybinladensdeathnolongerreallymattersxidrssfullworldyahoo;_ylt=ArrWKzJNmJkygkj.7r2h6FhH2ocA;_ylu=X3oDMTUxcDg2cHFzBGFzc2V0A3RpbWUvMjAxMTA1MDIvaHR0cGdsb2JhbHNwaW5ibG9nc3RpbWVjb20yMDExMDUwMXdoeWJpbmxhZGVuc2RlYXRobm9sb25nZXJyZWFsbHltYXR0ZXJzeGlkcnNzZnVsbHdvcmxkeWFob28EY3BvcwM2BHBvcwM2BHNlYwN5bl90b3Bfc3RvcmllcwRzbGsDb3BpbmlvbndoeWJp
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This all reminds me of the Wizard of Oz. As teh house fell upon the wicked witch of the east, an even wickeder witch arose from the west to take her place. Hmmm...Lets all see how long it takes for that "WICKEDER WITCH TO ARISE" to take Osamas place... and what will that mean for america(ns)? Oh and BTW how much more will the TSA searches become after the new "witch" surfaces?
US warns of anti-American violence after bin Laden
(http://l.yimg.com/a/i/us/nws/p/ap_logo_106.png)
MATTHEW LEE, Associated Press Matthew Lee, Associated Press – 1 hr 16 mins ago
WASHINGTON – The State Department early Monday put U.S. embassies on alert and warned of the heightened possibility for anti-American violence after the killing of al-Qaida leader Osama bin Laden by American forces in Pakistan.
In a worldwide travel alert released shortly after President Barack Obama late Sunday announced bin Laden's death in a U.S. military operation, the department said there was an "enhanced potential for anti-American violence given recent counterterrorism activity in Pakistan."
"Given the uncertainty and volatility of the current situation, U.S. citizens in areas where recent events could cause anti-American violence are strongly urged to limit their travel outside of their homes and hotels and avoid mass gatherings and demonstrations," it said.
The alert said U.S. embassy operations would continue "to the extent possible under the constraints of any evolving security situation." It noted that embassies and consulates may temporarily close or suspend public services, depending on conditions.
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Good shit!
240, MB come sum this up for us!
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Yeah the political implication is OBAMA WILL BE RE-ELECTED IN 2012
Osama Bin Laden death: Political implications
(http://l.yimg.com/a/i/us/nws/p/washpost_170x27.jpg)
Chris Cillizza Chris Cillizza – 41 mins ago
Los Angeles – The news that Osama bin Laden has been killed in a CIA operation will have a massive — although yet-to-be-fully determined — impact on the political landscape of the country.
The simple fact is that there is and will continue to be a huge desire for the details of how, when and where he was killed as well as analysis of what it means for American foreign policy. Media coverage for days — if not weeks — will be dominated by the news.
That landslide of coverage/attention will force anyone operating in the political space to respond to it. So, while this news is not political, it will cause major reverberations in the political world.
What we know in terms of the impact of bin Laden’s death is far less than what we don’t know. And, it’s easy in the moment to draw overbroad conclusions about the political meaning of these sorts of major events. (Remember that many people — and political strategists — insisted that then President George H.W. Bush was unbeatable in the 1992 election following the successful Gulf War.)
But below are a few likely near-term outcomes.
A partisan putting-aside: Bin Laden’s death will almost certainly serve as a symbolic bookend to the decade-long struggle against terrorism that began with the attacks against New York City, Washington and Shanksville, Pennsylvania on Sept. 11, 2001.
In the wake of that terrorist attack, there was an extended period of bipartisanship — or, perhaps more accurately, non-partisanship — in the political world.
The early reaction to bin Laden’s death suggests a similar putting aside of partisanship as a rallying effect takes hold in the country. And, Obama encouraged that sentiment in his remarks tonight; “Let us think back to the sense of unity that prevailed on 9/11,” said the president.
Whether — and how long — that spirit lasts is unknowable.
* Obama as leader: While the work of tracking down and catching bin Laden was a decades-long process that involved three presidents — not to mention thousands of people — it was President Obama who made the order today that put the operation in place that killed bin Laden. It was President Obama who announced bin Laden’s death. It was President Obama who, in his remarks tonight, used the killing of bin Laden as evidence that America can accomplish anything to which it sets its mind.
All of the above — not to mention the surge of patriotism in the wake of bin Laden’s death — will strengthen the image of Obama as a leader. It will also complicate attempts by Republican presidential candidates — at least in the near term — to attack Obama on any topic.
Former Minnesota governor Tim Pawlenty’s statement on the news is indicative of what’s to come; “I want to congratulate America’s armed forces and President Obama for a job well done,” Pawlenty said.
* It’s (still) the economy: Yes, this is giant news. Yes, this will be a defining moment of the Obama presidency. No, it will not likely fundamentally alter the over-arching issue of the 2012 election, which is, and is nearly-certain to remain, the economy.
In the coming weeks, the economy will take a backseat to the unspooling of the details of bin Laden’s death. But, the story will — at some point — lose steam and begin to move from the top of peoples’ minds. (To be clear: it’s not likely to disappear entirely given the magnitude of what the attacks of Sept. 11, 2001 meant to the country.)
When that happens, gas prices, the unemployment rate and the general direction of the economy will reassert themselves as major issues heading into next November.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/washpost/20110502/pl_washpost/osamabinladendeathpoliticalimplications;_ylt=AoeqbjhzuXFq_FoObDUZMtNH2ocA;_ylu=X3oDMTNnb2pvamt2BGFzc2V0A3dhc2hwb3N0LzIwMTEwNTAyL29zYW1hYmlubGFkZW5kZWF0aHBvbGl0aWNhbGltcGxpY2F0aW9ucwRjcG9zAzcEcG9zAzcEc2VjA3luX3RvcF9zdG9yaWVzBHNsawNvc2FtYWJpbmxhZGU-
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Let's not forget The Cole attack either that bin laden conducted as well.
And the attack on the American embassy in Kenia and Tanzania
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240 is going to be spraying pro-Obama cum all over his monitor when he sees this.
SPLOOOOOOOOOSH!
Okay, any predictions on Gallup numbers over the next 3 weeks for Obama?
Coicidental timing that he knew OBL was in a pine box 7 days ago - BUT - he released the birth cert FIRST.
Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
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I hate Obama almost as much as Osama but not quite.
This is big for Obama ( the only good thing that has happened on his watch in 2.5 years) but if the economy is in the tank, it won't mean much overall.
This is a victory for America. I don't care about who the President is for the time being.
For today at least, I am very proud of our Communist and Chief and my country.
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Burial at sea according to islamic law?
Wtf?
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"WASHINGTON – Osama bin Laden, the face of global terrorism and architect of the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks, was killed in a firefight with elite American forces Monday, then quickly buried at sea in a stunning finale to a furtive decade on the run."
"The U.S. official who disclosed the burial at sea said it would have been difficult to find a country willing to accept the remains. Obama said the remains had been handled in accordance with Islamic custom, which requires speedy burial."
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_bin_laden
I call BS on this one!
Were these "elite" American forces Muslims? When Bush had Saddam's sons killed, their bodies were displayed for days as proof. What proof is there now that Bin Laden dead? Oh, the government said so. Therefore it must be true.
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Burial at sea according to islamic law?
Wtf?
They probably just dropped him from a few thousand feet into the ocean. ;D
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Burial at sea according to islamic law?
Wtf?
Probably the closest thing he ever had to a shower.
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"WASHINGTON – Osama bin Laden, the face of global terrorism and architect of the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks, was killed in a firefight with elite American forces Monday, then quickly buried at sea in a stunning finale to a furtive decade on the run."
"The U.S. official who disclosed the burial at sea said it would have been difficult to find a country willing to accept the remains. Obama said the remains had been handled in accordance with Islamic custom, which requires speedy burial."
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_bin_laden
I call BS on this one!
Were these "elite" American forces Muslims? When Bush had Saddam's sons killed, their bodies were displayed for days as proof. What proof is there now that Bin Laden dead? Oh, the government said so. Therefore it must be true.
He's likely been dead for several years now.
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He's likely been dead for several years now.
::)
Conspiracy theorist.
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::)
Conspiracy theorist.
No, just because we hadn't heard anything for a long time and our government long ago dropped using his name to justify our occupation of Afghanistan. Simple logic.
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No, just because we hadn't heard anything for a long time and our government long ago dropped using his name to justify our occupation of Afghanistan. Simple logic.
Bin Laden released a video this year in January calling for France to leave Afghanistan or else. ::)
Don`t be a moron.
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Bin Laden released a video this year in January calling for France to leave Afghanistan or else. ::)
Don`t be a moron.
Link please.
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No, just because we hadn't heard anything for a long time and our government long ago dropped using his name to justify our occupation of Afghanistan. Simple logic.
Well, if we had the body for years, why not stage the kill in Afghanistan?
Simple logic.
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Well, if we had the body for years, why not stage the kill in Afghanistan?
Simple logic.
Because getbig.com is racist. That's why.
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Well, if we had the body for years, why not stage the kill in Afghanistan?
Simple logic.
I am not a conspiracist but it is curious why Benizir made that comment in the interview, is it not?
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Link please.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/01/21/us-hostages-binladen-idUSTRE70K2G220110121
By Erika Solomon
DUBAI | Fri Jan 21, 2011 11:34am EST
(Reuters) - Al Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden said in an audio recording that the release of French hostages held in guy depends on France's soldiers leaving Muslim lands, al Jazeera television reported on Friday.
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Because getbig.com is racist. That's why.
Obama killed Bin Laden, after Bush failed.
That's true today and will be true for the rest of your life.
I know that sucks for you, buddy.
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Obama killed Bin Laden, after Bush failed.
That's true today and will be true for the rest of your life.
I know that sucks for you, buddy.
Shitty troll gimmick attempting to politicize this.
Protip: This is the culmination of something that started over 4 years ago.
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Shitty troll gimmick attempting to politicize this.
Protip: This is the culmination of something that started over 4 years ago.
I don't care what anybody says, you are smart.
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Obama killed Bin Laden, after Bush failed.
That's true today and will be true for the rest of your life.
I know that sucks for you, buddy.
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I don't care what anybody says, you are smart.
I would make fun of you, but the challenge is gone.
Keep fighting the good fight!
The war on racism and rude behavior is more important than terrorism.
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Obama killed Bin Laden, after Bush failed.
That's true today and will be true for the rest of your life.
I know that sucks for you, buddy.
LMAOOOOOO--- Obama personally walked into the American taxpayer funded mansion Osama was staying at, and shot Osama. Bush tried to do the same thing repeatedly, but failed. I see.
Did an ied or roadside bomb force you to land on your head, or were you always this stupid?
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GREAT JOB SEALS!
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US strike violates Pak sovereignty: Musharraf
CNN-IBN, India ^ | May 02, 2011
US strike violates Pak sovereignty: Musharraf
CNN-IBN
Posted on May 02, 2011 at 01:58pm IST
New Delhi: Former Pakistan president General (retired) Pervez Musharraf called the operation by US forces to kill al Qaeda leader and 9/11 mastermind Osama bin Laden in Abbottabad near Islamabad a violation of Pakistani sovereignty."America coming to our territory and taking action is a violation of our sovereignty. Handling and execution of the operation (by US forces) is not correct. The Pakistani government should have been kept in the loop," Musharraf told CNN-IBN in an exclusive interview."Foreign troops crossing the border into Pakistan will not be liked by the people of Pakistan.
US forces should not have crossed over into Pakistan," he said.Musharraf, who was the chief of Pakistani Army before he orchestrated a bloodless coup in 1999 and took over the government in Pakistan, said that Pakistan has also been incurring the wrath of terrorists and has been an ally in the 'war against terror'. He said that all the forces trying to neutralise terror group should trust each other.
"If there is a lack of trust, it is bad. We are fighting the same enemy. It is wrong strategically and the issue of lack of trust is very bad. There has to be trust between the two agencies fighting the same enemy," he replied when asked if US claims that Pakistan was not kept in the loop about the operation against bin Laden were true.
He rubbished speculations that some Pakistani authorities were helping bin Laden and they helped him during his stay in Abbottabad, which incidentally also has the Pakistan Military Academy.
"There is no possibility of any local administration collusion but there could be involvement of
(Excerpt) Read more at ibnlive.in.com ...
________________________ ________________________ __________
FFFFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUPP PPPPPPPPMMMMMMMM!!!!!!!!
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US strike violates Pak sovereignty: Musharraf
CNN-IBN, India ^ | May 02, 2011
US strike violates Pak sovereignty: Musharraf
CNN-IBN
Posted on May 02, 2011 at 01:58pm IST
New Delhi: Former Pakistan president General (retired) Pervez Musharraf called the operation by US forces to kill al Qaeda leader and 9/11 mastermind Osama bin Laden in Abbottabad near Islamabad a violation of Pakistani sovereignty."America coming to our territory and taking action is a violation of our sovereignty. Handling and execution of the operation (by US forces) is not correct. The Pakistani government should have been kept in the loop," Musharraf told CNN-IBN in an exclusive interview."Foreign troops crossing the border into Pakistan will not be liked by the people of Pakistan.
US forces should not have crossed over into Pakistan," he said.Musharraf, who was the chief of Pakistani Army before he orchestrated a bloodless coup in 1999 and took over the government in Pakistan, said that Pakistan has also been incurring the wrath of terrorists and has been an ally in the 'war against terror'. He said that all the forces trying to neutralise terror group should trust each other.
"If there is a lack of trust, it is bad. We are fighting the same enemy. It is wrong strategically and the issue of lack of trust is very bad. There has to be trust between the two agencies fighting the same enemy," he replied when asked if US claims that Pakistan was not kept in the loop about the operation against bin Laden were true.
He rubbished speculations that some Pakistani authorities were helping bin Laden and they helped him during his stay in Abbottabad, which incidentally also has the Pakistan Military Academy.
"There is no possibility of any local administration collusion but there could be involvement of
(Excerpt) Read more at ibnlive.in.com ...
________________________ ________________________ __________
FFFFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUPP PPPPPPPPMMMMMMMM!!!!!!!!
Figures. Paki assholes have been a hindrance to this whole thing from the start.
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What an idiot, of course we should have... fucking dirt bag should have turned Bin Laden over to us...
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:D
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US strike violates Pak sovereignty: Musharraf
CNN-IBN, India ^ | May 02, 2011
US strike violates Pak sovereignty: Musharraf
CNN-IBN
Posted on May 02, 2011 at 01:58pm IST
New Delhi: Former Pakistan president General (retired) Pervez Musharraf called the operation by US forces to kill al Qaeda leader and 9/11 mastermind Osama bin Laden in Abbottabad near Islamabad a violation of Pakistani sovereignty."America coming to our territory and taking action is a violation of our sovereignty. Handling and execution of the operation (by US forces) is not correct. The Pakistani government should have been kept in the loop," Musharraf told CNN-IBN in an exclusive interview."Foreign troops crossing the border into Pakistan will not be liked by the people of Pakistan.
US forces should not have crossed over into Pakistan," he said.Musharraf, who was the chief of Pakistani Army before he orchestrated a bloodless coup in 1999 and took over the government in Pakistan, said that Pakistan has also been incurring the wrath of terrorists and has been an ally in the 'war against terror'. He said that all the forces trying to neutralise terror group should trust each other.
"If there is a lack of trust, it is bad. We are fighting the same enemy. It is wrong strategically and the issue of lack of trust is very bad. There has to be trust between the two agencies fighting the same enemy," he replied when asked if US claims that Pakistan was not kept in the loop about the operation against bin Laden were true.
He rubbished speculations that some Pakistani authorities were helping bin Laden and they helped him during his stay in Abbottabad, which incidentally also has the Pakistan Military Academy.
"There is no possibility of any local administration collusion but there could be involvement of
(Excerpt) Read more at ibnlive.in.com ...
________________________ ________________________ __________
FFFFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUPP PPPPPPPPMMMMMMMM!!!!!!!!
Hahaha, as if we give a fuck.
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Osama bin Laden's body buried at sea
CBS/AP ^
Osama bin Laden, the long-time figurehead of the al Qaeda terrorist network, has been buried at sea after being killed in a U.S. raid in Pakistan.
U.S. officials told CBS News that bin Laden's body would be handled in accordance with Muslim traditions, which include strict rules on burial taking place within 24 hours after death.
(Excerpt) Read more at cbsnews.com ...
________________________ ________________________ ____________-
Personally - I wished that wrapped the body in a pig carcas and doused it with pigs blood and let the families of the dead on 911 piss on it and then burn it.
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Didn't Obama say he wasn't a Muslim. Why handle his body like that then? ::)
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Barack Obama is an AMERICAN Hero !!!!
Hahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
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'American Born Hero' President Barack Hussin Obama finishes job George W Bush could not !!
Hahahahahahahahahahahaha ha !!!!
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Mons - why are you celebrating over this? You are the 911 Truther who thinks Bush did 911 correct?
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'American Born Hero' President Barack Hussin Obama finishes job George W Bush could not !!
Hahahahahahahahahahahaha ha !!!!
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Bro - you have been posting 911 CT's from day 1 along with 240, Blacken, etc. you clowns said Bush did 911. Are you guys no longer 911 CT'ers?
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Mons - why are you celebrating over this? You are the 911 Truther who thinks Bush did 911 correct?
Hahaha, exactly. He's one of the assholes claiming that Bin Laden was dead for years.
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We still don't know what went down on 9/11, this doesn't change anything.
There's way more to this story as well, can't wait to read more when people start looking into this.
Interesting as FUCK.................... ...
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We still don't know what went down on 9/11, this doesn't change anything.
There's way more to this story as well, can't wait to read more when people start looking into this.
Interesting as FUCK.................... ...
???
You missed those planes that flew into the buildings? You don`t believe the thousands and thousands of witnesses on the ground and the thousands and thousands of cameras that recorded the planes flying into the buildings and the entire aftermath?
I don`t get you conspiracy theorists whatsoever. You do everything in your power to try to NOT believe the evidence even as its waved like a big dick in your face. Religious people pull the same type of nonsense.
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Barack Obama is an AMERICAN HERO !!!!
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Good job, Coalition forces.
No 72 virgins for you, Osama, you grimy little rat bastard! :D ;D
;D
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Barack Obama is an AMERICAN HERO !!!!
Funny how overnight you are no longer a "truther"
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Funny how overnight you are no longer a "truther"
[/quote
He's a pathetic gimmick.
10 years of these asshole CTers ranting and raving about him being dead and this sweeping govt. conspiracy destroyed in a single night. Hahahahaha. Their worlds are shattered.
Look at these rats jumping ship trying to hop on with the people who didn't believe that shit. How sad.
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Funny how overnight you are no longer a "truther"
[/quote
He's a pathetic gimmick.
10 years of these asshole CTers ranting and raving about him being dead and this sweeping govt. conspiracy destroyed in a single night. Hahahahaha. Their worlds are shattered.
Look at these rats jumping ship trying to hop on with the people who didn't believe that shit. How sad.
Do you just call everyone on GB a gimmick so that your bases are covered or what?
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It is easier to discredit the messenger than his message
Its done in politics all the time
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"WASHINGTON – Osama bin Laden, the face of global terrorism and architect of the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks, was killed in a firefight with elite American forces Monday, then quickly buried at sea in a stunning finale to a furtive decade on the run."
"The U.S. official who disclosed the burial at sea said it would have been difficult to find a country willing to accept the remains. Obama said the remains had been handled in accordance with Islamic custom, which requires speedy burial."
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_bin_laden
I call BS on this one!
Were these "elite" American forces Muslims? When Bush had Saddam's sons killed, their bodies were displayed for days as proof. What proof is there now that Bin Laden dead? Oh, the government said so. Therefore it must be true.
Why the fuck isn't the media talking about this? I watched TV until 2am last night and have been watching again all morning....and I haven't heard a single mention about the burial at sea.
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Why the fuck isn't the media talking about this? I watched TV until 2am last night and have been watching again all morning....and I haven't heard a single mention about the burial at sea.
they are Doison. I agree, I honestly Don't think he should of been buried at sea. But the reason, so being said by media, is that the US didn't want any shrine or anything being built...HEY, I thought we had custody, I'm pretty sure we were NOT gonna hand his rotting corpse over to anyone. I dunno, something stinks with this
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So, can anyone tell me why Benazir claimed Osama was murdered in the video interview? ???
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Obama still cleaning up Bush's mess I see.
Like the economy? Which is still in the shitter and worse than it ever was under Bush?
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Obama Navy Seals killed Bin Laden.
That's true today and will be true for the rest of your life.
I know that I suck Obama's balls, buddy.
Fixed.
It is pathetic to forget the efforts of the military and to give the entire credit to a man, who if he had his way (withdrawing all troops from Iraq and Afghanistan and closing Gitmo), Bin Laden would have never been killed.
Bin Laden was killed IN SPITE of the most incompetent president ever.
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So, can anyone tell me why Benazir claimed Osama was murdered in the video interview? ???
Why don`t you go and ask her.
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Why don`t you go and ask her.
She's dead.
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Like the economy? Which is still in the shitter and worse than it ever was under Bush?
So the the economys condition is the responsibility of Obama but the killing of Bin Laden is not ???
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She's dead.
:'(
Missed it by a mile.
Anyways, she spoke of never having any credible evidence and furthermore, she was more of a figurehead than anything. Its a shame what happened to her.
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So the the economys condition is the responsibility of Obama but the killing of Bin Laden is not ???
exactly. Let's face it, whoever won the election walked into a shit storm.
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Lady Liberty..atta girl
(http://a8.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/60917_1616097367384_1384856026_1661125_2133785_n.jpg)
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The reports out of the Middle are saying Osama stood and fought to his last breath and so did his wife, standing in front of him and sacrificing her life trying to save him.
Yeah. Bullshit. Most likely he was using her as a shield and begging like a sniveling little coward for mercy.
On a side note, all we need now is a remake of that Downfall clip that shows Hitler getting the news that Osama is dead.
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Yeah. Bullshit. Most likely he was using her as a shield and begging like a sniveling little coward for mercy.
this
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So the the economys condition is the responsibility of Obama but the killing of Bin Laden is not ???
Supposedly Obama cleans Bush's messes. You, like many other idiots, blame Bush for the economy. Unfortunately for you, Obama has been an even bigger failure than Bush was regarding the economy.
Why does Obama get credit for Osama being killed? Tell me exactly what he personally did that led to his death So just because he happened to have his rear end planted in the Oval Office he gets adulation? He wanted to close Gitmo. Pull all troops out of Afghanistan. Both moves would have been counterproductive to locating Bin Laden.
Thank God for Gitmo and waterboarding.
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Supposedly Obama cleans Bush's messes. You, like many other idiots, blame Bush for the economy. Unfortunately for you, Obama has been an even bigger failure than Bush was regarding the economy.
Why does Obama get credit for Osama being killed? Tell me exactly what he personally did that led to his death So just because he happened to have his rear end planted in the Oval Office he gets adulation? He wanted to close Gitmo. Pull all troops out of Afghanistan. Both moves would have been counterproductive to locating Bin Laden.
Thank God for Gitmo and waterboarding.
http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/asiapcf/05/02/bin.laden.raid/index.html?hpt=T1
According to the senior administration officials, intelligence work determined at the beginning of 2011 that bin Laden might be located at the compound in Pakistan. By mid-February, the intelligence was considered strong enough to begin considering action pledged by Obama when bin Laden's whereabouts had been determined.
To discuss that intelligence and develop a plan, Obama chaired five National Security Council meetings from mid-March until late April, with the last two on April 19 and April 28 -- last Thursday. The next day, on Friday, Obama gave the order for the mission, the officials said.
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"WASHINGTON – Osama bin Laden, the face of global terrorism and architect of the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks, was killed in a firefight with elite American forces Monday, then quickly buried at sea in a stunning finale to a furtive decade on the run."
"The U.S. official who disclosed the burial at sea said it would have been difficult to find a country willing to accept the remains. Obama said the remains had been handled in accordance with Islamic custom, which requires speedy burial."
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_bin_laden
I call BS on this one!
Were these "elite" American forces Muslims? When Bush had Saddam's sons killed, their bodies were displayed for days as proof. What proof is there now that Bin Laden dead? Oh, the government said so. Therefore it must be true.
I'm still calling BS on this one!
If Bin Laden is as guilty as America says he is, then what message is America sending terrorists? That if you kill thousands of innocent American citizens, America will make a martyr of you giving you a quick and painless death and a nice quick burial in accordance to Islamic custom?
If Bin Laden is as guilty as America says he is, America should have wrapped his body in bacon and displayed it to the world for weeks. That's the message that America should have sent to terrorists.
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loco, I agree.. Something stinks
they are Doison. I agree, I honestly Don't think he should of been buried at sea. But the reason, so being said by media, is that the US didn't want any shrine or anything being built...HEY, I thought we had custody, I'm pretty sure we were NOT gonna hand his rotting corpse over to anyone. I dunno, something stinks with this
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I'm still calling BS on this one!
If Bin Laden is as guilty as America says he is, then what message is America sending terrorists? That if you kill thousands of innocent American citizens, America will make a martyr of you giving you a quick and painless death and a nice quick burial in accordance to Islamic custom?
If Bin Laden is as guilty as America says he is, America should have wrapped his body in bacon and displayed it to the world for weeks. That's the message that America should have sent to terrorists.
Once someone is dead thats it. It makes no difference whatsoever what is done with the remains. Who gives a shit.
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I'm NOT buying pakistan didn't know he was hiding there. He was on a compound owned by 2 brothers who DIDN'T work...hmmmmmmmm
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just heard. 2 detainees in gitmo yapped about this compound 5 years ago....WTF took so long.. ???
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Over the years, I have seen many protests outside the White House, I have never seen a large spontaneous celebration. Have you? ???
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So are the 911 truthers still comvinced bush did it?
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I'm NOT buying pakistan didn't know he was hiding there. He was on a compound owned by 2 brothers who DIDN'T work...hmmmmmmmm
I'm not buying that one either.
And here is more BS:
"A congressional source familiar with the operation said bin Laden was shot in the head."
http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/asiapcf/05/02/bin.laden.dead/index.html?hpt=T1&iref=BN1
When you go after someone like Bin Laden, Che Guevara, etc., you do not shoot the head so that you don't risk making the fugitive unrecognizable by the general public. You always shoot the body if you have to shoot at all. And again, you display the body as proof to the world that you got the right guy.
Example: Che Guevara
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/4/49/FreddyAlbertoChe.jpg/800px-FreddyAlbertoChe.jpg)
The day after his execution on October 10, 1967, Guevara's corpse was displayed to the world press in the laundry house of the Vallegrande hospital. (photo by Freddy Alborta)
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http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/asiapcf/05/02/bin.laden.raid/index.html?hpt=T1
According to the senior administration officials, intelligence work determined at the beginning of 2011 that bin Laden might be located at the compound in Pakistan. By mid-February, the intelligence was considered strong enough to begin considering action pledged by Obama when bin Laden's whereabouts had been determined.
To discuss that intelligence and develop a plan, Obama chaired five National Security Council meetings from mid-March until late April, with the last two on April 19 and April 28 -- last Thursday. The next day, on Friday, Obama gave the order for the mission, the officials said.
So all the credit goes to the intelligence officials and military. Some news reports state that the original tip was the name of one of the couriers that worked at the compound. Where did the tip come from regarding the courier? That info I want to know because if it was from a Gitmo interrogation, than Obama looks like a bigger fool than ever.
Again all credit goes to the intelligence community and the military. Obama is just a bystander. He should get as much credit for catching Bin Laden as I should.
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just heard. 2 detainees in gitmo yapped about this compound 5 years ago....WTF took so long.. ???
So all the credit goes to the intelligence officials and military. Some news reports state that the original tip was the name of one of the couriers that worked at the compound. Where did the tip come from regarding the courier? That info I want to know because if it was from a Gitmo interrogation, than Obama looks like a bigger fool than ever.
Again all credit goes to the intelligence community and the military. Obama is just a bystander. He should get as much credit for catching Bin Laden as I should.
If this is true, it'll be very interesting. Didn't Obama order the closing of Gitmo 2 years ago, which never happened btw?
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obama made the finale discession,so unless you had the opportunity to make the discession you get no credit :D :D
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holy FUCK
Fox news reporting this million dollar compound was 100 yards from a military base..looks like this will be VERY interesting
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I never had a problem w gitmo at all. That was another bogus issue by the far left crazies.
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obama made the finale discession,so unless you had the opportunity to make the discession you get no credit :D :D
If Obama made the discession decision to shoot Osama in the head and immediately dump his body in the sea, then he is dumber than people made Bush out to be!
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Blackass - you h?e pushed 911 cts for as long as I can remember. Are you no longer a truther? Same question for 240 and hugo.
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If Obama made the discession decision to shoot Osama in the head and immediately dump his body in the sea, then he is dumber than people made Bush out to be!
what's wrong with shooting him in the head ???
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part of the article
He said the house was 100 meters (yards) away from the gate of the Kakul Military Academy, an army run institution where top officers train. A Pakistan intelligence official said the property where bin Laden was staying was 3,000 square feet.
A Pakistani official in the town said fighters on the roof opened fire on the choppers as they came close to the building with rocket propelled grenades. Another official said four helicopters took off from the Ghazi air base in northwest Pakistan.
Last summer, the U.S. army was based in Ghazi to help out in the aftermath of the floods.
The officials spoke on condition of anonymity because of the sensitivity of the information.
Pakistan has in the past cooperated with the CIA in arresting al-Qaida suspects on its soil, but relations between its main intelligence agency and the CIA had been very strained in recent months amid tensions over the future of Afghanistan.
In late January, a senior Indonesian al-Qaida operative, Umar Patek, was arrested at another location in Abbottabad.
http://www.presstelegram.com/breakingnews/ci_17972415
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Supposedly Obama cleans Bush's messes. You, like many other idiots, blame Bush for the economy. Unfortunately for you, Obama has been an even bigger failure than Bush was regarding the economy.
Why does Obama get credit for Osama being killed? Tell me exactly what he personally did that led to his death So just because he happened to have his rear end planted in the Oval Office he gets adulation? He wanted to close Gitmo. Pull all troops out of Afghanistan. Both moves would have been counterproductive to locating Bin Laden.
Thank God for Gitmo and waterboarding.
I dont blame Bush for the economy.
You blame Obama for the economy. Fair enough but then you have to give him credit for the killing of Bin Laden as well
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this
CNN just reported the woman was used as a human shield by Osama or one of his men
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CNN just reported the woman was used as a human shield by Osama or one of his men
yea heard that..
just stated this compound was rented 5 years ago by these two brothers as a customs warehouse...In fact Osama is believed to have been hiding there for the 5 years..WTF 100 yards from a military base...this whole think stinks
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yea heard that..
just stated this compound was rented 5 years ago by these two brothers as a customs warehouse...In fact Osama is believed to have been hiding there for the 5 years..WTF 100 yards from a military base...this whole think stinks
Pakistan is full of extremists no surprise there. But yeah it stinks big time
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Body buried at sea? According to Muslim law? Lol what a joke. You'd think they'd parade the body around after all the money and lives and time that's passed.
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Pakistan is full of extremists no surprise there. But yeah it stinks big time
WOW I actually laughed as Clinton just spouted "we have worked closely with Pakistan" you dumb cu n t..Then A) they were lying, and they knew where this fucking towel head was B) or you're lying
wait how about all of the above
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The intelligence community has stated in previous years that Bin Laden is not even the head of Al Qaeda. That it would be very difficult for him to plan or launch attacks against USA. It doesn't matter how many videos he recorded over the years. Sure, he could inspire people to take up arms but from a tactical point of view, he was compromised. He was more a symbol, after 09/11, than anything else.
His killing does a lot for the morale of our nation and the military. But, Al Qaeda will continue on. The was on terror will continue on for years to come. It is great that Bin Laden has been rid off, but lets keep some perspective.
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Anyone find any pictures of the body? Were any released yet?
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They showed one of the face.
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They showed one of the face.
yup, MSNBC calling it a fake
(http://msnbcmedia.msn.com/j/MSNBC/Components/Photo/_new/pb-110502-osama-bin-laden-fake-picture.photoblog900.jpg)
http://photoblog.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/05/02/6568249-we-think-that-bin-laden-death-photo-is-a-fake
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A true AMERICAN HERO......President Barack Obama !!!!
:D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D
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yup, MSNBC calling it a fake
(http://msnbcmedia.msn.com/j/MSNBC/Components/Photo/_new/pb-110502-osama-bin-laden-fake-picture.photoblog900.jpg)
http://photoblog.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/05/02/6568249-we-think-that-bin-laden-death-photo-is-a-fake
Lol wtf is that? It's like some ten year old put that together. That can't be an official release. I'm surprised there hasn't been anything releases yet. They were quick to release footage of Saddam.
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Lol wtf is that? It's like some ten year old put that together. That can't be an official release. I'm surprised there hasn't been anything releases yet. They were quick to release footage of Saddam.
I believe it is the release..
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yup, MSNBC calling it a fake
(http://msnbcmedia.msn.com/j/MSNBC/Components/Photo/_new/pb-110502-osama-bin-laden-fake-picture.photoblog900.jpg)
http://photoblog.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/05/02/6568249-we-think-that-bin-laden-death-photo-is-a-fake
I know kids who can photo-shop better than that.
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hey don't kill the messenger..LOL
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Sounds like a bunch of bullshit to me until I see more.
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hey don't kill the messenger..LOL
Not directed at you at all. Thanks for posting the pic!
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supposedly the compound. Here osama lives in the same area as Pakistan generals and military personnel...No cable, phones..They burn their own trash and yards from a military base..
THIS SHIT STINKS
http://globalgrind.com/news-politics/house-real-big-osama-bin-ladens-pakistani-compound-photos?page=3
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I'm gonna give them the benefit of the doubt but you'd think that this kinda news would have video and picture documentation of this out already but now there's all this talk of Muslim sensitivity.
Appears they're using DNA off a can of Pepsi Osama drank from to confirm it's him.
At least the travel advisory states things are safer now.....oops.
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after he was killed, supposedly here
(http://globalgrind.com/sites/default/files/imagecache/article_images/images/2011_may/abc_osama_bin_laden_exclusive_interiors_4b_dm_110502_ssh.jpg)
the view of the compound..so how does abc news have this before the raid but we dont see a body..
(http://globalgrind.com/sites/default/files/imagecache/article_images/images/2011_may/osamacompound3.jpg)
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I know kids who can photo-shop better than that.
Barack Hussein Obama.....An AMERICAN HERO
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Not directed at you at all. Thanks for posting the pic!
oh I know loco, trying to laugh a little..All the things coming out..Just don't add up
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wait wait wait..Bret Hume on Fox News just said, President didn't want to blow up the compound so the world would know it's real..wait did i hear that correctly?
I'm on the fence on buying the buried at sea bullshit
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For all of those badmouthing Obama remember this -
Bush was playing fuckaround in Iraq all those years. He diverted countless resources to take Iraq and find Hussein. He neglected Afghanistan/Pakistan. At one point there were 50 thousand troops in Afghanistan and over 150,000 in Iraq.
Obama changed that. OBL was killed.
That's just the facts, gentlemen. Like it or not.
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THIS SHIT STINKS
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wait wait wait..Bret Hume on Fox News just said, President didn't want to blow up the compound so the world would know it's real..wait did i hear that correctly?
I'm on the fence on buying the buried at sea bullshit
Obama wanted the body. If you blow it up with a bomb there would have been no proof of OBL being killed.
I doubt the US got rid of the body, but I don't doubt that they will stick with that story.
Saves on a lot of fallout that could come from 'offending Islam'.
All the hotheads on here who think it's a great idea to piss off the entire Muslim world should go their nearest recruiter and put their money where their mouths are. But they won't.
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Pro, trust me, I saw it all first hand from my front lawn. Saw the devastation volunteering for 2 weeks at south street seaport. I know what devastation it caused.
Not sure where you are going with this
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Obama wanted the body. If you blow it up with a bomb there would have been no proof of OBL being killed.
I doubt the US got rid of the body, but I don't doubt that they will stick with that story.
Saves on a lot of fallout that could come from 'offending Islam'.
All the hotheads on here who think it's a great idea to piss off the entire Muslim world should go their nearest recruiter and put their money where their mouths are. But they won't.
I agree, my shock is that he wanted the world to believe him. I'm guessing most of the world does, albeit I'm on the fence. You don't think the Muslim community isn't pissed off about this or seeing the joyous Americans dancing..Come on gare they are plotting already.
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Pro, trust me, I saw it all first hand from my front lawn. Saw the devastation volunteering for 2 weeks at south street seaport. I know what devastation it caused.
Not sure where you are going with this
Listen and learn Child.
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For all of those badmouthing Obama remember this -
Bush was playing fuckaround in Iraq all those years. He diverted countless resources to take Iraq and find Hussein. He neglected Afghanistan/Pakistan. At one point there were 50 thousand troops in Afghanistan and over 150,000 in Iraq.
Obama changed that. OBL was killed.
That's just the facts, gentlemen. Like it or not.
Truth spoken
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Listen and learn Child.
what do you want me to learn.. Trust me, I lived 10-15 miles from ground zero
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I agree, my shock is that he wanted the world to believe him. I'm guessing most of the world does, albeit I'm on the fence. You don't think the Muslim community isn't pissed off about this or seeing the joyous Americans dancing..Come on gare they are plotting already.
The people who are plotting against America were doing that before OBL was even killed. No need to make more of them and no need to further endanger deployed troops.
Not to mention, being offensive to Islam DOES NOT HELP relations between American forces and Islamic allies. It would be a stupid move, endangering our personnel and undermining our own pursuits, if we do something offensive to Islam because we got OBL.
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The people who are plotting against America were doing that before OBL was even killed. No need to make more of them and no need to further endanger deployed troops.
Not to mention, being offensive to Islam DOES NOT HELP relations between American forces and Islamic allies. It would be a stupid move, endangering our personnel and undermining our own pursuits, if we do something offensive to Islam because we got OBL.
Garebear, you have my respect as a military person. But if you think we shouldn't be on high alert, you're batshit nuts. This added fuel to their fire.
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what do you want me to learn.. Trust me, I lived 10-15 miles from ground zero
::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::)
Ok...so u were NO WHERE near these hero Firefighters.
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::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::)
Ok...so u were NO WHERE near these hero Firefighters.
no I was NOT. Yes they were heros. Their were many that day and days that followed
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Garebear, you have my respect as a military person. But if you think we shouldn't be on high alert, you're batshit nuts. This added fuel to their fire.
There will probably a bit of a recruiting bump for his 'martyrdom', but that's an unavoidable consequence of kill/capture. I don't think OBL's death is going to bring a whole bunch more people into the fight, unless we were to handle in some super-arrogant manner.
It also would have been a lot worse for us if he had surrendered, gone to trial and was executed later. Actually, that would be a very bad scenario for the US. Maybe the US never really offered to capture, who knows?
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The people who are plotting against America were doing that before OBL was even killed. No need to make more of them and no need to further endanger deployed troops.
Not to mention, being offensive to Islam DOES NOT HELP relations between American forces and Islamic allies. It would be a stupid move, endangering our personnel and undermining our own pursuits, if we do something offensive to Islam because we got OBL.
