Getbig.com: American Bodybuilding, Fitness and Figure
Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: The True Adonis on September 29, 2014, 08:56:45 AM
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I feel this is the most optimal way to train. The pumps you get are absolutely insane. Another interesting note is that the workout forces you to stay intensely focused and what this does, engages and syncs your brain to the work being performed and nothing else. From the start you are put immediately "in the zone" or what is known in psychology as the Flow, the mental state of operation in which a person performing an activity is fully immersed in a feeling of energized focus, full involvement, and enjoyment in the process of the activity. In essence, flow is characterized by complete absorption in what one does. I experience this all the time, especially when gaming where a lot of studies are being made regarding this phenomena. I also used to get permanently locked in this state of mind driving at high speeds instantly.
Here is a little more info on the Flow:
Proposed by Mihály Csíkszentmihályi, this positive psychology concept has been widely referenced across a variety of fields.[1]
According to Csikszentmihalyi, flow is completely focused motivation. It is a single-minded immersion and represents perhaps the ultimate experience in harnessing the emotions in the service of performing and learning. In flow, the emotions are not just contained and channeled, but positive, energized, and aligned with the task at hand. The hallmark of flow is a feeling of spontaneous joy, even rapture, while performing a task[2] although flow is also described (below) as a deep focus on nothing but the activity – not even oneself or one's emotions.
Flow has many of the same characteristics as (the positive aspects of) hyperfocus. However, hyperfocus is not always described in such universally glowing terms. For examples, some cases of spending "too much" time playing video games, or of getting side-tracked and pleasurably absorbed by one aspect of an assignment or task to the detriment of the assignment in general. In some cases, hyperfocus can "grab" a person, perhaps causing him or her to appear unfocused or to start several projects, but complete few.
Components of flow
Nakamura and Csíkszentmihályi identify the following six factors as encompassing an experience of flow. [3]
intense and focused concentration on the present moment
merging of action and awareness
a loss of reflective self-consciousness
a sense of personal control or agency over the situation or activity
a distortion of temporal experience, one's subjective experience of time is altered
experience of the activity as intrinsically rewarding, also referred to as autotelic experience
Conditions for flow
Mental state in terms of challenge level and skill level, according to Csikszentmihalyi's flow model.[7] (Click on a fragment of the image to go to the appropriate article)
A flow state can be entered while performing any activity, although it is most likely to occur when one is wholeheartedly performing a task or activity for intrinsic purposes.[6][8] Passive activities like taking a bath or even watching TV usually don’t elicit flow experiences as individuals have to actively do something to enter a flow state.[9][10]
Flow theory postulates three conditions that have to be met to achieve a flow state:
One must be involved in an activity with a clear set of goals and progress. This adds direction and structure to the task.[11]
The task at hand must have clear and immediate feedback. This helps the person negotiate any changing demands and allows them to adjust their performance to maintain the flow state.[11]
One must have a good balance between the perceived challenges of the task at hand and their own perceived skills. One must have confidence in one's ability to complete the task at hand.[11]
However, it was argued that the antecedent factors of flow are interrelated, as a perceived balance between challenges and skills requires that one knows what he or she has to do (clear goals) and how successful he or she is in doing it (immediate feedback). Thus, a perceived fit of skills and task demands can be identified as the central precondition of flow experiences.[12]
In 1997, Csíkszentmihályi published the graph to the right. This graph depicts the relationship between the perceived challenges of a task and one's perceived skills. This graph illustrates one further aspect of flow: it is more likely to occur when the activity at hand is a higher-than-average challenge (above the center point) and the individual has above-average skills (to the right of the center point).[6] The center of this graph (where the sectors meet) represents one's average levels of challenge and skill across all activities an individual performs during their daily life. The further from the center an experience is, the greater the intensity of that state of being (whether it is flow or anxiety or boredom or relaxation).[8]
Several problems of this model have been discussed in literature.[12][13] One is, that it does not ensure a perceived balance between challenges and skills which is supposed to be the central precondition of flow experiences. Individuals with a low average level of skills and a high average level of challenges (or the other way round) do not necessarily experience a fit between skills and challenges when both are above their individual average.[14] In addition, one study found that low challenge situations which were surpassed by skill were associated with enjoyment, relaxation, and happiness, which, they claim, is contrary to flow theory.[15]
Schaffer (2013) proposed 7 flow conditions:
Knowing what to do
Knowing how to do it
Knowing how well you are doing
Knowing where to go (if navigation is involved)
High perceived challenges
High perceived skills
Freedom from distractions[16]
Schaffer also published a measure, the Flow Condition Questionnaire (FCQ), to measure each of these 7 flow conditions for any given task or activity.[16]
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I also have a tip for anyone who is going to give it a try. No One was not joking when he said, put all that stuff about weight and reps out of your mind. What I found that worked from the start was, just picking one weight and sticking with it the entire exercise. Don`t even count the reps. Just do whatever selected weight and go nearly to failure, take a few breaths, and do the same weight again and so on. Then next week or what have you, increase whatever weight you were using just by a little bit. (which is the way I will approach it).
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FFS chill the fuck out.
Its lifting weights and putting them down again, only a bit quicker.
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I also have a tip for anyone who is going to give it a try. No One was not joking when he said, put all that stuff about weight and reps out of your mind. What I found that worked from the start was, just picking one weight and sticking with it the entire exercise. Don`t even count the reps. Just do whatever selected weight and go nearly to failure, take a few breaths, and do the same weight again and so on. Then next week or what have you, increase whatever weight you were using just by a little bit. (which is the way I will approach it).