You're right. Killing OBL is not offensive to the Islamic world at all. Most Muslims will applaud the killing. However, if we hadn't dumped the body at sea within 24 hours, Muslims around the world would have been angry. ::)
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Barack Hussein Obama wins re-election !!!
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There will probably a bit of a recruiting bump for his 'martyrdom', but that's an unavoidable consequence of kill/capture. I don't think OBL's death is going to bring a whole bunch more people into the fight, unless we were to handle in some super-arrogant manner.
It also would have been a lot worse for us if he had surrendered, gone to trial and was executed later. Actually, that would be a very bad scenario for the US. Maybe the US never really offered to capture, who knows?
I bet they have young boys skipping school to join "the fight against america". I'm totally serious.
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You're right. Killing OBL is not offensive to the Islamic world at all. Most Muslims will applaud the killing. However, if we hadn't dumped the body at sea within 24 hours, Muslims around the world would have been angry. ::)
Following Islamic custom helps soldiers in the field. Therefore, I'm for it.
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Pro,
I have stated numerous times, I'm on the fence if it was an inside job or by those epic towel dickheads playing in the sand. So many things point that it was inside but it's so hard for me to believe we would do this to our own
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FU all those who are politicizing this issue. It's a win for all Americans, Bush and Obama included.
Attacking another American over this is nothing but divisive rubbish
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True. I'm glad they finally got this monster.
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Wow... a million dollar compound with giant walls and barbed wire. TWO MILES from a military base there? Any they didn't know?
I call bullshit on that one. I'm thinking militaries tend to vet their neighbors, particularly ones that look like military compounds.
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Supposedly no phone or internet lines to the compound either.
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Supposedly no phone or internet lines to the compound either.
So no Getbig?
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Supposedly no phone or internet lines to the compound either.
that's what I posted and they burned their own trash not have it picked up
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Pakis definately knew.
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Supposedly no phone or internet lines to the compound either.
jim mclsheski from pentagon/nbc news reporting that was a major red flag for us invetigators. you're that rich, you have a computer, period. pakis totally knew.
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Of course they knew... Ain't no fucking way they didn't.
How the fuck do we not nuke their asses for aiding him?
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and why does the paki govt get to interrogate the survivors of the compound and not the US. Why not both...
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Officials: CIA interrogators at secret prisons developed first strands that led to bin Laden
Star Tribune ^ | 05/02/2011 | Adam Goldman
WASHINGTON - Officials say CIA interrogators in secret overseas prisons developed the first strands of information that ultimately led to the killing of Osama bin Laden.
Current and former U.S. officials say that Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, the mastermind of the Sept. 11, 2001 terrorist attacks, provided the nom de guerre of one of bin Laden's most trusted aides. The CIA got similar information from Mohammed's successor, Abu Faraj al-Libi. Both were subjected to harsh interrogation tactics inside CIA prisons in Poland and Romania.
The news is sure to reignite debate over whether the now-closed interrogation and detention program was successful. Former president George W. Bush authorized the CIA to use the harshest interrogation tactics in U.S. history. President Barack Obama closed the prison system
(Excerpt) Read more at startribune.com ...
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Islamic scholars criticize bin Laden's sea burial (Clerics: Burial may provoke revenge attacks)
AP via Google ^ | 5/2/2011 | AP
CAIRO (AP) — Muslim clerics said Monday that Osama bin Laden's burial at sea was a violation of Islamic tradition that may further provoke militant calls for revenge attacks against American targets.
Although there appears to be some room for debate over the burial — as with many issues within the faith — a wide range of Islamic scholars interpreted it as a humiliating disregard for the standard Muslim practice of placing the body in a grave with the head pointed toward the holy city of Mecca.
Sea burials can be allowed, they said, but only in special cases where the death occurred aboard a ship.
(Excerpt) Read more at google.com ...
________________________ ________________________ ____
ha ha ha ha ha ha! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! !
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ABC News: U.S. Had Muslim Seaman Pray Over bin Laden Corpse Out of Fear of Muslim Wrath
Monday, May 2, 2011 | Kristinn
ABC News' Jake Tapper reports here and here on the Obama administration giving Osama bin Laden a Muslim-led Islamic burial at sea so as not to "inflame" the Muslim world.
...The SEALS shot the terrorist leader dead after he refused to surrender.
Bin Laden's corpse was taken to Afghanistan to have his DNA tested for positive identification. The body was then flown to the aircraft carrier USS Carl Vinson, officials told ABC News and he was buried at sea. The burial was done in accordance with Islamic law, officials said. A Muslim seaman conducted the process and said the prayers, with bin Laden's body wrapped in the "appropriate way."
Obama administration officials said it was important to handle the body in accordance with Islamic practices so not to inflame the Muslim world.
Really. My attitude is if the Muslim world wanted to ensure a proper Islamic burial for bin Laden they should have killed him and buried him.
I can't wait for the video of our non-Muslim sailors forced to stand at attention as bin Laden is dumped overboard.
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Fuck that!
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They will probably release a pic.
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ABC News: U.S. Had Muslim Seaman Pray Over bin Laden Corpse Out of Fear of Muslim Wrath
Monday, May 2, 2011 | Kristinn
ABC News' Jake Tapper reports here and here on the Obama administration giving Osama bin Laden a Muslim-led Islamic burial at sea so as not to "inflame" the Muslim world.
...The SEALS shot the terrorist leader dead after he refused to surrender.
Bin Laden's corpse was taken to Afghanistan to have his DNA tested for positive identification. The body was then flown to the aircraft carrier USS Carl Vinson, officials told ABC News and he was buried at sea. The burial was done in accordance with Islamic law, officials said. A Muslim seaman conducted the process and said the prayers, with bin Laden's body wrapped in the "appropriate way."
Obama administration officials said it was important to handle the body in accordance with Islamic practices so not to inflame the Muslim world.
Really. My attitude is if the Muslim world wanted to ensure a proper Islamic burial for bin Laden they should have killed him and buried him.
I can't wait for the video of our non-Muslim sailors forced to stand at attention as bin Laden is dumped overboard.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Fuck that!
Have to agree here, I can still remember in '93 US Soldiers being dragged through the streets of Mogadishu.
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WikiLeaks: Osama bin Laden 'protected' by Pakistani security
Pakistani security forces allegedly helped Osama bin Laden evade American troops for almost 10 years, according to secret US government files.
By Tim Ross 5:31PM BST 02 May 2011
Follow Tim Ross on Twitter
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/pakistan/8488236/WikiLeaks-Osama-bin-Laden-protected-by-Pakistani-security.html
American diplomats were told that one of the key reasons why they had failed to find bin Laden was that Pakistan’s security services tipped him off whenever US troops approached.
Pakistan’s Inter-Services Intelligence Directorate (ISID) also allegedly smuggled al-Qaeda terrorists through airport security to help them avoid capture and sent a unit into Afghanistan to fight alongside the Taliban.
The claims, made in leaked US government files obtained by Wikileaks, will add to questions over Pakistan’s capacity to fight al-Qaeda.
Last year, David Cameron caused a diplomatic furore when he told Pakistan that it could not “look both ways” on terrorism. The Pakistani government issued a strongly-worded rebuttal.
But bin Laden was eventually tracked down and killed in compound located just a few hundred yards from Pakistan’s prestigious military academy in Abbotabad.
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The raid by elite US troops was kept secret from the government of Pakistan. Only a tight circle within the Obama Administration knew of the operation.
In December 2009, the government of Tajikistan warned the United States that efforts to catch bin Laden were being thwarted by corrupt Pakistani spies.
According to a US diplomatic dispatch, General Abdullo Sadulloevich Nazarov, a senior Tajik counterterrorism official, told the Americans that “many” inside Pakistan knew where bin Laden was.
The document stated: “In Pakistan, Osama Bin Laden wasn’t an invisible man, and many knew his whereabouts in North Waziristan, but whenever security forces attempted a raid on his hideouts, the enemy received warning of their approach from sources in the security forces.”
Intelligence gathered from detainees at Guantanamo Bay may also have made the Americans wary of sharing their operational plans with the Pakistani government.
One detainee, Saber Lal Melma, an Afghan whom the US described as a probable facilitator for al-Qaeda, allegedly worked with the ISID to help members flee Afghanistan after the American bombing began in October 2001.
His US military Guantanamo Bay detainee file, obtained by Wikileaks and seen by The Daily Telegraph, claims he allegedly passed the al-Qaeda Arabs to Pakistani security forces who then smuggled them across the border into Pakistan.
He was also overheard “bragging about a time when the ISID sent a military unit into Afghanistan, posing as civilians to fight along side the Taliban against US forces”.
He also allegedly detailed “ISID's protection of Al-Qaida members at Pakistan airports. The ISID members diverted Al-Qaida members through unofficial channels to avoid detection from officials in search of terrorists,” the file claims.
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Now there is a surprise the ISI helping a terrorist ::)
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Obama might also have known that this info was about to come out and wanted to avoid a potential situation with the pakis. Better to just get Bn Laden ourselves.
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So no Getbig?
gh15 used a satlink. RIP.
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Suppose he covered the body in bacon bits and burned it. Yay, cowboy style, bring it on right?
Then you'd have 333386 starting threads next week blaming obama for an incident of violence as a result.
He erred on the side of caution for our men and wmoen in the field. can't hate on him for that. You do'nt poke 1 billion muslims with a stick when our forces are vulnerable in the field. Even bush admitted "bring it on" was a mistake. Abusing the body of a dead man in the eyes of those billion, just for shits and giggles, risks troops lives for nothing.
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White House Officials Debate Releasing Photographs of Bin Laden’s Corpse
ABC News ^ | 5-2-11 | Jake Tapper
The Obama administration has photographs of Osama bin Laden’s dead body and officials are debating what to do with them and whether they should be released to the public, officials tell ABC News.
“There’s no doubt it’s him,” says a US official who has seen the pictures and also reminds us that OBL was 6’4”.
The argument for releasing them: to ensure that the public knows and can appreciate that he's dead. There is of course skepticism throughout the world that the US government claim that it killed bin Laden is true.
The argument against releasing the pictures: they’re gruesome. He has a massive head wound above his left eye where he took bullet, with brains and blood visible.
In July 2003, the US government released photographs of Saddam Hussein’s dead sons Uday and Qusay Hussain but not until after they’d been touched up by a mortician, making them look not quite real.
(Excerpt) Read more at blogs.abcnews.com ...
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like when we saw the be headings of our military but those crazy fucknuts isn't gruesome.
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I can only hope that somewhere over there, there were millions of tv stations broadcasting all the US people in the streets in front of the White House celebrating, partying and laughing it up.
Just like we saw occurring over there when 9/11 happened.
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Arabs Riot in Jerusalem Over Bin Laden's Demise, Hamas Angry
http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/143848
by Hillel Fendel
Follow Israel news on and .
Arabs in the village of Silwan, adjacent to the City of David neighborhood in Jerusalem, rioted Monday night in protest over the elimination of Osama Bin-Laden. The rioters were throwing stones at police and attempting to block roads.
While most of the free world praised the United States for having rid it of arch-terrorist Bin Laden, the Hamas organization - which has recently all but merged with Fatah, headed by Mahmoud Abbas - condemned the act.
The Gaza-based website Al Qassam reports that Gaza leader Ismail Haniyeh, the head of the local Hamas chapter that runs Gaza, told reporters on Monday that Bin Laden was an "Arab holy warrior."
Meeting with journalists in his office in Gaza City, Haniyeh said, "If this news [of Bin Laden's killing] is true, then this means that it is part of the American policy based on the oppression and bloodshed in the Muslim and Arab world."
Haniyeh expressed his strong condemnation for the killing or assassination of Bin Laden, whom he referred to as "Mujahed" - someone in engaged in jihad, holy war against infidels. He said he was praying for mercy for Bin Laden.
Hamas reached a "reconciliation" agreement with Fatah last week, calling for the formation of a joint interim government in the coming days, and preparations for elections a year from now throughout Judea, Samaria and Gaza. The agreement was hailed by most left-wing and anti-Israel organizations, but even President Shimon Peres, a strong supporter of a two-state solution and the Oslo process, said, "Israel would like to see the Palestinian people become united for peace - [but] this is not an agreement, this is a split. Hamas is a recognized terrorist organization. According to this agreement Hamas doesn't have to change their charter that calls for the destruction of Israel, they can continue to shoot at us as they did when firing [last month] on a yellow school bus [and murdering a teenager]. Hamas is a branch of Iran - Iran, Hamas and Hizbullah want a union for war..."
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92% of Afghans have never heard about 9/11.
Think about that.
I don't worry too much about the d-bags who danced on 911, nor the morons offended by our dancing in the streets now. Most of them don't have TV and have no clue why we're in there capping their asses. CNN will put 40 morons dancing, and play that clip like there's 2 billion people raging over it. And al-jaz may do the same, acting like a few hundred at white house are an entire nation dancing in streets.
It's just tv being some dramatic bitches. Most people here cheer and move on, and most people there aren't even aware of it. Why we worry so much about what some moron in a mud hut who will never go more than 10 miles from his house in his life... it's beyond me.
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Arabs Riot in Jerusalem Over Bin Laden's Demise, Hamas Angry
http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/143848
by Hillel Fendel
Follow Israel news on and .
Arabs in the village of Silwan, adjacent to the City of David neighborhood in Jerusalem, rioted Monday night in protest over the elimination of Osama Bin-Laden. The rioters were throwing stones at police and attempting to block roads.
While most of the free world praised the United States for having rid it of arch-terrorist Bin Laden, the Hamas organization - which has recently all but merged with Fatah, headed by Mahmoud Abbas - condemned the act.
The Gaza-based website Al Qassam reports that Gaza leader Ismail Haniyeh, the head of the local Hamas chapter that runs Gaza, told reporters on Monday that Bin Laden was an "Arab holy warrior."
Meeting with journalists in his office in Gaza City, Haniyeh said, "If this news [of Bin Laden's killing] is true, then this means that it is part of the American policy based on the oppression and bloodshed in the Muslim and Arab world."
Haniyeh expressed his strong condemnation for the killing or assassination of Bin Laden, whom he referred to as "Mujahed" - someone in engaged in jihad, holy war against infidels. He said he was praying for mercy for Bin Laden.
Hamas reached a "reconciliation" agreement with Fatah last week, calling for the formation of a joint interim government in the coming days, and preparations for elections a year from now throughout Judea, Samaria and Gaza. The agreement was hailed by most left-wing and anti-Israel organizations, but even President Shimon Peres, a strong supporter of a two-state solution and the Oslo process, said, "Israel would like to see the Palestinian people become united for peace - [but] this is not an agreement, this is a split. Hamas is a recognized terrorist organization. According to this agreement Hamas doesn't have to change their charter that calls for the destruction of Israel, they can continue to shoot at us as they did when firing [last month] on a yellow school bus [and murdering a teenager]. Hamas is a branch of Iran - Iran, Hamas and Hizbullah want a union for war..."
LMAO..This is fucking low
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they didn't mention the crowd size.
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Senior Official on Bin Laden Compound: ‘We Were Shocked By What We Saw’
CNSNews ^ | May 2, 2011 | Terence P. Jeffrey
(CNSNews.com) - A senior administration official providing the “details on the intelligence background” of the raid that killed al Qaeda terrorist leader Osama bin Laden said that when U.S. intelligence officials first discovered the compound in Pakistan where they believed bin Laden was living they “were shocked” by what they saw.
U.S. intelligence agencies found the compound after years of following a trail that began with information they gleaned from “post-9/11 period” al Qaeda detainees, the official said in a conference call briefing held by the White House shortly after midnight. The transcript of the briefing was posted on the White House website.
The first step on the trail was information about a courier, who had been a protégé of Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, the mastermind of 9/11 attacks.
“Detainees also identified this man as one of the few al Qaeda couriers trusted by bin Laden,” the senior administration official said. “They indicated he might be living with and protecting bin Laden.”
After first positively identifying this courier and then ultimately discovering the unusual compound where he and his brother lived in Abbottabad, Pakistan, U.S. intelligence officials believed they may well have discovered the hiding place of Osama bin Laden.
“When we saw the compound where the brothers lived, we were shocked by what we saw--an extraordinarily unique compound,” said the senior administration official.
Here is the part of the White House transcript in which a senior administration official explains how the discovery was made:
Senior Administration Official: Thank you.
The bottom line of our collection and our analysis was that we had high confidence that the compound harbored a high-value terrorist target. The experts who worked this issue for years assessed that there was a strong probability that the terrorist that was hiding there was Osama bin Laden.
What I’d like to do is walk you through the key points in that intelligence trail that led us to that conclusion.
From the time that we first recognized bin Laden as a threat, the CIA gathered leads on individuals in bin Laden’s inner circle, including his personal couriers. Detainees in the post-9/11 period flagged for us individuals who may have been providing direct support to bin Laden and his deputy, Zawahiri, after their escape from Afghanistan.
One courier in particular had our constant attention. Detainees gave us his nom de guerre or his nickname and identified him as both a protégé of Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, the mastermind of September 11th, and a trusted assistant of Abu Faraj al-Libbi, the former number three of al Qaeda who was captured in 2005.
Detainees also identified this man as one of the few al Qaeda couriers trusted by bin Laden. They indicated he might be living with and protecting bin Laden. But for years, we were unable to identify his true name or his location.
Four years ago, we uncovered his identity, and for operational reasons, I can’t go into details about his name or how we identified him, but about two years ago, after months of persistent effort, we identified areas in Pakistan where the courier and his brother operated. Still we were unable to pinpoint exactly where they lived, due to extensive operational security on their part. The fact that they were being so careful reinforced our belief that we were on the right track.
Then in August 2010, we found their residence, a compound in Abbottabad, Pakistan, a town about 35 miles north of Islamabad. The area is relatively affluent, with lots of retired military. It’s also insolated from the natural disasters and terrorist attacks that have afflicted other parts of Pakistan. When we saw the compound where the brothers lived, we were shocked by what we saw -- an extraordinarily unique compound. The compound sits on a large plot of land in an area that was relatively secluded when it was built. It is roughly eight times larger than the other homes in the area.
When the compound was built in 2005, it was on the outskirts of the town center, at the end of a narrow dirt road. In the last six years, some residential homes have been built nearby. The physical security measures of the compound are extraordinary. It has 12- to 18-foot walls topped with barbed wire. Internal wall sections -- internal walls sectioned off different portions of the compound to provide extra privacy. Access to the compound is restricted by two security gates, and the residents of the compound burn their trash, unlike their neighbors, who put the trash out for collection.
The main structure, a three-story building, has few windows facing the outside of the compound. A terrace on the third floor has a seven-foot wall privacy--has a seven-foot privacy wall.
It’s also noteworthy that the property is valued at approximately $1 million but has no telephone or Internet service connected to it. The brothers had no explainable source of wealth.
Intelligence analysts concluded that this compound was custom built to hide someone of significance. We soon learned that more people were living at the compound than the two brothers and their families. A third family lived there--one whose size and whose makeup matched the bin Laden family members that we believed most likely to be with Osama bin Laden. Our best assessment, based on a large body of reporting from multiple sources, was that bin Laden was living there with several family members, including his youngest wife.
Everything we saw--the extremely elaborate operational security, the brothers’ background and their behavior, and the location and the design of the compound itself was perfectly consistent with what our experts expected bin Laden’s hideout to look like. Keep in mind that two of bin Laden’s gatekeepers, Khalid Sheikh Mohammed and Abu Faraj al-Libbi, were arrested in the settled areas of Pakistan.
Our analysts looked at this from every angle, considering carefully who other than bin Laden could be at the compound. We conducted red team exercises and other forms of alternative analysis to check our work. No other candidate fit the bill as well as bin Laden did.
So the final conclusion, from an intelligence standpoint, was twofold. We had high confidence that a high-value target was being harbored by the brothers on the compound, and we assessed that there was a strong probability that that person was Osama bin Laden.
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awesome article man!
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Obama might also have known that this info was about to come out and wanted to avoid a potential situation with the pakis. Better to just get Bn Laden ourselves.
I don't believe that the pakis had anything to do with helping us get Bin Laden.....I think Obama had to say that so as not to make Pakistan look bad..I could be wrong however..I have absolutely no proof of this
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yeah... someone builds a huge million dollar compound with walls and barbed wire fences... 2 miles from a military base... and they don't know who lives there? LMAO...
Try that shit yourself. Biuld a defensive fort 2 miles from a military base anywhere in the world... see if they look into your ass ;)
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obama actually undermines the paki leadership by giving them credit for assisting with killing OBL.
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???
You missed those planes that flew into the buildings? You don`t believe the thousands and thousands of witnesses on the ground and the thousands and thousands of cameras that recorded the planes flying into the buildings and the entire aftermath?
I don`t get you conspiracy theorists whatsoever. You do everything in your power to try to NOT believe the evidence even as its waved like a big dick in your face. Religious people pull the same type of nonsense.
What the fuck are you talking about? Of course planes hit the buildings...
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yeah... someone builds a huge million dollar compound with walls and barbed wire fences... 2 miles from a military base... and they don't know who lives there? LMAO...
Try that shit yourself. Biuld a defensive fort 2 miles from a military base anywhere in the world... see if they look into your ass ;)
AGREED
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So are the 911 truthers still comvinced bush did it?
Wonder if the Bush family is in morning considering their families relationship with the Bin Laden's? ???
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Wonder if the Bush family is in morning considering their families relationship with the Bin Laden's? ???
Osama Bin Laden was ostracized from the Bin Laden family long ago. (Or so they say)
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Cindy Sheehan: ‘If you believe the newest death of OBL, you’re stupid.’
nationalreview.com ^
Posted on Monday, May 02, 2011
Cindy Sheehan: ‘If you believe the newest death of OBL, you’re stupid.’ May 2, 2011 2:00 P.M. By Jim Geraghty
Tags: Cindy Sheehan, Maureen Dowd
Maureen Dowd, back in August 2005:
Cindy Sheehan, a 48-year-old Californian with a knack for P.R., says she will camp out in the dusty heat near the ranch until she gets to tell Mr. Bush face to face that he must pull all U.S. troops out of Iraq. Her son, Casey, a 24-year-old Army specialist, was killed in a Sadr City ambush last year…
Selectively humane, Mr. Bush justified his Iraq war by stressing the 9/11 losses. He emphasized the humanity of the Iraqis who desire freedom when his W.M.D. rationale vaporized.
But his humanitarianism will remain inhumane as long as he fails to understand that the moral authority of parents who bury children killed in Iraq is absolute.
Cindy Sheehan, today:
I am sorry, but if you believe the newest death of OBL, you’re stupid. Just think to yourself–they paraded Saddam’s dead sons around to prove they were dead–why do you suppose they hastily buried this version of OBL at sea? This lying, murderous Empire can only exist with your brainwashed consent–just put your flags away and THINK!
I have a hard time bearing much ill will toward Sheehan, no matter how nonsensical or inane her utterances get; who knows what the depths of grief can do to a parent’s mind? The widespread politicization of the grief, and the notion of the worst event in your life suddenly turning you into a celebrity with admirers, probably spurs one to react in strange ways.
But the degree to which the “anti-war” crowd — who today applaud war kinetic military action against Libya without congressional approval, and who are today applauding unilateral military action on foreign soil without the host government’s knowledge or consent or U.N. approval — exploited Ms. Sheehan remains unforgivably appalling. They lost interest in Sheehan right about the moment she ran against Nancy Pelosi for Congress.
I wonder if Maureen Dowd will ever reconsider that 2005 declaration in print.
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Fuck Cindy Sheehan.
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It was two miles from pakistan's version of West Point.
Pakistan is one tightly controlled police state.
Govt knows everything that goes on in the cities.
Insane to think two couriers with no income could build a million dollar fortified compound in a neighborhood filled with retired military officers, and nobody noticed a thing.
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Wikileaks already pakis were in on this.
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The same "dead Osama" picture was used way back in 2009. Shameful what america is about...sadder part is no one seems to be able to accept this fact. Here in THE PEOPLE'S VOICE in April 2009 was an article about a supposed dead Osama with the exact same pic shown Sunday on CNN and various other 24 hour news agencies.
Osama Bin Laden Believed Dead By Pak Intel
April 29th, 2009
The Media Line
(http://www.thepeoplesvoice.org/TPV3/media/blogs/blog/9/osama_bin_laden_dead0001_66.jpg)
Arch-terrorist Osama Bin Laden "may have been killed", since there is little information to suggest he is alive, Pakistani President Asif Ali Zardari said on Monday.
Neither Pakistani nor American intelligence experts have detected traces of Bin Laden since the Qatar-based Al-Jazeera aired an audio recording of his voice in March, Zardari said, and even that recording has not been confirmed as Bin Laden’s voice.
Zardari said his advisers believed there was substance to the rumors of his death, but he could not confirm this.
There have been several reports over the last few years suggesting Bin Laden, 52, could be dead, and others regarding his ailing health.
None of the reports have been substantiated.
It is believed the terror chief is hiding in the mountainous region that straddles the Pakistan-Afghanistan border.
U.S. State Department Spokesman Robert Wood said the U.S. had "no information" as to whether Bin Laden was dead or alive. “We will continue to hunt Osama Bin Laden until we can capture him or bring justice to him,” Wood said.
An editorial in the London-based Al-Quds Al-‘Arabi suggested that whoever leaked the rumor of his death wanted to prompt Bin Laden to produce a new video to prove he was still alive.
“They hope this will provide more information on his whereabouts or hideout, which will help bring about his arrest.”
Zardari’s comments could also be a message to the U.S. that the mastermind behind terrorism in Pakistan is in fact not alive, Al-Quds Al-‘Arabi said.
The U.S. has been pressuring Islamabad to take tougher measures against terrorism within its border.
However, the editorial’s author believes rumors of his death are premature.
“The death of the Al-Qa’ida leader is not so far-fetched, and he will depart at some point, whether as a result of a disease, an assassination or in clashes with the numerous intelligence agencies around the world that are pursuing him” the editorial said.
“But if he dies, it will be announced officially by the organization, the same way they already announced the deaths of several lower-level leaders.”
An official announcement of his death has to be made, he wrote, in order to solve legal issues such as inheritance laws and the legal status of the widow.
There is increasing concern in the international community that terrorists such as those in Bin Laden’s Al-Qa’ida organization and the hard-line Taliban will get their hands on Pakistan’s nuclear weapons.
Last week, the Taliban managed to reach an area located approximately 100 kilometers from the capital Islamabad before being repelled.
Zardari ruled out the possibility of nuclear weapons falling into the hands of the Taliban.
“The nuclear capability of Pakistan is in safe hands,” he said.
The Pakistani government said the Taliban had completely withdrawn from the district, but reports quoting local eyewitnesses said Taliban fighters were still present on the ground.
The Pakistan army killed 46 Taliban fighters over the past two days in northwest Pakistan’s Lower Dir district.
The Taliban is warning it will attack government forces in the North West Frontier Province (NWFP) if the government does not stop its offensive.
The Taliban has suspended talks with the provincial government in the wake of the clashes.
The government in NWFP struck a deal with the Taliban under which Islamic Law, or Shari’a would be introduced to the area in return for a suspension in Taliban hostilities.
http://www.thepeoplesvoice.org/TPV3/Voices.php/2009/04/29/osama-bin-laden-believed-dead-by-pak-int
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It was two miles from pakistan's version of West Point.
Pakistan is one tightly controlled police state.
Govt knows everything that goes on in the cities.
Insane to think two couriers with no income could build a million dollar fortified compound in a neighborhood filled with retired military officers, and nobody noticed a thing.
I've been saying it for close to 5 years now; Pakistan's ISI is a terrorist organization, is hiding all the Al Qaeda high command is the main reason we're still in Afghanistan. We need to stop sending Pakistan $3+ billion a year as they're doing nothing but killing our soldiers with it. Fucking scumbag terrorist state.
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I'm down with taking out the Pakistani PM.
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In Pakistan, an embarrassed silence on killing of bin Laden (They got caught hiding him)
msnbc ^ | 5/2/2011 | nbc
Pakistan faced enormous embarrassment Monday after Osama bin Laden was killed by U.S. Special Forces, raising questions over whether its military and intelligence were too incompetent to catch him themselves or knew all along where he was hiding.
The killing of the world's most-wanted man in a house just a few hundred meters from Pakistan's version of the West Point military academy will only fuel suspicions that the country has been playing a double-game over Islamist militants and al-Qaida.
Analysts say it would be a stretch to believe Pakistan's spy agency did not know bin Laden was living in a town just a couple of hours up the road from Islamabad: If it did know, the country was essentially caught red-handed shielding him from capture.
"There will be a lot of tension between Washington and Islamabad because bin Laden seems to have been living here close to Islamabad," said Imtiaz Gul, a Pakistani security analyst. "This is a serious blow to the credibility of Pakistan."
Pakistan must prove to the United States that it did not know bin Laden was hiding there, a top U.S. lawmaker said.
"This is going to be a time of real pressure" on Pakistan "to basically prove to us that they didn't know that bin Laden was there," Senate Homeland Security Committee Chairman Joseph Lieberman said at a news conference.
(Excerpt) Read more at msnbc.msn.com ...
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Pakistan can redeem themselves by handing over the heads of every member of the Al Qaeda high command as well as the heads of the Taliban's leadership council.
However, they'll probably take the logical Muslim approach and blow some people up.
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Pakistan can redeem themselves by handing over the heads of every member of the Al Qaeda high command as well as the heads of the Taliban's leadership council.
You know that won't happen... Fucking shit stains.
Fuck Pakistan.
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Report: Bin Laden’s Compound Was Once An ISI Safe House…
Dubai: The compound in Abbottabad where Osama Bin Laden was killed was once used as a safe house by Pakistan’s premier intelligence agency ISI, Gulf News has learnt.
“This area had been used as ISI’s safe house, but it was not under their use any more because they keep on changing their locations,” a senior intelligence official confided to Gulf News. However, he did not reveal when and for how long it was used by the ISI operatives. Another official cautiously said “it may not be the same house but the same compound or area used by the ISI”.
The official also confirmed that the house was rented out by Afghan nationals and is not owned by the government. The house is located just 800 metres away from the Pakistan Military Academy and some former senior military officials live nearby.
Abbottabad is a garrison town located just 50 kilometres north of Islamabad and it is a popular summer resort, originally built by the British during colonial rule. The city houses a number of upscale educational institutions and religious schools as well.
http://gulfnews.com/news/world/other-world/compound-in-pakistan-was-once-a-safe-house-1.802539
Hahahahaha. All falling into place now. There was no fucking way in hell these guys can avoid the CIA and other operators in Pakistan for 10 years without the ISI helping to hide them.
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AP: CIA Secret Prisons and “Harsh Interrogation Tactics” Developed First Strands That Led to Bin Laden
WASHINGTON (AP) — Officials say CIA interrogators in secret overseas prisons developed the first strands of information that ultimately led to the killing of Osama bin Laden.
Current and former U.S. officials say that Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, the mastermind of the Sept. 11, 2001 terrorist attacks, provided the nom de guerre of one of bin Laden’s most trusted aides. The CIA got similar information from Mohammed’s successor, Abu Faraj al-Libi. Both were subjected to harsh interrogation tactics inside CIA prisons in Poland and Romania.
The news is sure to reignite debate over whether the now-closed interrogation and detention program was successful. Former president George W. Bush authorized the CIA to use the harshest interrogation tactics in U.S. history. President Barack Obama closed the prison system.
http://www.startribune.com/nation/121089124.html
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
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I've been saying it for close to 5 years now; Pakistan's ISI is a terrorist organization, is hiding all the Al Qaeda high command is the main reason we're still in Afghanistan. We need to stop sending Pakistan $3+ billion a year as they're doing nothing but killing our soldiers with it. Fucking scumbag terrorist state.
their top general sent 100k to head 911 hijacker Atta... 4 days before the 911 attacks. Did you know that?
The fact it was played on cspan during the 911 investigation, but scrubbed from the transcript... wow, ain't that some shit?
Look it up. Bush wanted no part of investigating that. Suddenly it went from a small group of nutjobs to state sponsored terrorism.
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AP: CIA Secret Prisons and “Harsh Interrogation Tactics” Developed First Strands That Led to Bin Laden
WASHINGTON (AP) — Officials say CIA interrogators in secret overseas prisons developed the first strands of information that ultimately led to the killing of Osama bin Laden.
Current and former U.S. officials say that Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, the mastermind of the Sept. 11, 2001 terrorist attacks, provided the nom de guerre of one of bin Laden’s most trusted aides. The CIA got similar information from Mohammed’s successor, Abu Faraj al-Libi. Both were subjected to harsh interrogation tactics inside CIA prisons in Poland and Romania.
The news is sure to reignite debate over whether the now-closed interrogation and detention program was successful. Former president George W. Bush authorized the CIA to use the harshest interrogation tactics in U.S. history. President Barack Obama closed the prison system.
http://www.startribune.com/nation/121089124.html
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
Thank you George Bush & Obama. Both deserve credit.
Nothing wrong with Waterboarding and Gitmo. I have said so from day 1.
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I'm still not down with the whole waterboarding thing... Glad we got OBL but was it REALLY from the waterboarding?
I highly doubt it...
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I'm still not down with the whole waterboarding thing... Glad we got OBL but was it REALLY from the waterboarding?
I highly doubt it...
We'll probably never know if it was from waterboarding but it does appear that the pseudonym that set them on this path 4 years ago did come from enhanced interrogation.
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We'll probably never know if it was from waterboarding but it does appear that the pseudonym that set them on this path 4 years ago did come from enhanced interrogation.
I am sure if we look back 4 years, we've probably run across this guy many times... However, if it was from enhanced interrogation... Good for it... Glad we killed that son of a bitch.
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We'll probably never know if it was from waterboarding but it does appear that the pseudonym that set them on this path 4 years ago did come from enhanced interrogation.
Shit - I'll waterboard and torture those fuckers myself. Sit them down in from of a monitor and i will hammer them with posts and articles all day. We can do this remotely via Get Big political board.
When they fall asleep, we have an auto button to power hose those fuckers locked in their chair in front of the monitor. Break out the water hoses, after that I bomb them with tons of more articles on the pedophile prophet, they try to get up or turn away - more power hoses, and repeat until they give up.
They come back to their senses - I post tons of articles on how the Jews transformed the desert into what it is today. they get pissed off - power wash. And on and on and on.
I would love it and could do it 18 hours a day without pay.
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I would love it and could do it 18 hours a day without pay.
You already do!
;D
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You already do!
;D
;D
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Viva Guantanamo (Obama endorses Gitmo)
WSJ and AP ^ | Today | JAMES TARANTO
Posted on Monday, May 02, 2011 5:58:59
Officials say CIA interrogators in secret overseas prisons developed the first strands of information that ultimately led to the killing of Osama bin Laden. Current and former U.S. officials say that Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, the mastermind of the Sept. 11, 2001 terrorist attacks, provided the nom de guerre of one of bin Laden's most trusted aides. The CIA got similar information from Mohammed's successor, Abu Faraj al-Libi. Both were subjected to harsh interrogation tactics inside CIA prisons in Poland and Romania. A senior administration official told a White House briefing that "for years, we were unable to identify [the courier's] true name or his location":
Four years ago, we uncovered his identity, and for operational reasons, I can't go into details about his name or how we identified him, but about two years ago, after months of persistent effort, we identified areas in Pakistan where the courier and his brother operated. Still we were unable to pinpoint exactly where they lived, due to extensive operational security on their part. The fact that they were being so careful reinforced our belief that we were on the right track. Finally, last August, they found the compound in Abbottabad, Pakistan. ABC News's Jake Tapper reports that in March, President Obama authorized "the development of a plan" to bomb the compound with 2,000-pound Joint Direct Attack Munitions carried by B2 "stealth" bombers. "But when the president heard the compound would be reduced to rubble he chose not to pursue that option. . . . The president wanted proof" that bin Laden was dead. So he assembled a small death panel, which went to the compound in Pakistan and shot him.
(Excerpt) Read more at online.wsj.com ...
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I like how they use the term "death panel".
Did Palin write some of this?
:D
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word
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Barry proved he's not a complete idiot. He knew he couldn't bomb em. He realized the world wasn't the sunny happy place he thought it was before he took the job. Good job Barry.
It started with a courier’s name.
Senior White House officials said early Monday that the trail that led to Osama bin Laden began before 9/11, before the terror attacks that brought bin Laden to prominence. The trail warmed up last fall, when it discovered an elaborate compound in Pakistan.
“From the time that we first recognized bin Laden as a threat, the U.S. gathered information on people in bin Laden’s circle, including his personal couriers,” a senior official in the Obama administration said in a background briefing from the White House.
After the terror attacks of Sept. 11, 2001, “detainees gave us information on couriers. One courier in particular had our constant attention. Detainees gave us his nom de guerre, his pseudonym, and also identified this man as one of the few couriers trusted by bin Laden.”
In 2007, the U.S. learned the man’s name.
In 2009, “we identified areas in Pakistan where the courier and his brother operated. They were very careful, reinforcing belief we were on the right track.”
In August 2010, “we found their home in Abbottabad,” in an isolated area.
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"good job barry"
:o :o :o :o :o
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"good job barry"
:o :o :o :o :o
"Heck of a job Barry"
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"Heck of a job Barry"
:o :o :o :o
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What...it was a good call.....made with a military built by Bush. Obama did well. The poll bump won't last. We should bet how long this is all forgotten and we're back to worring about gas and the tanking dollar.
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What...it was a good call.....made with a military built by Bush. Obama did well. The poll bump won't last. We should bet how long this is all forgotten and we're back to worring about gas and the tanking dollar.
all this shit will resurface next year for elections sake
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I just hope to hell I didn't obligate to killing myself in a past post if 3333 and HH6 ever said Barry did a good job... :D
How you doing HH6? You back home?
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So nobody got the reward money?
Also, we should get pics. Otherwise, throwing the body into the ocean real quicklike probably just isn't going to cut it.
Seems kind of fishy.
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Oh yeah....FT Knox, KY. I'm headed to A-stan next april. I'm not looking forward to this one.
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here fishy fishy
(http://images.politico.com/global/news/110502_uss_carl_vinson_ap_605.jpg)
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Oh yeah....FT Knox, KY. I'm headed to A-stan next april. I'm not looking forward to this one.
That sucks. You've gone over there enough already. We need to bring this to a close so you guys can stay home.
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Compound in Pakistan was once a safe house
Dubai: The compound in Abbottabad where Osama Bin Laden was killed was once used as a safe house by Pakistan's premier intelligence agency ISI, Gulf News has learnt.
"This area had been used as ISI's safe house, but it was not under their use any more because they keep on changing their locations," a senior intelligence official confided to Gulf News. However, he did not reveal when and for how long it was used by the ISI operatives. Another official cautiously said "it may not be the same house but the same compound or area used by the ISI".
The official also confirmed that the house was rented out by Afghan nationals and is not owned by the government. The house is located just 800 metres away from the Pakistan Military Academy and some former senior military officials live nearby.
Abbottabad is a garrison town located just 50 kilometres north of Islamabad and it is a popular summer resort, originally built by the British during colonial rule. The city houses a number of upscale educational institutions and religious schools as well.
Secluded affluence
According to the briefing by senior US officials on the killing of Bin Laden, the area is relatively affluent, with lots of retired military staff. It is also insulated from the natural disasters and terrorist attacks that have afflicted other parts of Pakistan — an extraordinarily unique compound. The compound sits on a large plot of land in an area that was relatively secluded when it was built. It is roughly eight times larger than nearby
homes.
The physical security measures of the compound are extraordinary.
It has 12-to-18-foot outer walls, topped with barbed wires. Internal walls sectioned off different portions of the compound to provide extra privacy.
Access to the compound is restricted by two security gates and the residents of the compound burnt their trash, unlike their neighbours, who put the trash out for collection.
The property is valued at approximately $1 million (Dh3.67 million), but has no telephone or Internet connection.
http://gulfnews.com/news/world/other-world/compound-in-pakistan-was-once-a-safe-house-1.802539
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Obama did his job. It is a rare day in America where Barry does something positive for this country without apologizing. I will start to get alarmed if Barry follows today's performance with another competent action tomorrow or any day thereafter before the 2012 election.
All kidding aside, what President of sound mind could possibly have had Osama's whereabouts without striking?
This whole episode reminds me of the Chris Rock skit about N*ggers and Black people; He imitates a guy who says "I take care of my kids"-- Your supposed to you dumb motherfucka!
Let's applaud Barry but keep things in proper perspective please.
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Obama did his job. It is a rare day in America where Barry does something positive for this country without apologizing. I will start to get alarmed if Barry follows today's performance with another competent action tomorrow or any day thereafter before the 2012 election.
All kidding aside, what President of sound mind could possibly have had Osama's whereabouts without striking?
This whole episode reminds me of the Chris Rock skit about N*ggers and Black people; He imitates a guy who says "I take care of my kids"-- Your supposed to you dumb motherfucka!
Let's applaud Barry but keep things in proper perspective please.
It's better to act like a douche and politicize this, especially given that it was the culmination of a mission that started over 4 years ago. But why split hairs? ::)
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Have we got pictures yet or are we still not trying to offend any Musilms? ::)
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I think we'll see them soon. http://abcnews.go.com/International/osama-bin-laden-sea-burial-video-released/story?id=13508657
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they should have buried him at GITMO!
Let as many people come to that "shrine" as they'd like!
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Dear Westboro Baptist Church, we have a funeral you can protest. It's near Pakistan, we'll help you pack, you're going to need your flippers. Sincerely, America ;)
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Dear Westboro Baptist Church, we have a funeral you can protest. It's near Pakistan, we'll help you pack, you're going to need your flippers. Sincerely, America ;)
LMAO
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Dear Westboro Baptist Church, we have a funeral you can protest. It's near Pakistan, we'll help you pack, you're going to need your flippers. Sincerely, America ;)
Stolen and used as my facebook status... Thanks!
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The leftists who still want gitmo closed need to stfu. I never had an issue w gitmo and or torture for that matter. Considering the intel originated from waterboarding will you leftists be satisfied knowing that but for these techniques - we never would have gotten bin laden?
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Obama going to NYC to mark Osama bin Laden's death
Associated Press ^ | 5/2/11 | Julie Pace
Posted on May 2, 2011 10:17:26 PM EDT by Nachum
WASHINGTON -- President Barack Obama plans to visit New York City on Thursday to mark the death of al-Qaida leader Osama bin Laden. The White House says Obama will visit ground zero, the site of al-Qaida's attack on the World Trade Center, and meet with the families of those killed nearly 10 years ago. U.S. forces killed bin Laden during a raid on a compound in Pakistan where he had been hiding, then buried him at sea. Flag-waving crowds have been gathering at the lower Manhattan site of the attack since Obama announced bin Laden's death late Sunday.
(Excerpt) Read more at hosted.ap.org ...
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From Start to Finish: How the U.S. Got Bin Laden
Townhall.com ^ | May 2, 2011 | Elisabeth Meinecke
Posted on May 2, 2011 10:50:13 PM EDT by Kaslin
What happened in the takedown of Osama bin Laden was the pinnacle of years of intelligence work which included the CIA, the NGA, and the NSA, according to White House senior administration officials' reports which chronicle the details below:
It began with the CIA following leads on those bin Laden considered his closest. Detainees post-9/11 gave information on individuals who had been directly aiding bin Laden and his deputy after they left Afghanistan.
The detainees turned over one courier's nickname who featured a repulsive resume: he was the student of Khalid Sheikh Mohammed and an assistant to Al Qaeda's former number 3, Abu Faraj al-Libbi. Even more important, this courier was one of few trusted by bin Laden and possibly was living with him and protecting him.
For years, however, the courier's real name and location remained a secret from the U.S. Then, four years ago, his name was discovered. Two years later, the U.S. also discovered his areas of operation in Pakistan, though his living quarters eluded U.S. intel, which in itself was a further indication to the U.S. that they were pursuing something worthwhile.
In August 2010, that home was finally discovered. It's interesting to note that the White House report describes the area as somewhat affluent and a place with much retired military. Khalid Sheikh Mohammed and Al Qaeda's #3 were also captured in settled areas of the country. The sight of the 3-story, $1 million living residence surprised the U.S.: it was on a large area of land, approximately eight times larger than the other residences there. It had 12 to 18-foot walls with barbed wire perched on top. It also had internal wall sections. Those who lived there reportedly burned their trash (unlike their neighbors, who put the trash out to be picked up), and the compound's entrances were two security gates. The 3rd floor terrace had a 7-foot privacy wall. It also had no internet or telephone service connected. The courier (and his brother) did not have an "explainable source of wealth." At the time it was built (2005), it was relatively isolated, but other homes have since built up close by.
Then U.S. intelligence discovered there was another family living in the compound in addition to those of the two brothers. This family fit the description consistent with that which the U.S. expected would be accompanying bin Laden.
But the U.S. wanted to be sure, so it conducted red team exercises and analyzed the intel from every angle. The results consistently pointed to the secret inside the compound being Osama bin Laden.
Meanwhile, the operation to take out bin Laden had been under preparation for months, with regular briefings for President Obama. In September of last year (approximately a month after the compound location was discovered), the president and the CIA began to work "on a set of assessments" that resulted in the U.S.'s belief that bin Laden could indeed be in the compound. By mid-February, the intelligence basis justified plotting a course of action for getting bin Laden at that location. From March 14th to April 29th, the president chaired at least five National Security Council meetings on the mission. He gave the final order for the now famous mission on the morning of April 29th (at least one American who probably wasn't watching the royal wedding live).
The mission that took bin Laden out was a collaboration between intelligence agencies and the U.S. military. A small U.S. team made a helicopter raid on the compound. The White House report details the dangers associated with the task: high walls, security setup, the relatively settled location, and it being only 35 miles north of Islamabad.
It took the U.S. team under 40 minutes in the compound to do its work. The only loss the U.S. sustained was one of the two helicopters used in the raid -- the crew members were able to board the remaining helicopter to get out. The total death toll was four adult males killed -- bin Laden, and supposedly the two couriers and bin Laden's son-- and one woman, who one of the men used as a human shield. Two women were also injured in the attack.
Bin Laden, who resisted the assault force, met his death in a firefight by the most well-trained military in the world -- a testament to the great country he tried so hard to destroy.
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I'm still calling BS on this one!
If Bin Laden is as guilty as America says he is, then what message is America sending terrorists? That if you kill thousands of innocent American citizens, America will make a martyr of you giving you a quick and painless death and a nice quick burial in accordance to Islamic custom?
If Bin Laden is as guilty as America says he is, America should have wrapped his body in bacon and displayed it to the world for weeks. That's the message that America should have sent to terrorists.
That is exactly the message we are trying to give. It is called American Exceptionalism. We don't torture, we don't maim, murder, steal, etc. Sorry if you had some sadist torture scenario in your mind of some big hairy man shocking Osama's nuts with car jumpers. :-\
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I never had a problem w gitmo at all. That was another bogus issue by the far left crazies.
Yea... torturing is perfectly sane ::). Douche
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That is exactly the message we are trying to give. It is called American Exceptionalism. We don't torture, we don't maim, murder, steal, etc. Sorry if you had some sadist torture scenario in your mind of some big hairy man shocking Osama's nuts with car jumpers. :-\
I understand what you're saying, but to those who have the warped view of Islam that says it is supposed to be the world's dominant superpower, it really doesn't matter if we show Exceptionalism or not. If their ideology is to kill, this won't change a thing.
To those who follow true Islam, this will mean something.
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It works. And I really don't give a fuck about these muslim crazies.
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I understand what you're saying, but to those who have the warped view of Islam that says it is supposed to be the world's dominant superpower, it really doesn't matter if we show Exceptionalism or not. If their ideology is to kill, this won't change a thing.
To those who follow true Islam, this will mean something.
There also needs to be an understanding that we will hunt you down to the ends of the earth... While people say it doesn't matter... I call bullshit.
Fear is a powerful motivator.
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Yea... torturing is perfectly sane ::). Douche
Any means necessary to save American lives. If you don't believe that, this place isn't for you.
Should be go around yanking everyone's nuts with piano wire? Of course not. But there's context for everything. In a case like KSM, it's more than sane. It would be insane not to try to extract every single piece of information, by all means available.
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There also needs to be an understanding that we will hunt you down to the ends of the earth... While people say it doesn't matter... I call bullshit.
Fear is a powerful motivator.
Agreed. Any the power of the sword is all radical Islam understands. If they didn't have us for a target, they'd be killing each other. It's been that way for 3000 years.
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Any means necessary to save American lives. If you don't believe that, this place isn't for you.
Should be go around yanking everyone's nuts with piano wire? Of course not. But there's context for everything. In a case like KSM, it's more than sane. It would be insane not to try to extract every single piece of information, by all means available.
There are plenty of ways to get information from someone without inflicting pain.
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Aide who led to bin Laden was Kuwaiti-born courier
By ADAM GOLDMAN and MATT APUZZO Associated Press
Posted: 05/02/2011 07:21:12 PM PDT
Updated: 05/02/2011 07:21:14 PM PDT
WASHINGTON—Three U.S. officials say American forces were led to Osama bin Laden by his most trusted courier, a Kuwaiti-born man named Sheikh Abu Ahmed.
Ahmed was a shadowy figure for U.S. intelligence, someone it took many years to identify. For a long time, intelligence officials knew him only by his nom de guerre, Abu Ahmed al-Kuwaiti. The first indications about his significance came from CIA detainees shortly after the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks.
Ahmed and his brother were killed in the same predawn raid Monday that left bin Laden dead.
The officials spoke on condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to discuss the matter.
http://www.mercurynews.com/natbreakingnews/ci_17978135?nclick_check=1
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AP: CIA Secret Prisons and “Harsh Interrogation Tactics” Developed First Strands That Led to Bin Laden
WASHINGTON (AP) — Officials say CIA interrogators in secret overseas prisons developed the first strands of information that ultimately led to the killing of Osama bin Laden.
Current and former U.S. officials say that Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, the mastermind of the Sept. 11, 2001 terrorist attacks, provided the nom de guerre of one of bin Laden’s most trusted aides. The CIA got similar information from Mohammed’s successor, Abu Faraj al-Libi. Both were subjected to harsh interrogation tactics inside CIA prisons in Poland and Romania.
The news is sure to reignite debate over whether the now-closed interrogation and detention program was successful. Former president George W. Bush authorized the CIA to use the harshest interrogation tactics in U.S. history. President Barack Obama closed the prison system.
http://www.startribune.com/nation/121089124.html
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
Going to be tough for waterboarding critics to celebrate Osama's death.
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LOL @ the white house announcing the killing during Sunday's "The Apprentice", knocking it off the air.
God..> Trump can't stop getting punked by Obama this week!
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Going to be tough for waterboarding critics to celebrate Osama's death.
Not a bit... I'm against waterboarding. Glad we got the fucker, but I'm sure we had other info aside from waterboarding to point to this compound.
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Was funny to hear the press secretary quote the 2007-08 Obama promising to kill Bin Laden in Pakistan if he could, etc. Didn't hear any quotes from the 07-08 Obama about the authority to go to war after he went to war with Libya.
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::)
Shortly before the November election, U.S. Rep. Nancy Pelosi spoke about the American effort to capture or kill bin Laden. "Even if he is caught tomorrow, it's five years too late," she said. "He has done more damage the longer he has been out there. But in fact, the damage that he has done is done. And even to capture him now I don't think makes us any safer."
http://articles.sfgate.com/2007-01-21/opinion/17227846_1_laden-bin-house-speaker-pelosi
"The death of Osama bin Laden marks the most significant development in our fight against al Qaeda," Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) said in a statement. "It is a testament to the professionalism of our dedicated national security professionals that no American lives were lost in this operation.
“Though the death of Osama bin Laden is historic," she added, "it does not diminish our relentless pursuit of terrorists who threaten our country."
http://thehill.com/homenews/house/158633-dem-leaders-hail-historic-bin-laden-death-call-for-continued-vigilance
Is there any question this woman is a liberal hack?
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::)
Shortly before the November election, U.S. Rep. Nancy Pelosi spoke about the American effort to capture or kill bin Laden. "Even if he is caught tomorrow, it's five years too late," she said. "He has done more damage the longer he has been out there. But in fact, the damage that he has done is done. And even to capture him now I don't think makes us any safer."
http://articles.sfgate.com/2007-01-21/opinion/17227846_1_laden-bin-house-speaker-pelosi
"The death of Osama bin Laden marks the most significant development in our fight against al Qaeda," Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) said in a statement. "It is a testament to the professionalism of our dedicated national security professionals that no American lives were lost in this operation.
“Though the death of Osama bin Laden is historic," she added, "it does not diminish our relentless pursuit of terrorists who threaten our country."
http://thehill.com/homenews/house/158633-dem-leaders-hail-historic-bin-laden-death-call-for-continued-vigilance
Is there any question this woman is a liberal hack?
Not a bit. She's a damn kook.
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That is exactly the message we are trying to give. It is called American Exceptionalism. We don't torture, we don't maim, murder, steal, etc. Sorry if you had some sadist torture scenario in your mind of some big hairy man shocking Osama's nuts with car jumpers. :-\
LOL
Did I say anything about torture? Can you torture a dead body? ::)
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The important question to be raised is if any of our lives will be significantly changed by this or if the economy will suddenly recover; I think the answer is no; when real unemployment is no longer above 20% we can all rejoice.
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The leftists who still want gitmo closed need to stfu. I never had an issue w gitmo and or torture for that matter. Considering the intel originated from waterboarding will you leftists be satisfied knowing that but for these techniques - we never would have gotten bin laden?
I want GITMO closed. Torture is wrong. And I won't shut up.
Seriously, why do you tell people to shut up on here?
It really drives me to write more.
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Bin Laden is dead; meanwhile food and energy prices continues to go up and real unemployment hovers at 23%. Bin Laden is dead.
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Bin Laden is dead; meanwhile food and energy prices continues to go up and real unemployment hovers at 23%. Bin Laden is dead.
Are you in England?
I went to London in early March and stayed about a week.
It was fun but very expensive. Like Hong Kong expensive.
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Are you in England?
I went to London in early March and stayed about a week.
It was fun but very expensive. Like Hong Kong expensive.
I live in London, yes. It is insanely expensive. The equivalent of $25 a pop for the cinema, insane.
London makes NYC cheap. HK is expensive yes, London even more so. Don't get me started on how much money public transportation costs for the most abominable service in the world.
You still on the Mainlaind or in HK or Taiwan now?
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I want GITMO closed. Torture is wrong. And I won't shut up.
Seriously, why do you tell people to shut up on here?
It really drives me to write more.
:'( boo hoo hoo torture is wrong. Racism is wrong! Being mean is wrong! Shut the fuck up you panzi left wing apologist douche.
Beheading innocent people and soldiers on tape is also wrong, terrorism is wrong, suicide bombings are wrong, apologizing for Islamic fanatics is wrong, playing by a different set of rules than the animals trying to kill Western civilization is wrong, Pelosi is wrong and your wrong.
Hope this helps.
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There are plenty of ways to get information from someone without inflicting pain.
Reading your stupidity provides useless information that inflicts mental pain and anguish on those with an iq above 12. That is a form of torture. Therefore, you should stop participating in this thread unless you're a hypocrite.
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Bin Laden is dead; meanwhile food and energy prices continues to go up and real unemployment hovers at 23%. Bin Laden is dead.
It can all be solved by giving incentives for not having children. All of it.
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LOL
Did I say anything about torture? Can you torture a dead body? ::)
What do you want with a dead body? Its dead. There is nothing more to do.
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It can all be solved by giving incentives for not having children. All of it.
Uh? Care to explain?
Aren't you a welfare state advocate? How can you support a welfare state when people are not having children and the state is running out of new workers to tax in order to pay for handouts?
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Uh? Care to explain?
Aren't you a welfare state advocate? How can you support a welfare state when people are not having children and the state is running out of new workers to tax in order to pay for handouts?
Sell carbon credits, wiccan books, legalize pot, etc.
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What do you want with a dead body? Its dead. There is nothing more to do.
You say there is nothing more to do with Osama's dead body, but Obama disagrees with you. Obama had plenty more to do with Osama's dead body:
"The body was washed and placed in a white sheet. A military official read prepared remarks, which were then translated into Arabic by a native speaker, The body of Osama bin Laden was placed on a flat board, which was then tipped up, and allowed to slide into the sea,"
http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/asiapcf/05/02/bin.laden.burial.at.sea/index.html?iref=allsearch
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Bin Laden skull blown apart, official says
CBS News ^
Posted on 05/03/2011 5:06:05 AM PDT
Left eye and the bullet blew away part of his skull, a U.S. official says. He was also shot in the chest.
The precision kill shot was delivered by a member of the Navy's elite SEAL Team Six during a pre-dawn raid Monday on bin Laden's hideout in Pakistan.
The official spoke on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to speak to reporters.
Photos of bin Laden's injuries were transmitted to Washington as proof that the mission was a success.
The administration is still weighing whether to release photos of bin Laden's corpse and video of his swift burial at sea. Officials were reluctant to inflame Islamic sentiment by showing graphic images of the body. But they were also eager to address the mythology already building in Pakistan and beyond that bin Laden was somehow still alive.
The only information about what occurred inside the compound has come from American officials, much of it provided under condition of anonymity.
(Excerpt) Read more at cbsnews.com ...
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Bin Laden skull blown apart, official says
CBS News ^
Posted on 05/03/2011 5:06:05 AM PDT
The administration is still weighing whether to release photos of bin Laden's corpse and video of his swift burial at sea. Officials were reluctant to inflame Islamic sentiment by showing graphic images of the body. But they were also eager to address the mythology already building in Pakistan and beyond that bin Laden was somehow still alive.
Read more: http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2011/05/03/501364/main20059222.shtml#ixzz1LI94H2ge
There you go, what have I been saying all along? They need to show the world proof.
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I live in London, yes. It is insanely expensive. The equivalent of $25 a pop for the cinema, insane.
London makes NYC cheap. HK is expensive yes, London even more so. Don't get me started on how much money public transportation costs for the most abominable service in the world.
You still on the Mainlaind or in HK or Taiwan now?
I'm in the US now.
Just a few summer classes to go on my BA. Then moving back to China.
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Osama Bin Laden Sea Burial Video May Be Released
Osama bin Laden Dead: Details on Death, BurialAuto Start: On | Off
By SUSAN DONALDSON JAMES
May 2, 2011
http://abcnews.go.com/International/osama-bin-laden-sea-burial-video-released/story?id=13508657&singlePage=true
Video of Osama bin Laden's dead body being dropped into the North Arabian Sea from the USS Carl Vinson early this morning could be made public, according to officials.
The 40-minute ceremony, and perhaps photos of his corpse, will be released "cautiously," according to The Associated Press, citing two Pentagon officials.
The world's most notorious terrorist did not receive a customary Islamic burial as he was slipped into the North Arabian Sea today when no others countries would accept his body, according to experts in Muslim funeral rites.
"Dumping the body into the sea is not part of any Islamic ritual," said Dr. Zuhdi Jasser, president of the American Islamic Forum for Democracy and a physician of internal medicine. "Koranic scripture says God created him and he must return to the earth."
AP Photo
Osama bin Laden, killed Sunday by Navy Seals,... View Full Size
U.S. officials told ABC News that the last thing they wanted was to create a burial place which could become a terrorist shrine. To avoid that, bin Laden was buried at sea.
Deputy National Security Advisor John Brennan said earlier today that the administration would likely release an image of bin Laden's body. He added that they would do so carefully as, "We don't want to do anything to compromise our ability to be successful the next time we get one of these guys and take him off the battlefield," he said.
Complete coverage of the death of bin Laden.
The corpse was taken to the aircraft carrier USS Carl Vinson, officials told ABC News. The ceremony, done according to Islamic law, began about 1:10 a.m. today EST and lasted about 45 minutes, according to officials.
Traditional washing of the body was followed by wrapping in white sheets. A military officer read religious remarks that were translated by a native Arabic speaker, then bin Laden was eased into the sea.
Officials said no other alternatives were available.
"We are ensuring that it is handled in accordance with Islamic practice and tradition," an administration official said. "This is something that we take very seriously. And so therefore this is being handled in an appropriate manner."
It is rare, but when a body must be buried at sea, there are rules, according to Al Islam online.
The body should be lowered into the water, "in a vessel of clay or a weight tied to its feet," and as far as possible, it should "not be lowered at a point where it is eaten up immediately by sea predators."
Tradition dictates that the body is washed by Muslim men and a funeral prayer is said, then it is buried as soon as possible, usually within 24 hours of death. The body is wrapped in a shroud of white cloth and the face is moved toward Mecca. The remains are always buried in the earth.
Similar to the orthodox Jewish tradition, bodies cannot be embalmed or in any way preserved and the coffin, if used, must be wooden.
Cremation is prohibited, because it is considered disrespectful, and unless a person died in an accident at sea, they would never be thrown in the water, according to Dr. Muzamil Siddiqi, chairman of the Fiqh Council of North America and a scholar on the legal systems of Islam.
"They don't even have a casket -- the body is in the ground," he said. "After a person dies, the body is treated like any other human being. We don't do a retaliation on the dead body."
Scholars say that even those who are criminals and murderers are given the Islamic rite of burial.
"Even those who are executed have a proper burial given to them," Siddiqi said. "It is strictly forbade any mutilation -- even of the enemy's body."
God reckons with a person's deeds in the afterlife on judgment day, he said.
"This is not a normal procedure," Siddiqi said. "But if scholars in Pakistan said this is OK, it's OK."
Sources told ABC News that President Obama authorized the bombing of a compound outside Islamabad in Pakistan last March, but worried about collateral damage and wanted evidence of bin Laden's body and DNA evidence.
No photos have been released.
Instead, he authorized a daring operation for ground troops to enter the compound low to the ground and undetected. It was scheduled for Friday afternoon, but because of weather, was postponed until Sunday.
Critics Say Bin Laden Didn't Deserve Rites
Khalid Latif, chaplain at New York University and director of its Islamic Center, said Islamic law is "flexible" in how it handles burial, especially in this case. The question would be not "how to bury a body, but how Osama bin Laden's body would be buried."
He said the government's approach was reasonable -- letting bin Laden's body, "wash back and forth in the sea."
"If we think about burying him in the ground, there are multiple scenarios," he said. "The problem is people don't want him buried near them or their loved ones. Giving him a place on land would create an opportunity for many individuals to unleash and lash out their rage against him. He made lives terrible for so many of us."
Officials were also worried that having a burial site might become a place where his sympathizers would "glorify" his acts, according to Latif.
"There are people who believe that this man was someone to look up to, even though he distorted our teachings and grossly misinterpreted Islam," he said.
Some critics say the White House was trying to play the "respect-for-Islam" card. But American Islamic leader Jasser said Osama bin Laden is not worthy of that respect.
"As one who is devoted to Islam and its ideology, it makes me nauseated and sick that someone would make sure he had a religious rite given to a man like this because he was an evil barbarian who declared war against our nation," Jasser said.
ABC News' Jake Tapper and The Associated Press contributed to this report.
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Still waiting....do they have to do a few more takes and editing?
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The body should be lowered into the water, "in a vessel of clay or a weight tied to its feet," and as far as possible, it should "not be lowered at a point where it is eaten up immediately by sea predators."
________________________ _________
ha ha ha ha ha. llmmmffaaoo.
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Still waiting....do they have to do a few more takes and editing?
Don`t be one of THOSE people. Seriously. By your rationale, Ronald Reagan may still be alive since you didn`t get to see his body either.
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Critics Say Bin Laden Didn't Deserve Rites
Khalid Latif, chaplain at New York University and director of its Islamic Center, said Islamic law is "flexible" in how it handles burial, especially in this case. The question would be not "how to bury a body, but how Osama bin Laden's body would be buried."
He said the government's approach was reasonable -- letting bin Laden's body, "wash back and forth in the sea."
"If we think about burying him in the ground, there are multiple scenarios," he said. "The problem is people don't want him buried near them or their loved ones. Giving him a place on land would create an opportunity for many individuals to unleash and lash out their rage against him. He made lives terrible for so many of us."
Officials were also worried that having a burial site might become a place where his sympathizers would "glorify" his acts, according to Latif.
"There are people who believe that this man was someone to look up to, even though he distorted our teachings and grossly misinterpreted Islam," he said.
Some critics say the White House was trying to play the "respect-for-Islam" card. But American Islamic leader Jasser said Osama bin Laden is not worthy of that respect.
"As one who is devoted to Islam and its ideology, it makes me nauseated and sick that someone would make sure he had a religious rite given to a man like this because he was an evil barbarian who declared war against our nation," Jasser said.
http://abcnews.go.com/International/osama-bin-laden-sea-burial-video-released/story?id=13508657&singlePage=true
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"As one who is devoted to Islam and its ideology, it makes me nauseated and sick that someone would make sure he had a religious rite given to a man like this because he was an evil barbarian who declared war against our nation," Jasser said.
________________________ ______________
240 and blacken disagree.
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"As one who is devoted to Islam and its ideology, it makes me nauseated and sick that someone would make sure he had a religious rite given to a man like this because he was an evil barbarian who declared war against our nation," Jasser said.
________________________ ______________
240 and blacken disagree.
hey, i would be okay with the bacon bit treatment.
however, if it means one more bad guy will put on a vest and blow up US soldiers... then I'm okay with not poking that hornets nest with a stick when there's nothing to gain but immature smugness.
obama went out of his way to show we respect their religion.
While I don't subscribe to that belief system, nor care one shit about OBL, I do appreciate any efforts to avoid further unnecessary instigation of those religious zealouts. If you polled our troops on the streets of the cities - and asked them if they'd like to see muslims extremists further prodded - I'm betting they'd say no.
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Tight security at Obama granny's Kenya home
http://www.africareview.com/News/Tight+security+at+Obama+grannys+home/-/979180/1154986/-/se6h76/-/
Picture of the front covers of newspapers with news of the death of Osama bin Laden, at a newsstand in Rio de Janeiro on May 2, 2011. Security has been beefed up at the home of US President Barack Obama's grandmother in western Kenya for fear of terrorist attack. AFP | AFRICA REVIEW |
By ERIC OLOO in Siaya, Kenya (email the author)
Security has been heightened at the Kogelo rural home of the grandmother of US President Barack Obama following the killing of al-Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden.
More police officers have been deployed to man Mama Sarah Obama's in homestead western Kenya following fears of a terrorist attack in retaliation for the killing of Osama by US special forces.
According to the local Siaya police boss Stephen Cheteka, they decided to beef-up security for the relatives of the US President after receiving threats of a planned terrorist attack three days ago.
“We received reports of plans to attack the home of Mama Sarah Obama three days ago and we immediately put in place adequate security measures,” Mr Cheteka said.
The police boss added that the home would be under round-the-clock surveillance, adding that all visitors would be subjected to a thorough screening.
He, however, assured the public that there was no cause for alarm as the family of Mama Sarah Obama had been well informed of the security measures.
Local leaders, led by former Siaya Mayor Obiero Otare, expressed fears that the Kogelo home of the Obama granny could be the target of terrorist attack, especially now that reports indicated that terrorists had penetrated into Kenyan territory.
“Security must be beefed up at the home and the surrounding environs lest we become the next target of terrorists,” observed Mlr Otare.
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Osama bin Laden raid yields trove of computer data
By MIKE ALLEN | 5/2/11 7:51 PM EDT
The assault force of Navy SEALs snatched a trove of computer drives and disks during their weekend raid on Osama bin Laden’s compound, yielding what a U.S. official called “the mother lode of intelligence.”
The special operations forces grabbed personal computers, thumb drives and electronic equipment during the lightning raid that killed bin Laden, officials told POLITICO.
Continue Reading Text Size
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POLITICO 44
“They cleaned it out,” one official said. “Can you imagine what’s on Osama bin Laden’s hard drive?”
U.S. officials are about to find out. The material is being examined at a secret location in Afghanistan.
“Hundreds of people are going through it now,” an official said, adding that intelligence operatives back in Washington are very excited to find out what they have.
“It’s going to be great even if only 10 percent of it is actionable,” the official said.
Savoring the military and intelligence triumph, officials late Monday described new details about how the mission unfolded:
The SEALs took fire on their way to the compound’s third floor, where bin Laden had been sleeping, officials said. The encounter with bin Laden lasted only seconds, and ended with a kill shot to his face.
The team’s photos of bin Laden are gruesome, complicating officials’ deliberations about whether to release them.
Officials also have images of bin Laden in a white shroud before his burial at sea.
The raid was not supposed to last more than 30 minutes. The forces finished in 38 minutes, even though they lost one of their choppers and had to go to a back-up plan.
Four helicopters were used in the raid. Two went in, and two were in reserve.
Hovering above the compound on the way in, one of the choppers developed a mechanical problem that caused it to lose lift, officials said. The pilot made a controlled landing, according to the officials. When he couldn’t get the bird airborne again, the SEALs blew it up and left in one of the reserves.
Officials described the reaction of the special operators when they were told a number of weeks ago that they had been chosen to train for the mission.
“They were told, ‘We think we found Osama bin Laden, and your job is to kill him,’” an official recalled.
The SEALs started to cheer.
Radioing a commander on Sunday, the team reported the capture with a pre-arranged signal: “Geronimo!”
Read more: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0511/54151.html#ixzz1LIUsRWv5
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Jackpot: U.S. finds huge amount of data on Bin Laden’s computers (What's on that hard drive?)
Hotair ^ | 05/03/2011 | Allahpundit
________________________ ________________________ ___________
Would you care for some whipped cream and sprinkles on your sundae?
The assault force of Navy SEALs snatched a trove of computer drives and disks during their weekend raid on Osama bin Laden’s compound, yielding what a U.S. official called “the mother lode of intelligence.”
The special operations forces grabbed personal computers, thumb drives and electronic equipment during the lightning raid that killed bin Laden, officials told POLITICO…
“Hundreds of people are going through it now,” an official said, adding that intelligence operatives back in Washington are very excited to find out what they have.
“It’s going to be great even if only 10 percent of it is actionable,” the official said.
Follow the link for tantalizing details about how the SEALs encountered Bin Laden in the compound and their reaction when they were told what the mission was. Who’s next on the hit list once we’re done analyzing the data? You guessed it:
Does bin Laden’s demise mean the death of al-Qaeda? CIA analysts won’t go that far. But they have concluded that the operation “will accelerate its demise,” and that the battered organization is now at a “tipping point” that could lead to collapse.
The hidden trophy of Sunday’s raid: The JSOC team captured intelligence materials from the compound that might reveal the location of Ayman al-Zawahiri, the organization’s new commander. “That’s where we’re going next,” says one U.S. official involved in planning the operation.
So at last, after fully a decade of wondering, we’ll have an answer to the question I asked in this post: Did Bin Laden have an actual job with Al Qaeda anymore or was he basically just being cc’d on messages and offering “spiritual encouragement”? Stories have popped up on the wires from time to time alleging that he’s still giving battlefield orders. Some that we’ve blogged were murky yet spectacular, like this one from Newsweek in 2007 alleging a power struggle between OBL and Zawahiri. More recently, in the fall of last year, U.S. officials claimed that Bin Laden had dispatched his couriers with instructions for a Mumbai-style attack in Europe or America. That report emerged in October — which we now know was after U.S. intelligence had already zeroed in on him in his Abbottabad compound. Wouldn’t surprise me if the hard drives confirm their suspicions.
According to Dianne Feinstein, he might have been living at the compound for the past six years. Six years. And somehow, supposedly, nobody knew.
Update: Was it even longer than six years? Was he there all along?
U.S. officials say detainees held at Guantanamo helped lead them to the courier.
In one early clue, according to a secret Pentagon cable made public by Wikileaks, senior Al Qaeda commander Abu al Libi told interrogators he became “the official messenger” for bin Laden and for a year in 2003 “moved his family to Abbottabad, Pakistan” — the city near Islamabad where bin Laden was killed Sunday.
Update: You know, I’m actually less interested in who Osama was talking to within Al Qaeda than who he was talking to within Pakistani intelligence. Let the probe begin:
Obama administration officials said Monday they would probe whether Pakistani authorities helped al Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden stay in hiding for years, one day after he was killed by U.S. special forces at an outsize mansion complex located in the same city as Pakistan’s top military academy…
He didn’t specify which agencies of Pakistan’s government would be investigated. But privately, administration officials said the U.S. would have to probe for the possible involvement of Pakistan’s spy service and the military. “There are only so many agencies in the government that might have been involved,” said an official…
[An] ISI official acknowledged that Pakistanis are embarrassed by the raid. “It’s unfortunate, but we did not know about the people resident in that compound,” said the official. “That is a negative fallout that we have to live with.”
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Don`t be one of THOSE people. Seriously. By your rationale, Ronald Reagan may still be alive since you didn`t get to see his body either.
Trust but verfiy, that's all Im saying, nothing more.
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Don`t be one of THOSE people. Seriously. By your rationale, Ronald Reagan may still be alive since you didn`t get to see his body either.
Don`t be one of THOSE people. Seriously. By your rationale, there were Weapons of Mass Destruction in Iraq because the Bush Administration said so.
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Don`t be one of THOSE people. Seriously. By your rationale, there were Weapons of Mass Destruction in Iraq because the Bush Administration said so.
You cannot even begin to compare the two. Furthermore, Bush never said there were WMD`s only that the BELIEVED they harbored them. Hans Blix and the teams of weapons inspectors while there, always came up empty with their finds. Saddam kind of got tired of the annoyance and kicked them out. Saddam also lied to his top generals in his own military about WMD`s. He would tell them at times that they did have them. He did not want to appear weak to Iran especially and did not want them to get wind that he actually had nothing.
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> Who Gets The $27 Million Reward Offered For Bin Laden's Capture?
Categories: National News
04:48 pm
May 2, 2011
The FBI's Most Wanted poster for Osama bin Laden.
Under a special program started by Congress back in 1984, the U.S. government has paid $100 million to dozens of people who helped bring international terrorists to justice. But the reward for the most notorious terrorist of all — Osama bin Laden — could go unclaimed.
The State Department's Rewards for Justice Program had a $27 million bounty on bin Laden. Oficials removed bin Laden from their list Monday after confirmation of his death at the hands of U.S. troops.
At a news briefing, Secretary of State Hillary Clinton was circumspect about the case.
"Given the importance of confidentiality to the Rewards for Justice program, I cannot comment at all on whether anyone has been nominated for a reward in this or any other case," she told reporters.
The money has paid dividends in other cases, though. The prospect of cash payments motivated an informant to go to the U.S. Embassy in Pakistan and turn in Ramzi Yousef back in 1995. He helped plan the first World Trade Center bombing.
The program also helped the U.S. military find Saddam Hussein's sons. An unidentified source shared their location and after a four-hour firefight, both of them died.
But U.S. authorities have offered some reason to doubt whether the bin Laden reward will ever leave the bank. That's because investigators say they pieced together bin Laden's whereabouts from many different bits of information. Intelligence officials told reporters Monday that no single person is responsible for putting investigators on his trail.
That dynamic produced some friction in the case of Zacharias Moussaoui, who eventually pleaded guilty to terrorism conspiracy charges. A flight instructor and former Navy pilot who taught at the Minnesota school that Moussaoui attended collected $5 million after testifying about his suspicions at his trial.
But two other employees at the same flight school later complained that they had done more – even going so far as to call the FBI to report Moussaui. One of those men later got $100,000 from the Rewards for Justice program.
There's another reason why the bin Laden reward money may not easily leave federal hands. Investigating agencies within the Pentagon, or at the FBI or CIA, have to nominate tipsters. The nominations go to a special government committee and Clinton must approve them.
Intelligence officials say that key tips on the bin Laden courier network came from detainees, some of whom were exposed to enhanced interrogation tactics. Not exactly the people U.S. investigators would choose to get a huge payday.
Carrie Johnson covers the Justice Department for NPR.
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hey, i would be okay with the bacon bit treatment.
however, if it means one more bad guy will put on a vest and blow up US soldiers... then I'm okay with not poking that hornets nest with a stick when there's nothing to gain but immature smugness.
obama went out of his way to show we respect their religion.
While I don't subscribe to that belief system, nor care one shit about OBL, I do appreciate any efforts to avoid further unnecessary instigation of those religious zealouts. If you polled our troops on the streets of the cities - and asked them if they'd like to see muslims extremists further prodded - I'm betting they'd say no.
Was burying bin Laden at sea a mistake?
Amid the justified celebrations over the killing of Osama bin Laden, an awkward question is starting to rear its head: Did U.S. policymakers err in burying the al Qaeda leader at sea?
Already, the decision has provoked criticism from some Islamic scholars, who say a maritime burial isn't in keeping with Muslim law. And there are signs that the move could help fuel skepticism, especially among President Obama's critics, about whether bin Laden was really killed at all.
The Pentagon has said the body was treated in accordance with traditional Islamic procedures--including washing the corpse--before it was placed in the waters of the northern Arabian Sea.
U.S. officials have said they wanted to avoid the al Qaeda leader's grave site becoming a shrine for his followers. They've also said it would have been difficult to find a foreign country willing to accept bin Laden's remains, especially in so short a time: Islamic tradition and practice call for the body of the deceased to be buried within 24 hours of death.
But several Muslim authorities said today that the sea burial in fact violated Muslim tradition--and warned that it could help trigger calls for revenge from militant Muslims.
The sea burial "runs contrary to the principles of Islamic laws, religious values and humanitarian customs," Sheik Ahmed al-Tayeb, the grand Imam of Cairo's al-Azhar mosque, told the AP.
And Mohammed al-Qubaisi, Dubai's grand mufti, echoed that view. "If the family does not want him, it's really simple in Islam: You dig up a grave anywhere, even on a remote island, you say the prayers and that's it."
He added: "Sea burials are permissible for Muslims in extraordinary circumstances," he added. "This is not one of them."
And Abdul-Sattar al-Janabi, who preaches at Baghdad's Abu Hanifa mosque declared: "It is not acceptable, and it is almost a crime to throw the body of a Muslim man into the sea," adding that the action "might provoke some Muslims."
But the religious verdict may not be quite that open and shut. Imam Shamsi Ali, of the Islamic Cultural Center of New York, told The Lookout that in emergency circumstances, any Islamic law can be overlooked. "For example, you're not allowed to eat pork," he said, but added that if you were starving to death, it would be considered acceptable. Ali said that because the United States appears to have been unable to find a country to take bin Laden's body within 24 hours, this might have qualified as such an emergency.