TA, how long were you resting between sets (average number)?
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I completed a workout in about 20 minutes or so that nearly took me an hour to an hour and 15 or more sometimes. Afterwards, I couldn`t even lift my arms without shaking and that blood engorged feeling. It lasted hours. I still feel it today even. Everything is very tight and feels like I just worked out. This, is the most ideal and optimal way to train for sure.
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TA, how long were you resting between sets (average number)?
I wasn`t. I would literally take 3-5 deep breaths and go again. The good thing about this is, it forces you to actually do work and the weight does not have to be great at all. I can also envision that one could "Go Heavy" in a sense with this approach by selecting a weight and doing around 1-6 reps (thats all you may be able to get) each set. I chose a weight that I could do about 20-25 reps with and took it from there.
You really feel that you are doing actual work with this routine.
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TA your approaching this 100% correctly. I know also that you did the routine to the T based on your feedback ie- the pump and how the training leaves you pretty drained.
the reason this is so powerful is that you pump and fullness you have experienced once you get to week 9 stays. it's doesn't dissipate really due to the constant stress the muscle is under.
it def keeps you locked into the task at hand. you don't have time to look at the TV or chat up broads. in that it causes you to focus and like you found forces a better mind muscle connection. as I alluded to in my original post there's all kinds of benefit to training like this but I wasn't here to sell the system. if you wanted to find out what the benefits were your have to get off your lazy ass and try it. kinda weeds out the undesirables this way- those who want to be hand fed everything with an expectation of behind deserving.
were a lazy society who wants to be 'sold' something. were to lazy and unmotivated to try something unless were sold on it. this program rewards those who aren't lazy like yourself.
the flow as you called it is also known as the zone in sports. my whole life I have been athletic. and only ONCE can I say I have been in the zone. I was playing 4 on 4 full court at a Y abt 12 years ago. I was running down floor w the ball. man I shit you not EVERYTHING slowed down- I became fluid. I used to pass very well that was my thing- setting up the play- I threw the ball overhand to the forward in the low post but I let the ball slide of my fingers at the last second so I could catch the ball with the back of my hand reversed my grip on it and passed it around my neck to the guy trailing behind me to my left who scored an easy lay up cause every defender bit on the original pass. my buddy came up and said 'brah that looked fucking awesome' I'm like I have no idea how I did it. it was an automatic response to the stimulus at that exact moment. unthinking fluid and effortless. I get that feeling almost every time I'm ripping trails on my mountain bike now. total fluidity and effortless control. it's very addictive. better than any drug.
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TA your approaching this 100% correctly. I know also that you did the routine to the T based on your feedback ie- the pump and how the training leaves you pretty drained.
the reason this is so powerful is that you pump and fullness you have experienced once you get to week 9 stays. it's doesn't dissipate really due to the constant stress the muscle is under.
it def keeps you locked into the task at hand. you don't have time to look at the TV or chat up broads. in that it causes you to focus and like you found forces a better mind muscle connection. as I alluded to in my original post there's all kinds of benefit to training like this but I wasn't here to sell the system. if you wanted to find out what the benefits were your have to get off your lazy ass and try it. kinda weeds out the undesirables this way- those who want to be hand fed everything with an expectation of behind deserving.
were a lazy society who wants to be 'sold' something. were to lazy and unmotivated to try something unless were sold on it. this program rewards those who aren't lazy like yourself.
the flow as you called it is also known as the zone in sports. my whole life I have been athletic. and only ONCE can I say I have been in the zone. I was playing 4 on 4 full court at a Y abt 12 years ago. I was running down floor w the ball. man I shit you not EVERYTHING slowed down- I became fluid. I used to pass very well that was my thing- setting up the play- I threw the ball overhand to the forward in the low post but I let the ball slide of my fingers at the last second so I could catch the ball with the back of my hand reversed my grip on it and passed it around my neck to the guy trailing behind me to my left who scored an easy lay up cause every defender bit on the original pass. my buddy came up and said 'brah that looked fucking awesome' I'm like I have no idea how I did it. it was an automatic response to the stimulus at that exact moment. unthinking fluid and effortless. I get that feeling almost every time I'm ripping trails on my mountain bike now. total fluidity and effortless control. it's very addictive. better than any drug.
Inspiring
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you did one work out using this method and are already certain it is the optimal way to train ::)
and it's really nothing groundbreaking it's just high volume over heavy weights, as there will be a massive trade in the weights you will be using when not resting at all between sets.
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FFS chill the fuck out.
Its lifting weights and putting them down again, only a bit quicker.
Only this.
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33386's workout were you do 1 min on, 15 seconds off for 45 sets is similar, but doesn't use traditional BB exercises.