Islamic practices aside, the decision is already triggering conspiracy theories that cast doubt on whether bin Laden is truly dead--even though DNA testing is said to have confirmed with virtual certainty that the al Qaeda leader was indeed killed. An assertion by Pakistan's Taliban that bin Laden is still living was picked up on several users of the conservative website FreeRepublic.com. In addition, one writer on the Andrew Breitbart website Big Peace called for bin Laden's body to be"digitally scanned" so that Americans could verify his death for themselves. On Twitter, Emily Miller, an editor at the conservative Washington Times, demanded a photo of the body as "proof."
Skepticism could only increase in some quarters if the Obama administration declines to release photos of bin Laden's body. No decision has yet been made on that question, according to White House counter-terror adviser John Brennan, who said this afternoon that doing so could jeopardize future operations.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/yblog_thelookout/20110502/ts_yblog_thelookout/was-it-burying-bin-laden-at-sea-a-mistake
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Obama to make statement in a few minutes. Blitzes said it is huge and won't say. Something is afoot.
God Bless Barack 'Bounty Hunter' Hussein Obama
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God Bless Barack 'Bounty Hunter' Hussein Obama
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Source: US Government Believes Pakistan Compound was Built Specifically for Bin Laden
ABC News ^ | May 03, 2011 | Jake Tapper
Sources tell ABC News that administration officials believe Osama bin Laden had been living at the Abbottabad, Pakistan compound for years, with one senior administration source even suggesting the compound was specifically built in 2005 for the al Qaeda leader.
That this compound was constructed in the neighborhood of former Pakistani military officials and a local military academy is of course calling into question the participation of the local – if not national – government.
“It’s inconceivable that bin Laden did not have a support system in the country that allowed him to remain there for an extended period of time,” said White House counterterrorism adviser John Brennan on Monday.
[Snip]
As always, there is a line that the US government walks when it comes to its alliance with Pakistan’s government. The Pakistanis seldom are as cooperative as the US wants them to be, and yet the US cannot afford to alienate the country’s leadership.
(Excerpt) Read more at blogs.abcnews.com ...
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Twenty more articles please.
You are really getting some traction today.
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Twenty more articles please.
You are really getting some traction today.
Fuck off troll.
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Fuck off troll.
What are we, broken up?
Can we still be friends?
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Obama didn't see bin Laden die
Politico ^ | 5/3/2011 | Matt Negrin
President Obama didn’t see Osama bin Laden get shot but got word that he was killed after a team said “Geronimo,” the code word to signify the terrorist was captured, CIA Director Leon Panetta says.
Panetta said in an interview with PBS that the officials in the Situation Room “didn’t know just exactly what was going on” for 20 to 25 minutes when the team sent to get bin Laden in Pakistan entered his compound on Sunday.
“There were some very tense moments as we were waiting for information,” Panetta said. “But finally Admiral [William] McRaven came back and said he had picked up the word 'Geronimo,' which was the code word that represented they got bin Laden.”
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How to make a bin laden cocktail
2 shots and a splash of water...
:D
oh come on it's kind of funny
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Obama didn't see bin Laden die
Politico ^ | 5/3/2011 | Matt Negrin
President Obama didn’t see Osama bin Laden get shot but got word that he was killed after a team said “Geronimo,” the code word to signify the terrorist was captured, CIA Director Leon Panetta says.
Panetta said in an interview with PBS that the officials in the Situation Room “didn’t know just exactly what was going on” for 20 to 25 minutes when the team sent to get bin Laden in Pakistan entered his compound on Sunday.
“There were some very tense moments as we were waiting for information,” Panetta said. “But finally Admiral [William] McRaven came back and said he had picked up the word 'Geronimo,' which was the code word that represented they got bin Laden.”
Well, this makes another version.
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"Carney said bin Laden wasn't armed. When asked Tuesday why the decision was made to shoot and kill bin Laden if he was not armed, Carney responded that "he resisted" and that the U.S. personnel "handled themselves with the utmost professionalism." He did not explain how bin Laden resisted."
http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/05/03/white-house-bin-laden-was-unarmed-when-killed/?hpt=T1
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he didn't have a gun because his chick probably capped his ass.
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:)
(http://media.staradvertiser.com/images/500*339/a21ced21d4221609ec0e6a7067002166.jpg)
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More unfounded cts from 240.
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he didn't have a gun because his chick probably capped his ass.
and his 'chick' was a ladyboy...
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he didn't have a gun because his chick probably capped his ass.
More unfounded cts from 240.
Unfounded isn't even the word... "Made up shit" is the correct phraseology.
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to be clear....
osama - who had an appointed 'suicide guy' and vowed to be never taken alive, being killed with a eye shot in crowded night gun battle.... thinking that might be suicide is commpletely unfounded.
BUT
OBAMA intentionally sinking the US economy for his NWO bosses - that's completely unreasonable?
Sorry champs - this latest thing of "This CT is unacceptable because it's unfounded" is gayer than a stack of strawberry pancakes. You have no definition of "unfounded" that will apply to mine but not 333386's.
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to be clear....
osama - who had an appointed 'suicide guy' and vowed to be never taken alive, being killed with a eye shot in crowded night gun battle.... thinking that might be suicide is commpletely unfounded.
BUT
OBAMA intentionally sinking the US economy for his NWO bosses - that's completely unreasonable?
Sorry champs - this latest thing of "This CT is unacceptable because it's unfounded" is gayer than a stack of strawberry pancakes. You have no definition of "unfounded" that will apply to mine but not 333386's.
No... That's fucking dumb too.
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Maybe it was a hologram of bin laden in the room or a wax double.
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everybody knows that there are like eight clones of bin Laden in the hindukush mountains at any time. the real bin laden lives in southlake, texas - where he has been since 1998.
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No... That's fucking dumb too.
;D
You've been killing it the last few days.
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;D
You've been killing it the last few days.
I'm just tired of all the god damn bullshit... I feel like everyone is fucking crazy.
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I'm just tired of all the god damn bullshit... I feel like everyone is fucking crazy.
I don't think it's so much crazy as it is stupid. This board (and the rest of the internet, for that matter) is crawling with morons like Mr. "I don't know dick about Islam but I know beyond a shadow-of-a-doubt that OBL's wife capped him, one of the most devout and pious Muslims on the planet".
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33,
do you stand by your CT that obama is intentionally trying to sink the US economy for his NWO warlords?
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I don't think it's so much crazy as it is stupid. This board (and the rest of the internet, for that matter) is crawling with morons like Mr. "I don't know dick about Islam but I know beyond a shadow-of-a-doubt that OBL's wife capped him, one of the most devout and pious Muslims on the planet".
If it's really stupid and not crazy, then the world is screwed, and it's certainly not Bin Laden or even Obama that are the problems... It's people who pull fucking stupid ass hollywood story lines out of their asses and claim them as fact when having absolutely not a fucking piece of evidence to support it.
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but I know beyond a shadow-of-a-doubt
where did I write that?
I think it's a possibility he would rather take his own life than be captured.
And now, we know he heard choppers landing in his yard and gunfighting on floors 1 and 2 before they got to his door.
We know he wasn't splattered with rounds to the torso, it was a precision shot to eye. And he had no weapon. I don't think it's impossible he would shoot himself. Or his woman would do it.
Where did I say "I know beyond a shadow-of-a-doubt", Berz?
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I don`t think 240 is trying to push any type of conspiracy theory, he is just trying to piece together events with the given information thus far. He is not drawing any conclusions that I can see, just having some fun speculating.
There are some on here though that are blatant conspiracy theorists and they are truly dumb. They still think Bin Laden was killed years ago or that he wasn`t killed etc..
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If it's really stupid and not crazy, then the world is screwed, and it's certainly not Bin Laden or even Obama that are the problems... It's people who pull fucking stupid ass hollywood story lines out of their asses and claim them as fact when having absolutely not a fucking piece of evidence to support it.
The internet is the bane of humanity. It gave voices to people whose voices shouldn't be heard.
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If it's really stupid and not crazy, then the world is screwed, and it's certainly not Bin Laden or even Obama that are the problems... It's people who pull fucking stupid ass hollywood story lines out of their asses and claim them as fact when having absolutely not a fucking piece of evidence to support it.
Like our govt did with jessica Lynch and Pat Tillman?
Sorry, but the second I heard we killed him, I wondered just how hollywood this romantic shotout story would be. Sure enough, an unarmed osama cowering behind a woman, shot in the eye by a precision shot form a soldier.
Hell, any of us could have written that story. Did he crap his pants first too? it's like when they killed off Chef on South Park - they gave him the worst possible ending.
I believe IF they had walked into the room and found him already dead, they may not say that. They wouldn't give him that win, that control, that escape. They'd take credit. Without a fricking doubt.
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where did I write that?
I think it's a possibility he would rather take his own life than be captured.
And now, we know he heard choppers landing in his yard and gunfighting on floors 1 and 2 before they got to his door.
We know he wasn't splattered with rounds to the torso, it was a precision shot to eye. And he had no weapon. I don't think it's impossible he would shoot himself. Or his woman would do it.
Where did I say "I know beyond a shadow-of-a-doubt", Berz?
You know what... You didn't say beyond a shadow of a doubt, but you certainly don't present your alternative as a "slight" possibility... You present it as "most likely accurate".
So you're saying that your "theory" of what went down is much more reliable than the word of the US military.
Calling the boys a bunch of liars... I will not abide by that.
Have there been lies, yes... but I will not paint the broad stroke that my military personnel who serve this country so valiantly are a crew of lying fuckups.
I won't have anyone else do it either.
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Like our govt did with jessica Lynch and Pat Tillman?
Sorry, but the second I heard we killed him, I wondered just how hollywood this romantic shotout story would be. Sure enough, an unarmed osama cowering behind a woman, shot in the eye by a precision shot form a soldier.
Hell, any of us could have written that story. Did he crap his pants first too? it's like when they killed off Chef on South Park - they gave him the worst possible ending.
I believe IF they had walked into the room and found him already dead, they may not say that. They wouldn't give him that win, that control, that escape. They'd take credit. Without a fricking doubt.
The lies that have been told... especially about Tillman were done to protect the familes... not to "get over".
Jessica Lynch was a propaganda tool.. yes... was it false... sure... but it was something that helped inspire America... Want to call it wrong... fine... A lie... ok.... but don't act like your made up shit has more truth to it... because it certainly fucking does not.
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Like our govt did with jessica Lynch and Pat Tillman?
Sorry, but the second I heard we killed him, I wondered just how hollywood this romantic shotout story would be. Sure enough, an unarmed osama cowering behind a woman, shot in the eye by a precision shot form a soldier.
Hell, any of us could have written that story. Did he crap his pants first too? it's like when they killed off Chef on South Park - they gave him the worst possible ending.
I believe IF they had walked into the room and found him already dead, they may not say that. They wouldn't give him that win, that control, that escape. They'd take credit. Without a fricking doubt.
You act like it's this stunning revelation that one of the best soldiers on the planet managed to shoot him in the chest and face. From what I've read, they spent the longest amount of time clearing the two brothers out of the bottom of the house. After that it was bing-bang-boom, done.
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Calling the boys a bunch of liars... I will not abide by that.
*I didn't say anything about "our boys"
I'm talking about Obama. He will paint the story he wants for this. You know this. Just like Bush did.
I'm saying if they were willing to change Jessica lynch from "surrender then rape" to "shot a bunch of bad guys"............
if they were willing to change Tillman from "killed by his own team then burned on battlefield" to "led the charge and saved his boys then was shot"........
I don't trust a damn word they say. Period. This is the equivalent of killing hitler. This event will be in the history books for centuries. He had this ending written already. maybe it happened exactly as obama told us. But it's not impossible that HE would lie about it.
Our troops are brave, the seals are badasses and OBL needed that bullet. But to me, IMO, the story of cowering unarmed behind a woman hiding sounds like propaganda.
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I don`t think 240 is trying to push any type of conspiracy theory, he is just trying to piece together events with the given information thus far. He is not drawing any conclusions that I can see, just having some fun speculating.
There are some on here though that are blatant conspiracy theorists and they are truly dumb. They still think Bin Laden was killed years ago or that he wasn`t killed etc..
Dude... You know full well his MO is to start out saying "well maybe" and the next thing you know, he's acting like his opinion of incidents is more accurate than someone elses.
In this instance, we 240 saying things which are actually LESS likely, but he likes the idea that the military didn't do their job and are lying about it... Every thing he says in regards to our armed service individuals and the people who help protect our freedoms comes across as a negative.
Fuck him.
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*I didn't say anything about "our boys"
I'm talking about Obama. He will paint the story he wants for this. You know this. Just like Bush did.
I'm saying if they were willing to change Jessica lynch from "surrender then rape" to "shot a bunch of bad guys"............
if they were willing to change Tillman from "killed by his own team then burned on battlefield" to "led the charge and saved his boys then was shot"........
I don't trust a damn word they say. Period. This is the equivalent of killing hitler. This event will be in the history books for centuries. He had this ending written already. maybe it happened exactly as obama told us. But it's not impossible that HE would lie about it.
Our troops are brave, the seals are badasses and OBL needed that bullet. But to me, IMO, the story of cowering unarmed behind a woman hiding sounds like propaganda.
Exactly... You are calling the people on the ground liars.
Until someone proves the guys that were there are lying... I will believe them instead of some shit you make up.
You are calling them liars, you just admitted to it.
Fuck you.
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Dude... You know full well his MO is to start out saying "well maybe" and the next thing you know, he's acting like his opinion of incidents is more accurate than someone elses.
In this instance, we 240 saying things which are actually LESS likely, but he likes the idea that the military didn't do their job and are lying about it... Every thing he says in regards to our armed service individuals and the people who help protect our freedoms comes across as a negative.
Fuck him.
This is 240's modus operandi. He was doing the same shit with Libya two weeks ago. And with 9/11. And with every other story under the Sun.
He's a fucking troll.
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Dude... You know full well his MO is to start out saying "well maybe" and the next thing you know, he's acting like his opinion of incidents is more accurate than someone elses.
In this instance, we 240 saying things which are actually LESS likely, but he likes the idea that the military didn't do their job and are lying about it... Every thing he says in regards to our armed service individuals and the people who help protect our freedoms comes across as a negative.
Fuck him.
Disagree. I've said they deserve Time's man of the year cover for this mission.
But I'm saying i'm not ruling out Obama changing the story to fit his narrative and how history will view HIM.
it probably happened just like he said it. But in my opinion, it doesn't match what our generals said for years about osama bin laden - planned suicide before capture. Hiding on bed behind woman during 120 seconds of gun battles doesn't jive with what Gen barry Mccaffrey and Jack Jacobs said on the news all those years - that suicide was first on his mind over capture.
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Obama blocked plot to bomb Bin Laden's lair FOUR months ago - he wanted DNA proof he was dead
dailymail.co.uk ^ | May 3, 2011 | Rob Cooper
Posted on May 2, 2011 11:04:10 PM EDT by Free ThinkerNY
Barack Obama vetoed a plan for stealth bombers to blow up Osama Bin Laden's compound in March so special forces could get DNA evidence to confirm he was dead.
The U.S. President gave the all clear for an air strike on the 54-year-old's hideaway - but backed out.
Military leaders were going to drop 2,000lb bombs from two B2 stealth bombers on the secure site yards from Pakistan's military academy, sources revealed.
But Obama told the military to hold off, and instead an elite team American forces killed the terrorist during a firefight.
The President vetoed the original plan so the U.S. could preserve the terror leader's remains and prove that he had been killed, ABC News reported.
DNA samples taken from the body showed the man killed was '99.9 per cent certain' to be Bin Laden.
Detailed photo analysis by the CIA, confirmation by other people at the raid site and matching physical features like bin Laden's height all helped confirmed the identification.
His body was swiftly dumped at sea so that his burial site did not become a shrine.
Destroying the compound in Abbottabad, Pakistan, from the air would have killed all 22 people inside - including women and children potentially sparking an angry backlash from the international community.
The daring mission to take out the world's most wanted man was finally given the go-ahead last Friday, according to the source.
(Excerpt) Read more at dailymail.co.uk ...
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Like our govt did with jessica Lynch and Pat Tillman?
Sorry, but the second I heard we killed him, I wondered just how hollywood this romantic shotout story would be. Sure enough, an unarmed osama cowering behind a woman, shot in the eye by a precision shot form a soldier.
Hell, any of us could have written that story. Did he crap his pants first too? it's like when they killed off Chef on South Park - they gave him the worst possible ending.
I believe IF they had walked into the room and found him already dead, they may not say that. They wouldn't give him that win, that control, that escape. They'd take credit. Without a fricking doubt.
Precision shot to the eye???
Where the fuck do you get this crap? Just make it up?
For all we know, Osama was dropping down to pick up a gun and when the soldier fired it him in the eye. Or any other number of possibilities.
You were claiming in another post that it was crowded? How the fuck do you know?
Dude, you really can't see that you just make shit up to support your delusional CT fantasies? You really can't see that?
Here's a future post for you after you make up some more shit:
"There was 15 people between the soldier and Osama, the roof was collapsing with debris, the moon was reflecting off a mirror into the eyes of the soldier, the soldier had his kneecap shot off...but somehow the seal pulled off a precision shot. Yeah right guys...totally unbelievable that he could have taken his own life. It's all cool though..."
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Pakistan: We Alerted US Administration About OBL Compound Back in 2009
Gateway ^ | 5/04/2011 | Jim Hoft
________________________ ______________________-
The Pakistani Foreign Secretary told the BBC yesterday that Pakistan alerted the US about Osama Bion Laden’s compound back in 2009. Dawn reported:
Pakistan alerted the US to its suspicions about a compound where Osama bin Laden was found hiding as far back as 2009, Pakistani Foreign Secretary Salman Bashir said on Wednesday.
Bashir also hit out at “disquieting” comments by CIA Director Leon Panetta that US officials had ruled out informing Islamabad in advance about Sunday’s US raid on the Pakistani compound which led to the al Qaeda chief’s death.
Asked in a BBC radio interview about the compound in Abbottabad where the al Qaeda chief was discovered, Bashir said: “This particular location was pointed out by our intelligence quite some time ago to the US intelligence.
“Of course they have a much more sophisticated equipment to evaluate and to assess.”
(Excerpt) Read more at gatewaypundit.rightnetwo rk.com ...
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The Intellectual Dishonesty of Nancy Pelosi
Commentary Magazine ^ | May 3, 2011 | by Peter Wehner
________________________ ________________________ ______________
Here’s Nancy Pelosi from a press conference on September 7, 2006:
[E]ven if [Osama bin Laden] is caught tomorrow, it is five years too late. He has done more damage the longer he has been out there. But, in fact, the damage that he has done . . . is done. And even to capture him now I don’t think makes us any safer.
And here’s Nancy Pelosi yesterday:
The death of Osama bin Laden marks the most significant development in our fight against al-Qaida. . . . I salute President Obama, his national security team, Director Panetta, our men and women in the intelligence community and military, and other nations who supported this effort for their leadership in achieving this major accomplishment. . . . [T]he death of Osama bin Laden is historic. . . .
This devastating then-and-now comparison comes to us courtesy of John Hideraker of Power Line. It underscores the degree to which partisanship can ravage people’s fair-mindedness and, in the process, make them look like fools and hacks. Such things aren’t uncommon in politics—but what is rare is to see such intellectual dishonesty proven so conclusively.
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Administration's initial misstatements raise questions
Bin Laden was shielded during the shooting by women, including his wife, they said. He was an active participant in an ongoing firefight, they insisted, implying bin Laden was armed and therefore gave U.S. Navy SEALs little choice but to shoot him down.
Hours later, a senior administration official began to revise that narrative to some White House reporters. Further revisions came Tuesday when White House Press Secretary Jay Carney gave a step-by-step description of the raid provided by the Defense Department that made clear bin Laden was unarmed and had no human shields.
http://www.cnn.com/2011/POLITICS/05/03/bin.laden.evolving.story/index.html?hpt=T1
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Administration's initial misstatements raise questions
Bin Laden was shielded during the shooting by women, including his wife, they said. He was an active participant in an ongoing firefight, they insisted, implying bin Laden was armed and therefore gave U.S. Navy SEALs little choice but to shoot him down.
Hours later, a senior administration official began to revise that narrative to some White House reporters. Further revisions came Tuesday when White House Press Secretary Jay Carney gave a step-by-step description of the raid provided by the Defense Department that made clear bin Laden was unarmed and had no human shields.
http://www.cnn.com/2011/POLITICS/05/03/bin.laden.evolving.story/index.html?hpt=T1
Yup, theres been parts of this thing that came out sounding like a bad b movie movie script. There's been several versions and it's only been a few days . Quite a change compared to the capture of Saddam which was way more accurate.
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The Young Wife Who Defended Osama Bin Laden
ABC News ^ | May 4, 2011 | By BRIAN ROSS
The woman who the White House said charged U.S. Navy SEALs in an apparent desperate last ditch effort to protect Osama bin Laden has been identified as bin Laden's youngest wife, a woman nearly half his age.
Fatah, bin Laden's fifth wife and the only one left living with him in the house, had been gifted to the al Qaeda leader from a Yemeni family when she was just a teenager and later had three young children with him.
To former high-ranking CIA analyst and former FBI counterterrorism official Phil Mudd, it's not surprising that she apparently was willing to risk her life for the man the U.S. has been hunting for more than a decade.
"He is, in the al Qaeda context, an honorable man and he's viewed in their context not as a terrorist but as a statesman," Mudd told ABC News. "I would be surprised if this guy would sacrifice a wife for this operation, but I'm sure she was willing to get in front of a bullet for him."
(Excerpt) Read more at abcnews.go.com ...
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Bin Laden captured alive and THEN shot, claims daughter, 12, as White House admits he wasn't armed
Daily Mail UK ^ | May 4, 2011
Osama bin Laden's daughter has claimed he was captured alive in his Pakistani hideout and then shot by US special forces, it was reported today.
Arabic news network Al-Arabiya quoted 'senior Pakistani security officials' who said the 12-year-old saw her father executed and his body dragged to a helicopter.
A Pakistani official rejected US accounts of a bloody firefight, saying: 'Not a single bullet was fired from the compound at the U.S. forces and their choppers. Their chopper developed some technical fault and crashed and the wreckage was left on the spot.'
The channel also said the surviving bin Laden relatives, including six children and one of his wives, had been taken to hospital in Rawalpindi. Amal Al-Sadah, the terror chief's 27-year-old wife and youngest bride, was shot in the leg during the raid but survived.
In initial accounts of the firefight, US. officials had claimed bin Laden was armed with an AK47 rifle and was using his wife as a ‘human shield’ when he was shot. U.S. Press Secretary Jay Carney confirmed more details of the death of Al Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden last night
U.S. press secretary Jay Carney confirmed more details of the death of Al Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden last night
Counter-terrorism official John Brennan had said. 'There was family at that compound, and there was a female who was, in fact, in the line of fire that reportedly was used as a shield to shield Bin Laden from the incoming fire.'
But last night, the White House said Bin Laden was not armed when a U.S. Navy SEAL confronted and killed him during Sunday night's assault on his compound.
(Excerpt) Read more at dailymail.co.uk ...
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but but but I thought it was an unfounded CT to question Obama's initial fairy tale version of events?
Is it founded yet? Can we now question whether the White House was just feeding us a perfect narrative to fit their own agenda?
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but but but I thought it was an unfounded CT to question Obama's initial fairy tale version of events?
Is it founded yet? Can we now question whether the White House was just feeding us a perfect narrative to fit their own agenda?
If they were watching this thing on a live feed - how the hell is thing so muddled?
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but but but I thought it was an unfounded CT to question Obama's initial fairy tale version of events?
Is it founded yet? Can we now question whether the White House was just feeding us a perfect narrative to fit their own agenda?
I believe he's dead, but after the Paki information about informing the US that he's been there for 2 years and the revisiions/embellishments, the timing of all this, etc...I just don't believe he died the way they suggest.
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If they were watching this thing on a live feed - how the hell is thing so muddled?
Who was watching? That story has been changed as well, depending on who you are referring to.
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If they were watching this thing on a live feed - how the hell is thing so muddled?
Very good question.
I just don't believe he died the way they suggest.
When I said that last night - tu and berzerker called it an unfounded CT.
This is the biggest individual kill by this govt since 1945. You know they're going to sell it with as much gusto and glitter as possible. They may have found him on the floor on his knees and executed him. They may have found him dead. Or maybe it happened just as they initially said.
Changing stories... our govt wouldn't do that. Right, Tillman, Lynch, and a million others?
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Very good question.
When I said that last night - tu and berzerker called it an unfounded CT.
This is the biggest individual kill by this govt since 1945. You know they're going to sell it with as much gusto and glitter as possible. They may have found him on the floor on his knees and executed him. They may have found him dead. Or maybe it happened just as they initially said.
Changing stories... our govt wouldn't do that. Right, Tillman, Lynch, and a million others?
It is still unfounded... You have some other proof that something went down?
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It is still unfounded... You have some other proof that something went down?
"Proof?"
Well, OBL's daughter is now saying he was captured, then executed in front of his family.
We can argue the credibility of her statement. But at this point, we have official recounts of events which do not match "cowering behind a woman as a human shield and shot in eye" and "Armed, resisting, and shot".
So now there's 2 accounts from the white house alone, and another account from the scene. Still unfounded?
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"Proof?"
Well, OBL's daughter is now saying he was captured, then executed in front of his family.
We can argue the credibility of her statement. But at this point, we have official recounts of events which do not match "cowering behind a woman as a human shield and shot in eye" and "Armed, resisting, and shot".
So now there's 2 accounts from the white house alone, and another account from the scene. Still unfounded?
Yes... still unfounded.
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Yes... still unfounded.
the US govt has released two official statements with differing accounts. Not minor differences - pretty major in shooting an armed or unarmed person.
So you don't consider two official statements to be enough to determine 1 of the stories isn't correct? :) :) :)
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the US govt has released two official statements with differing accounts. Not minor differences - pretty major in shooting an armed or unarmed person.
So you don't consider two official statements to be enough to determine 1 of the stories isn't correct? :) :) :)
I'm sure one is incorrect, but that certainly doesn't make some shit you pulled out of your ass correct.
The absence of evidence, is not the evidence of absence.
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Most likely - SEALS busted in the room - saw OBL - and just capped his ass.
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I'm sure one is incorrect, but that certainly doesn't make some shit you pulled out of your ass correct.
I listed a few diff possibilities.
We already know the white house has destroyed their own initial reports of what happened.
So it's not offensive to our soldiers to say "that story smells like bullshit" when Obama is selling us a 2nd or 3rd version now, with little kids over there saying he surrended and was capped.
Which I'm fine with - he had it coming. But why would Obama lie to us?
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I'm all fo the hit squad... but i dont understand why the white house would make shit up, just to sell a rosier story.
BBC
The White House backtracks on Bin Laden
Mark Mardell | 06:51 UK time, Wednesday, 4 May 2011
The White House has had to correct its facts about the killing of Bin Laden, and for some that has diminished the glow of success that has surrounded all those involved in the operation.
Bin Laden wasn't armed when he was shot. It raises suspicions that this was indeed a deliberate shoot-to-kill operation.
Here are the inaccuracies in the first version. The woman killed was not his wife. No woman was used as a human shield. And he was not armed.
The president's press secretary Jay Carney suggested this was the result of trying to provide a great deal of information in a great deal of haste.
I can largely accept that. There is no mileage in misleading people and then correcting yourself. But the president's assistant national security advisor John Brennan had used the facts he was giving out to add a moral message - this was the sort of man Bin Laden was, cowering behind his wife, using her as a shield. Nice narrative. Not true. In fact, according to Carney this unarmed woman tried to attack the heavily armed Navy Seal. In another circumstance that might even be described as brave.
Jay Carney said that Bin Laden didn't have to have a gun to be resisting. He said there was a great deal of resistance in general and a highly volatile fire fight. The latest version says Bin Laden's wife charged at the US commando and was shot in the leg, but not killed. The two brothers, the couriers and owners of the compound, and a woman were killed on the ground floor of the main building. This version doesn't mention Bin Laden's son, who also died.
By this count only three men, at the most, were armed. I do wonder how much fight they could put up against two helicopters' worth of Navy Seals.
Does any of this matter? Well, getting the fact right is always important. You can't make a judgment without them. We all make mistakes, and journalists hate doing so because it makes people trust us less. For those involved an operation like this, time must go past in a confused and noisy instant, and they aren't taking notes. Confusion is very understandable. But you start to wonder how much the facts are being massaged now, to gloss over the less appealing parts of the operation.
And of course there is the suspicion that the US never wanted to take Bin Laden alive. Here at least many see a trial as inconvenient, awkward - a chance for terrorists to grandstand. Look at all the fuss about the trial of Khalid Sheikh Mohammed.
In the confusion of a raid it's hard to see how the Seals could be sure that Bin Laden wasn't armed, didn't have his finger on the trigger of a bomb, wasn't about to pull a nasty surprise. If he had his hands in the air shouting "don't shoot" he might have lived, but anything short of that seems to have ensured his death.
I suspect there will be more worry about this in Britain and Europe than in the US. That doesn't mean we are right or wrong. It is a cultural difference. We are less comfortable about frontier justice, less forgiving about even police shooting people who turn out to be unarmed, perhaps less inculcated with the Dirty Harry message that arresting villains is for wimps, and real justice grows from the barrel of a gun. Many in America won't be in the slightest bit bothered that a mass murderer got what was coming to him swiftly, whether he was trying to kill anyone in that instant or not.
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WWWTTTFFF is wrong with these idiots?
Very simple - "He killed 3000 of our citizens - we were on a seek and destroy mission for him and whoever harbored and protected him"
End of story.
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The absence of evidence, is not the evidence of absence.
Man, when it comes to evidence you really go back and forth depending on what's convenient for you.
You just posted on another board that the absence of texts mentioning Jesus Christ which were written during his lifetime is proof that Jesus never existed. ::)
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I listed a few diff possibilities.
We already know the white house has destroyed their own initial reports of what happened.
So it's not offensive to our soldiers to say "that story smells like bullshit" when Obama is selling us a 2nd or 3rd version now, with little kids over there saying he surrended and was capped.
Which I'm fine with - he had it coming. But why would Obama lie to us?
We do?
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Man, when it comes to evidence you really go back and forth depending on what's convenient for you.
You just posted on another board that the absence of texts mentioning Jesus Christ which were written during his lifetime proof that Jesus never existed. ::)
There were no texts written in Jesus' lifetime... Find one.
But again... stick to the thread at hand... you really are on the Jesus kick man...
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There were no texts written in Jesus' lifetime... Find one.
But again... stick to the thread at hand... you really are on the Jesus kick man...
So? You just said "The absence of evidence, is not the evidence of absence."
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So? You just said "The absence of evidence, is not the evidence of absence."
Yes... It was a quote from a TV show... so what?
The whole point behind "faith" is that you have to take it at face value... I get that you do... I'm not saying don't... You can have it all day long, I don't criticize it. I simply say that when it comes to the whole Jesus thing, I don't.
You will never have any "proof" of his existence beyond your belief that Bible is a historical telling, but we all know that the history in it is confusing and I can't know that one part is wrong but believe the rest... It's not in me.
Now, the Bin Laden thing... I believe that whatever happened will come out and that we will know exactly what happened. I don't believe it's some big conspiracy.
That's all there is to it.
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WWWTTTFFF is wrong with these idiots?
Very simple - "He killed 3000 of our citizens - we were on a seek and destroy mission for him and whoever harbored and protected him"
End of story.
BUMP
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WWWTTTFFF is wrong with these idiots?
Very simple - "He killed 3000 of our citizens - we were on a seek and destroy mission for him and whoever harbored and protected him"
End of story.
He killed more people than that.
As someone posted on another thread.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osama_bin_Laden
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BUMP
I`m with you 100 percent.
Also, I`m sure the power was completely cut to Bin Laden`s house and flashbangs thrown into rooms. Everyone was operating in complete darkness with night vision. Bin Laden never knew what hit him. Hopefully when they got to him, he was able to at least see the United States Flag on the arm of the soldiers before he was taken out.
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I`m with you 100 percent.
Also, I`m sure the power was completely cut to Bin Laden`s house and flashbangs thrown into rooms. Everyone was operating in complete darkness with night vision. Bin Laden never knew what hit him. Hopefully when they got to him, he was able to at least see the United States Flag on the arm of the soldiers before he was taken out.
10000000% - on this - there is no GOP - Dem - Lib - consv - etc in my mind.
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Yes... It was a quote from a TV show... so what?
The whole point behind "faith" is that you have to take it at face value... I get that you do... I'm not saying don't... You can have it all day long, I don't criticize it. I simply say that when it comes to the whole Jesus thing, I don't.
You will never have any "proof" of his existence beyond your belief that Bible is a historical telling, but we all know that the history in it is confusing and I can't know that one part is wrong but believe the rest... It's not in me.
Now, the Bin Laden thing... I believe that whatever happened will come out and that we will know exactly what happened. I don't believe it's some big conspiracy.
That's all there is to it.
Faith has nothing to do with this. We are not talking about whether or not Jesus was the Son of God or anything like that. We are talking about the historicity of Jesus, whether or not Jesus is a real person who lived in Israel in the 1st century. You are claiming that Jesus is nothing but a myth.
Scholarly response to the Jesus Myth Hypothesis:
"There are those who argue that Jesus is a figment of the Church's imagination, that there never was a Jesus at all. I have to say that I do not know any respectable critical scholar who says that any more."
Burridge, R & Gould, G, Jesus Now and Then, Wm. B. Eerdmans, 2004, p.34.
The classical historian Michael Grant writes:
"To sum up, modern critical methods fail to support the Christ myth theory. It has 'again and again been answered and annihilated by first rank scholars.' In recent years, 'no serious scholar has ventured to postulate the non historicity of Jesus' or at any rate very few, and they have not succeeded in disposing of the much stronger, indeed very abundant, evidence to the contrary."
Michael Grant does not see the similarities between Christianity and pagan religions to be significant. Grant states that "Judaism was a milieu to which doctrines of the deaths and rebirths, of mythical gods seemed so entirely foreign that the emergence of such a fabrication from its midst is very hard to credit."
Grant, Michael (1995). Jesus: An Historian's Review of the Gospels. Scribner, 199. ISBN 978-0684818672 .
R.T. France points out that Christianity was actively opposed by both the Roman Empire and the Jewish authorities, and would have been utterly discredited if Jesus had been shown as a non-historical figure. He argues that there is evidence in Pliny, Josephus and other sources of the Roman and Jewish approaches at the time, and none of them involved this suggestion.
In response to Jesus-myth proponents who argue the lack of early non-Christian sources, or question their authenticity, R. T. France counters that "even the great histories of Tacitus have survived in only two manuscripts, which together contain scarcely half of what he is believed to have written, the rest is lost" and that the life of Jesus, from a Roman point of view, was not a major
event.
R.T France disagrees with the notion that the Apostle Paul did not speak of Jesus as a physical being. He argues that arguments from silence are unreliable and that there are several references to historical facts about Jesus's life in Paul's letters, such as that Jesus "who as to his earthly life was a descendant of David" (Romans 1:3, TNIV).
France, RT (1986). Evidence for Jesus (Jesus Library). Trafalgar Square Publishing, 19-20. ISBN 0340381728.
Supporting a historical Jesus
Bovon, François (2006). The Last Days of Jesus, trans. Kristin Hennessy; Louisville: Westminster, John Knox. ISBN 0664230075.
Burridge, Richard A. (2006). Four Gospels, One Jesus? A Symbolic Reading, 2nd edn., Grand Rapids:Eerdmans. ISBN 0802829805 .
Charlesworth, James H. (ed.) (2006). Jesus and Archaeology. Grand Rapids: Eerdmans. ISBN 080284880X.
Grant, Michael [1977] (1999). Jesus. London: Phoenix. ISBN 0-75380-899-4.
Komoszewski, J. Ed ; et al (2006). Reinventing Jesus. Kregel Publications. ISBN 082542982X.
Meier, John P. A Marginal Jew: Rethinking the Historical Jesus, 3 vols., New York: Doubleday.
(1991) The Roots of the Problem and the Person. ISBN 0-385-26425-9 .
(1994) Mentor, Message, and Miracles. ISBN 0-385-46992-6 .
(2001) Companions and Competitors. ISBN 0-385-46993-4 .
Sanders, E. P. (1993). The Historical Figure of Jesus. London: Allen Lane. ISBN 0-7139-9059-7.
Theissen, Gerd; and Annette Merz (1998). The Historical Jesus: A Comprehensive Guide , trans. John Bowden, Minneapolis: Fortress Press. ISBN 0-8006-3123-4.
Wright, NT (1996). The New Testament and the People of God. Augsburg Fortress Publishers. ISBN 0800626818.
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Faith has nothing to do with this. We are not talking about whether or not Jesus was the Son of God or anything like that. We are talking about the historicity of Jesus, whether or not Jesus is a real person who lived in Israel in the 1st century. You are claiming that Jesus is nothing but a myth.
It is my right to do so.
Look... I get why a lot of people believe he existed... I do... But for me... A dude does amazing things for 3 years, but no one writes anything about it while he's alive? Nothing?
He doesn't write anything, no one writes jack while he's alive, but yet I'm supposed to take it at face value because he's in this book that people hold sacred that he must have existed?
I suppose you could say he was just some regular guy who was nothing special, but then why write about him at all?
Doesn't work for me dude.
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Osama may be dead but his legend lives on in his 'Love Me Tender' Jeans.
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I suppose you could say he was just some regular guy who was nothing special, but then why write about him at all?
You can deny Jesus' deity if you want to, but scholars know that a guy named Jesus who was called The Christ did exist in the 1st century.
A regular guy who was nothing special? A guy who started the largest and most influential faith, Christianity, in the history of the world? Christianity, the Eastern faith that shaped Western culture?
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You can deny Jesus' deity if you want to, but scholars know that a guy named Jesus who was called The Christ did exist in the 1st century.
A regular guy who was nothing special? A guy who started the largest and most influential faith, Christianity, in the history of the world? Christianity, the Eastern faith that shaped Western culture?
He didn't create Christianity... Other people did.
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He didn't create Christianity... Other people did.
Like who? Show us the evidence, please!
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1. Torture = fuck you if you dont like it.
2. EIT -= FUCK YOU if you dont like it.
3. Navy SEALS - Speechless at the admiration i have for them.
4. Bin Laden - I wish he would have suffered a lot more.
5. Obama - Good job. Stop the socialist crap domestically and you are good to go.
6. Bush - I hated a lot of shit you did - but good job on this.
7. Pelosi and the far left - fuck you and die. you are are communist traitors and will always be,
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Like who? Show us the evidence, please!
I would say it was the Apostles who went around preaching about him that started it... That's just me.
I can't start a faith in myself... Other people have to believe in me and that starts a faith.
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I would say it was the Apostles who went around preaching about him that started it... That's just me.
I can't start a faith in myself... Other people have to believe in me and that starts a faith.
I see you love to spread CT just like 240. :)
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I see you love to spread CT just like 240. :)
How is that a CT?