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TA your approaching this 100% correctly. I know also that you did the routine to the T based on your feedback ie- the pump and how the training leaves you pretty drained.
the reason this is so powerful is that you pump and fullness you have experienced once you get to week 9 stays. it's doesn't dissipate really due to the constant stress the muscle is under.
it def keeps you locked into the task at hand. you don't have time to look at the TV or chat up broads. in that it causes you to focus and like you found forces a better mind muscle connection. as I alluded to in my original post there's all kinds of benefit to training like this but I wasn't here to sell the system. if you wanted to find out what the benefits were your have to get off your lazy ass and try it. kinda weeds out the undesirables this way- those who want to be hand fed everything with an expectation of behind deserving.
were a lazy society who wants to be 'sold' something. were to lazy and unmotivated to try something unless were sold on it. this program rewards those who aren't lazy like yourself.
the flow as you called it is also known as the zone in sports. my whole life I have been athletic. and only ONCE can I say I have been in the zone. I was playing 4 on 4 full court at a Y abt 12 years ago. I was running down floor w the ball. man I shit you not EVERYTHING slowed down- I became fluid. I used to pass very well that was my thing- setting up the play- I threw the ball overhand to the forward in the low post but I let the ball slide of my fingers at the last second so I could catch the ball with the back of my hand reversed my grip on it and passed it around my neck to the guy trailing behind me to my left who scored an easy lay up cause every defender bit on the original pass. my buddy came up and said 'brah that looked fucking awesome' I'm like I have no idea how I did it. it was an automatic response to the stimulus at that exact moment. unthinking fluid and effortless. I get that feeling almost every time I'm ripping trails on my mountain bike now. total fluidity and effortless control. it's very addictive. better than any drug.
This is really the best way to go about training. It really will weed people out for many reason. I can see many ego lifters losing their mind when they have to drop weights by 50 or more pounds. The Zone is an interesting phenomena. Your subconscious takes over totally and you function on autopilot. A lot of tasks I do seem to trigger it. I find myself asking after a completed project or what have you, "how the hell did I do all of that. I don`t even remember doing it at the time". Its really an intense feeling. Its really interesting when you are in that zone and fall out of it briefly and you come to the realization that you really were not actively enaged at all, but you were functioning on all twelve cylinders-top performance- the entire time without realizing it.
Imagine being able to control the on/off switch of this phenomena at any time and what you could be capable of mentally and physically.
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you did one work out using this method and are already certain it is the optimal way to train ::)
and it's really nothing groundbreaking it's just high volume over heavy weights, as there will be a massive trade in the weights you will be using when not resting at all between sets.
High Volume? Its whatever volume you want.
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FFS chill the fuck out.
Its lifting weights and putting them down again, only a bit quicker.
This. Weightlifting isn't rocket surgery.
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I completed a workout in about 20 minutes or so that nearly took me an hour to an hour and 15 or more sometimes. Afterwards, I couldn`t even lift my arms without shaking and that blood engorged feeling. It lasted hours. I still feel it today even. Everything is very tight and feels like I just worked out. This, is the most ideal and optimal way to train for sure.
Do you have any DOMS with that tightness?
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Do you have any DOMS with that tightness?
I do and haven`t had DOMS in a very long time, despite changing routines and of course, being very consistent as always. First time in months actually.
I noticed Arnold has been using a similar method in his current training. He has been saying he does set after set, no rest at all. He said he wishes he trained this way decades ago (according to him, he would have been in the gym way less with the same or better results, than what he did) which I found interesting.
(http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2014/09/28/1411929420319_wps_10_US_actor_and_former_Calif.jpg)
(http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2014/09/28/1411933109063_wps_5_Arnold_Sports_Instagram.jpg)
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(https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xfp1/v/t1.0-9/10689977_10152652606401760_5346314038797093819_n.jpg?oh=3414831169669be165cf69ca12db4e46&oe=548760DE&__gda__=1422832571_97b71e6a268693b26d1064dc3a0a52e7)
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TA effortlessly trolling in this thread, I doff my cap to you sir.
Sublime.
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i found that i got this nostalgic feeling about training, like an excitedness i hadn't felt in years. i used to get this feeling about practicing an instrument - the desire to push myself, challenge myself, see and feel progress. i've been training for years and never had this level of excitement, anticipation about it. every day it's still strong, like i can't wait to push my body even harder.
as for weights, like actual numbers, mine went down. a lot. i do a 'warm up' set of as many as i can (usually 50 or so) with a light weight, and then the 5 seconds between sets from set 1 onward using as heavy as i can bear up to 6-8 reps. my mind is sharp and present and i ride the pumps through each set.
it's liberating not to give a fuck about numbers and really focus on adapting.
Same exact experience here and am glad to see that it persists as No One indicated it will.
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i found that i got this nostalgic feeling about training, like an excitedness i hadn't felt in years. i used to get this feeling about practicing an instrument - the desire to push myself, challenge myself, see and feel progress. i've been training for years and never had this level of excitement, anticipation about it. every day it's still strong, like i can't wait to push my body even harder.
as for weights, like actual numbers, mine went down. a lot. i do a 'warm up' set of as many as i can (usually 50 or so) with a light weight, and then the 5 seconds between sets from set 1 onward using as heavy as i can bear up to 6-8 reps. my mind is sharp and present and i ride the pumps through each set.
it's liberating not to give a fuck about numbers and really focus on adapting.
::)
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TA.. greatest troll in the history of getbig
Noone.. shut the fuck up old man. Anyone who knows shit about shit knows your books are shill bait and your retarded dinosaur ass isn't even profiting.
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TA.. greatest troll in the history of getbig
He's potentially the greatest of all time.
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Same exact experience here and am glad to see that it persists as No One indicated it will.
TA, I skimmed the thread and need the cliff notes version.
Can you tell me aprox the body part, exercises and reps you used and rest between sets?
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33386's workout were you do 1 min on, 15 seconds off for 45 sets is similar, but doesn't use traditional BB exercises.
Except with mine - its functional and works out everything and applicable to real life tasks.
Have crushed people trying my routine who are BB types thinking they are fit.
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High Volume? Its whatever volume you want.
well if i read the original thread correct(i did only skim tbf) , the aim was to build up to 5+ full body work outs per week. so you're training every body part 5+ times a week. i would say that might be considered high volume ::)
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The only issue I have with this type of workout and Im not doubting its validity and effectiveness is that I dont want to become a "machine".
I don't want to have to train a body part 500 times a year, Im happy training it 50 times a year if its growing.
As no one said, you are not going to get 10 times the benefit.
Paula Bircumshaw one of the best bodybuilders ever to come out of the UK (famously flipped all the judges at the Arnold classic the wanker sign to applause from Arnold himself ;D) used to train for about 4 months a year leading up to a show, the rest of the year she didnt touch a weight apart from aerobic sessions.
Her position was that the body grew and responded better to periods of rest and hard training, not consistently.
You stop getting DOMS the more you train as opposed to training a body part every week to ten days.
As again each to their own but taking it literally if I could look like i do without going to the gym then I wouldn't be there.
For me working out and training is a means to an end.
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Sounds like how Reeves trained, 3X week, whole body each time, no rest between sets.
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The only issue I have with this type of workout and Im not doubting its validity and effectiveness is that I dont want to become a "machine".
I don't want to have to train a body part 500 times a year, Im happy training it 50 times a year if its growing.
As no one said, you are not going to get 10 times the benefit.
Paula Bircumshaw one of the best bodybuilders ever to come out of the UK (famously flipped all the judges at the Arnold classic the wanker sign to applause from Arnold himself ;D) used to train for about 4 months a year leading up to a show, the rest of the year she didnt touch a weight apart from aerobic sessions.
Her position was that the body grew and responded better to periods of rest and hard training, not consistently.
You stop getting DOMS the more you train as opposed to training a body part every week to ten days.
As again each to their own but taking it literally if I could look like i do without going to the gym then I wouldn't be there.
For me working out and training is a means to an end.
Did she tell you this?
I used to see her train a lot at one point in my life and she was always working out at the times of year I'd be there - summer / easter / christmas.
She was a fantastic bodybuilder and if my memory can be relied upon was a really hard working trainer.
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Did she tell you this?
I used to see her train a lot at one point in my life and she was always working out at the times of year I'd be there - summer / easter / christmas.
She was a fantastic bodybuilder and if my memory can be relied upon was a really hard working trainer.
I heard it from someone who used to compete with her around the same time in 89 and early 90s
If you knew her and you saw different then thats better than my second hand story.
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it's not even about growing, it's about the quality and density of the tissue.
Sorry
The only issue I have with this type of workout and Im not doubting its validity and effectiveness is that I dont want to become a "machine".
I don't want to have to train a body part 500 times a year, Im happy training it 50 times a year if Im hardening up my muscles.
Fixed.
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You stop getting DOMS the more you train as opposed to training a body part every week to ten days.
This is clearly not true. It is possible to sustain DOMS if you train the muscle again every third day.
However, sooner or later you will damage the connective tissue which seems to need longer to recover.
Injuries happen when rapid growth follows rapid increases in strength.
I have found that after the third set the reps drop significantly. If you were doing 20 reps you drop to about 12 by the 4th set.
Larry Scott used to do up and down the rack training with virtually no rest between sets. Just the time needed to put the
dumbbells down and pick up the next ones. It was a very effective but painful way to train. Few persisted with torture like this.
Training with little rest between sets over and over and using the same light resistance doesn't sound like the way to maximum hypertrophy to me.
Let us see what happens with Adonis. Will he be making gains after a month using this system?
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The only issue I have with this type of workout and Im not doubting its validity and effectiveness is that I dont want to become a "machine".
I don't want to have to train a body part 500 times a year, Im happy training it 50 times a year if its growing.
As no one said, you are not going to get 10 times the benefit.
Paula Bircumshaw one of the best bodybuilders ever to come out of the UK (famously flipped all the judges at the Arnold classic the wanker sign to applause from Arnold himself ;D) used to train for about 4 months a year leading up to a show, the rest of the year she didnt touch a weight apart from aerobic sessions.
Her position was that the body grew and responded better to periods of rest and hard training, not consistently.
You stop getting DOMS the more you train as opposed to training a body part every week to ten days.
As again each to their own but taking it literally if I could look like i do without going to the gym then I wouldn't be there.
For me working out and training is a means to an end.
I train consistently and still get DOMS by switching between free weights and machines, I take a break and just do leg press, hack squat and leg curls for few weeks, then go back to squat,lunges, deadlifts and stiff legged dead lifts and I am sore all week.
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I'm sick of hardcore training, to be honest. I'd rather go in, get a pump, and leave feeling great!
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I'm sick of hardcore training, to be honest. I'd rather go in, get a pump, and leave feeling great!
You are a pussy I bully guys like you in the gym.
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The only issue I have with this type of workout and Im not doubting its validity and effectiveness is that I dont want to become a "machine".
I don't want to have to train a body part 500 times a year, Im happy training it 50 times a year if its growing.
As no one said, you are not going to get 10 times the benefit.
c'mon man. your smarter than that.
you see absolutely no benefit as an anabolics user being able to train a muscle w 7x the frequency you do now?