That makes no sense... You're saying that Jesus started the belief that he died and was risen in and of himself?
It was Apostles and people saying he did what he did that started the faith.
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How is that a CT?
That makes no sense... You're saying that Jesus started the belief that he died and was risen in and of himself?
It was Apostles and people saying he did what he did that started the faith.
You said earlier that you believe Socrates did exist, even though he wrote nothing, because his one student Plato wrote about him.
But you claim Jesus is a myth, even though his many students wrote about him.
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You said earlier that you believe Socrates did exist, even though he wrote nothing, because his one student Plato wrote about him.
But you claim Jesus is a myth, even though his many students wrote about him.
I said Plato wrote about him while Socrates was still alive... but what's that got to do with who started Christianity?
This is a completely different subject matter than did he even exist or not... Obviously Christianity exists... I'm saying the Apostles and the people who claim they saw what they saw started it as opposed to this Jesus cat himself (if he even existed).
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The only thing Obama did wrong is not bring the body back the NYC for us to piss on.
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I said Plato wrote about him while Socrates was still alive... but what's that got to do with who started Christianity?
This is a completely different subject matter than did he even exist or not... Obviously Christianity exists... I'm saying the Apostles and the people who claim they saw what they saw started it as opposed to this Jesus cat himself (if he even existed).
Are you sure that Plato wrote about Socrates before Socrates' death?
Your double standards are comical. You could apply lot of the stuff you've said about Bin Laden's death, Socrates, etc. to a historical Jesus, but you won't. You are conveniently inconsistent.
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Are you sure that Plato wrote about Socrates before Socrates' death?
Your double standards are comical. You could apply lot of the stuff you've said about Bin Laden's death, Socrates, etc. to a historical Jesus, but you won't. You are conveniently inconsistent.
That's what is stated... I also admitted that Socrates, Aristotle, and Plato could all be Greek myth... Did you miss that?
I also stated that I am believing what the US government is telling me here and now until the proof comes out... which it will and we will have actual proof one way or the other.
I see no inconsistency there... You still haven't responded to my statement about who started Christianity... You flipped back to the Socrates / Jesus existence tip.
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I'm blasting Slayer/Megadeth/anthrax/PE/Beasties/3rd Bass etc in joy of OBL being dead.
Is that wrong?
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That's what is stated... I also admitted that Socrates, Aristotle, and Plato could all be Greek myth... Did you miss that?
I also stated that I am believing what the US government is telling me here and now until the proof comes out... which it will and we will have actual proof one way or the other.
I see no inconsistency there... You still haven't responded to my statement about who started Christianity... You flipped back to the Socrates / Jesus existence tip.
That's what is stated where? By whom?
I didn't flip back to anything. My point is that you don't deny the existence of a historical Socrates because his student Plato wrote about him.
Likewise, Christianity was started by Jesus Christ. He picked his students, he thought them by word and by example. His students wrote about all this, but it all started with Jesus Christ.
You are being inconsistent:
No... I just take things at face value until they are proven otherwise.
The absence of evidence, is not the evidence of absence.
There is also no direct people to have written about Jesus that wrote anything when he was supposedly alive... Everyone wrote everything after he was "dead" already.
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Ok. If you say so.
I will concede that you like arguing a lot more than I do.
So much for this thread.
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I'm blasting Slayer/Megadeth/anthrax/PE/Beasties/3rd Bass etc in joy of OBL being dead.
Is that wrong?
3rd Bass?
Are you giving Bin Laden the 'gas face'?
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3rd Bass?
Are you giving Bin Laden the 'gas face'?
Definately. I love 3rd Bass. Makes Eminmem look like dog shit.
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..Photos show three dead men at bin Laden raid house
By Adrees Latif | Reuters – 1 hour 15 minutes ago
...The grounds of the compound are seen after U.S. Navy SEAL commandos killed al Qaeda …
..Warning: The following images contain graphic content
....ISLAMABAD (Reuters) - Photographs acquired by Reuters and taken about an hour after the U.S. assault on Osama bin Laden's compound in Abbottabad in Pakistan show three dead men lying in pools of blood, but no weapons.
The photos, taken by a Pakistani security official who entered the compound after the early morning raid on Monday, show two men dressed in traditional Pakistani garb and one in a t-shirt, with blood streaming from their ears, noses and mouths.
The official, who wished to remain anonymous, sold the pictures to Reuters.
None of the men looked like bin Laden. President Barack Obama decided not to release photos of his body because it could have incited violence and used as an al Qaeda propaganda tool, the White House said on Wednesday.
Based on the time-stamps on the pictures, the earliest one was dated May 2, 2:30 a.m., approximately an hour after the completion of the raid in which bin Laden was killed.
Other photos, taken hours later at between 5:21 a.m. and 6:43 a.m. show the outside of the trash-strewn compound and the wreckage of the helicopter the United States abandoned. The tail assembly is unusual, and could indicate some kind of previously unknown stealth capability.
Reuters is confident of the authenticity of the purchased images because details in the photos appear to show a wrecked helicopter from the assault, matching details from photos taken independently on Monday.
U.S. forces lost a helicopter in the raid due to a mechanical problem and later destroyed it.
The pictures are also taken in sequence and are all the same size in pixels, indicating they have not been tampered with. The time and date in the photos as recorded in the digital file's metadata match lighting conditions for the area as well as the time and date imprinted on the image itself.
The close-cropped pictures do not show any weapons on the dead men, but the photos are taken in medium close-up and often crop out the men's hands and arms.
One photo shows a computer cable and what looks like a child's plastic green and orange water pistol lying under the right shoulder of one of the dead men. A large pool of blood has formed under his head.
A second shows another man with a streak of blood running from his nose across his right cheek and a large band of blood across his chest.
A third man, in a T-shirt, is on his back in a large pool of blood which appears to be from a head wound.
U.S. acknowledgment on Tuesday that bin Laden was unarmed when shot dead had raised accusations Washington had violated international law. The exact circumstances of his death remained unclear and could yet fuel controversy, especially in the Muslim world.
Pakistan faced national embarrassment, a leading Islamabad newspaper said, in explaining how the world's most-wanted man was able to live for years in the military garrison town of Abbottabad, just north of the capital.
Pakistan blamed worldwide intelligence lapses for a failure to detect bin Laden, while Washington worked to establish whether its ally had sheltered the al Qaeda leader, which Islamabad vehemently denies.
(Writing by Chris Allbritton; Editing by Jon Boyle)
..
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Sen. Scott Brown on Osama bin Laden; attack ads
FOX 25 Morning News
Updated: Wednesday, 04 May 2011, 3:43 PM EDT
Published : Wednesday, 04 May 2011, 10:20 AM EDT
Gene
Lavanchy
(FOX 25 / MyFoxBoston.com) - UPDATE: Scott Brown tells FOX25 - "The photo that I saw and that a lot of other people saw is not authentic."
----------------------------------------------------
U.S. Sen. Scott Brown is heading to Afghanistan for his annual training as a member of the Massachusetts Army National Guard.
Brown, who serves as a lieutenant colonel, says he requested to conduct his training overseas in keeping with the tradition of other lawmakers.
Meanwhile, the senator is also under attack from the league of women voters.
Senator Brown recently joined the FOX 25 Morning News from Washington D.C. to talk about this latest news and more, including Osama bin Laden.
Read more: http://www.myfoxboston.com/dpp/morning/sen-scott-brown-on-attack-ad-bin-laden-20110504#ixzz1LQHgiA6s
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NBC's 'Today' Frets Celebrations After bin Laden's Death Were 'Very Disturbing' to Children
newsbusters.org ^ | May 04, 2011 | 17:32 | Kyle Drennen
On NBC's Today on Wednesday, co-host Matt Lauer worried about Americans celebrating the death of Osama bin Laden: "...your children are going to see, and have already seen, people in the streets celebrating about the death of someone and that's a contradictory image for them." Today contributor and psychiatrist Gail Saltz replied: "Absolutely, very disturbing for them."
(Excerpt) Read more at newsbusters.org ...
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NBC's 'Today' Frets Celebrations After bin Laden's Death Were 'Very Disturbing' to Children
newsbusters.org ^ | May 04, 2011 | 17:32 | Kyle Drennen
On NBC's Today on Wednesday, co-host Matt Lauer worried about Americans celebrating the death of Osama bin Laden: "...your children are going to see, and have already seen, people in the streets celebrating about the death of someone and that's a contradictory image for them." Today contributor and psychiatrist Gail Saltz replied: "Absolutely, very disturbing for them."
(Excerpt) Read more at newsbusters.org ...
Fuck him too. No wonder people watch Fox News.
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Staging of Obama photo taken after TV announcement of bin Laden's death.
REUTERS vis Drudge Report ^ | 5/4/2011 | Al Tompkins
“As President Obama continued his nine-minute address in front of just one main network camera, the photographers were held outside the room by staff and asked to remain completely silent. Once Obama was off the air, we were escorted in front of that teleprompter and the President then re-enacted the walk-out and first 30 seconds of the statement for us.”
(Excerpt) Read more at poynter.org ...
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Osama bin Laden dead: Blackout during raid on bin Laden compound
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/al-qaeda/8493391/Osama-bin-Laden-dead-Blackout-during-raid-on-bin-Laden-compound.html
The head of the CIA admitted yesterday that there was no live video footage of the raid on Osama bin Laden's compound as further doubts emerged about the US version of events.
CIA Director Leon Panetta speaks as Army General David Petraeus and Marine General John Allen listen Photo: GETTY IMAGESBy Steven Swinford 10:25PM BST 04 May 2011
Leon Panetta, director of the CIA, revealed there was a 25 minute blackout during which the live feed from cameras mounted on the helmets of the US special forces was cut off.
A photograph released by the White House appeared to show the President and his aides in the situation room watching the action as it unfolded. In fact they had little knowledge of what was happening in the compound.
Mr Panetta said: "Once those teams went into the compound I can tell you that there was a time period of almost 20 or 25 minutes where we really didn't know just exactly what was going on. And there were some very tense moments as we were waiting for information.
"We had some observation of the approach there, but we did not have direct flow of information as to the actual conduct of the operation itself as they were going through the compound."
Mr Panetta also revealed that the US Navy Seals made the final decision to kill bin Laden rather than the president.
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He said: "The authority here was to kill bin Laden. And obviously, under the rules of engagement, if he had in fact thrown up his hands, surrendered and didn't appear to be representing any kind of threat, then they were to capture him. But they had full authority to kill him.
"To be frank, I don't think he had a lot of time to say anything. It was a firefight going up that compound. And by the time they got to the third floor and found bin Laden, I think it - this was all split-second action on the part of the Seals."
The President only knew the mission was successful after the Navy Seals commander heard the word “Geronimo” on the radio, a code word from commandos reporting that they had killed bin Laden.
The absence of footage of the raid has led to conflicting reports about what happened in the compound. According to Pakistani authorities one of bin Laden’s daughter’s, who was present during the raid, claimed that her father was captured alive before he was killed.
There was also growing doubt about the US claims that Pakistan’s intelligence agencies involved in the raid.
Lieutenant General Asad Durrani, former head of the ISI, Pakistan's intelligence service, said it was "inconceivable" that his government was unaware of the US raid on Osama bin Laden's compound.
He claimed his country was forced to deny any knowledge of the raid to avoid a domestic backlash. The ISI's official line has been that bin Laden's compound had "slipped off our radar" after it raided the building in 2003 while hunting for another senior al-Qaeda operative.The agency claims it was unaware that bin Laden was hiding there.
Lieutenant General Durrani, however, said that the denial was a "political" maneuver by the intelligence services to avoid claims that they were working too closely with the US.
He said: "It is more likely that they did know [about the raid]. It is not conceivable that it was done without the involvement of Pakistani security forces at some stage. They were involved and they were told they were in position.
"The army chief was in his office, the cordons had been thrown around that particular place. The Pakistani helicopters were also in the air so that indicates that it was involved.
"[There are] political implications back home. If you say that you are involved there is a large, vocal faction of Pakistani society that will get very upset because we are carrying out repeatedly these operations with the Americans."
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If they were watching this thing on a live feed - how the hell is thing so muddled?
Because you know perfectly well that initial reports are rarely completely accurate. CT'rs are too retarded to differentiate.
And do we even know what kind of a live feed yet? Was it a cam on one of the Seals? An overhead view, etc. I doubt they saw everything going down with perfect clarity.
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I'm sure one is incorrect, but that certainly doesn't make some shit you pulled out of your ass correct.
BOOM!! Exactly.
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If they were watching this thing on a live feed - how the hell is thing so muddled?
From what I've read the live feed was a drone flying overhead so they saw nothing that went down inside the compound. Although you would think that they'd have cameras strapped on at least one of the SEALs. Who knows.
Either way, 240's full of shit.
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Are you sure that Plato wrote about Socrates before Socrates' death?
Your double standards are comical. You could apply lot of the stuff you've said about Bin Laden's death, Socrates, etc. to a historical Jesus, but you won't. You are conveniently inconsistent.
We don't know if Socrates ever existed, nor do we know that about Jesus but in the case of Socrates he is just a metaphor; in antiquity many Christians saw Jesus as a metaphor as well but over the centuries that has changed.
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From what I've read the live feed was a drone flying overhead so they saw nothing that went down inside the compound. Although you would think that they'd have cameras strapped on at least one of the SEALs. Who knows.
Either way, 240's full of shit.
Exactly... They will eventually get everything clear, but 240 is making up so god damn much shit it's fucking ridiculous.
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Either way, 240's full of shit.
But, but, but,
He Knows!!
He Knows they weren't using modified silent copters.
He Knows they weren't using silencers and making a loud racket.
He Knows Osama had tons of time.
He Knows the Seal hit him with a precision shot.
He Knows the room was crowded.
He Knows the picture quality and clarity of what the WH was watching
Amazing how much He Knows from sitting down in his trailer in Florida surfing the internet and watching MSNBC.
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But, but, but,
He Knows!!
He Knows they weren't using modified silent copters.
He Knows they weren't using silencers and making a loud racket.
He Knows Osama had tons of time.
He Knows the Seal hit him with a precision shot.
He Knows the room was crowded.
He Knows the picture quality and clarity of what the WH was watching
Amazing how much He Knows from sitting down in his trailer in Florida surfing the internet and watching MSNBC.
Good One!!! :D
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But, but, but,
He Knows!!
He Knows they weren't using modified silent copters.
He Knows they weren't using silencers and making a loud racket.
He Knows Osama had tons of time.
He Knows the Seal hit him with a precision shot.
He Knows the room was crowded.
He Knows the picture quality and clarity of what the WH was watching
Amazing how much He Knows from sitting down in his trailer in Florida surfing the internet and watching MSNBC.
Actually, if you look at the rear rotar of the chopper they destroyed... Check out the rotar and the air cover on it.
It "appeared' silenced.
Either way, it sure as hell wasn't an apache.
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Hopefully when they got to him, he was able to at least see the United States Flag on the arm of the soldiers before he was taken out.
hahahahahah
you should right a few scripts buddy. That was classic Rambo material.
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Actually, if you look at the rear rotar of the chopper they destroyed... Check out the rotar and the air cover on it.
It "appeared' silenced.
Either way, it sure as hell wasn't an apache.
JSOC has their own budget. I'm guessing you're right about the chopper. Probably something none of us know about.
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Leon Panetta, director of the CIA, revealed there was a 25 minute blackout during which the live feed from cameras mounted on the helmets of the US special forces was cut off.
Does anyone know if this is standard practice?
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Leon Panetta, director of the CIA, revealed there was a 25 minute blackout during which the live feed from cameras mounted on the helmets of the US special forces was cut off.
Does anyone know if this is standard practice?
Makes sense. Why give the lunatic left a reason to go after these SEALs in a court of law? We've already seen those assholes try that once for just punching a fucking mass-murdering terrorist in Iraq.
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Makes sense. Why give the lunatic left a reason to go after these SEALs in a court of law? We've already seen those assholes try that once for just punching a fucking mass-murdering terrorist in Iraq.
So video was used in this type of situation before? Sorry, I'm not familiar with the situation you're mentioning above.
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So video was used in this type of situation before? Sorry, I'm not familiar with the situation you're mentioning above.
Not video but the incident a year or two ago involving the terrorist (forget his name) that was responsible for orchestrating the ambush of those Blackwater guys that were killed, burned and then dragged through the streets before being hung from that bridge in Iraq, and who was also responsible for countless other attacks in Iraq. When the SEALs caught him they apparently roughed him up a bit and he cried about it. Well, I believe Holder decided to have two of the SEALs from the team that caught him brought up on assault charges. The judge thankfully threw it out but it would explain why they would have their cameras "cut out".
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Obama: "Osama bin Laden is not a trophy," Will NOT Release Photos
Pundit Press ^ | 5/4/11 | Aurelius
Posted on May 4, 2011 1:48:59 PM EDT by therightliveswithus
It is now being reported that President Obama has decided not to release the death photos of terrorist master mind Osama bin Laden.
The news was broken by CBS in a Tweet:
They also linked to an article of theirs, written just minutes before, explaining that the President would not release the photos. They quoted the President as saying:
"The risks of release outweigh the benefits. Conspiracy theorists around the world will just claim the photos are doctored anyway, and there is a real risk that releasing the photos will only serve to inflame public opinion in the Middle East. Imagine how the American people would react if Al Qaida killed one of our troops or military leaders, and put photos of the body on the internet. Osama bin Laden is not a trophy - he is dead and let's now focus on continuing the fight until Al Qaida has been eliminated."
This is surprising news, considering that yesterday out-going CIA director Leon Panetta stated that he thought the pictures would be released.
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Not video but the incident a year or two ago involving the terrorist (forget his name) that was responsible for orchestrating the ambush of those Blackwater guys that were killed, burned and then dragged through the streets before being hung from that bridge in Iraq, and who was also responsible for countless other attacks in Iraq. When the SEALs caught him they apparently roughed him up a bit and he cried about it. Well, I believe Holder decided to have two of the SEALs from the team that caught him brought up on assault charges. The judge thankfully threw it out but it would explain why they would have their cameras "cut out".
Got it.
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China was in on Osama's whereabouts.
Discuss.
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Something not sitting well w me on this. I can't explain it exactly.
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China was in on Osama's whereabouts.
Discuss.
Batchelor has a great show tonight.
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China was in on Osama's whereabouts.
Discuss.
why do u say that?...it would be interesting if true
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why do u say that?...it would be interesting if true
The further Pakistani and American relations drift, the better China and Pakistani relations strengthen. they both share major strategic interests and Pakistan takes in a lot of military aid from China. Maybe George was referrring to something else though.
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Looks like the guys around Osama were in fact armed. if you look closely at the guys shoulder, you can see a military style water pistol.
(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-Qf_5_HFSczM/TcG_DajvgjI/AAAAAAAA27I/ibhAuiV0Uyo/s320/Dead+Man+Bin+Laden+Compound.jpg)
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Looks like the guys around Osama were in fact armed. if you look closely at the guys shoulder, you can see a military style water pistol.
(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-Qf_5_HFSczM/TcG_DajvgjI/AAAAAAAA27I/ibhAuiV0Uyo/s320/Dead+Man+Bin+Laden+Compound.jpg)
One photo shows a computer cable and what looks like a child's plastic green and orange water pistol lying under the right shoulder of one of the dead men. A large pool of blood has formed under his head.
U.S. acknowledgment on Tuesday that bin Laden was unarmed when shot dead had raised accusations Washington had violated international law. The exact circumstances of his death remained unclear and could yet fuel controversy, especially in the Muslim world.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/us_binladen_pakistan_photos
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'If he's not naked, shoot him': Navy Seals warned Al Qaeda chief could be wearing suicide vest...
Daily Mail ^ | May 5, 2011
Being naked was the only way Osama Bin Laden could have avoided being killed, it emerged today.
The elite U.S. Navy Seals team that killed him was told to assume he was wearing a suicide vest if he was clothed, according to a briefing given to a congressional aide.
The aide - briefed on the rules of engagement - revealed that Bin Laden 'would have had to be naked for them to allow him to surrender'.
The terror mastermind was wearing his nightclothes - believed to be pyjamas - when the commandos stormed his compound in Abbottabad.
(Excerpt) Read more at dailymail.co.uk ...
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'If he's not naked, shoot him': Navy Seals warned Al Qaeda chief could be wearing suicide vest...
Daily Mail ^ | May 5, 2011
Being naked was the only way Osama Bin Laden could have avoided being killed, it emerged today.
The elite U.S. Navy Seals team that killed him was told to assume he was wearing a suicide vest if he was clothed, according to a briefing given to a congressional aide.
The aide - briefed on the rules of engagement - revealed that Bin Laden 'would have had to be naked for them to allow him to surrender'.
The terror mastermind was wearing his nightclothes - believed to be pyjamas - when the commandos stormed his compound in Abbottabad.
(Excerpt) Read more at dailymail.co.uk ...
Muslims never get naked..They have sex with turbins and shit on.. ;D
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White House Insider: Obama Hesitated – Panetta Issued Order to Kill Osama Bin Laden
by Ulsterman in Issues, May 3, 2011
"What Valerie Jarrett, and the president, did not know is that Leon Panetta had already initiated a program that reported to him –and only him, involving a covert on the ground attack against the compound."
At the conclusion of the mission, after it had been repeatedly confirmed a success, President Obama was once again briefed behind closed doors. The only ones who went in that room besides the president were Bill Daley. John Brennan, and a third individual whose identity remains unknown to me. When leaving this briefing, the president came out of it “…much more confident. Much more certain of himself.” He was also carrying papers in his hand that quite possibly was the address to the nation given later that evening on the Bin Laden mission. The president did not have those papers with him prior to that briefing. The president then returned to the war room, where by this time, Leon Panetta had personally arrived and was receiving congratulations from all who were present.
In my initial communication to you of these events I described what unfolded as a temporary Coup initiated by high ranking intelligence and military officials. I stand by that term. These figures worked around the uncertainty of President Obama and the repeated resistance of Valerie Jarrett. If they had not been willing to do so, I am certain Osama Bin Laden would still be alive today. There will be no punishment to those who acted outside the authority of the president’s office. The president cannot afford to admit such a fact. What will be most interesting from here is to now see what becomes of Valerie Jarrett. One source indicated she is threatening resignation. I find that unlikely given my strong belief she needs the protection afforded her by the Oval Office and its immense powers to delay and eventually terminate investigations back in Chicago, but we shall see.
Read more in Issues
« Good Riddance to Osama Bin LadenPresident Obama Shouldn’t be Trusted: Osama Bin Laden Might Resurrect »
Stay safe.
__________
The very first Insider Report Found Here:
White House Insider On Obama: President Losing It
http://newsflavor.com/opinions/white-house-insider-on-obama-president-losing-it/
Read more: http://socyberty.com/issues/white-house-insider-obama-hesitated-panetta-issued-order-to-kill-osama-bin-laden/#ixzz1LUBfuVGq
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US troops took away ‘Osama’s son’By Owen Bennett Jones | From the Newspaper
Yesterday
ISLAMABAD, May 3:
http://www.dawn.com/2011/05/04/us-troops-took-away-osamas-son.html
Osama bin Laden’s teenage daughter witnessed her father’s death in the compound in Abbottabad according to an ISI official. The girl is now in Pakistani custody together with Bin Laden’s wife. The wife, who speaks only Arabic and who was injured in the attack, said on regaining consciousness that she was Yemeni and that she had been in the compound for a few months.
The official said there were 17 or 18 people in the compound at the time of the attack and that as well as taking Osama bin Laden’s body away the Americans took one person alive — possibly one of his sons.
Four dead bodies were left in the compound. It is believed they are of another son, 2 brothers and a guard.
Those who survived the attack included the wife, the daughter and 8 to 9 other children — not apparently Bin Laden’s but possibly those of his brothers. All those being held in Pakistan will be returned to their countries of origin.
When the Pakistan authorities found the surviving women and children in the compound their hands were bound with plastic tags and it is believed that had one of the American helicopters not malfunctioned then they too would have been taken away.
There were four helicopters involved in the attack: two remained in the air and two landed. The Pakistani authorities recovered some documents from the compound apparently missed by the Americans.
Local officials in Abbottabad said that the ownership of the compound remains unclear as the relevant documentation is in the name of someone with a false identity.
The ISI said that they had no advance warning of the American operation. Between 25 and 40 American personnel were involved in the raid on the compound.
It is believed the American helicopters, possibly fitted with stealth technology, were in the air for about 30 minutes as they moved from Jalalabad to Abbottabad. They were on the ground for 40 minutes before making the return journey.
Asked why they had not checked out a building so close a major military facility the ISI said that the compound had actually been raided when the house was under construction in 2003 when the authorities believed an Al Qaeda operative Abu Faraj Al Libbi was there. On that occasion he escaped.
But since then the house had not been on their radar. However, a satellite image of the site of the compound taken in 2004 shows no sign of any construction work.
ISI officials have accepted that their failure to know Bin Laden was living in Abbottabad was embarrassing but argue that that should be placed against the fact that on many occasions they have identified the locations of senior Al Qaeda operatives and arrested them.
It is not known if anybody had yet claimed the $25 million dollar reward money that the Americans said was on offer for information leading them to Bin Laden
The writer is a BBC correspondent
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Something not sitting well w me on this. I can't explain it exactly.
I think i could take a stab at it
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New at Starbucks- The Bin Latte. Dark body, frothy head....two shots
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New at Starbucks- The Bin Latte. Dark body, frothy head....two shots
Racist post reported! :)
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Source: Only 1 killed in bin Laden raid was armed
WASHINGTON – Only one of the five people killed in the raid that got Osama bin Laden was armed and fired a shot, a senior defense official said Thursday, acknowledging the new account differs greatly from original administration portrayals of a chaotic, intense and prolonged firefight.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_bin_laden
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Racist post reported! :)
:o :o :o :o
;D
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I think i could take a stab at it
You "people" are so violent. ;D
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New at Starbucks- The Bin Latte. Dark body, frothy head....two shots
very nice ;)
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China and Pakistan have very close ties-- especially through Pakistan's ISI. Strategically, India is in competition with China and Pakistan is India's sworn enemy. Also bare in mind that both Pakistan and China hate America. While none of that information by itself is evidence that China knew where Bin Laden was, you also have to consider that China was at least tacitly aware of the Mumbai massacre before it happened, China came out strongly denouncing Obama's decision to take Bin Laden out because it violted Pakistani sovereignty etc. and there are reports that rubble from the American chopper that went down during the Bin Laden operation was taken by the Pakistani military and sent to China for analysis.
There is a lot of circumstantial evidence that China was aware of Bin Ladens whereabouts.
One thing that experts have noted is that Bin Laden never mentioned the Uighur Muslim minority population in China even though he referenced practically every other Islamic population in conflict with non-Islamist regimes.
No smoking gun as of yet, but definitely some food for thought.
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Photojournalists describe staging of Obama photo taken after TV announcement of bin Laden’s death
Poynter ^ | May 4, 2011 | Al Tompkins
________________________ ________________________ __
Reuters White House photographer Jason Reed describes how the president made his speech to a single TV camera, then immediately after finishing, he pretended to speak for the still cameras.
Reed writes: “As President Obama continued his nine-minute address in front of just one main network camera, the photographers were held outside the room by staff and asked to remain completely silent. Once Obama was off the air, we were escorted in front of that teleprompter and the President then re-enacted the walk-out and first 30 seconds of the statement for us.”
That means the photograph that appeared in many newspapers Monday morning of Obama speaking may have been the staged shot, captured after the president spoke. This type of staging has been going on for decades.
This is the cutline transmitted with this AP photo: “President Barack Obama reads his statement to photographers after making a televised statement on the death of Osama bin Laden from the East Room of the White House in Washington, Sunday, May 1, 2011. (AP Photo/Pablo Martinez Monsivais)”
John Harrington, president of the White House News Photographers Association, tells me that the Obama Administration has used this technique before and they are not the first.
“I am aware of it happening in previous administrations. I believe Bush 41 [George H.W. Bush] did it too,” Harrington says. “The times where I have known of it happening before is when the president is in the Oval Office and you are working in a very tight space.” Other photographers who work at the White House told Poynter.org that since the Reagan era (and possibly before) it has been the standard operating procedure that during a live presidential address, still cameras are not allowed to photograph the actual event. “AP understands why the still photographers are not allowed into the live address area and the captions disclose that these are re-enactment situations as well,” says David Ake, the Associated Press’ assistant bureau chief for photos in Washington.
Because of the noise from the camera shutters and the placement of the teleprompter, “we are not able to photograph those events.”
Senior AP Staff Photographer Pablo Martinez Monsivais was called in from vacation on Sunday to cover the White House announcement.
The AP’s Pablo Martinez Monsivais, who took this photo, told Poynter, “What was very unique this time was that the White House actually allowed the still press photography pool to photograph the president’s ‘walk in’ so that images could be distributed prior to the late, 11:45 p.m. address.”
“There is nothing that we do as photojournalists that is unethical” about this, he says. “We fully disclose in our captions that this is a re-enactment, after the live announcement. We put that in.”
“The statement for the photographers took place two to three minutes after the live speech and it happened very quickly — extremely fast — with each photographer rotating into the center position.”
Doug Mills, New York Times photojournalist and former Associated Press staffer, says it has been done this way “always, always … well, as long as I have covered the White House, going back to the Reagan administration. We [still photographers] have never, never, never, ever been allowed to cover a live presidential address to the nation!”
Poynter’s Senior Faculty for Visual Journalism, Kenny Irby, explains, “The most obvious concern is noise. The 35mm cameras emit shutter noise, that would be multiplied by several photographers and increased by the echo which resonates off of the marble floors. The other visual distraction is the placement of the teleprompter that impedes the photographers’ line of sight to the president.”
Harrington says there are alternatives to staging the photographs.
As video images are increasingly detailed, it is easier to use screen captures that meet still photograph standards. He also points to devices like the “Jacobson blimp,” which he demonstrates in a YouTube video. The blimp is a hard case with a cut-out for the camera and a remote control that allows a photographer to capture images while the case mutes the sound of the camera. Harrington says other photographers have customized still cameras to make them quieter. In fact, a camera was customized to take an unusual photo of Obama during his inauguration.
But this practice of re-enacting a historic speech flies directly in the face of the National Press Photographers Association Code of Ethics, which includes this relevant passage: “Resist being manipulated by staged photo opportunities.”
Harrington says, “I know we are splitting hairs here, but the White House photographers covering those re-enactments did not stage, request or direct them. They are covering an event. They photograph what they are presented with.”
Harrington says the re-enactment is an alternative to just handing out a White House photo. “Obviously you should refer to it as a re-enactment in the cutline of the photo; it does need to be disclosed.” Both Reuters and the AP did disclose the re-enactment in the cutlines they transmitted with photos. For example, the AP cutline reads:
However, not all newspapers reprinted those disclosures. Some newspapers disclose Poynter’s Library Director David Shedden searched 50 newspaper front pages from Monday morning to see if papers that used the staged image disclosed it. Keep in mind, newsrooms were scrambling to create new front pages late Sunday evening.
This cutline was transmitted with this Reuters photo: “U.S. President Barack Obama is pictured after announcing live on television the death of Osama bin Laden, from the East Room of the White House in Washington May 1, 2011. Al Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden was killed on Sunday in a firefight with U.S. forces in Pakistan and his body was recovered, President Obama announced on Sunday.” (Jason Reed/Reuters) Some newspapers that we viewed used both the AP photo and its cutline, which disclosed the image’s origins. The Wausau Daily Herald, Wisconsin State Journal, Biloxi Sun Herald, Lodi News-Sentinel, Yuma Sun, The Sarasota Herald-Tribune, The Detroit Free Press, The Wichita Eagle and The Orange County Register used the AP photo and its cutline (or a variation). The Orlando Sentinel page simply states, “President Barack Obama is shown after his announcement about Osama bin Laden Sunday.” The San Jose Mercury News had a similar caption with a Getty image. Thirty other front pages we reviewed used an AP, Reuters or Getty photo, credited appropriately, with a caption that implied or strongly suggested it was an image of the live address.
The remaining nine front pages don’t say where the photos came from; although several look like the re-enactments, they could be screen captures from the live address.
What should happen next
It is time for this kind of re-enactment to end. The White House should value truth and authenticity. The technology clearly exists to document important moments without interrupting them. Photojournalists and their employers should insist on and press for access to document these historic moments.
In the meantime, anyone who uses these recreations should clearly disclose to the reader the circumstances under which they were captured.
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Five Mistakes the Obama Administration Has Made in the Aftermath of Bin Laden Killing
Play Video Barack Obama Video:AP Top Stories AP .
By MARK HALPERIN Mark Halperin – Wed May 4, 12:15 pm ET
www.yahoo.com
Aftermath can be heck.
The White House's brilliant conceptualization and execution of the plan to bring Osama bin Laden to justice has, in the last 48 hours, been complicated by mistakes.
No one can question the heroism of the US military, the doggedness of the intelligence community, or the cajones of the President in making the call. But the administration has since made real errors, some with political costs, some with substantive costs, and some with both. (See pictures of Osama bin Laden's Pakistan hideaway.)
The major errors so far:
1. Not getting its story straight: Was bin Laden armed or not? What woman served as a human shield? Who actually was killed beyond the main target? The administration deserves mountains of credit for its painstaking, conspicuous effort to brief the world on the mission, knowing a lot of information would have to be held back to protect sources, operatives, methods, and sensitive data. Which makes the carelessness of the errors somewhat surprising. The costs: the media coverage sours, the President's opponents (especially on talk radio) go crazy, other details of the mission unfairly get called into question, and the wild theories of global enemies and conspiracy seekers get a foothold.
2. Not giving George W. Bush enough credit for helping bring bin Laden to justice: Even if the White House believes the previous occupant had nothing to do with OBL's ultimate demise, it would have been better for national unity and Obama's own political fortunes if he had gone out of his way to thank 43. His invitation to Bush to join the event Thursday at Ground Zero (an offer declined) was the right idea, but belated. (Watch "President Obama on the Death of bin Laden.")
3. Letting the photo debate get out of control: The decision about whether to release images of a dead bin Laden is not an easy one. But the administration's conflicting statements and public agonizing has created an extended distraction. The White House has stumbled by violating one of Washington's iron rules: when something becomes famous inside the Beltway for not being released, the pressure from the media to release it becomes unrelenting.
4. Letting the debate about the war in Afghanistan get out of control: There are signs that some of the president's advisers are looking to scale back the commitment in Afghanistan sooner rather than later. But by failing to go on the offensive in defining and defending whatever policy the President wants to pursue, the White House has allowed those pressing for an end of the war to use bin Laden's death as rhetorical leverage. (See pictures of Osama bin Laden's life of terror.)
5. Letting the debate about Pakistan get out of control: The congressional and media demand for a radical change in America's relationship with Pakistan is burning like wildfire. The administration knows that a shift in policy is complicated and compromising, and not necessarily in the United States' interest. Stoking the problem: executive branch officials, publicly and privately, are expressing incredulity that the Pakistanis were unaware bin Laden was hiding in plain sight in their country. There should be and will be a debate about all this, but the administration's actions and inactions is making it less likely it will be on their terms.
See the top 10 defining moments of the post-9/11 era.
See TIME's complete coverage of Osama bin Laden's death.
View this article on Time.com
Most Popular on Time.com:
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333386, will you please start posting links with your articles? I'd appreciate it! :)
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Five Mistakes the Obama Administration Has Made in the Aftermath of Bin Laden Killing
Play Video Barack Obama Video:AP Top Stories AP .
By MARK HALPERIN Mark Halperin – Wed May 4, 12:15 pm ET
www.yahoo.com
Aftermath can be heck.
The White House's brilliant conceptualization and execution of the plan to bring Osama bin Laden to justice has, in the last 48 hours, been complicated by mistakes.
No one can question the heroism of the US military, the doggedness of the intelligence community, or the cajones of the President in making the call. But the administration has since made real errors, some with political costs, some with substantive costs, and some with both. (See pictures of Osama bin Laden's Pakistan hideaway.)
The major errors so far:
1. Not getting its story straight: Was bin Laden armed or not? What woman served as a human shield? Who actually was killed beyond the main target? The administration deserves mountains of credit for its painstaking, conspicuous effort to brief the world on the mission, knowing a lot of information would have to be held back to protect sources, operatives, methods, and sensitive data. Which makes the carelessness of the errors somewhat surprising. The costs: the media coverage sours, the President's opponents (especially on talk radio) go crazy, other details of the mission unfairly get called into question, and the wild theories of global enemies and conspiracy seekers get a foothold.
2. Not giving George W. Bush enough credit for helping bring bin Laden to justice: Even if the White House believes the previous occupant had nothing to do with OBL's ultimate demise, it would have been better for national unity and Obama's own political fortunes if he had gone out of his way to thank 43. His invitation to Bush to join the event Thursday at Ground Zero (an offer declined) was the right idea, but belated. (Watch "President Obama on the Death of bin Laden.")
3. Letting the photo debate get out of control: The decision about whether to release images of a dead bin Laden is not an easy one. But the administration's conflicting statements and public agonizing has created an extended distraction. The White House has stumbled by violating one of Washington's iron rules: when something becomes famous inside the Beltway for not being released, the pressure from the media to release it becomes unrelenting.
4. Letting the debate about the war in Afghanistan get out of control: There are signs that some of the president's advisers are looking to scale back the commitment in Afghanistan sooner rather than later. But by failing to go on the offensive in defining and defending whatever policy the President wants to pursue, the White House has allowed those pressing for an end of the war to use bin Laden's death as rhetorical leverage. (See pictures of Osama bin Laden's life of terror.)
5. Letting the debate about Pakistan get out of control: The congressional and media demand for a radical change in America's relationship with Pakistan is burning like wildfire. The administration knows that a shift in policy is complicated and compromising, and not necessarily in the United States' interest. Stoking the problem: executive branch officials, publicly and privately, are expressing incredulity that the Pakistanis were unaware bin Laden was hiding in plain sight in their country. There should be and will be a debate about all this, but the administration's actions and inactions is making it less likely it will be on their terms.
See the top 10 defining moments of the post-9/11 era.
See TIME's complete coverage of Osama bin Laden's death.
View this article on Time.com
Most Popular on Time.com:
That was fast
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333386, will you please start posting links with your articles? I'd appreciate it! :)
Ok. that last one was from Time
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In other news, I'm gonna chow down Mexican food tonight, because I have a heart and want to celebrate cinco de mayo.
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In other news, I'm gonna chow down Mexican food tonight, because I have a heart and want to celebrate cinco de mayo.
There are two things in this world I hate:
1. Racist people
2. Mexicans...
...I kid I kid! ;D
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:o :o :o :o :o :o :o
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Ok. that last one was from Time
Hey, Obama's at ground zero. You going to see him?
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Hey, Obama's at ground zero. You going to see him?
Hell no. He is proably heading to a myriad of fundraisers after that and scarfing down beers, dogs, burgers, etc
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Hell no. He is proably heading to a myriad of fundraisers after that and scarfing down beers, dogs, burgers, etc
mmmmmmm burgers at jackson hole on 64th street.