I'm not going to talk anyone into using this. I don't need to. truthfully I hope people for the most part ignore it. I posted it as I made a commitment to people on this board that I would.
like I said I'm not here to sell anything. if you want to try it great. if not that's great too. :)
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TA.. greatest troll in the history of getbig
Noone.. shut the fuck up old man. Anyone who knows shit about shit knows your books are shill bait and your retarded dinosaur ass isn't even profiting.
lol I'm having a difficult time taking your insults to heart given your weak enough to have been addicted to pretty much every chemical created and had to tape yourself to a chair to dry out, nancy.
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I also have a tip for anyone who is going to give it a try. No One was not joking when he said, put all that stuff about weight and reps out of your mind. What I found that worked from the start was, just picking one weight and sticking with it the entire exercise. Don`t even count the reps. Just do whatever selected weight and go nearly to failure, take a few breaths, and do the same weight again and so on. Then next week or what have you, increase whatever weight you were using just by a little bit. (which is the way I will approach it).
Any before and after pics to actually prove the efficacy of this type of training and the results attained?
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This is clearly not true. It is possible to sustain DOMS if you train the muscle again every third day.
However, sooner or later you will damage the connective tissue which seems to need longer to recover.
Injuries happen when rapid growth follows rapid increases in strength.
I have found that after the third set the reps drop significantly. If you were doing 20 reps you drop to about 12 by the 4th set.
Larry Scott used to do up and down the rack training with virtually no rest between sets. Just the time needed to put the
dumbbells down and pick up the next ones. It was a very effective but painful way to train. Few persisted with torture like this.
Training with little rest between sets over and over and using the same light resistance doesn't sound like the way to maximum hypertrophy to me.
Let us see what happens with Adonis. Will he be making gains after a month using this system?
I have had DOMS all day long so far. I just took a nap to get ready for my next session and I woke up with extreme soreness and the muscles all still with that pumped and aching feeling, so much that it felt like I had just worked out. I also feel an overall increase in body heat and warmth, particularly in the muscles I worked yesterday.
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Did Arnold get biceps implants?
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Is your IQ increasing as well?
I wouldn`t doubt that brain cells are getting more oxygen, neurons firing faster, synapes being more receptive to neurotransmission.
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I wouldn`t doubt that brain cells are getting more oxygen, neurons firing faster, synapes being more receptive to neurotransmission.
Where's the pics.
Proof is in the pudding.
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Where's the pics.
Proof is in the pudding.
lol fuck you guys are dense. I give you something that will 100% change the way you look in less than 9 weeks and you want pics.
pics?
I got something better than pics for you. it's advise. you ready?
don't do it. no sweat off my balls.
see how easy that was. carry on w whatever it was you were doing. good luck.
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listen up, boneheads.
there are people who will try this routine in earnest and find it to be everything I say it is. the rest of you fucking numptys like colon4life will sit and bitch and still look like the dork he is a year from now.
this is for those who want to better themselves. I'm not going to give you proof. I'm not going to give you pics. don't fucking do it. I don't care. when your done reading this go look in the mirror. see that skinny fat idiot looking back at you? that's exactly what your going to be a year from now. I gave you the opportunity to change that. but your rather doubt, mock and deride.
what I do care to do is help those genuinely interested in improving their physiques and performance. it's that simple. lol
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listen up, boneheads.
there are people who will try this routine in earnest and find it to be everything I say it is. the rest of you fucking numptys like colon4life will sit and bitch and still look like the dork he is a year from now.
this is for those who want to better themselves. I'm not going to give you proof. I'm not going to give you pics. don't fucking do it. I don't care. when your done reading this go look in the mirror. see that skinny fat idiot looking back at you? that's exactly what your going to be a year from now. I gave you the opportunity to change that. but your rather doubt, mock and deride.
what I do care to do is help those genuinely interested in improving their physiques and performance. it's that simple. lol
Appreciate your help. I haven't tried it yet but plan on soon once my minor injury heals and I can go full out.
I know you said it doesn't give one 10x the results but I'm just hoping to be accused of being on something as a natural. Don't want to be anything like a pro, just well conditioned muscle.
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listen up, boneheads.
there are people who will try this routine in earnest and find it to be everything I say it is. the rest of you fucking numptys like colon4life will sit and bitch and still look like the dork he is a year from now.
this is for those who want to better themselves. I'm not going to give you proof. I'm not going to give you pics. don't fucking do it. I don't care. when your done reading this go look in the mirror. see that skinny fat idiot looking back at you? that's exactly what your going to be a year from now. I gave you the opportunity to change that. but your rather doubt, mock and deride.
what I do care to do is help those genuinely interested in improving their physiques and performance. it's that simple. lol
No one.
don't listen to the these loser.
your program is working. i have been following your diet, AAs and training for few months and it works great.
it require, people to change there thinking \ mind. which is the most difficult part of this program.
but yes. size wise, you may not be bigger, however, more quality, dens..ect
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No one.
don't listen to the these loser.
your program is working. i have been following your diet, AAs and training for few months and it works great.
it require, people to change there thinking \ mind. which is the most difficult part of this program.
but yes. size wise, you may not be bigger, however, more quality, dens..ect
I am interested in maximum hypertrophy. Improving the body as a machine doesn't interest me much. I don't do aerobics, either.
If a new method doesn't result in increased size for everyone using it then something is wrong somewhere.
Let us be clear about one thing. The science relating to the body and especially the muscles cannot and should not be ignored.
If no one's method works then it has to be explainable by science. If there is something new discovered then those findings will
be part of the revised science of the muscles.
One question for no one. He talks about adaptation. Well, from my reading and personal experience I found that there are
specific adaptations. It makes no sense to tell people to do things for adaptation. You need a goal and then a method to achieve it.
In the 1940s bodybuilders did full body workouts three times a week. By 1960 most were splitting upper body MWF and lower body
Tu Th and Sat. That was a big improvement and bodybuilders were able to get bigger. By 1960 Dianabol was becoming fashionable
by the insiders and that changed bodybuilding forever.
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Damn. I've been on a hiatus but I missed out on some good shit. no one and adonis are two very great minds.
Only skimmed over things but I've always known the mind-muscle connection was important. I haven't counted reps or sets in years and can't fathom training any other way other than instinctively and with nothing but 100% focus. That's why taking a few puffs of marijuana has always resonated with me (no pun intended). It's obviously not the only way and definitely not for everyone, but I've found a groove to workout in that works like none other for the shitty genetics and bodily structure I've got to work with.
Bookmarking this shit for later. Keep the discussion going please!
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seeing as you've never accomplished anything i don't expect you to understand this. minstrel.
the fuck are you going on about? which "science" is that exactly?
There are plenty of relevant studies in the area that concerns bodybuilding.
http://www.cell.com/cell-metabolism/pdf/S1550-4131(12)00503-7.pdf
http://www.lookgreatnaked.com/articles/mechanisms_of_muscle_hypertrophy.pdf
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perhaps body building guru vince basille
can explain why he has looked like a fat turd for 40 years
who is going to take the advice of a creepy blob
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perhaps body building guru vince basille
can explain why he has looked like a fat turd for 40 years
who is going to take the advice of a creepy blob
I contribute positively to this thread. How about you?
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c'mon man. your smarter than that.
you see absolutely no benefit as an anabolics user being able to train a muscle w 7x the frequency you do now?
I'm not going to talk anyone into using this. I don't need to. truthfully I hope people for the most part ignore it. I posted it as I made a commitment to people on this board that I would.
like I said I'm not here to sell anything. if you want to try it great. if not that's great too. :)
I train now 5/6 days a week, I train most body parts twice a week, I upped the pace last night and it took me 22minutes to train back
I did three main exercises
pulldowns wide grip
machine pulldowns close grip
rear pec dec for traps and upper back/rear delts
Dont ask me how many sets and reps because I have no idea I just pushed to failure each one, lots of partials at the end of the set,
Rest periods between sets were just enough to catch my breath and let the pump go down in my forearms (20 seconds or thereabouts)
I finished off with three sets of stiff leg deadlifts with a 10 k plate to stretch my low back and hams
I was sweating like a twat and gassed to now try and train legs would for me defeat the object or engorging that area with blood and keeping it there.
I will likely do that again Thursday or Friday
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...and Ron made an asshole like you a moderator? What you Ron Avidan?
you would ruin the board as a moderator
your agenda blinds you to the truth
lose some weight dick strap
being morbidly obese at your age isn't good for your health
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What exactly is this workout routine?
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http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=551480.0
Thanks.
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Try doing a weeks worth of 100's to shock the system instead.
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What exactly is this workout routine?
1. Compression. Duration-3 Weeks. Use any routine as normally laid out. Stop resting between sets. Count to 5 then hit the next set.
2. Adaption. Duration-3 Weeks. Use any routine. Do the entire routine each day (all body-parts), but in 3 non-consecutive days. Same rest as phase 1.
3. Completion. Duration-3 Weeks. Use any routine. Do the entire routine (all body-parts), 7 days a weeks. Same rest phase as in 1 and 2. You are now a machine.
4. Using the Machine. Duration-3 Weeks and on. Use any routine. Entire routine (all body-parts) 7 days a week- 3 of those days include 2 sessions a day. 4 of those days will just be one session. Total workouts this phase= 10. Same rest.
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Try doing a weeks worth of 100's to shock the system instead.
I`ve done that and the only thing that shocked me was how stupid it was.
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When you move onto full body workouts would you choose one exersize per bodypart then? I already train with next to no rest, chasing the pump... I think a lot of long time trainers gravitate to this for longetivity
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Yet another no one fad. And this time even TA caught the bug. Gosh. And I seriously thought you're smarter than that.
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I am interested in maximum hypertrophy. Improving the body as a machine doesn't interest me much. I don't do aerobics, either.
If a new method doesn't result in increased size for everyone using it then something is wrong somewhere.
Let us be clear about one thing. The science relating to the body and especially the muscles cannot and should not be ignored.
If no one's method works then it has to be explainable by science. If there is something new discovered then those findings will
be part of the revised science of the muscles.
One question for no one. He talks about adaptation. Well, from my reading and personal experience I found that there are
specific adaptations. It makes no sense to tell people to do things for adaptation. You need a goal and then a method to achieve it.
In the 1940s bodybuilders did full body workouts three times a week. By 1960 most were splitting upper body MWF and lower body
Tu Th and Sat. That was a big improvement and bodybuilders were able to get bigger. By 1960 Dianabol was becoming fashionable
by the insiders and that changed bodybuilding forever.
sorry vince i cant discuss or debate the science behind it cause i know nothing of science.
i discovered this by accident, like most cool things that get discovered. i was on vacation and wanted to train. i was already training my whole body 3x a week zero rest between sets by this point- i guess you could say i had adapted myself to level 2 of this routine just going by feel thru years of training, like most guys who i'd consider 'advanced' do- they train by feel.
i wanted to train again, but i was hesitant to train because this would have been 2 full body workouts in a row- and according to the 'science' i needed 72 hours to recover. but i said fuck it and trained anyway. and guess what? i felt amazing. huge pump. no soreness or stiffness. strength remained static. i left the gym thinking 'fuck im going to do this again tomorrow' and i did. and i did it for over 100 days. now i can blow thru my current routine and not even break a sweat. but its not about the cardiovascular benefits as you say, well my body has changed remarkably for the better. how can it not? cause the science doesnt agree?
i cant debate science with you sir. i love to train. i love being in the gym and just banging out sets with no thought to structure, numbers and science. i just listen to my body. something nobody does anymore cause the science tells them differently.
in all my posts here and all the years i have given advise i have been transparent and 100% forthright and truthful as to my experiences- and those who took what i suggested and put it into practice had the exact same experience i did. this will be no different.