Hell no. He is proably heading to a myriad of fundraisers after that and scarfing down beers, dogs, burgers, etc
I almost did on a bike run, but decided not to
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sun-sentinel.com/news/nationworld/wpix-family-unhappy-about-obama-visit,0,4037272.story
South Florida Sun-Sentinel.com
9/11 Family Invited To Presidential Ground Zero Visit Snubs Obama
By MONICA MORALES
pix11.com
11:51 AM EDT, May 5, 2011
NEW YORK (PIX11)
Advertisement
As 50 carefully selected families prepare to join President Barack Obama for a ceremony at the World Trade Center site Thursday, one of the invited 9/11 families have decided to pass on the Commander-in-chief's visit.
Although many consider it to be a once in a lifetime invitation, the Vigiano family of Deer Park, Long Island have respectfully declined.
"If this form letter was the invitation, it was kinda lame," John Vigiano told PIX 11 News when describing the email invitation sent to him from the White House.
Jan and John Vigiano received the email invite Tuesday and admitted that they nearly deleted it, thinking it was spam. The private invitation complete with the White House seal informed the couple about President Obama's visit to the World Trade Center site just days after news broke about Osama bin Laden's death.
What rubbed the Vigiano's the wrong way was not what the email said, but how it was addressed.
"It says 'Dear 9-11 family member,' - no names" " John Vigiano said, reading the invite aloud to PIX 11 cameras. "I don't know if its disrespectful, but it doesn't work for me."
The Vigianos lost both their sons on September 11, 2001. John Vigiano Jr. was 36, and a FDNY firefighter, while their youngest Joe Vigiano was an emergency services detective with the NYPD.
"There is no closure," a sobbing John Vigiano said. "There is none."
The Vigiano family is just one of fifty families sent the exclusive invitation to meet the President at what is being billed as a historic visit to Ground Zero Thursday. With all that considered, the mourning father says he's not going.
"I'm honored the President of the United States is coming to New York," he said. "[But] to me its just going to be a photo op."
Jeannie Evans, of Elmont, who lost her baby brother firefighter Robert Evans on 9/11 will also not be there Thursday. She wasn't invited.
"I guess I feel lucky and leftout," Evans said as she held a picture of her brother. "Its always a select few. Is it fair? No. We all have voices."
Evans says she will probably watch Obama's visit on television but wishes she could ask him a few questions.
"Why not show us proof, that Bin Laden was killed? I would like to see that," wondered Evans.
Meanwhile, the Vigiano family insisted they mean no disrespect toward the President as John is a former marine and a retired Brooklyn firefighter.
"I got a call from the White House today apologizing," he revealed. "Apology accepted of course. He is the President of the United States after all."
In an email to Monica Morales, the White House said, "In consultation with the National 9/11 Memorial staff, we personally invited a group of 9/11 family members who we believe represents a cross section of family members from various 9/11 organizations. If that personal touch did not come across, it was only as a result of technological and time constrictions in pulling together such an important discussion on such short notice. The president looks forward to spending time visiting with the families of those who were tragically killed on 9/11."
Copyright © 2011, WPIX-TV, New York
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Hey, Obama's at ground zero. You going to see him?
Who feels like having there rectum checked for TNT by the DHS? Not me
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Michael Moore: Bin Laden wasn't killed, he was executed
MSN.com ^ | 4 May 11 | Brent Lang
Osama bin Laden wasn't killed by a Navy SEAL team, he was straight up executed, Michael Moore told TheWrap on Wednesday.
The "Fahrenheit 9/11" director has been setting Twitter aflame Wednesday afternoon urging the Obama administration to come clean about the circumstances surrounding the terrorist leader's death -- particularly in light of the White House's shifting account of last weekend's firefight in Abbottabad.
The Oscar-winning director has been tweeting about his belief that Bin Laden should have received a trial, and his theory that Pakistan was keeping the Al Qaeda head under house arrest.
(Excerpt) Read more at movies.msn.com ...
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Michael Moore: Bin Laden wasn't killed, he was executed
MSN.com ^ | 4 May 11 | Brent Lang
Osama bin Laden wasn't killed by a Navy SEAL team, he was straight up executed, Michael Moore told TheWrap on Wednesday.
The "Fahrenheit 9/11" director has been setting Twitter aflame Wednesday afternoon urging the Obama administration to come clean about the circumstances surrounding the terrorist leader's death -- particularly in light of the White House's shifting account of last weekend's firefight in Abbottabad.
The Oscar-winning director has been tweeting about his belief that Bin Laden should have received a trial, and his theory that Pakistan was keeping the Al Qaeda head under house arrest.
(Excerpt) Read more at movies.msn.com ...
Wow Micheal Moore has something to say about this, color me surprised.
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Dershowitz: Release OBL Photos or Face Lawsuit
NRO ^ | 05/05/2011 | Andrew Stiles
Posted on Thursday, May 05, 2011 3:02:06 PM by OldDeckHand
Harvard Law Professor Alan Dershowitz renders his two opponents — Col. Morris Davis, former chief prosecutor at Guantanamo and Nicholas Kristof of The New York Times — speechless as he makes the case for why the photos of a dead Osama bin Laden should be released, dismantling every one of their counterpoints in the process. He suggests that news outlets, should they elect to sue the government to obtain the photos, would have a winning case. But will any have the gumption to do so? (Or at least, more than had the gumption to publish the Muhammad cartoons?)
DERSHOWITZ: The precedent this would establish for suppressing material because it might be offensive or might lead to this, it would give…Muslim extremists veto about what we can read, what we can hear. It harks back to the cartoon issues and other forms of censorship. We should not censor because if we publish it will offend the sensibilities of people who don’t share our values.
-video-
(Excerpt) Read more at nationalreview.com ...
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HAHAHAHAHAHA more 'changed stories' of what happened that day.
make up your mind, obama.
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HAHAHAHAHAHA more 'changed stories' of what happened that day.
make up your mind, obama.
Problem is that Bama had NOTHING to do with this. If anything, I give credit to Panetta, USN, CIA. Bama is just johnny come lately and trying to take credit for something he had nothing to do with in any fashion at all.
Fuck him. any good feelings i had a few days ago are gone.
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seals kicked some ass. and they reported everything 100% accurate to the white house in REAL TIME.
it's the damn white house, posturing for history and angling for political correctness, that keeps changing their fcking story.
Nobody is saying the seals weren't 100% honest about their job. It's the white house that deserves criticism for changing their story nonstop.
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Problem is that Bama had NOTHING to do with this. If anything, I give credit to Panetta, USN, CIA. Bama is just johnny come lately and trying to take credit for something he had nothing to do with in any fashion at all.
Fuck him. any good feelings i had a few days ago are gone.
well ya dont say...
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still, 33, obama did take some serious risk in this kind of mission.
IF IF IF Bin Laden had rigged the house with explosives (likely had be been real about this martyr shit), he would have had plenty of time to light up the place and take 20 Seals with him.
Repubs would be criticizing obama NONSTOP for not just putting a jdam on that house - you know it, man.
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well ya dont say...
I met Burlingame in December 2009 in NYC at the anti-KSM rally in the freezing cold at Foley Square. I have posted pics of it. I'm still surprised I never got sick that day. She has been 100000000000000000% patriot on this from day 1.
For the communist traitor and puke you support to treat her like he did on this issue . . .. fuck him . . . . seriously .. . . . go vote for him dude . . . . you and him deserve each other. i'll leave it at that.
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still, 33, obama did take some serious risk in this kind of mission.
IF IF IF Bin Laden had rigged the house with explosives (likely had be been real about this martyr shit), he would have had plenty of time to light up the place and take 20 Seals with him.
Repubs would be criticizing obama NONSTOP for not just putting a jdam on that house - you know it, man.
Bama didnt do dick. His panzi ass was on the golf course. From what I am reading, this whole thing really is the work of Hillary and Panetta. Jarrett, who is Bamas brain, actually fought against this. It seems Panetta was really the driving force behind this.
Screw obama. i am beyond pissed off how he treated Burlingame.
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Bama didnt do dick. His panzi ass was on the golf course. From what I am reading, this whole thing really is the work of Hillary and Panetta. Jarrett, who is Bamas brain, actually fought against this. It seems Panetta was really the driving force behind this.
Screw obama. i am beyond pissed off how he treated Burlingame.
So the honeymoon's over, huh?
Didn't see this one coming.
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So the honeymoon's over, huh?
Didn't see this one coming.
I should have known better. He is trying to take adavantage of a situation he had nothing to do with.
fuck him. He makes me sick with his communist shit.
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I should have known better. He is trying to take adavantage of a situation he had nothing to do with.
fuck him. He makes me sick with his communist shit.
Haha. Now that's the vile 333386 that I know.
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From what I am reading, this whole thing really is the work of Hillary and Panetta.
Wow.... So Obama recognized his inexperience in this area, and followed the wisdom of his two more experienced appointees.
Very admirable he was able to put his ego and friendship for Jarrett aside, and roll with the experience of Hilary and Panetta.
;)
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Wow.... So Obama recognized his inexperience in this area, and followed the wisdom of his two more experienced appointees.
Very admirable he was able to put his ego and friendship for Jarrett aside, and roll with the experience of Hilary and Panetta.
;)
Problem is that if he would not have acted and that got out . . . . . . . . . . . .
Its all politics for maobama. That asshole probably said prayers for bin laden himself.
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Yeah, that's probably what happened.
It's gonna be tough for you when he gets re-elected.
Epic 4 yr meltdown part deux.
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Yeah, that's probably what happened.
It's gonna be tough for you when he gets re-elected.
Epic 4 yr meltdown part deux.
If Obama get re-elected after the dismal mess the country is in, we deserve what we get.
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Problem is that if he would not have acted and that got out . . . . . . . . . . . .
Its all politics for maobama. That asshole probably said prayers for bin laden himself.
evidence?
Link to evidence our president secretly prayed for bin laden?
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evidence?
Link to evidence our president secretly prayed for bin laden?
Reality.
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Reality.
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Obama: "prettiest sound I ever heard was the muslim call to prayer"
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Sources Involved in Taking Down Osama: Bin Laden "Scared", "Completely Confused" in Final Moments
Pundit Press ^ | 5/5/11 | Aurelius
As time goes on, the official story from the White House changes. Here's a new twist to the story.
According to sources that were involved in the operation to kill Osama bin Laden, the terrorist leader acted "scared" and was "completely confused" in the final moments of his life. Right before being shot, bin Laden shoved his wife the NAVY Seal that ultimately killed him.
A US official, speaking on the condition of anonymity, tried to further straighten out aspects of the White House's story and what really happened. Referring to Seals being shot at by a man when they entered, he stated:
"He was the one guy shot who had a gun in his hand and was firing when he was shot -- other weapons were at the scene. When the SEALs reached the third floor, after resistance and physical barricades, Osama bin Laden did not immediately surrender. When someone like OBL who has said he wants to kill as many Americans as possible, doesn't 150 percent surrender, you have to assess as a threat."
The official also emphasized that "at least a half-dozen weapons" were found at the bin Laden complex and that the first person the Seals encountered "immediately opened fire."
(Excerpt) Read more at punditpress.blogspot.com ...
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21 pages of lesser men arguing about "stuff" that doesn't really affects them.
Gayer than asking the wife/husband/lifePartner permission to go to the bathroom during "supper".
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Sources: Bin Laden Acted 'Cowardly,' Confused in Final Moments
FoxNews.com ^ | 5/5/11 | Jennifer Griffin, Justin Fishel and Catherine Herridge
Sources involved in the operation that took down Usama bin Laden told Fox News the terrorist leader acted "scared" and "completely confused" in his final moments, "shoving his wife" at the Navy SEAL who ultimately shot him.
The information helps clarify the conflicting details about what exactly happened toward the end of the 40-minute raid on bin Laden's northern Pakistan compound. Sources who were part of the mission said bin Laden acted in a "cowardly manner" when confronted. Fox News has also learned that while bin Laden was unarmed, he was standing near the door within reach of two weapons -- an AK-47 and a Makarov handgun that are now in U.S. custody. The handgun is a 9mm semi-automatic Russian pistol, standard issue in the Russian military until 1991.
A senior U.S. official also told Fox News that only one of the five people killed in the raid was carrying a weapon and firing. The detail seemed at first to diverge from White House accounts claiming the Navy SEALs encountered resistance throughout the raid and were engaged in a firefight during much of the 40-minute operation. However, the scene was described as chaotic, with U.S. forces encountering barricades and women in the compound screaming and attacking the men.
(Excerpt) Read more at foxnews.com ...
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http://www.dnainfo.com/20110505/downtown/president-obama-vows-help-911-teen-meet-justin-bieber
President Obama Vows to Help 9/11 Teen Meet Justin Bieber
Updated 2 hrs ago
May 5, 2011
New Jersey teen Payton Wall, whose father died on 9/11, asked the president in a letter to meet Justin Bieber.
President Obama met with the Wall family Thursday during a wreath-laying ceremony at Ground Zero, including Payton Wall, far right. Payton really wants to meet Justin Bieber. (DNAinfo/Julie Shapiro)By Julie Shapiro and Tom Liddy
DNAinfo Staff
GROUND ZERO — A New Jersey teen who lost her father on 9/11 got the rare privilege Thursday of meeting the President — but she really wants to meet Justin Bieber.
So a few months ago, Payton Wall, 14, of Rumson, wrote to President Barack Obama, asking the leader of the free world for help in meeting the teenage Canadian pop prince.
Justin Bieber visits 'Late Show With David Letterman' at the Ed Sullivan Theater on Jan. 31, 2011 in New York City. (James Devaney/WireImage)"Justin Bieber inspired me to share my story," said the beaming teen, who met the president at Ground Zero Thursday.
"I wrote a letter to the president a few months ago. I talked about how I lost my dad on 9/11 and how I like Justin Bieber."
After laying down a wreath of red, white and blue flowers near Survivor Tree at the Trade Center site, Obama warmly embraced Payton.
"I was practicing my handshake all day, but he gave me a hug," said the ecstatic teen.
"He told us he knows Justin," and that she could meet him some time soon.
Her younger sister, Avery, 12, and mom, Diane, were also at the ceremony and met Obama.
"He said it was an honor to meet us. He's really cool," said Avery.
Her father, Glen Wall, was a partner at Cantor Fitzgerald when a plane struck Tower 1 nearly 10 years ago.
He was 38 when he died.
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Osama Bin Laden Death Pictures Now in Freedom of Information Act Limbo
Village Voice ^ | 05/05/2011 | Joe Coscarelli,
Since President Barack Obama decided that the pictures of Osama Bin Laden were too gruesome to make public, lest they inflame violence or be used as anti-U.S. propaganda, it will be up to journalists to force transparency from the administration. (That, or Obama could have them leaked, thereby avoiding the complications that come with an officially sanctioned government release.) But assuming that won't happen, the Associated Press has already taken it upon themselves to file a Freedom of Information Act...
(Excerpt) Read more at blogs.villagevoice.com ...
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Osama Bin Laden Raiders Encountered False Door, Found Small Arsenal in Compound
ABC News ^ | May 5, 2011 | JAKE TAPPER, & MARTHA RADDATZ, & JESSICA HOPPER
New revelations about the raid that killed Osama bin Laden reveal that the SEAL raiders encountered a false door and found a small arsenal of weapons, including an AK-47 assault rifle in bin Laden's bedroom.
As the Navy SEALs have been debriefed about their mission that left the al Qaeda leader dead, the White House has been forced to correct details of what happened during Sunday's raid at bin Laden's Abbottabad compound.
Despite the changes in the White House version of what happened during the 40 minute raid on bin Laden's sprawling million dollar mansion, officials were unapologetic about the SEALs' actions.
"These guys are American heroes. They were told to kill bin Laden. We've had the authority to kill bin Laden since 9/11. And that's exactly what they did," a U.S. official told ABC News.
The SEALs were already in a heightened and aggressive posture, but that was exacerbated when one of the first doors they tried to open turned out to be a false door. The bricked off, false door put the military members in a position of suspecting that the house would be full of such items, perhaps with lethal booby traps. The SEALs reportedly had a specially trained dog with them on the raid who could sniff for bombs and to see if rooms were booby trapped.
The Americans were also fired on by a man who was one of bin Laden's trusted couriers, officials said. The courier was killed by return fire from the SEALs, and they did not encounter any additional gunfire.
That early gunfire indicated to the SEALs that they might expect further resistance. And they did find a small arsenal of weapons in the home.
[Snip]
At least one AK-47 was found in bin Laden's room.
(Excerpt) Read more at abcnews.go.com ...
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333, if I don't get an email soon, your face will be on this can too ;D
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333, if I don't get an email soon, your face will be on this can too ;D
I did my part earlier today. Thats all I can say.
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Obama Hesitated - Panetta Issued Order to Kill Osama Bin Laden
By Ulsterman in Issues
Posted on 05/04/11 | From socyberty.com | Comments (0)
"What Valerie Jarrett, and the president, did not know is that Leon Panetta had already initiated a program that reported to him –and only him, involving a covert on the ground attack against the compound."
Note:This update comes some 24 hours after our longtime Washington D.C. Insider first outlined shocking details of an Obama administration having been "overruled" by senior military and intelligence officials leading up to the successful attack against terrorist Osama Bin Laden. What follows is further clarification of Insider's insights surrounding that event.
_______
Q: You stated that President Obama was "overruled" by military/intelligence officials regarding the decision to send in military specialists into the Osama Bin Laden compound. Was that accurate?
A: I was told – in these exact terms, "we overruled him." (Obama) I have since followed up and received further details on exactly what that meant, as well as the specifics of how Leon Panetta worked around the president's "persistent hesitation to act." There appears NOT to have been an outright overruling of any specific position by President Obama, simply because there was no specific position from the president to do so. President Obama was, in this case, as in all others, working as an absentee president.
I was correct in stating there had been a push to invade the compound for several weeks if not months, primarily led by Leon Panetta, Hillary Clinton, Robert Gates, David Petraeus, and Jim Clapper. The primary opposition to this plan originated from Valerie Jarrett, and it was her opposition that was enough to create uncertainty within President Obama. Obama would meet with various components of the pro-invasion faction, almost always with Jarrett present, and then often fail to indicate his position. This situation continued for some time, though the division between Jarrett/Obama and the rest intensified more recently, most notably from Hillary Clinton. She was livid over the president's failure to act, and her office began a campaign of anonymous leaks to the media indicating such. As for Jarrett, her concern rested on two primary fronts. One, that the military action could fail and harm the president's already weakened standing with both the American public and the world. Second, that the attack would be viewed as an act of aggression against Muslims, and further destabilize conditions in the Middle East.
Q: What changed the president's position and enabled the attack against Osama Bin Laden to proceed?
A: Nothing changed with the president's opinion – he continued to avoid having one. Every time military and intelligence officials appeared to make progress in forming a position, Jarrett would intervene and the stalling would begin again. Hillary started the ball really rolling as far as pressuring Obama began, but it was Panetta and Petraeus who ultimately pushed Obama to finally act – sort of. Panetta was receiving significant reports from both his direct CIA sources, as well as Petraeus-originating Intel. Petraeus was threatening to act on his own via a bombing attack. Panetta reported back to the president that a bombing of the compound would result in successful killing of Osama Bin Laden, and little risk to American lives. Initially, as he had done before, the president indicated a willingness to act. But once again, Jarrett intervened, convincing the president that innocent Pakistani lives could be lost in such a bombing attack, and Obama would be left attempting to explain Panetta's failed policy. Again Obama hesitated – this time openly delaying further meetings to discuss the issue with Panetta. A brief meeting was held at this time with other officials, including Secretary Gates and members of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, but Gates, like Panetta, was unable to push the president to act. It was at this time that Gates indicated to certain Pentagon officials that he may resign earlier than originally indicated – he was that frustrated. Both Panetta and Clinton convinced him to stay on and see the operation through.
What happened from there is what was described by me as a "masterful manipulation" by Leon Panetta. Panetta indicated to Obama that leaks regarding knowledge of Osama Bin Laden's location were certain to get out sooner rather than later, and action must be taken by the administration or the public backlash to the president's inaction would be "...significant to the point of political debilitation." It was at that time that Obama stated an on-ground campaign would be far more acceptable to him than a bombing raid. This was intended as a stalling tactic, and it had originated from Jarrett. Such a campaign would take both time, and present a far greater risk of failure. The president had been instructed by Jarrett to inform Mr., Panetta that he would have sole discretion to act against the Osama Bin Laden compound. Jarrett believed this would further delay Panetta from acting, as the responsibility for failure would then fall almost entirely on him. What Valerie Jarrett, and the president, did not know is that Leon Panetta had already initiated a program that reported to him –and only him, involving a covert on the ground attack against the compound. Basically, the whole damn operation was already ready to go – including the specific team support Intel necessary to engage the enemy within hours of being given notice. Panetta then made plans to proceed with an on-ground assault. This information reached either Hillary Clinton or Robert Gates first (likely via military contacts directly associated with the impending mission) who then informed the other. Those two then met with Panetta, who informed each of them he had been given the authority by the president to proceed with a mission if the opportunity presented itself. Both Gates and Clinton warned Panetta of the implications of that authority – namely he was possibly being made into a scapegoat. Panetta admitted that possibility, but felt the opportunity to get Bin Laden outweighed that risk. During that meeting, Hillary Clinton was first to pledge her full support for Panetta, indicating she would defend him if necessary. Similar support was then followed by Gates. The following day, and with Panetta's permission, Clinton met in private with Bill Daley and urged him to get the president's full and open approval of the Panetta plan. Daley agreed such approval would be of great benefit to the action, and instructed Clinton to delay proceeding until he had secured that approval. Daley contacted Clinton within hours of their meeting indicating Jarrett refused to allow the president to give that approval. Daley then informed Clinton that he too would fully support Panetta in his actions, even if it meant disclosing the president's indecision to the American public should that action fail to produce a successful conclusion. Clinton took that message back to Panetta and the CIA director initiated the 48 hour engagement order. At this point, the President of the United States was not informed of the engagement order – it did not originate from him, and for several hours after the order had been given and the special ops forces were preparing for action into Pakistan from their position in Afghanistan, Daley successfully kept Obama and Jarrett insulated from that order.
This insulation ended at some point with an abort order that I believe originated from Valerie Jarrett's office, and was then followed up by President Obama. This abort order was later explained as a delay due to weather conditions, but the actual conditions at that time would have been acceptable for the mission. A storm system had been in the area earlier, but was no longer an issue. Check the data yourself to confirm. Jarrett, having been caught off guard, was now scrambling to determine who had initiated the plan. She was furious, repeating the acronym "CoC" and saying it was not being followed. This is where Bill Daley intervened directly. The particulars of that intervention are not clear to me beyond knowing he did meet with Jarrett in his office and following that meeting, Valerie Jarrett was not seen in the West Wing for some time, and apparently no longer offered up any resistance to the Osama Bin Laden mission. What did follow from there was one or more brief meetings between Bill Daley, Hillary Clinton, a representative from Robert Gates' office, a representative from Leon Panetta's office, and a representative from Jim Clapper's office. I have to assume that these meetings were in essence, detailing the move to proceed with the operation against the Osama Bin Laden compound. I have been told by more than one source that Leon Panetta was directing the operation with both his own CIA operatives, as well as direct contacts with military – both entities were reporting to Panetta only at this point, and not the President of the United States. There was not going to be another delay as had happened 24 hour earlier. The operation was at this time effectively unknown to President Barack Obama or Valerie Jarrett and it remained that way until AFTER it had already been initiated. President Obama was literally pulled from a golf outing and escorted back to the White House to be informed of the mission. Upon his arrival there was a briefing held which included Bill Daley, John Brennan, and a high ranking member of the military. When Obama emerged from the briefing, he was described as looking "very confused and uncertain." The president was then placed in the situation room where several of the players in this event had already been watching the operation unfold. Another interesting tidbit regarding this is that the Vice President was already "up to speed" on the operation. A source indicated they believe Hillary Clinton had personally made certain the Vice President was made aware of that day's events before the president was. The now famous photo released shows the particulars of that of that room and its occupants. What that photo does not communicate directly is that the military personnel present in that room during the operation unfolding, deferred to either Hillary Clinton or Robert Gates. The president's role was minimal, including their acknowledging of his presence in the room.
At the conclusion of the mission, after it had been repeatedly confirmed a success, President Obama was once again briefed behind closed doors. The only ones who went in that room besides the president were Bill Daley. John Brennan, and a third individual whose identity remains unknown to me. When leaving this briefing, the president came out of it "...much more confident. Much more certain of himself." He was also carrying papers in his hand that quite possibly was the address to the nation given later that evening on the Bin Laden mission. The president did not have those papers with him prior to that briefing. The president then returned to the war room, where by this time, Leon Panetta had personally arrived and was receiving congratulations from all who were present.
In my initial communication to you of these events I described what unfolded as a temporary Coup initiated by high ranking intelligence and military officials. I stand by that term. These figures worked around the uncertainty of President Obama and the repeated resistance of Valerie Jarrett. If they had not been willing to do so, I am certain Osama Bin Laden would still be alive today. There will be no punishment to those who acted outside the authority of the president's office. The president cannot afford to admit such a fact. What will be most interesting from here is to now see what becomes of Valerie Jarrett. One source indicated she is threatening resignation. I find that unlikely given my strong belief she needs the protection afforded her by the Oval Office and its immense powers to delay and eventually terminate investigations back in Chicago, but we shall see.
Read more: http://socyberty.com
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:D
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Good batchlor show tonight.
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:D
LMAOOOOO
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Good grief. Appeaser in Chief at it again. ::)
Obama Defends Bin Laden Sea Burial as 'respectful'
Thursday, 05 May 2011
WASHINGTON - President Barack Obama said U.S. forces were "respectful of the body" of Osama bin Laden when they buried his remains at sea, despite criticism from some Muslim clerics that it violated Islamic practice.
"We took more care on this than, obviously, bin Laden took when he killed 3,000 people. He didn't have much regard for how they were treated and desecrated," Obama told CBS's "60 Minutes" program, referring to the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks that the al Qaeda leader masterminded.
"But that, again, is something that makes us different. And I think we handled it appropriately," Obama said, according to an advance excerpt of an interview that will air in full Sunday.
Questions have multiplied since the White House said bin Laden was unarmed when U.S. helicopter-borne commandos shot and killed him Monday at the fortified villa where he had been hiding in the Pakistani city of Abbottabad.
Bin Laden's swift burial at sea from the deck of a U.S. aircraft carrier in the north Arabian sea has also stirred misgivings, with some Muslims saying it was done contrary to Islamic custom.
U.S. officials have insisted that bin Laden's body was washed and that Islamic prayers were recited in accordance with religious laws. They said there was concern that a grave could have served as a shrine and rallying point for his followers.
"It was a joint decision," Obama said when asked whether he personally made the decision for burial at sea. "We thought it was important to think through ahead of time how we would dispose of the body if he were killed in the compound."
"And I think that what we tried to do was -- consulting with experts in Islamic law and ritual-- to find something that was appropriate, that was, respectful of the body," Obama added.
Saudi Sheikh Abdul Mohsen Al-Obaikan, an adviser to the Saudi Royal Court, said: "That is not the Islamic way. The Islamic way is to bury the person in land (if he has died on land) like all other people." (Reporting by Matt Spetalnick; Editing by Vicki Allen)
http://www.newsmax.com/InsideCover/burial-respectful-sea-bin/2011/05/05/id/395351
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Is the Obama administration setting up to toss the SEALs under the bus?
Pajamas Media ^ | 5/6/2011 | Staff
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2715964/posts
That is one way, though surely not the only way, to read this story. The gist: the administration is now admitting that it had no video feed during the most crucial 20-25 minutes of the bin Laden raid. But take note of a detail that’s hanging in the new new new version of events.
A photograph released by the White House appeared to show the President and his aides in the situation room watching the action as it unfolded. In fact they had little knowledge of what was happening in the compound.
Mr Panetta also told the network that the US Navy Seals made the final decision to kill bin Laden rather than the president.
In an interview with PBS, Mr Panetta said: “Once those teams went into the compound I can tell you that there was a time period of almost 20 or 25 minutes where we really didn’t know just exactly what was going on. And there were some very tense moments as we were waiting for information.
“We had some observation of the approach there, but we did not have direct flow of information as to the actual conduct of the operation itself as they were going through the compound.”
Mr Panetta also told the network that the US Navy Seals made the final decision to kill bin Laden rather than the president. (emphasis mine)
It’s that last line that puts some distance now between the White House and the raid. The WH wasn’t actually watching, and the SEALs made the call to kill. Put that together with the information that came out yesterday about the disposition of the enemy within the compound.
Several other details from the raid support the narrative that bin Laden felt a certain sense of security in his walled compound in northern Pakistan—there were no guards on site, and he was unarmed when the CIA-led Navy SEALs team dropped in Sunday to capture or kill him.
The circumstances surrounding his final minutes are still a bit blurry. A senior U.S. official said that while he was unarmed, he appeared to be reaching for a weapon before being fatally shot.
Other accounts said one of the guards was armed, but the others and bin Laden were not. Of course, we’ll never see the actual order that sent the SEAL team in, so we’ll never know if it truly was a kill order. Most Americans wouldn’t care either way — bin Laden was one of that rare breed of thug who just needs killlin’. But this administration isn’t composed of “most Americans,” it’s composed of people who hold a skeptical view of American power, to say the least. And it’s not as if Obama hasn’t made a habit of throwing anyone and everyone under the bus as soon as they become inconvenient to him. And let’s face it: Obama’s voting base hates the military and has spent the entire war decrying every tactic the military and our intel agencies have used over the course of the war.
The Obama administration would be making a colossal mistake if it goes anywhere near turning on the SEALs who got bin Laden. But they have been making mistake after mistake since the successful raid. So I’m no longer confident they can manage to dodge making this one. And if your agenda of frittering away American power and influence remains in place, it’s not a mistake at all.
Plus: The New York Times Magazine suffers from a case of bad timing…and worse judgment.
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CIA agents lived in spy house near Bin Laden's compound for MONTHS in most intricate operation in agency's history
By Tim Shipman
Last updated at 12:50 PM on 6th May 2011
Pakistan warns of 'disastrous consequences' if there are any more raids
U.S. ordered to reduce presence in the country
The CIA spied on Osama bin Laden for months from its own top-secret safehouse in Abbottabad, it has been revealed.
In one of the most intricate intelligence operations in CIA history, spies moved in to a property next door to Bin Laden's fortified compound to establish his 'pattern of life'.
The surveillance operation was so extensive that the CIA was forced to go cap in hand to Congress in December to ask for tens of millions of dollars more funding, which was met by creaming money from a variety of other agency budgets.
Top secret: A Pakistani man leans against a wall in Abbotabad bearing the graffiti 'Osama Bin Town' - but it has emerged the area was also home to a CIA spy-house
U.S officials refused to reveal how many agents were part of the close-quarters surveillance team but were at pains to stress the remarkable levels of care required because Bin Laden would flee the moment suspicions were aroused.
They used every possible means to gather information, including Pakistani informants, satellite images, telephoto lenses and listening devices in an attempt to record Bin Laden and his cohorts.
However, Bin Laden was so adept at hiding that the CIA admit to admiring his commitment, having rejected the suspicious-looking trappings of bodyguards and vehicles.
According to Pakistan security officials, the al Qaeda leader spent the last five years living in the same room of his mansion where he was shot and killed by U.S. forces.
The claims were made by the terrorist leader's wife, who apparently told interrogators that she and her husband had not left the same room for the past half a decade.
More...The glamour model, the billionaire patriarch with 22 wives and the child terrorist: Meet the OTHER Bin Ladens
Terror secrets of bin Laden's mansion: Al Qaeda was planning to derail U.S. trains on 10th anniversary of 9/11
Sightseers flock to Bin Laden's compound as it becomes a ghoulish tourist attraction
President Obama to meet SEAL heroes who eliminated Bin Laden after he visits Ground Zero to lay wreath in silent honour of 9/11 victims
I'm uneasy about Bin Laden killing, admits Archbishop while Dalai Lama says: Sometimes you have to strike back
The revelations of Amal al-Sadah, Bin Laden's Yemeni wife, who is now in the custody of Pakistani intelligence, sheds new light on the existence of the world's most wanted man.
But Pakistani authorities who are interrogating her are now threatening to cut their intelligence-sharing arrangement with the U.S. because of the country's anger and embarrassment over the whole operation.
If the country makes good on that threat it would mean the U.S. faces a struggle to act on any new intelligence gleaned from Bin Laden's compound.
'You’ve got to give him credit for his tradecraft,' a former senior CIA official who played a leading role in the manhunt told The Washington Post.
The CIA safehouse played no part in the actual capture and kill operation and it has now closed down.
While it would have been too dangerous for the team to remain on the ground in the aftermath of the operation, it has served the purpose for which it was created.
Discreet: The CIA moved into a house near Bin Laden's compound and were able to remain undetected by a mixture of extraordinary skill and the local conditions that helped the terrorist leader hide for so long
'The intelligence work was as complete as it was going to be, and it was the military’s turn to finish the target,' a U.S. official told The Washington Post, speaking on condition of anonymity.
The CIA were able to move into the Abbottabad spy-house for the same reasons that Bin Laden was able to remain in the city undetected.
It was not considered a terrorist stronghold like Quetta or Peshawar, and because it has many holiday homes and refugees from the recent earthquakes it has a transient population.
All those conditions made it easier for the CIA to slip in unnoticed.
But the intelligence gathering work did not stop once the spy-house team had achieved its goals. And with the 'mother lode' of information seized by the Special Forces team during the capture and kill operation, plans for a major terrorist plot have been uncovered.
The swathes of evidence found on computers, DVDs and documents recovered by U.S. Navy SEALs in Sunday's shoot-out show that the terror mastermind was still keen on so-called 'soft targets' like trains and planes.
Domestic life: The Yemeni wife of Osama bin Laden, Amal al-Sadah, says she lived with her husband in the same room in the Abbottabad compound for the past five years
Inside the lair: This still image from a video shows a part of the room where it is believed Bin Laden lived and was killed
Tourist site: A Pakistani family leave after viewing the walled compound in Abbottabad where Bin Laden was caught and killed
Pride: The under-construction Freedom Tower at 1 World Trade Center was lit up in red white and blue last night
The only plot that looked nearly ready was one to derail a train on the 10th anniversary of the September 11 terror attacks, said the FBI.
Military strongman: Army Chief General Ashfaq Parvez Kayani is demanding a serious reduction in U.S. troop numbers in Pakistan
As recriminations flew over the assassination of Bin Laden, Pakistan's military strongman demanded cuts in the number of U.S. personnel on Pakistani soil and said it would slash ties altogether if the U.S. launches another anti-terrorist raid on their soil.
Army chief General Ashfaq Kayani, who is seen as more powerful than Pakistan’s civilian leaders, was voicing widespread anger at American claims that the country's intelligence agency the ISI sheltered the terrorist leader for a decade.
He told his colleagues that a decision had been made to reduce the number of U.S. military personnel to the 'minimum essential' levels.
A spokesman said General Kayani 'made it clear that any similar action violating the sovereignty of Pakistan will warrant a review on the level of military intelligence cooperation with the United States'.
Earlier, the government had warned of 'disastrous consequences' if the U.S. staged a similar attack on its territory.
The UN's independent investigator on extrajudicial killings has called on the U.S. to reveal more details of the raid to allow experts to assess the legality of his killing.
South African law professor Christof Heyns said in a statement today that Washington 'should disclose the supporting facts to allow an assessment in terms of international human rights law standards.'
'It will be particularly important to know if the planning of the mission allowed an effort to capture Bin Laden,' said Heyns.
Although U.S. officials say the raid is legal under U.S. and international law, the Heyn's call echoes similar appeals from other UN officials, human rights groups and the International Committee of the Red Cross.
But as the war of words between Pakistan and the U.S. escalated, a senior British source said the U.S. would ignore the threats and would launch another raid to capture or kill Bin Laden's deputy Ayman Al Zawahiri — the new head of Al Qaeda — if they can locate him in Pakistan.
'He’s next and they'll get him if they can, however many feathers it ruffles,' one official said.
'It has always been likely that he is in Pakistan.'
'The capability they bring to the fight cannot be replicated by man or machine,' he said last year.
The dogs even come armed with their own hi-tech weaponry - titanium fangs.
The modification, which costs around $2,000 per tooth, means the dogs are reputedly capable of biting through protective armoured clothing.
The source said that General Kayani’s comments were 'intended for internal consumption'.
'Whenever there’s an American Predator strike on Al Qaeda you always hear these public complaints but activities of that nature still continue with tacit consent'.
U.S. officials called for the £1.8billion in annual aid that America sends to Pakistan to be blocked until the government in Islamabad explains how Bin Laden lived unmolested just a few hundred yards from the Pakistani Army training school.
Patrick Leahy, the chairman of the Senate subcommittee that allocates foreign aid, said he was certain that some Pakistani military and intelligence officials knew that Bin Laden was hiding 30 miles from Islamabad.
'It's impossible for them not to have some idea he was there.'
Senior Pentagon official Michelle Flournoy said the Pakistanis must now demonstrate visibly and convincingly their commitment to defeating Al Qaeda by helping the U.S. exploit the intelligence hoard seized inside Bin Laden's compound on Monday.
Prime Minister David Cameron has admitted that Bin Laden had an 'extensive support network' in the Pakistani security forces. Tory MPs want a review of the £650million in aid that Britain is sending Pakistan.
But Mr Cameron has insisted that the UK must continue to engage with the country.
That view was echoed yesterday by U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton.
'It is not always an easy relationship,' she said.
'But on the other hand, it is a productive one for both of our countries and we are going to continue to co-operate between our governments, our militaries, our law enforcement agencies.'
The former head of the British Army, General Lord Dannatt, defended the action of the U.S. special forces, saying Bin Laden's killing had been 'unfortunate but necessary'.
He added: 'The special forces troops going in had been briefed, perfectly reasonably, that if Bin Laden was anything other than naked, he could be assumed to be wearing a suicide vest.
'Unless he put his hands straight up and surrendered straightaway they had to assume that he had evil intent.'
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1384137/Osama-Bin-Laden-death-CIA-agents-lived-spy-house-near-compound-MONTHS.html#ixzz1LZhxSeHf
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WOW!
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Major Garrett condemns ‘ham-handed’ way White House told OBL mission story
Daily Caller ^ | 5/6/2011 | Jeff Poor
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2716008/posts
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The ever-changing “narrative” from the White House about the U.S. mission to kill Osama bin Laden has shed some doubt on the events that took place that historic day, and that’s not the way the government should have handled such a historic moment argues National Journal’s Major Garrett.
In an appearance on MSNBC’s “Morning Joe” on Friday, Garrett explained how the White House went wrong in the days after President Barack Obama’s late Sunday night announcement.
“One quick point about that,” Garrett said. “I believe the administration should be justifiably criticized for the ham-handed nature of telling this story. This is the most serious military operation this administration has engaged in in a decade. It should be told once with precision and clarity for everyone. And they didn’t do that and it’s their fault.”
The former Fox News Channel White House correspondent said if it had taken time to get the story straight for the public, then it should have taken that time and “dispense facts,” not build a narrative.
“That’s not a partisan statement at all,” he said. “This is a responsibility of the government to explain what happened and if it takes time to make that explanation, and if takes time to build a — and not a narrative, I’m sorry. I resent that phrase, entirely. These are facts. Governments dispense facts or should, not narratives. And the time should have been taken to put the facts together and explain them once.”