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When you move onto full body workouts would you choose one exersize per bodypart then? I already train with next to no rest, chasing the pump... I think a lot of long time trainers gravitate to this for longetivity
no you do the routine you already do. its sounds like you train a lot like i did before i stumbled upon this training like this. no counting sets. just banging it out going by feel. thats exactly what your going to do for every body part, once you get to training it 3 times a week, then every day. nothing regarding the structure of your routine changes- its the same exercises, same amount of reps and sets. all the changes is the frequency.
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I train now 5/6 days a week, I train most body parts twice a week, I upped the pace last night and it took me 22minutes to train back
I did three main exercises
pulldowns wide grip
machine pulldowns close grip
rear pec dec for traps and upper back/rear delts
Dont ask me how many sets and reps because I have no idea I just pushed to failure each one, lots of partials at the end of the set,
Rest periods between sets were just enough to catch my breath and let the pump go down in my forearms (20 seconds or thereabouts)
I finished off with three sets of stiff leg deadlifts with a 10 k plate to stretch my low back and hams
I was sweating like a twat and gassed to now try and train legs would for me defeat the object or engorging that area with blood and keeping it there.
I will likely do that again Thursday or Friday
ya man lol awesome. it leaves you tanked eh? at some point tho you'll be blowing thru that routine. it wont even tax you. you'll find you reach such a stage of adaptation that the only way you think you'll be able to further tax yourself is by adding more sets cause the workout gets too 'easy'. i found this kicked in around week 11 or so? thats when i was like fuck it, lets try it 2x a day 3x a week instead of just adding extra sets cause i have a schedule that allows me the comfort of training that way.
now take that- your increased your workload over and above what you are doing now. then you add additional work on top of it. plus your using anabolics. you get the picture here?
i would venture to say that once you get to this point increasing anabolic intake, along with your ability to keep the muscle under stress longer, train with additional sets over and above what your using now- so now its volume, and frequency- and have it repair to the point it can be trained again the next day- how the fuck can you NOT 'grow'. im speaking from experience cause i upped my coasting dose at the 12 week mark. doubled it in fact- from 350 to 700. so this isnt speculation. im not going to tell you what happens. ill let you find out for yourself.
and all it takes is abt 9 -12 weeks to get there. but you'll def see significant changes all the way thru right from the start until at 9-12 week mark.
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Yet another no one fad. And this time even TA caught the bug. Gosh. And I seriously thought you're smarter than that.
what the fuck is your problem?
im trying to better people. im giving my time and experiences to help people with their training.
if you dont like it fuck off. its that simple.
fuck your the whiniest bitch on this board. make yourself useful, sally, and go make us some sandwiches.
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No one.
don't listen to the these loser.
your program is working. i have been following your diet, AAs and training for few months and it works great.
it require, people to change there thinking \ mind. which is the most difficult part of this program.
but yes. size wise, you may not be bigger, however, more quality, dens..ect
thank you sir.
the size will come once you start hitting everything 7x a week if your up your dose a hair. you dont even need a huge increase for it to be noticeable.
this gets me onto another thing. i think using this a slight bump in mgs every 12 weeks would keep you constantly growing and adding really good quality tissue. id guinea pig it myself but i already know where it'll take me and its a look i no longer want.
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my superior routine is this
- train your whole body once or twice a week
- do something for your heart and lungs like riding a bike a few times a week
- plenty of sex
- plenty of rest
- do some yoga
repeat
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Off topic, but Gamechanger's routine is actually really good.
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It's like any new routine. you do the same shit for years and stop feeling the effects, you switch it up and all of a sudden get DOMS again, better pump but do it for a while and it becomes mundane. NO ONE doesn't something good in that every few weeks changes the routine so you don't go stale.
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Off topic, but Gamechanger's routine is actually really good.
totally on topic and I agree.
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people will try every excuse to complicate, justify and defend what should be so simple.
I still have no real specifics on what the workout was? ???
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Shoulders and arms today 25 mins
machine press supersetted with lateral raises with a powerband
preacher curls supersetted with standing 1 arm curls with a band
triceps single arm extensions with band
machine dips
arms like balloons and gassed.
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So noone so call magic routine is nothing more than doing high volume with no rest between sets, what an amazing discovery right up there with the discovery of the wheel I am sure noone is being considered for the noble peace prize.
(http://images.cryhavok.org/d/22959-2/Slow+Clap.gif)
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So noone so call magic routine is nothing more than doing high volume with no rest between sets, what an amazing discovery right up there with the discovery of the wheel I am sure noone is being considered for the noble peace prize.