“Morning Joe” co-host Willie Geist agreed with Garrett’s assessment.
“And it’s not a story that needs embellishing,” Geist said. “That’s the shame of it. Just get the story out there. It’s impressive enough on its own.”
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Obama to Allah:pardon Osama(Did he order Marines to wash his body and saying prayers over him?)
washtimes ^ | 5/6/11 | a green
The Obama administration is in lockdown on the particulars of their disposal of the most hated man in the civilized world. Officials have refused to release photos or video of bin Laden’s capture, corpse or controversial sea burial, instead averring that it was “taken care of in the appropriate way.” “Appropriate” seems to be the administration’s final word on the matter. The answer to whether a Muslim expert was consulted was that “appropriate specialists and experts” were sought out, while a senior defense official at a Pentagon briefing emphasized Osama was handled “using the appropriate procedures and rituals.”
Additional questions on the burial have been decidedly unwelcome—when asked whether American service members were the ones who cleaned the terrorist’s body or why he was given an Islamic funeral, Pentagon Press Secretary Geoff Morrell sniffed, “I don’t think we care to get into those details.” John Brennan, Assistant to the President for Homeland Security and Counterterrorism, cut off a reporter asking whether an imam was at the funeral with, “It was done appropriately with the appropriate people there.”
For those wondering just what an “appropriate” Islamic burial entails, “Navy Military Funerals,” created by the Navy to govern laying their dead to rest, is a bit more forthcoming. Their “Service for the committal of a person of the Muslim faith” lays out explicit steps that must be followed in a Muslim sea burial. The body must have been washed and wrapped “as required for the bodies of Muslims,” which refers to ceremonial cleanings that must be done by another Muslim. Those who have gathered to pray at the burial—ostensibly crewmembers since family is not allowed at sea burials—must face Mecca
(Excerpt) Read more at washingtontimes.com ...
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2716105/posts
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There wasn't ONE time in all those months where they lived next to him that he couldn't be captured alive?
They assumed he was wearing a suicide vest, for ten years, everyday?
I'm gonna listen to that show soon.
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Amazing. Obama can release the propoganda films and crap they got at the house but not the death or burial video.
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Amazing. Obama can release the propoganda films and crap they got at the house but not the death or burial video.
Were those things actually released? Oh boy... ::)
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There wasn't ONE time in all those months where they lived next to him that he couldn't be captured alive?
They assumed he was wearing a suicide vest, for ten years, everyday?
I'm gonna listen to that show soon.
Would you really risk losing 30 DEVGRU and CIA paramilitary in an attempt to capture him?
They never saw him once before they launched the raid. And given that he had money sewn into all of his clothes along with phone numbers and email addresses I don't think it would have really been a stretch for him to have a bomb vest on him while he was awake at least.
Amazing. Obama can release the propoganda films and crap they got at the house but not the death or burial video.
Don't worry, Obama and the MSM are too busy rambling on about proper Muslim burials. ::)
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Is it completly wrong to believe that Osama was probably just being detained instead of hiding? A vital "clue" will be when the public has a better idea of just how long the west knew he was there. It's already suggested that they knew he was there for months, maybe it was years. There was no mention of a suicide vest on his persosns when they found him. No groups of bodyguards, just some dope with a water pistol that I'm being told could have been the lone armed shooter. One guy put up a 45 minuter shootout against the SEALs? All I know is dead bodies can't speak. Crazier shit has been happening around the world. Werent guns shipped across the Mexico border knowingly? Wasnt the CIA involved in smuggling drugs into the country? The list goes on.
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perhaps the 14 foot fence with barbed wire was there to keep him IN - not keep others out.
He and his wife had been in that same ROOM for 5 years. imagine that. Sounds more like house arrest than hiding.
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Is it completly wrong to believe that Osama was probably just being detained instead of hiding? A vital "clue" will be when the public has a better idea of just how long the west knew he was there. It's already suggested that they knew he was there for months, maybe it was years. There was no mention of a suicide vest on his persosns when they found him. No groups of bodyguards, just some dope with a water pistol that I'm being told could have been the lone armed shooter. One guy put up a 45 minuter shootout against the SEALs? All I know is dead bodies can't speak. Crazier shit has been happening around the world. Werent guns shipped across the Mexico border knowingly? Wasnt the CIA involved in smuggling drugs into the country? The list goes on.
No group of bodyguards isn't a giveaway. It makes sense that he wouldn't have his Black Guard with him as they would have been the most gigantic giveaway that he was there and moving them around with him would have made it a lot easier to track him. It's a lot easier to move one or two people than one guy with a dozen+ bodyguards like he used to have. And if he was being detained then he wouldn't have been leading Al Qaeda from there.
US intelligence has long considered Pakistan's ISI a terrorist organization. They're the same group that organized the Mumbai attacks and made sure that the shooters went around killing anyone who looked foreign. Anyone thinking they had OBL "detained" while, at the same time letting him run AQ from there, is a fucking retard.
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No group of bodyguards isn't a giveaway. It makes sense that he wouldn't have his Black Guard with him as they would have been the most gigantic giveaway that he was there and moving them around with him would have made it a lot easier to track him. It's a lot easier to move one or two people than one guy with a dozen+ bodyguards like he used to have. And if he was being detained then he wouldn't have been leading Al Qaeda from there.
US intelligence has long considered Pakistan's ISI a terrorist organization. They're the same group that organized the Mumbai attacks and made sure that the shooters went around killing anyone who looked foreign. Anyone thinking they had OBL "detained" while, at the same time letting him run AQ from there, is a fucking retard.
What about all the computers they said he had at the compound with him and the documents, tapes..etc....? He was sewing money into his clothing for a quick get away but he had a whole bunch of computers and documents laying around with sensitive information on them? Sounds like if he was there he felt pretty combfortable about it. i don't know....
Are there any pictures of the blown up helicopter? I cant find any.
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Word is that they blew up the inner computer stuff, not the shell.
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The army chief of staff, Gen. Ashfaq Parvez Kayani, "made it very clear that any similar action, violating the sovereignty of Pakistan, will warrant a review on the level of military/intelligence cooperation with the United States," the statement said.
http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/asiapcf/05/07/pakistan.bin.laden/index.html?hpt=T1
General Kayani must be on crack.
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Now here's a little something that you might not like.
http://www.ibtimes.com/articles/142480/20110507/osama-bin-laden-dead-fury-sparked-among-supporters-photos.htm
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Now here's a little something that you might not like.
http://www.ibtimes.com/articles/142480/20110507/osama-bin-laden-dead-fury-sparked-among-supporters-photos.htm
Well it's pretty clear that not releasing a picture of dead Osama has placated Muslims. ::)
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:)
(http://media.staradvertiser.com/images/500*464/c7fc6a633bd7910aec0e6a70670077f7.jpg)
In this undated image taken from video provided by the U.S. Department of Defense, Osama bin Laden is shown watching himself on television in a new video released on Saturday. (AP Photo/Department of Defense)
(http://media.staradvertiser.com/images/500*374/0495e6be3bd0910aec0e6a70670047cb.jpg)
Osama bin Laden is shown In this undated image taken from new video provided by the U.S. Department of Defense.
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i bet that room smelled like shit.
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Older commentary about Abu Ghraib. Obama's positions on releasing information and pictures have been all over the place.
Obama's Abu Ghraib photo incompetence
First, the Obama Administration was going to surrender to the ACLU and release potentially inflammatory pictures of the treatment of Abu Ghraib detainees. Now, the administration is saying that Obama will oppose the release of the photos because, as the NY Times reports, “Mr. Obama changed his mind after seeing the photographs and getting warnings from top Pentagon officials that the images, taken from the early years of the wars, would ‘further inflame anti-American opinion’ and endanger troops in two war zones.”
Obama elaborated yesterday: “The publication of these photos would not add any additional benefit to our understanding of what was carried out in the past by a small number of individuals,” Mr. Obama told reporters on the South Lawn. “In fact, the most direct consequence of releasing them, I believe, would be to further inflame anti-American opinion and to put our troops in greater danger.” That certainly makes it hard to believe (particularly for people predisposed to see the worst in America) that the pictures “are not particularly sensational", as Obama added.
This circus of executive incompetence has already damaged the nation.
The problems with Obama’s logic and the necessity of his flip-flop are so many that it’s hard to know where to start, but let’s take a stab at it:
1. The Abu Ghraib photos released during the Bush Administration were probably of similar nature to the photos proposed to be released now. What about the prior photos could have made Obama believe that their release would “add any additional benefits to our understanding”? Obama’s explanation of his change of heart therefore represents either a lie or a dangerous combination of stupidity and incompetence.
2. Obama claims to have been swayed in part by warnings from top generals about the danger of releasing the pictures. However, Obama was not swayed by the protests of 4 prior CIA Directors as well as Obama’s own current CIA director when it came to the release of the probably more damaging “torture memos”. Therefore, Obama’s secondary explanation of his change of heart also rings false.
3. While I’m pleased that Obama has decided to oppose the release of the photos, his flip-flop and his public explanations of it makes the whole affair quite damaging to the nation even if the pictures are never seen by the public. This is because Obama is now saying, or at least implying, that both his view and the view of top generals is that the pictures depict treatment of prisoners harsh enough to cause a rise in anti-American sentiment or maybe even anti-American attacks. In other words, since Obama implied that the reason he opposes releasing the pictures is because they show treatment of detainees which our enemies (whether Taleban or ACLU) might find objectionable, he leaves it to people’s imaginations to create their own nightmare scenes, with the flames of anger among the American far left and the Arab street fanned by bloggers and anti-American propagandists. Indeed, if the pictures were as tame as Obama tries to imply – at the same time that he’s saying he can’t release them because they’re inflammatory – he should release them and get it over with rather than let Americans and our enemies alike imagine the worst.
Obama should have opposed the release of the pictures from the beginning. However, as the “torture memos” show, his default inclination is to blame America first, so it’s not surprising he would have at first gone along with the ACLU’s calls for releasing the pictures. But if Obama had as much sense as a box of rocks, once he made the decision to oppose the release, he should have given a bland “national security” explanation and leave it at that. Yes, it would have required him to stand up to the far left fringe of liberal activists which is clearly not his strong suit. As it stands, Obama’s explanation of his flip-flop on the release of the pictures is only slightly better than the release of inflammatory pictures might be. It’s just the latest reminder that Americans elected to the presidency a man who is clearly not ready or able to lead without the help of a teleprompter and focus group.
http://rossputin.com/blog/index.php/obama-s-abu-ghraib-photo-incompetence
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Only when it suits him personally.
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Word is that they blew up the inner computer stuff, not the shell.
So the stealth technology in terms of the actual physical tailpiece might have been left there ?
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No group of bodyguards isn't a giveaway. It makes sense that he wouldn't have his Black Guard with him as they would have been the most gigantic giveaway that he was there and moving them around with him would have made it a lot easier to track him. It's a lot easier to move one or two people than one guy with a dozen+ bodyguards like he used to have. And if he was being detained then he wouldn't have been leading Al Qaeda from there.
US intelligence has long considered Pakistan's ISI a terrorist organization. They're the same group that organized the Mumbai attacks and made sure that the shooters went around killing anyone who looked foreign. Anyone thinking they had OBL "detained" while, at the same time letting him run AQ from there, is a fucking retard.
FOX news just said they recived reports that "Osama was an operational commander till the end". and the intelligence community said they watched him for months, how do we know it wasnt years? No one can say for certain, anything is possible but if they possibly knew for that long, it doesn't make detention such a crazy idea.
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Pakistan again outs CIA station chief in Islamabad
WASHINGTON: Amid bitter, recriminatory exchanges between the United States and Pakistan over the Osama bin Laden extermination, planned bilateral visits of President Asif Ali Zardari to Washington DC and a return trip of President Barack Obama to Islamabad are both in jeopardy. Ties between the two sides are expected to slide further following Pakistan's "outing" of the CIA station chief in Islamabad on Saturday.
In a sign of how bad ties are between the two countries, Pakistani media on Saturday once again publicly named the CIA station chief in Islamabad, a breach of both protocol and trust, that is bound to enrage Washington.
A Pakistani TV channel and a newspaper considered mouthpieces of the country's military said the ISI chief Ahmed Shuja Pasha had met CIA station chief Mark Carlton to protest US incursion into Abbottabad to kill al-Qaida chief Osama bin Laden. CIA station chiefs remain anonymous and unnamed in public although the host government is told.
Earlier, the Obama administration had asked Pakistan to disclose names of its top intelligence operatives to determine whether they had contact with Osama or his agents.
The latest breach indicates that a section of the Pakistani military-intelligence establishment is determined to run the CIA out of the country fearing that the ISI's links with terror groups and its sheltering of terrorist leaders will be exposed.
Zardari has been waiting to come to US practically every week for several months now, with Hussain Haqqani, his ambassador in Washington, doing the spadework for the visit. The visit was first slated for March and then pushed to May as ties headed south after the Raymond Davis episode.
Obama meanwhile had promised to visit Pakistan when the White House announced his India trip, in part to assuage Islamabad's wounded pride at being left out. No dates were announced but it was expected sometime later this year. But Pakistans furious reaction to the wide-spread belief that it sheltered Osama has for now wrecked both trips. There is also growing realization in Washington that the military junta fully controls Pakistan and it rather pointless to publicly engage a weak civilian government that cannot deliver on promises.
The disclosure that the CIA established a safehouse in Abbottabad within sighting distance of the Osama's compound under the ISI's nose had also rattled the military brass.
And in a further embarrassment for the ISI, it now transpires that Osama lived in village just off the town of Haripur on the Abbottabad Highway for 2-1/2 years before he moved into the new compound. That would make it at least 7-1/2 years that he lived close to urban settlements.
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/world/us/Pakistan-breaches-trust-names-local-CIA-boss/articleshow/8191679.cms
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BREAKING NEWS: Osama Bin Laden found ALIVE!!!!
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BREAKING NEWS: Osama Bin Laden found ALIVE!!!!
At Disneyland?
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Guest on batchelor again said his sources are saying burial at sea is all a lie.
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Guest on batchelor again said his sources are saying burial at sea is all a lie.
Couldn't be, Obama and our government are infallible according to some on this forum. ::)
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Great show tonight as always. Batchelor is so far ahead of the rest it's not funny. Like I said panetta and Hillary seem to be the driving force behind this, not bam a.
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Got to love these liberal idiots. Bama gets credit for bin laden - but not gas prices or economy or inflation. Ha ha ha ha. Lmao.
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Got to love these liberal idiots. Bama gets credit for bin laden - but not gas prices or economy or inflation. Ha ha ha ha. Lmao.
Hahaha! Got to love it. But you forgot, "gets credit for bin laden - all while using Bush-era policies that he railed against, campaigned against and then went back on his promise to get rid of". :D
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Hahaha! Got to love it. But you forgot, "gets credit for bin laden - all while using Bush-era policies that he railed against, campaigned against and then went back on his promise to get rid of". :D
your lying is absolutely amazing..keep fooling yourself
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Couldn't be, Obama and our government are infallible according to some on this forum. ::)
"I won't stand for you saying Obama would lie about this!".........
the white house official story has been full of shit from minute one. anyone with a brain could tell that.
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Great show tonight as always. Batchelor is so far ahead of the rest it's not funny. Like I said panetta and Hillary seem to be the driving force behind this, not bam a.
again EPIC downplaying of Obama's success..sorry...no ones buying it
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Sorry douche - the stories are coming out. Jarrett, who is really the the POTUS said no to panetta, and hillary, panetta, gates, and a few others demanded that Daley knock some sense into Jarrett and they forced it.
My guess is that the military did this on their own and now bama is trying to take credit. That is why there are 10 stories already.
Funny - you want to give credit for obama in this, yet never blame him for the bad shit. I give him credit for whatever limited role he has, and also give him credit for the horrible economy and horrible gas prices and inflation.
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Sorry douche - the stories are coming out. Jarrett, who is really the the POTUS said no to panetta, and hillary, panetta, gates, and a few others demanded that Daley knock some sense into Jarrett and they forced it.
My guess is that the military did this on their own and now bama is trying to take credit. That is why there are 10 stories already.
Funny - you want to give credit for obama in this, yet never blame him for the bad shit. I give him credit for whatever limited role he has, and also give him credit for the horrible economy and horrible gas prices and inflation.
I do give him credit for the good and bad shit as you put it.....the economy is not his fault..very few presidents have an affect on the economy in a free market system and you know that deep down....you conservatives rail against interference in the free market system yet you want the president to intervene..what is he supposed to do exactly>???..yes of course in the end Obama will be blamed for the economy as he should be since he is the one currently in charge....but give him credit for the good he has done which you and the other dickfaces on here don't want to do because you are all hypocritical
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Got to love these liberal idiots. Bama gets credit for bin laden - but not gas prices or economy or inflation. Ha ha ha ha. Lmao.
lmao.. you really hate that guy dont you..lmao... had something go wrong.. you would have attached Your Presidents name all over it.. but it went off well.. so he didnt do it.. LMAO....."his security detail did.. "..hahahahah Man are you weak
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lmao.. you really hate that guy dont you..lmao... had something go wrong.. you would have attached Your Presidents name all over it.. but it went off well.. so he didnt do it.. LMAO....."his security detail did.. "..hahahahah Man are you weak
I did give him credit for going along with the plan, and thats it. He didnt say no. I give him credit for that.
And if the raid went bad, you or I would never have heard about it.
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I did give him credit for going along with the plan, and thats it. He didnt say no. I give him credit for that.
And if the raid went bad, you or I would never have heard about it.
hahahaha you are sounding more and more like a little bitch... a whiney bitch
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hahahaha you are sounding more and more like a little bitch... a whiney bitch
Bro - go print out that cowboy pic of obama and be alone with it for a bit. cool down - you and andre are a hot mess over this lately.
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Two Britons planned US raid on Osama's hideout
Prokerala News ^ | 5-8-11
Posted on Monday, May 09, 2011 1:02:03 AM by STARWISE
London, May 8
Not many may know it, but two British special forces' officers planned the May 2 US commando raid on Osama bin Laden's hideout in Pakistan in which the Al Qaeda chief was killed, a media report said Sunday.
Two officers from the Special Boat Service (SBS) could be in line for American military honours for the parts they played in planning the audacious raid on the Al Qaeda leader's compound in Abbottabad, the Sunday Express reported.
Neither the major not the captain had a "trigger job" in the fight that raged when US Navy Seals stormed Osama's lair but their top secret role has been described as crucial for the success of the mission.
Both men were involved in the detailed planning of an operation so precise that an exact replica of Osama's sprawling home was constructed in Afghanistan so the assault could be rehearsed.
The SBS officers were involved in the briefings prior to the attack.
A military insider said: "One of the things the SBS is renowned for is its specialist signals capabilities and these were used by the US forces in the days and weeks leading up to the operation."
A separate intelligence source told the Sunday Express: "We did have people on exchange but they were exchange staff officers in a role which we have maintained for many years."
The Pentagon has encouraged British involvement in some of their most secretive work in recent times because of the special forces' unrivalled expertise in urban warfare, particularly surveillance operations and raids on fortified buildings.
SAS (Special Air Services regiment) and SBS personnel have carried out as many as 2,000 assaults on Al Qaeda and Taliban strongholds in Afghanistan and Iraq over the past decade, many in close co-operation with US troops.
A spokesman for Britian's ministry of defence said: "We do not comment on special forces' matters."
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http://www.prokerala.com/news/articles/a220271.html
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lmao.. you really hate that guy dont you..lmao... had something go wrong.. you would have attached Your Presidents name all over it.. but it went off well.. so he didnt do it.. LMAO....."his security detail did.. "..hahahahah Man are you weak
EXACTLY
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EXACTLY
Like we would have heard about it? ::) ::)
Either way - I give bama credit for getting out of the way and letting the military do their thing. As for putting a crown on him and treat him like Julius Ceasar, sorry - that is something you messianic cultists of TK are doing.
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Bro - go print out that cowboy pic of obama and be alone with it for a bit. cool down - you and andre are a hot mess over this lately.
you're the one who is a hot mess over this since it shows Obama as victorious...I'm happy..you're so sad and angry inside that you have to now say that Obama had no part in the operation and that Hillary was the mastermind
Meanwhile you were killing Hillary last week because you felt she was the mastermind behind the Libyan operation...you are so mixed up that you are driving yourself crazy...you can't even keep up with the lies you're telling yourself any more
AGAIN..THE HYPOCRISY IS AMAZING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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you're the one who is a hot mess over this since it shows Obama as victorious...I'm happy..you're so sad and angry inside that you have to now say that Obama had no part in the operation and that Hillary was the mastermind
Meanwhile you were killing Hillary last week because you felt she was the mastermind behind the Libyan operation...you are so mixed up that you are driving yourself crazy...you can't even keep up with the lies you're telling yourself any more
AGAIN..THE HYPOCRISY IS AMAZING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I said Panetta. so far - the story is that Panetta was working this hard and could not get bama or jarrett on board. Panetta then went to Hillary to get her on board and she stareted applying pressure along with Gates, and eventually Daley.
Making Bama look like he is Patton racing across Europe is beyond absurd.
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Bro - go print out that cowboy pic of obama and be alone with it for a bit. cool down - you and andre are a hot mess over this lately.
hahahayou youre just talking.. i aint been on in like 6 days.. hahahahaha youre melting
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I said Panetta. so far - the story is that Panetta was working this hard and could not get bama or jarrett on board. Panetta then went to Hillary to get her on board and she stareted applying pressure along with Gates, and eventually Daley.
Making Bama look like he is Patton racing across Europe is beyond absurd.
Even if this was the case, so what???..thats the way its supposed to work...this is why presidents have advisors...some want to do this..some want to do that...some are opposed and some are against....they all put pressure on the president to see things their way....and then the president makes the decision....
its the same shit..Obama still makes the call..and he reaps the benefits or suffer the consequences when it doesn't go well.....
sorry I had to sink your ship again.....I just can't help calling you out for the idiot you are
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So when bama made the terrible calls to ban drilling, ban refinieries, ban the pipeline, ban shells' investments, etc, print dollars like no tommorow, and everything spikes from food to energy - you dont blame him for those results.
Got it. ::) ::)
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My guess is that the military did this on their own and now bama is trying to take credit.
Completely unfounded CT here ;)
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Osama bin Laden mission agreed in secret 10 years ago by US and Pakistan
US forces were given permission to conduct unilateral raid inside Pakistan if they knew where Bin Laden was hiding, officials say
guardian.co.uk, Monday 9 May 2011 19.06 BST Article history
The deal was struck between Pervez Musharraf and George Bush in 2001 and renewed during the 'transition to democracy' – a six-month period from February 2008 when Musharraf was still president but a civilian government had been elected. Photograph: Joshua Roberts/Reuters
The US and Pakistan struck a secret deal almost a decade ago permitting a US operation against Osama bin Laden on Pakistani soil similar to last week's raid that killed the al-Qaida leader, the Guardian has learned.
The deal was struck between the military leader General Pervez Musharraf and President George Bush after Bin Laden escaped US forces in the mountains of Tora Bora in late 2001, according to serving and retired Pakistani and US officials.
Under its terms, Pakistan would allow US forces to conduct a unilateral raid inside Pakistan in search of Bin Laden, his deputy, Ayman al-Zawahiri, and the al-Qaida No3. Afterwards, both sides agreed, Pakistan would vociferously protest the incursion.
"There was an agreement between Bush and Musharraf that if we knew where Osama was, we were going to come and get him," said a former senior US official with knowledge of counterterrorism operations. "The Pakistanis would put up a hue and cry, but they wouldn't stop us."
The deal puts a new complexion on the political storm triggered by Bin Laden's death in Abbottabad, 35 miles north of Islamabad, where a team of US navy Seals assaulted his safe house in the early hours of 2 May.
Pakistani officials have insisted they knew nothing of the raid, with military and civilian leaders issuing a strong rebuke to the US. If the US conducts another such assault, Prime Minister Yousaf Raza Gilani warned parliament on Monday, "Pakistan reserves the right to retaliate with full force."
Days earlier, Musharraf, now running an opposition party from exile in London, emerged as one of the most vocal critics of the raid, terming it a "violation of the sovereignty of Pakistan".
But under the terms of the secret deal, while Pakistanis may not have been informed of the assault, they had agreed to it in principle.
A senior Pakistani official said it had been struck under Musharraf and renewed by the army during the "transition to democracy" – a six-month period from February 2008 when Musharraf was still president but a civilian government had been elected.
Referring to the assault on Bin Laden's Abbottabad compound, the official added: "As far as our American friends are concerned, they have just implemented the agreement."
The former US official said the Pakistani protests of the past week were the "public face" of the deal. "We knew they would deny this stuff."
The agreement is consistent with Pakistan's unspoken policy towards CIA drone strikes in the tribal belt, which was revealed by the WikiLeaks US embassy cables last November. In August 2008, Gilani reportedly told a US official: "I don't care if they do it, as long as they get the right people. We'll protest in the National Assembly and then ignore it."
As drone strikes have escalated in the tribal belt over the past year, senior civilian and military officials issued pro forma denunciations even as it became clear the Pakistani military was co-operating with the covert programme.
The former US official said that impetus for the co-operation, much like the Bin Laden deal, was driven by the US. "It didn't come from Musharraf's desire. On the Predators, we made it very clear to them that if they weren't going to prosecute these targets, we were, and there was nothing they could do to stop us taking unilateral action.
"We told them, over and again: 'We'll stop the Predators if you take these targets out yourselves.'"
Despite several attempts to contact his London office, the Guardian has been unable to obtain comment from Musharraf.
Since Bin Laden's death, Pakistan has come under intense US scrutiny, including accusations that elements within Pakistan's Inter-Services Intelligence helped hide the al-Qaida leader.
On Sunday, President Barack Obama said Bin Laden must have had "some sort of support network" inside Pakistan.
"We don't know whether there might have been some people inside of government, outside of government, and that's something we have to investigate," Obama said.
Gilani has stood firmly by the ISI, describing it as a "national asset", and said claims that Pakistan was "in cahoots" with al-Qaida were "disingenuous".
"Allegations of complicity or incompetence are absurd," he said. "We didn't invite Osama bin Laden to Pakistan."
Gilani said the army had launched an investigation into how Bin Laden managed to hide inside Pakistan. Senior generals will give a briefing on the furore to parliament next Friday.
Gilani paid lip-service to the alliance with America and welcomed a forthcoming visit from the US secretary of state, Hillary Clinton, but pointedly paid tribute to help from China, whom he described as "a source of inspiration for the people of Pakistan".
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/may/09/osama-bin-laden-us-pakistan-deal
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Osama bin Laden mission agreed in secret 10 years ago by US and Pakistan
US forces were given permission to conduct unilateral raid inside Pakistan if they knew where Bin Laden was hiding, officials say
guardian.co.uk, Monday 9 May 2011 19.06 BST Article history
The deal was struck between Pervez Musharraf and George Bush in 2001 and renewed during the 'transition to democracy' – a six-month period from February 2008 when Musharraf was still president but a civilian government had been elected. Photograph: Joshua Roberts/Reuters
The US and Pakistan struck a secret deal almost a decade ago permitting a US operation against Osama bin Laden on Pakistani soil similar to last week's raid that killed the al-Qaida leader, the Guardian has learned.
The deal was struck between the military leader General Pervez Musharraf and President George Bush after Bin Laden escaped US forces in the mountains of Tora Bora in late 2001, according to serving and retired Pakistani and US officials.
Under its terms, Pakistan would allow US forces to conduct a unilateral raid inside Pakistan in search of Bin Laden, his deputy, Ayman al-Zawahiri, and the al-Qaida No3. Afterwards, both sides agreed, Pakistan would vociferously protest the incursion.
"There was an agreement between Bush and Musharraf that if we knew where Osama was, we were going to come and get him," said a former senior US official with knowledge of counterterrorism operations. "The Pakistanis would put up a hue and cry, but they wouldn't stop us."
The deal puts a new complexion on the political storm triggered by Bin Laden's death in Abbottabad, 35 miles north of Islamabad, where a team of US navy Seals assaulted his safe house in the early hours of 2 May.
Pakistani officials have insisted they knew nothing of the raid, with military and civilian leaders issuing a strong rebuke to the US. If the US conducts another such assault, Prime Minister Yousaf Raza Gilani warned parliament on Monday, "Pakistan reserves the right to retaliate with full force."
Days earlier, Musharraf, now running an opposition party from exile in London, emerged as one of the most vocal critics of the raid, terming it a "violation of the sovereignty of Pakistan".
But under the terms of the secret deal, while Pakistanis may not have been informed of the assault, they had agreed to it in principle.
A senior Pakistani official said it had been struck under Musharraf and renewed by the army during the "transition to democracy" – a six-month period from February 2008 when Musharraf was still president but a civilian government had been elected.
Referring to the assault on Bin Laden's Abbottabad compound, the official added: "As far as our American friends are concerned, they have just implemented the agreement."
The former US official said the Pakistani protests of the past week were the "public face" of the deal. "We knew they would deny this stuff."
The agreement is consistent with Pakistan's unspoken policy towards CIA drone strikes in the tribal belt, which was revealed by the WikiLeaks US embassy cables last November. In August 2008, Gilani reportedly told a US official: "I don't care if they do it, as long as they get the right people. We'll protest in the National Assembly and then ignore it."
As drone strikes have escalated in the tribal belt over the past year, senior civilian and military officials issued pro forma denunciations even as it became clear the Pakistani military was co-operating with the covert programme.
The former US official said that impetus for the co-operation, much like the Bin Laden deal, was driven by the US. "It didn't come from Musharraf's desire. On the Predators, we made it very clear to them that if they weren't going to prosecute these targets, we were, and there was nothing they could do to stop us taking unilateral action.
"We told them, over and again: 'We'll stop the Predators if you take these targets out yourselves.'"
Despite several attempts to contact his London office, the Guardian has been unable to obtain comment from Musharraf.
Since Bin Laden's death, Pakistan has come under intense US scrutiny, including accusations that elements within Pakistan's Inter-Services Intelligence helped hide the al-Qaida leader.
On Sunday, President Barack Obama said Bin Laden must have had "some sort of support network" inside Pakistan.
"We don't know whether there might have been some people inside of government, outside of government, and that's something we have to investigate," Obama said.
Gilani has stood firmly by the ISI, describing it as a "national asset", and said claims that Pakistan was "in cahoots" with al-Qaida were "disingenuous".
"Allegations of complicity or incompetence are absurd," he said. "We didn't invite Osama bin Laden to Pakistan."
Gilani said the army had launched an investigation into how Bin Laden managed to hide inside Pakistan. Senior generals will give a briefing on the furore to parliament next Friday.
Gilani paid lip-service to the alliance with America and welcomed a forthcoming visit from the US secretary of state, Hillary Clinton, but pointedly paid tribute to help from China, whom he described as "a source of inspiration for the people of Pakistan".
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/may/09/osama-bin-laden-us-pakistan-deal
Verrry interesting. So Dubya deserves even more credit for this. I wonder how Obama will deal with it?
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Osama bin Laden mission agreed in secret 10 years ago by US and Pakistan
US forces were given permission to conduct unilateral raid inside Pakistan if they knew where Bin Laden was hiding, officials say
guardian.co.uk, Monday 9 May 2011 19.06 BST Article history
The deal was struck between Pervez Musharraf and George Bush in 2001 and renewed during the 'transition to democracy' – a six-month period from February 2008 when Musharraf was still president but a civilian government had been elected. Photograph: Joshua Roberts/Reuters
The US and Pakistan struck a secret deal almost a decade ago permitting a US operation against Osama bin Laden on Pakistani soil similar to last week's raid that killed the al-Qaida leader, the Guardian has learned.
The deal was struck between the military leader General Pervez Musharraf and President George Bush after Bin Laden escaped US forces in the mountains of Tora Bora in late 2001, according to serving and retired Pakistani and US officials.
Under its terms, Pakistan would allow US forces to conduct a unilateral raid inside Pakistan in search of Bin Laden, his deputy, Ayman al-Zawahiri, and the al-Qaida No3. Afterwards, both sides agreed, Pakistan would vociferously protest the incursion.
"There was an agreement between Bush and Musharraf that if we knew where Osama was, we were going to come and get him," said a former senior US official with knowledge of counterterrorism operations. "The Pakistanis would put up a hue and cry, but they wouldn't stop us."
The deal puts a new complexion on the political storm triggered by Bin Laden's death in Abbottabad, 35 miles north of Islamabad, where a team of US navy Seals assaulted his safe house in the early hours of 2 May.
Pakistani officials have insisted they knew nothing of the raid, with military and civilian leaders issuing a strong rebuke to the US. If the US conducts another such assault, Prime Minister Yousaf Raza Gilani warned parliament on Monday, "Pakistan reserves the right to retaliate with full force."
Days earlier, Musharraf, now running an opposition party from exile in London, emerged as one of the most vocal critics of the raid, terming it a "violation of the sovereignty of Pakistan".
But under the terms of the secret deal, while Pakistanis may not have been informed of the assault, they had agreed to it in principle.
A senior Pakistani official said it had been struck under Musharraf and renewed by the army during the "transition to democracy" – a six-month period from February 2008 when Musharraf was still president but a civilian government had been elected.
Referring to the assault on Bin Laden's Abbottabad compound, the official added: "As far as our American friends are concerned, they have just implemented the agreement."
The former US official said the Pakistani protests of the past week were the "public face" of the deal. "We knew they would deny this stuff."
The agreement is consistent with Pakistan's unspoken policy towards CIA drone strikes in the tribal belt, which was revealed by the WikiLeaks US embassy cables last November. In August 2008, Gilani reportedly told a US official: "I don't care if they do it, as long as they get the right people. We'll protest in the National Assembly and then ignore it."
As drone strikes have escalated in the tribal belt over the past year, senior civilian and military officials issued pro forma denunciations even as it became clear the Pakistani military was co-operating with the covert programme.
The former US official said that impetus for the co-operation, much like the Bin Laden deal, was driven by the US. "It didn't come from Musharraf's desire. On the Predators, we made it very clear to them that if they weren't going to prosecute these targets, we were, and there was nothing they could do to stop us taking unilateral action.
"We told them, over and again: 'We'll stop the Predators if you take these targets out yourselves.'"
Despite several attempts to contact his London office, the Guardian has been unable to obtain comment from Musharraf.
Since Bin Laden's death, Pakistan has come under intense US scrutiny, including accusations that elements within Pakistan's Inter-Services Intelligence helped hide the al-Qaida leader.
On Sunday, President Barack Obama said Bin Laden must have had "some sort of support network" inside Pakistan.
"We don't know whether there might have been some people inside of government, outside of government, and that's something we have to investigate," Obama said.
Gilani has stood firmly by the ISI, describing it as a "national asset", and said claims that Pakistan was "in cahoots" with al-Qaida were "disingenuous".
"Allegations of complicity or incompetence are absurd," he said. "We didn't invite Osama bin Laden to Pakistan."
Gilani said the army had launched an investigation into how Bin Laden managed to hide inside Pakistan. Senior generals will give a briefing on the furore to parliament next Friday.
Gilani paid lip-service to the alliance with America and welcomed a forthcoming visit from the US secretary of state, Hillary Clinton, but pointedly paid tribute to help from China, whom he described as "a source of inspiration for the people of Pakistan".
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/may/09/osama-bin-laden-us-pakistan-deal
B-b-b-b-but according to 240 and the other guys who take turns sucking Obama's tiny pecker, Bush chose not to focus on OBL and both he and McCain said they wouldn't invade Pakistan or something retarded along those lines. It's hard trying to replicate guys who type with Obama's spunk in their eyes.
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weird... i wonder why bush let him escape capture in pakistan, as was revealed in july 14 2005, saying he was scared it would upset out paki allies.
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weird... i wonder why bush let him escape capture in pakistan, as was revealed in july 14 2005, saying he was scared it would upset out paki allies.
Maybe you should read the book written by one of the Delta force soldiers that was there, dipshit. He runs down exactly why OBL got away and the biggest reason was trusting Pakistan with the simple task of securing the mountain pass they walked right through.
But hey, let's talk about things we have no fucking clue about.
Derp, OBL's wife shot him. Derp, I'm 240 and I'm a retard. Derp.
(http://27.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lg45unzdhV1qglv1yo1_400.jpg)
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Maybe you should read the book written by one of the Delta force soldiers that was there, dipshit. He runs down exactly why OBL got away and the biggest reason was trusting Pakistan with the simple task of securing the mountain pass they walked right through.
I was under the impression that this was the case... That's how it was presented in the news... Oh wait, I'm not supposed to trust them... Only Alex Jones knows the truth right? ::)
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I was under the impression that this was the case... That's how it was presented in the news... Oh wait, I'm not supposed to trust them... Only Alex Jones knows the truth right? ::)
Why trust one of the Delta guys that was inserted half a mile ahead of anyone else alongside CIA paramilitary and was involved in fighting cave-to-cave while also taking friendly fire due to the fact no one knew they were there? Much easier to believe 240. He's got access to the internet, after all.
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no dummies :)
I'm talking about the attempt in early 2005 which was cancelled due to fears of upsetting the paki govt.
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Why trust one of the Delta guys that was inserted half a mile ahead of anyone else alongside CIA paramilitary and was involved in fighting cave-to-cave while also taking friendly fire due to the fact no one knew they were there? Much easier to believe 240. He's got access to the internet, after all.
I've talked to the CIA ground ops guys... (We worked with them here in the studio for the last MOH) and when I said, "How did Osama get away", they point blank said to me... "Ask Pakistan."
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I've talked to the CIA ground ops guys... (We worked with them here in the studio for the last MOH) and when I said, "How did Osama get away", they point blank said to me... "Ask Pakistan."
You should read the book (can't remember the name right now). He gives a few reasons for why OBL got away but his #1 was, far and away, the mistake of trusting Pakistan.
Of course, 240 knows better. He stared down some black dude at a gas station.
Must have been pretty cool meeting those guys. 8)
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You should read the book (can't remember the name right now). He gives a few reasons for why OBL got away but his #1 was, far and away, the mistake of trusting Pakistan.
Of course, 240 knows better. He stared down some black dude at a gas station.
Must have been pretty cool meeting those guys. 8)
Some interesting stories...
Apparently, to get to the US... they take all kinds of flights... hopping all over. Well one guy had taken about 10 hops or something ridiculous to get to LA all on military stuff, and ended up in LAX.
He goes to security and he's looking ridiculous and scruffy... The TSA people go to stop him for some random checks and he doesn't have any ID... He just didn't think about it... They try to give him a hard time, and he's all are you kidding me? A argument ensues... Airport police are called over... He reaches into his bag and the cops draw down on him.
He pulls out a letter (I'm not sure exactly what this letter was, but it basically says, he is in the US government and you can not detain him for ANY reason.
The cops read it... they call some number on the letter... Whoever the spooky voice was at the other end basically straightened them all out post haste and he walks right through security like he owns the place.
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Some interesting stories...
Apparently, to get to the US... they take all kinds of flights... hopping all over. Well one guy had taken about 10 hops or something ridiculous to get to LA all on military stuff, and ended up in LAX.
He goes to security and he's looking ridiculous and scruffy... The TSA people go to stop him for some random checks and he doesn't have any ID... He just didn't think about it... They try to give him a hard time, and he's all are you kidding me? A argument ensues... Airport police are called over... He reaches into his bag and the cops draw down on him.
He pulls out a letter (I'm not sure exactly what this letter was, but it basically says, he is in the US government and you can not detain him for ANY reason.
The cops read it... they call some number on the letter... Whoever the spooky voice was at the other end basically straightened them all out post haste and he walks right through security like he owns the place.
That's pretty cool. HH6 told me about the times he ran into them into Iraq and what not. I believe he said they pretty much just came and went at their own discretion and would pop up every now and then inside one of the bases.
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I've talked to the CIA ground ops guys... (We worked with them here in the studio for the last MOH) and when I said, "How did Osama get away", they point blank said to me... "Ask Pakistan."
Wht did you do for MOH?
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Wht did you do for MOH?
I'm the Senior Infrastructure Engineer in IT for Dangerclose Games and Victory Game Studio. (EALA)
From the Medal of Honor credits... About 6 lines down. (In IT) The top guy is the studio IT manager... I'm the guy below him.
(http://a3.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/149567_464594047583_577082583_5685973_1749954_n.jpg)
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we are not talking about 2001 tora bora.
talking about bush not pursuing bin laden in pakistan in 2005 when they had him in sights.
tu, that's awesome!!!!!!!!!!!!
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we are not talking about 2001 tora bora.
talking about bush not pursuing bin laden in pakistan in 2005 when they had him in sights.
tu, that's awesome!!!!!!!!!!!!
Haha. What constitutes "in their sights". A purported sighting? You seem to think tracking HVTs in an area of the world where everyone wants you dead is the easiest thing in the world. Yessir, the dozens of JSOC operators (you know, the best trained fighters on the planet) that have been killed in Pakistan since 2001 really scream "easy job".
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i think they showed the video, didn't they? tall guy in flowing white robe? surrounded with guards? we decided against the airstrike? there were threads on it here on getbig on july 14-20, back in 2005, but i am watching the nba at the moment.
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Al Queada "command center" - ha ha ha ha
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Al Queada "command center" - ha ha ha ha
Funny, but it's probably more sophisticated than the command center used to plan 9/11. :-\
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Of course Bush deserves a bunch of credit.
In a related note, Herbert Hoover won WWII.
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Well, this destroys 240's credibility for the umpteenth time:
Gutsy Call: Bush Ordered SEAL Raids Into Pakistan in 2006 and 2008
ON a moonless night, US helicopters carrying a team of America's most elite forces crossed the Afghanistan border into Pakistan in pursuit of one of the world's most wanted terrorists.
Hovering over the compound, heavily armed US Navy SEALs scrambled expertly down ladders on to Pakistani soil as Pentagon officials in Virginia watched the events unfold by video link from a camera in an unmanned drone flying over the site.
But this did not happen last week, and the target was not Osama bin Laden.
It was 2006 and the man in the American's sights was bin Laden's
al-Qa'ida deputy, Ayman al-Zawahiri, who is still believed to be hiding within or close to Pakistan's tribal areas.
The little-known operation in Pakistan's remote Bajaur Agency near the Afghan border, ultimately unsuccessful, is rarely talked about and was never publicly claimed by the US administration.
But what it reveals is that last Monday's operation, which has sparked ferocious debate in Pakistan over national sovereignty, is far from the first time that elite USforces have mounted military operations on the ground in the nuclear-armed nation.
Prime Minister Yousaf Raza Gilani was to address parliament last night to reiterate a message driven home last week by Pakistani military chiefs - that the country would not tolerate any further breaches of sovereignty by the US or any other nation.
He was also expected to announce a parliamentary inquiry into the intelligence services' failure to detect bin Laden, who lived for five years under their noses in the garrison town of Abbottabad.
Pakistani army chief General Ashfaq Parvez Kayani told senior Pakistani journalists last week that "certain red lines had been crossed" by the US military.
Several people present at that briefing have suggested the subtext of his message was that the US had crossed a line by carrying out an operation in an area where Pakistan's urban and increasingly anti-US population could bear witness to it.
The Navy SEAL operation in Bajaur Agency was first reported by The New York Times in 2008, which cited a former top CIA official as confirming the mission.
A former ISI station chief for Pakistan's Pashtun-dominated northwest and tribal areas from 2001 to 2003, Asad Munir, yesterday also confirmed the 2006 operation took place, and was different to the drone strike on a suspected Zawahiri compound in January of the same year that is said to have killed up to 25 civilians.
"They flew over in helicopters, people came out on ladders and searched the compound, found nothing, and flew back," Brigadier Munir told The Australian.
"It was known by the ISI, but not by the media, and never made it to the newspapers. It was a very low-profile operation, but I have no doubt that it occurred."
He said yet another operation occurred in 2008 just over the Afghan border in South Waziristan, in which three US special operations officers raided a madrassa suspected of being used as a base from which insurgents were firing on coalition forces.
Rustam Shah Mohmand, a former chief secretary of the northwest frontier province and Tribal Areas Commissioner, also confirmed the fact that last week's Navy SEALs raid was not the first on Pakistani soil.
"Americans have carried out small operations mostly on the border areas in the past, but they were hidden from public view," he said. "But this time they came deep inside Pakistan territory."
Authority for such sovereignty-breaching operations is believed to have been given in a 2004 classified US document called "Al-Qa'ida Network Exord", which streamlined the approval process for the US military to act outside officially declared war zones.
US President Barack Obama has conceded his administration took a giant risk by launching such a high-profile operation within an urban area when they were not certain bin Laden was even in the compound.
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/seals-have-been-over-there-before-just-quietly/story-fn8ljzlv-1226052818060
And countless other unknown excursions into Pakistan.
Onward and upward to the neck stupid fucking claim for you, 240. :)
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the event i was speaking of was 2005, wasn't it?
what does your 06 and 08 events prove?
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the event i was speaking of was 2005, wasn't it?
what does your 06 and 08 events prove?
No. The event you JUST RECENTLY started talking about was 2005. And you've yet to post anything about the event besides your opinion.
Again, your little quips and digs at Bush for not wanting to go into Pakistan have turned out to be bullshit. Thanks for playing. The dozens of dead JSOC operators killed in Pakistan over the last 10 years say hello, by the way. Twat.
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Well, this destroys 240's credibility for the umpteenth time:
Gutsy Call: Bush Ordered SEAL Raids Into Pakistan in 2006 and 2008
ON a moonless night, US helicopters carrying a team of America's most elite forces crossed the Afghanistan border into Pakistan in pursuit of one of the world's most wanted terrorists.
Hovering over the compound, heavily armed US Navy SEALs scrambled expertly down ladders on to Pakistani soil as Pentagon officials in Virginia watched the events unfold by video link from a camera in an unmanned drone flying over the site.
But this did not happen last week, and the target was not Osama bin Laden.
It was 2006 and the man in the American's sights was bin Laden's
al-Qa'ida deputy, Ayman al-Zawahiri, who is still believed to be hiding within or close to Pakistan's tribal areas.
The little-known operation in Pakistan's remote Bajaur Agency near the Afghan border, ultimately unsuccessful, is rarely talked about and was never publicly claimed by the US administration.
But what it reveals is that last Monday's operation, which has sparked ferocious debate in Pakistan over national sovereignty, is far from the first time that elite USforces have mounted military operations on the ground in the nuclear-armed nation.
Prime Minister Yousaf Raza Gilani was to address parliament last night to reiterate a message driven home last week by Pakistani military chiefs - that the country would not tolerate any further breaches of sovereignty by the US or any other nation.
He was also expected to announce a parliamentary inquiry into the intelligence services' failure to detect bin Laden, who lived for five years under their noses in the garrison town of Abbottabad.
Pakistani army chief General Ashfaq Parvez Kayani told senior Pakistani journalists last week that "certain red lines had been crossed" by the US military.
Several people present at that briefing have suggested the subtext of his message was that the US had crossed a line by carrying out an operation in an area where Pakistan's urban and increasingly anti-US population could bear witness to it.
The Navy SEAL operation in Bajaur Agency was first reported by The New York Times in 2008, which cited a former top CIA official as confirming the mission.
A former ISI station chief for Pakistan's Pashtun-dominated northwest and tribal areas from 2001 to 2003, Asad Munir, yesterday also confirmed the 2006 operation took place, and was different to the drone strike on a suspected Zawahiri compound in January of the same year that is said to have killed up to 25 civilians.
"They flew over in helicopters, people came out on ladders and searched the compound, found nothing, and flew back," Brigadier Munir told The Australian.
"It was known by the ISI, but not by the media, and never made it to the newspapers. It was a very low-profile operation, but I have no doubt that it occurred."
He said yet another operation occurred in 2008 just over the Afghan border in South Waziristan, in which three US special operations officers raided a madrassa suspected of being used as a base from which insurgents were firing on coalition forces.
Rustam Shah Mohmand, a former chief secretary of the northwest frontier province and Tribal Areas Commissioner, also confirmed the fact that last week's Navy SEALs raid was not the first on Pakistani soil.
"Americans have carried out small operations mostly on the border areas in the past, but they were hidden from public view," he said. "But this time they came deep inside Pakistan territory."
Authority for such sovereignty-breaching operations is believed to have been given in a 2004 classified US document called "Al-Qa'ida Network Exord", which streamlined the approval process for the US military to act outside officially declared war zones.
US President Barack Obama has conceded his administration took a giant risk by launching such a high-profile operation within an urban area when they were not certain bin Laden was even in the compound.
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/seals-have-been-over-there-before-just-quietly/story-fn8ljzlv-1226052818060
And countless other unknown excursions into Pakistan.
Onward and upward to the neck stupid fucking claim for you, 240. :)
That's why we needed Obama. Bush failed by putting a majority of his resources into Iraq.
That's a fact whether you like or not, kid.
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That's why we needed Obama. Bush failed by putting a majority of his resources into Iraq.
That's a fact whether you like or not, kid.
That makes zero sense. It wasn't resources or a surge that resulted in killing Osama. It was a handful of SEALS.
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That makes zero sense. It wasn't resources or a surge that resulted in killing Osama. It was a handful of SEALS.
True... The two are not connected.
Should Bush have stayed out of Iraq... yes.
Did he do good things in Afghanistan / Pakistan too though... yes.
They are not mutually inclusive.
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Iran can prove Bin Laden was dead long before US raid – Iranian minister
RT.com ^ | May 11 2011 | RT.com
Iranian Intelligence Minister Heydar Moslehi claims that Osama Bin Laden died from an illness before the US raid on his compound in Abbottabad. Iran has documents to prove it, he said.
"We have credible information that Bin Laden died some time ago of a disease," Moslehi said on the sidelines of a cabinet meeting on Sunday, as quoted by ISNA news agency.
(Excerpt) Read more at rt.com ...
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Iran can prove Bin Laden was dead long before US raid – Iranian minister
RT.com ^ | May 11 2011 | RT.com
Iranian Intelligence Minister Heydar Moslehi claims that Osama Bin Laden died from an illness before the US raid on his compound in Abbottabad. Iran has documents to prove it, he said.
"We have credible information that Bin Laden died some time ago of a disease," Moslehi said on the sidelines of a cabinet meeting on Sunday, as quoted by ISNA news agency.
(Excerpt) Read more at rt.com ...
You believe something that Iran says?
That pretty much means that we can bet the US killed him.
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No, I'm just reporting what i read.
I believe the SEALS (Who i have endless admiration for) killed him in that room, but OBL was probably on the floor in the fetal position at the time. Not like i care, shit - i would not have shot him myself - but stabbed him endlessly with my KA BAR.
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That's why we needed Obama. Bush failed by putting a majority of his resources into Iraq.
That's a fact whether you like or not, kid.
That entire post was one gigantic contradiction. It's clear that you don't possess the mental firepower to troll beyond making posts about dicks in your ass. I suggest you stick to those.
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That entire post was one gigantic contradiction. It's clear that you don't possess the mental firepower to troll beyond making posts about dicks in your ass. I suggest you stick to those.
One gigantic contradiction.
I broke it up into small sentences just for you.
I don't find your criticism constructive, buddy.
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Iran can prove Bin Laden was dead long before US raid – Iranian minister
RT.com ^ | May 11 2011 | RT.com
LOL! I love it how they paint it as iran's story. So to even look at the info there, or any evidence they may present, is instantly stained. Smart!
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Inhofe first member of congress to see Bin Laden photos
Last Updated: 4 hours and 2 minutes ago
By: Jason Grubbs
www.drudgereport.com
TULSA - More people are starting to see photos of Osama Bin Laden's body.
On Wednesday, U.S. Senator Jim Inhofe was the first member of Congress to view them.
Fifteen images were shown during a secure briefing with the Senator.
"It's a little easier for me to talk to people and say what I've seen. I felt like I owed that to my constituents," Sen. Inhofe (R) said.
He talked with 2NEWS via Skype from Washington, D.C. after seeing them.
He said several of the photos were taken inside the compound where Bin Laden was killed.
"The bullet either went in the ear and out the eyeball or in the eyeball and out the ear," he said.
The senator said the most identifying photos were taken onboard the USS Carl Vinson.
That's the aircraft carrier where Bin Laden's body was cleaned before the burial at sea.
"It's easier to identify who it is by looking at those shots," he said.
Senator Inhofe told 2NEWS he didn't have doubts before and he doesn't now.
He said some of the pictures are graphic. But he continues to rally for at least one of them to be released to the public.
"I just want to make sure that the people are entitled to and have a picture that they can look at and say he's dead," Sen. Inhofe said.
The Obama administration has said a release could spark retaliation.
Senator Inhofe calls that a "phony argument."
"Since 9/11 there have been 32 attacks on America that we stopped through our intelligence. They would do anything they could to kill everyone of us who's watching right now if they could. But this isn't going to make them try anymore, they're trying right now anyway," he said.
The office of Oklahoma Congressman Dan Boren (D) told 2NEWS he is expected to view the photos sometime this week.
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Definately going to be CT's now.
http://dailycaller.com/2011/05/11/inhofe-gruesome-photos-reveal-bin-laden-in-nothing-but-his-underwear-when-shot
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The Gun That Killed Bin Laden Revealed...(HK416-5.56)
USNews ^ | 05/11/2011 | Paul Bedard
Sources say the HK416 rifle was used to kill bin Laden. The biggest secret in the special operations community—what gun did SEALs from "DevGru" kill Osama bin Laden with—has been revealed. Two military gear blogs, citing multiple insider sources, credit the highly reliable HK416 rifle, an M-16 type weapon, with the "double tap" of 5.56 mm bullets to bin Laden's head.
While the military isn't talking about what SEALs from United States Naval Special Warfare Development Group, formerly SEAL Team Six, carried in, two sites—Military Times Gear Scout and Soldier Systems—said the gun used was the German made, Delta Force designed Heckler & Koch rifle used by several militaries.
"I've just heard from a SOCOM vet," says Military Times "He tells me the stack of SEAL assaulters from Red team that went through Osama bin Laden's bedroom door were running HK416s."
Soldier Systems adds that bin Laden "was gunned down using German engineering – the HK416 which was my gut feeling from the very beginning."
(Excerpt) Read more at usnews.com ...
________________________ ________________________ _______________
hhhhmmm - maybe need to get one.
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which getbigger claimed it was a handgun? LOL!
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which getbigger claimed it was a handgun? LOL!
Not me - I like my Bushmaster and Glocks.
Only Gun I dont have but really want is the SA SOCOM 2
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which getbigger claimed it was a handgun? LOL!
Actually... no one claimed it was a handgun.
They claimed it could be one of many weapons, but that at the time we didn't know what the gun was... As a matter of fact... I listed a whole shit ton of possibilities... I think left out the 416 though, but yes... It's a very viable option. I can put my hands on one if need be.
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Actually... no one claimed it was a handgun.
They claimed it could be one of many weapons, but that at the time we didn't know what the gun was... As a matter of fact... I listed a whole shit ton of possibilities... I think left out the 416 though, but yes... It's a very viable option. I can put my hands on one if need be.
Can you get me a leftover for free? ;D
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Can you get me a leftover for free? ;D
HAHAHA!!!
I wish... Notice I said put my hands on one... I didn't say I own it.
Sometimes a couple of the Tier1 guys will go with us out to the desert to shoot their toys.
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which getbigger claimed it was a handgun? LOL!
You claimed OBL's wife killed him. You think she had a HK416 in her hands? Maybe she picked it up in between broadcasting holograms of planes flying into skyscrapers.
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Ha ha ha ha ha lmfao!
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You claimed OBL's wife killed him. You think she had a HK416 in her hands? Maybe she picked it up in between broadcasting holograms of planes flying into skyscrapers.
good one ;)
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You claimed OBL's wife killed him.
No, I didn't.
I said we don't know what happened in that room because the white house keeps changing the story.
Maybe we shot him after he surrendered. Maybe his wife did it. Maybe he capped himself. Maybe he was cowering in his underwear. Maybe he was armed, maybe unarmed.
So much bullshit coming out of the white house, we will probably never know what really happened in that room.
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http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2011/05/12/eveningnews/main20062410.shtml?tag=cbsContent;cbsCarousel
The electronic files the SEALs carted away from bin Laden's compound contain -- among many things -- the names of terrorist operatives which until now were unknown to U.S. intelligence. The files also contain a small, 12-page journal of bin Laden's handwritten notes about launching a major attack against the United States. He instructed against using Arabs because they arouse too much suspicion, to go after trains and to time the attack to coincide with the 10th anniversary of September 11.
Bin Laden wanted to attack U.S. on 9/11 anniversary
There are also messages to his senior lieutenants and to al Qaeda affiliates, urging them not to waste time on small, local operations and focus their efforts on the United States.
Ruppersberger said, "He kept all that information and he kept all of the data, computers, hard drives and this is what we're analyzing and it shows that his focus was clearly the United States."
U.S. officials cannot understand why bin Laden apparently left what amounts to the keys to his terrorist kingdom just lying around his compound in plain sight -- none of it rigged for self destruction.
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CBS Evening News .May 12, 2011
SEAL helmet cams recorded entire bin Laden raid
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2011/05/12/eveningnews/main20062410.shtml?tag=cbsContent;cbsCarousel
More accurate version of what happened includes details that bin Laden first emerged on third floor, retreated to bedroom after shot fired
By David Martin .
Every minute of the raid that killed Osama bin Laden was captured by the SEALs' tiny helmet cams, and the video is now helping investigators construct a picture of exactly how it all went down. David Martin reports.
.(CBS News) WASHINGTON - A new picture emerged Thursday of what really happened the night the Navy SEALs swooped in on Osama bin Laden's compound in Pakistan.
CBS News national security correspondent David Martin reports the 40 minutes it took to kill bin Laden and scoop his archives into garbage bags were all recorded by tiny helmet cameras worn by each of the 25 SEALs.
Officials reviewing those videos are still reconstructing a more accurate version of what happened. We now know that the only firefight took place in the guest house, where one of bin Laden's couriers opened fire and was quickly gunned down. No one in the main building got off a shot or was even armed, although there were weapons nearby.
Special Report: The Killing of Osama bin Laden
The SEALs first saw bin Laden when he came out on the third floor landing. They fired, but missed. He retreated to his bedroom, and the first SEAL through the door grabbed bin Laden's daughters and pulled them aside.
When the second SEAL entered, bin Laden's wife rushed forward at him -- or perhaps was pushed by bin Laden. The SEAL shoved her aside and shot bin Laden in the chest. A third seal shot him in the head.
The top Democrat on the House Intelligence Committee went to CIA headquarters Thursday to view photos the SEALs took of bin Laden's body.
Lawmakers see bin Laden photos
"There were probably about maybe four, five or six photos," said Rep. C.A. Dutch Ruppersberger, D-Md. "There are just a couple body shots. He was like, in a white undershirt and a tan robe."
The electronic files the SEALs carted away from bin Laden's compound contain -- among many things -- the names of terrorist operatives which until now were unknown to U.S. intelligence. The files also contain a small, 12-page journal of bin Laden's handwritten notes about launching a major attack against the United States. He instructed against using Arabs because they arouse too much suspicion, to go after trains and to time the attack to coincide with the 10th anniversary of September 11.
Bin Laden wanted to attack U.S. on 9/11 anniversary
There are also messages to his senior lieutenants and to al Qaeda affiliates, urging them not to waste time on small, local operations and focus their efforts on the United States.
Ruppersberger said, "He kept all that information and he kept all of the data, computers, hard drives and this is what we're analyzing and it shows that his focus was clearly the United States."
U.S. officials cannot understand why bin Laden apparently left what amounts to the keys to his terrorist kingdom just lying around his compound in plain sight -- none of it rigged for self destruction.The killing of Osama bin Laden
Why didn't bin Laden protect his files? The best guess is he thought the United States would never find him.
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but but but but I thought Hilary claimed they weren't even watching anything there.
I'm sure every single eyeball in that room was just fixed on a spot on that wall for no reason, huh? ;)
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but but but but I thought Hilary claimed they weren't even watching anything there.
I'm sure every single eyeball in that room was just fixed on a spot on that wall for no reason, huh? ;)
They were proably reviewing obama's bullshit BC he put out.
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They were proably reviewing obama's bullshit BC he put out.
weak sauce
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..Exclusive: Pornography found in bin Laden hideout: officials
By Mark Hosenball and Tabassum Zakaria | Reuters – 37 minutes ago
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - A stash of pornography was found in the hideout of Osama bin Laden by the U.S. commandos who killed him, current and former U.S. officials said on Friday.
The pornography recovered in bin Laden's compound in Abbottabad, Pakistan, consists of modern, electronically recorded video and is fairly extensive, according to the officials, who discussed the discovery with Reuters on condition of anonymity.
The officials said they were not yet sure precisely where in the compound the pornography was discovered or who had been viewing it. Specifically, the officials said they did not know if bin Laden himself had acquired or viewed the materials.
Reports from Abbottabad have said that bin Laden's compound was cut off from the Internet or other hard-wired communications networks. It is unclear how compound residents would have acquired the pornography.
But a video released by the Obama administration confiscated from the compound showed bin Laden watching pictures of himself on a TV screen, indicating that the compound was equipped with video playback equipment.
Materials carted away from the compound by the U.S. commandos included digital thumb drives, which U.S. officials believe may have been a principal means by which couriers carried electronic messages to and from the late al Qaeda leader.
Three other U.S. officials familiar with evidence gathered during investigations of other Islamic militants said the discovery of pornography is not uncommon in such cases.
(Reporting by Mark Hosenball and Tabassum Zakaria; editing by Warren Strobel)
..
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Shocker.
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Justice Stevens says bin Laden killing legally justified
By Bill Mears, CNN Supreme Court Producer
May 13, 2011
Washington (CNN) -- Retired Supreme Court Justice John Paul Stevens has voiced support for the killing of al Qaeda terrorist leader Osama bin Laden by U.S. forces, saying it was legally justified.
In remarks Thursday evening at his alma mater, Northwestern University, the 91-year-old former justice said the order by President Barack Obama for the covert mission by U.S. Navy SEALs was "to remove an enemy who had been trying every day to attack the United States," according to two people who attended a symposium and dinner that was closed to the media.
Stevens said he was pleased the president took the risky decision to launch the May 2 commando assault on bin Laden's compound in Pakistan. The justice added, "I must say I was very proud of the SEALs."
No sitting member of the Supreme Court has commented on the bin Laden killing and is not likely to, since current or related executive branch issues may someday come before them.
There have been legal questions surrounding whether U.S. and international law would permit a unilateral executive decision to kill a terrorist leader with no ties to any government. Attorney General Eric Holder said the day after the mission, "It's lawful to target an enemy commander in the field."
As founder and head of al Qaeda, bin Laden was viewed by the administration as a combatant actively involved in past and current hostilities against the United States and other countries.
The insistence by Obama officials that the killing was justified come despite bin Laden not being armed when commandos stormed his third-floor room. Those officials insist the Saudi native "resisted" and made no clear indication he would surrender.
Stevens said based on his knowledge of the facts, "I haven't the slightest doubt it was entirely appropriate for American forces to act" as they did. "It was not merely to do justice and avenge September 11."
The Wall Street Journal Law Blog first reported Stevens' remarks.
He stepped down from the high court last year after nearly 35 years on the bench, and was replaced by Justice Elena Kagan.
Unusually for a retired justice, he has been outspoken on current hot-button cases his former colleagues are considering and on other news events. He voiced support in November for a planned Islamic community center near the site of the September 11 terrorist attacks in New York, urging religious and ethnic tolerance.
He announced this week he has almost completed writing a memoir of sorts, a look at the five chief justices he has known and worked with over the past 64 years. Called the "Five Chiefs," and to be published by Little Brown this October, the book will also give an inside look at the court and Stevens' personal insights on colleagues past and present, including current Chief Justice John Roberts.
Before retiring, Stevens had been a consistent supporter of limited rights for terror suspects in U.S. custody overseas to challenge their detention in federal courts. In the first terrorism case to arise in the high court from the 9/11 attacks, Stevens said foreign-born terror suspects captured abroad and held at a Navy-run prison at Guantánamo Bay, Cuba, did have some basic rights.
"What is presently at stake is only whether the federal courts have jurisdiction to determine the legality of the executive's potentially indefinite detention of individuals who claim to be wholly innocent of wrongdoing," he wrote in 2004.
Stevens is a World War II veteran. He served as an intelligence officer in Hawaii, where his work included supervising the cracking of secret Japanese codes. He was speaking in public Friday to graduates at his old law school in Chicago, where he graduated in 1947 at the top of his class.
http://www.cnn.com/2011/US/05/13/scotus.stevens.bin.laden/index.html?hpt=T2
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:)
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.,
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I'm just tired of all the god damn bullshit... I feel like everyone is fucking crazy.
x2 I should have known that it was all just a CT thing.... SEAL's can't possibly pull off an eye shot with night vision goggles on.... or how about just plain dumb luck? whatever, the pile of smelly camel shit is dead and the entire world is better off for it.
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..Exclusive: Pornography found in bin Laden hideout: officials
By Mark Hosenball and Tabassum Zakaria | Reuters – 37 minutes ago
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - A stash of pornography was found in the hideout of Osama bin Laden by the U.S. commandos who killed him, current and former U.S. officials said on Friday.
The pornography recovered in bin Laden's compound in Abbottabad, Pakistan, consists of modern, electronically recorded video and is fairly extensive, according to the officials, who discussed the discovery with Reuters on condition of anonymity.
The officials said they were not yet sure precisely where in the compound the pornography was discovered or who had been viewing it. Specifically, the officials said they did not know if bin Laden himself had acquired or viewed the materials.
Reports from Abbottabad have said that bin Laden's compound was cut off from the Internet or other hard-wired communications networks. It is unclear how compound residents would have acquired the pornography.
But a video released by the Obama administration confiscated from the compound showed bin Laden watching pictures of himself on a TV screen, indicating that the compound was equipped with video playback equipment.
Materials carted away from the compound by the U.S. commandos included digital thumb drives, which U.S. officials believe may have been a principal means by which couriers carried electronic messages to and from the late al Qaeda leader.
Three other U.S. officials familiar with evidence gathered during investigations of other Islamic militants said the discovery of pornography is not uncommon in such cases.
(Reporting by Mark Hosenball and Tabassum Zakaria; editing by Warren Strobel)
..
lol, now they say he has a huge stash of porn?!
Oh boy. They really are going for the gold on this story arent they? I mean I know hes a bad guy and all but this is ridiculous. There's enough factual evidence out there that proves our government lies to us day in and day out and is corrupt to the core but know i'm suppose to believe they are honest about this and foriegn policy decisions and god knows what else surrounding the whole thing? So he alluded capture for 10 years but when they catch him he has a diary, computers and documents, flash cards with vital info, had money sewn into his clothes for quick escape and a chest full of porn?! If anyone believes this you need to get your head examined, that I'm sure of.
The whole thing stinks to high heaven. I'm more cynical then ever when it comes to what they tell me.
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I'm thinking they knew he was there all along and did this to prop up Obama as he was nearing no mans land politically.
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I'm thinking they knew he was there all along and did this to prop up Obama as he was nearing no mans land politically.
People need to step out of their emotional zone for a minute or two and really think about this. I have never defended Bin Laden so I don't even want to hear someone say that I am, but god damn something aint right here. I dont think the guys from Southpark could right a stranger script. i just want the truth but it's hard to beleive anything a when the higher ups have a track record of being full of shit and protecting their own. Just look at the economis crisis as an example. Who's in jail? Who is paying the price? etc...now Im suppose to beleive this stranger than strange story.
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I love how they are calling this place a command center. Ha ha.
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I love how they are calling this place a command center. Ha ha.
lol
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Oh boy. They really are going for the gold on this story arent they? I mean I know hes a bad guy and all but this is ridiculous.
It's so funny. People on getbig call obama a liar nonstop.
however, on this bin laden thing, they get upset and angry when people don't believe the ever-changing tale that the white house is telling us about this event.
the first story stunk to high heaven. now they just keep piling on. next it'll be 'we found bacon in his fridge'.
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It's so funny. People on getbig call obama a liar nonstop.
however, on this bin laden thing, they get upset and angry when people don't believe the ever-changing tale that the white house is telling us about this event.
the first story stunk to high heaven. now they just keep piling on. next it'll be 'we found bacon in his fridge'.
This whole thing with the live video is also strange.
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next it'll be 'we found bacon in his fridge'.
LMAO
Im preparing myself.
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theres also something bugging my about the tail piece of the helicopter. As far as i know they just left it there, Now you got these pakistani guys saying the might give it to China to take a look at it? wtf? I hope this isnt true. Didn't they blow that thing sky high? Why not make sure it's totally destroyed or is there something deeper going on here, like some form of "payoff" or some shit? I don't know...
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lol
My office is more high tech than this hovel.
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(http://fastcache.gawkerassets.com/assets/images/4/2011/05/osama-porn-stash-like.jpg)
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This whole thing with the live video is also strange.
what was the deal with that? first, it was "everyone watches as the events unfold".
Then it was hilary saying "we weren't watching anything, and I was coughing at the moment - with my eyes open".
history books will be written about that day, and Obama can't make up his mind.
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(http://fastcache.gawkerassets.com/assets/images/4/2011/05/osama-porn-stash-like.jpg)
Ha ha ha
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You guys must be on weed.
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Osama Bin Laden wanted to assassinate President Obama as in the run up to the 2012 presidential elections, the terror leader’s journal seized by U.S. forces reveals.
The mastermind behind the 9/11 attacks wanted to kill the President in a follow up mission, 10 years after the devastating 2001 attack.
U.S. intelligence officials are currently analysing over one million pages of data taken from the terror leader’s compound, including his handwritten journal.
The documents reveal that the Al Qaeda leader was still plotting attacks against the U.S. and wanted to find a way to kill Obama.
Bin Laden’s own writings indicate that he had urged followers to assassinate Obama as a way of disrupting the 2012 presidential election.
Former intelligence officials said that Bin Laden was focussed on killing the President
::)
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Osama smoked weed.
Weed and porn? Shhheeeaat.
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Weed and porn? Shhheeeaat.
Osama was gangsta
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Osama was gangsta
So it would seem.
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ttt
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Bush breaks silence on bin Laden
By: CNN's Rebecca Stewart
(CNN)-In his first informal comments following the death of Osama bin Laden, President George W. Bush said he was not “overjoyed” at the news of the bin Laden's death but it was a “good call” to mount the Navy SEAL operation into Pakistan and go after the terrorist leader.
According to ABC News, Bush told a crowd of 1,800 hedge fund managers in Las Vegas that the mission he initiated to track down bin Laden almost ten years ago following 9/11 was not "out of hatred but to exact judgment."
Still, "The guy is dead. That is good," Bush said. "Osama's death is a great victory in the war on terror."
The former commander-in-chief who famously vowed to bring justice to those responsible for 9/11 and "smoke them out of their holes," released a written statement following the assault on bin Laden’s compound, saying, “This momentous achievement marks a victory for America, for people who seek peace around the world, and for all those who lost loved ones on September 11, 2001.”
“The fight against terror goes on, but tonight America has sent an unmistakable message: No matter how long it takes, justice will be done,” he said.
Bush later declined an invitation to visit Ground Zero with the president four days after bin Laden was killed, and refused requests for interviews.
President Obama called both Bush and former President Clinton following the raid to deliver the news of bin Laden’s death personally. Bush revealed Wednesday that upon hearing the details from President Obama of the success of the Navy SEAL team’s mission, he told Obama, "good call."
Bush said he was eating soufflé with Laura Bush and two friends when he got the call from the president. He then excused himself and returned home to take Obama's call.
http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2011/05/13/bush-breaks-silence-on-bin-laden/
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;D
http://www.funnyordie.com/videos/8e464776e6/the-navy-seal-who-killed-osama-bin-laden
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;D
http://www.funnyordie.com/videos/8e464776e6/the-navy-seal-who-killed-osama-bin-laden
lol
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;D
http://www.funnyordie.com/videos/8e464776e6/the-navy-seal-who-killed-osama-bin-laden
FUNNY!!!! :D
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Bush breaks silence on bin Laden
By: CNN's Rebecca Stewart
(CNN)-In his first informal comments following the death of Osama bin Laden, President George W. Bush said he was not “overjoyed” at the news of the bin Laden's death but it was a “good call” to mount the Navy SEAL operation into Pakistan and go after the terrorist leader.
Well that settles it, Bush is obviously an al qaeda sympathizer. Has he started attending Ron Paul rallies? We should have him checked out.
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if Obama had said he was not overjoyed, we'd hear all about how he's soft on extremists or a sympathizer.
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Well that settles it, Bush is obviously an al qaeda sympathizer. Has he started attending Ron Paul rallies? We should have him checked out.
Bush would have taken Osama out. Ron Paul would not have:
Bush revealed Wednesday that upon hearing the details from President Obama of the success of the Navy SEAL team’s mission, he told Obama, "good call."
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Bush would have taken Osama out. Ron Paul would not have:
Bush revealed Wednesday that upon hearing the details from President Obama of the success of the Navy SEAL team’s mission, he told Obama, "good call."
Exactly right. I have always said that Ron Paul would be worse on foreign policy than Obama. That's why I wont pull the lever for him if he wins the nomination.
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Was on the Mighty Mo today and read this story. Reminded me of the Osama sea burial.
Attack on the USS Missouri
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/05/Kamikaze_zero.jpg/220px-Kamikaze_zero.jpg)
Japanese A6M Zero about to strike the side of USS Missouri on April 11, 1945
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/bb/USS_Missouri_from_bow.jpg/220px-USS_Missouri_from_bow.jpg)
USS Missouri permanently anchored as a museum ship at Pearl Harbor in 2002
At 2:42 PM on April 11, 1945, off the coast of Kikaijima Island, a Japanese fighter pilot in an A6M5c Zero launched a kamikaze attack on the USS Missouri. Bill Obitz, a Seaman at the time, recalled that the attacking plane approached at an extreme angle and estimated that it was 20 feet (6 m) above the water. Although struck by intense antiaircraft fire, the plane survived and struck the ship's starboard side at frame 169 below the main deck. While the impact of one of the plane's wings started a fire at 5-inch mount number 3, its 500-pound bomb did not detonate, so the damage was minimal. There were no American casualties, but the Japanese pilot died. Parts of the plane's wreckage and the top half of the pilot's body landed on board. The plane's wing was turned over to the crew to be cut up for souvenirs.
Despite protests from some of his crew, Callaghan insisted that the young Japanese airman had done his job to the best of his ability, with honor, and deserved a military funeral. Stephen Cromwell, a corpsman at the time, later recalled, "I was able to recover his body and I called up to the bridge to ask if I should throw it overboard ... Captain Callaghan said, ‘No, when we secure, take it down to the sick bay, and we'll have a burial for him tomorrow.’" Ivan Dexter, another crew member, gave his account of events to Herb Fahr, recalling that the top half of the Japanese pilot's body was scattered over the deck, while the bottom half fell with the rest of the plane into the sea. What remained of the body was brought to sick bay for examination, and various Missouri crew took souvenirs from the clothing, including the helmet, scarf, and jacket. Following examination, the remains were placed in a canvas bag with dummy shell casings to weigh it down.
The following day, the Japanese pilot received a military funeral at sea. An improvised Japanese flag, sewn by one of the ship's bosun's mates, covered the bag holding the man's remains. The ship's chaplain committed the body to the sea and the six pallbearers let it slide overboard, accompanied by a volley of rifle fire. Fahr wrote, "There was still much bitterness on the part of many in the crew, but now, the honorable thing was done." According to Lee Collins, visitor operations director for the Battleship Missouri Memorial, Callaghan said that the ceremony was simply a tribute to "a fellow warrior who had displayed courage and devotion, and who had paid the ultimate sacrifice with his life, fighting for his country."
On May 14, 1945, Callaghan passed command of the Missouri on to Captain Stuart Murray, who had been a classmate of his at the US Naval Academy.
. . .
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_M._Callaghan#Attack_on_the_USS_Missouri
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Cool. But I have heard a few stories than obl was not buried at sea at all. Could be nonsense, but Batchelor is usually very good with his sources.
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Cool. But I have heard a few stories than obl was not buried at sea at all. Could be nonsense, but Batchelor is usually very good with his sources.
I wouldn't be shocked if wasn't buried at sea right away.
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I wouldn't be shocked if wasn't buried at sea right away.
I'm sure they kicked, mutilated, and spit on the body before dumping his ass into the ocean :)
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LEAKED STRATFOR EMAILS: Analysts Didn't Believe Bin Laden Was Buried At Sea
Michael Kelley | 2 hours ago | 2,630 | 19
STRATFOR On Assange: 'Bankrupt The A-------, Ruin His Life, Give Him 7-12 For Conspiracy'BOOM! Obama Just Played The Bin Laden CardDemocrats Release New Video Touting Obama's Role In Osama Bin Laden Killing
Stratfor analysts did not believe that Osama bin Laden was buried at sea, according to Stratfor emails leaked by WikiLeaks.
At 5:26 a.m. on May 2, the morning after Barack Obama announced the successful raid on bin Laden's Abbottabad compound, Stratfor CEO George Friedman sent an email with the subject "[alpha] OBL" that said:
Reportedly, we took the body with us. Thank goodness.
Fred Burton, Stratfor's vice president for intelligence, followed that up at 5:51 a.m. with an email titled "[alpha] Body bound for Dover, DE on CIA plane" that said:
Than [sic] onward to the Armed Forces Institute of Pathology in Bethesda.
At 1:36 p.m. Burton replied to a thread named "Re: OBL's corpse" with the message:
Body is Dover bound, should be here by now.
That contradicts the official story that his body was handled in accordance with Islamic tradition and released into the sea from a U.S. Navy vessel.
WikiLeaks has published 442 out of what they say is a cache of 5 million internal emails from the private US security firm dated between July 2004 to December 2011.
Tags: Wikileaks, Osama bin Laden, Stratfor , Barack Obama, 2012 Election, Republicans, Mitt Romney, Democrats | Get Alerts for these topics »
Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/leaked-emails-stratfor-analysts-didnt-believe-laden-was-buried-at-sea-2012-3#ixzz1nuYP9Mk6