(http://images.cryhavok.org/d/22959-2/Slow+Clap.gif)
fuck off
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It's like any new routine. you do the same shit for years and stop feeling the effects, you switch it up and all of a sudden get DOMS again, better pump but do it for a while and it becomes mundane. NO ONE doesn't something good in that every few weeks changes the routine so you don't go stale.
We all know that extreme NEW protocols can trigger adaptation and growth. If you change what you are doing every 3 weeks for 12 weeks you should continue to adapt.
However, if after 9 weeks the soreness disappears I doubt hypertrophy is occurring. What then?
Consider what would happen if instead of trying to make your body a machine that you tried to keep your muscles in a steady state of DOMS? Not all your muscles but one or two groups.
It is my conjecture that the muscle will continue to hypertrophy and do so rapidly. To test this see if you can get your biceps sore. Next, keep them sore for a whole month! It is easy to get your triceps sore. Then do the same for
the calves. Train every third day for a month and you should put an inch on both muscle groups. I advocate gaining weight as you grow.
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So noone so call magic routine is nothing more than doing high volume with no rest between sets, what an amazing discovery right up there with the discovery of the wheel I am sure noone is being considered for the noble peace prize.
(http://images.cryhavok.org/d/22959-2/Slow+Clap.gif)
Try my workout - you will be dead in 15 minutes flat.
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Got the routine, and already started applying it. But what about the cardio element, still don't get it. Do you add cardio to complement leg training? Please elaborate.
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Try my workout - you will be dead in 15 minutes flat.
What is your workout like?
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ya man lol awesome. it leaves you tanked eh? at some point tho you'll be blowing thru that routine. it wont even tax you. you'll find you reach such a stage of adaptation that the only way you think you'll be able to further tax yourself is by adding more sets cause the workout gets too 'easy'. i found this kicked in around week 11 or so? thats when i was like fuck it, lets try it 2x a day 3x a week instead of just adding extra sets cause i have a schedule that allows me the comfort of training that way.
now take that- your increased your workload over and above what you are doing now. then you add additional work on top of it. plus your using anabolics. you get the picture here?
i would venture to say that once you get to this point increasing anabolic intake, along with your ability to keep the muscle under stress longer, train with additional sets over and above what your using now- so now its volume, and frequency- and have it repair to the point it can be trained again the next day- how the fuck can you NOT 'grow'. im speaking from experience cause i upped my coasting dose at the 12 week mark. doubled it in fact- from 350 to 700. so this isnt speculation. im not going to tell you what happens. ill let you find out for yourself.
and all it takes is abt 9 -12 weeks to get there. but you'll def see significant changes all the way thru right from the start until at 9-12 week mark.
I like to see others helping people with ideas to improve their training. However, when such help suggests using anabolics I turn off because that method is devoid of principles that will continue to generate hypertrophy. What a shame.
From my 56 years training with resistance I can't see how no one's method will work. Sure, maybe for a few weeks or a month but after that nothing but more endurance.
It all comes down to asking a very simple question. What are big muscles good for? Ah, when you know that you can then train properly. Quite simply big muscles are good at moving significant loads over a short distance for several times and then repeat this several times. That is it. Suppose you can bench press 200 pounds for 10 reps. If you rest 2 to 3 minutes you can probably duplicate that number of reps. However, if you don't rest but try to do another set you can't do any reps. So that means you have to reduce the starting load to something like 100 to 120 pounds. That isn't going to generate much in the way of hypertrophy. In a month's time you still won't be able to do set after set with 200 pounds with no rest between sets. In 6 months time you still won't be able to do it!
I applaud anyone who can come up with something new and original re training. If the method works and others swear that it does then it should be investigated more closely. No one is at a loss about what to do after 12 weeks so suggests progressively increasing anabolics. This is an admission that the method doesn't work because the steroids will be generating new growth after the initial protocols are tried. No thanks.
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no one is at a loss about what to do after 12 weeks so suggests progressively increasing anabolics. This is an admission that the method doesn't work because the steroids will be generating new growth after the initial protocols are tried. No thanks.
the hell are you talking about? have you been following what I say happens after the body adapts?
after 12 weeks your body is capable of handling not just 7x the workload your probably giving it now, you could quite feasibly had you the time and inclination train your whole body 2x a day 7 days a week.
that being said after 12 weeks this program will increase exponentially your ability to do more work, and recover rapidly despite that increased workload.
you might not be able to see the benefits of this routine in increasing your performance, your lean tissue in both the assisted and natty alike, or how such an upswing in workload and recovery will create a denser more quality fiber but others following this thread and trying the routine will.
given what I have outlined in the above paragraph I don't understand how you can't see that hypertrophy will take place.
far be it from me to talk someone into trying this, but I'm not about to let someone who's never even attempted it to tell others it's a waste of time when it's the exact opposite of that.
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I like to see others helping people with ideas to improve their training. However, when such help suggests using anabolics I turn off because that method is devoid of principles that will continue to generate hypertrophy. What a shame.
From my 56 years training with resistance I can't see how no one's method will work. Sure, maybe for a few weeks or a month but after that nothing but more endurance.
It all comes down to asking a very simple question. What are big muscles good for? Ah, when you know that you can then train properly. Quite simply big muscles are good at moving significant loads over a short distance for several times and then repeat this several times. That is it. Suppose you can bench press 200 pounds for 10 reps. If you rest 2 to 3 minutes you can probably duplicate that number of reps. However, if you don't rest but try to do another set you can't do any reps. So that means you have to reduce the starting load to something like 100 to 120 pounds. That isn't going to generate much in the way of hypertrophy. In a month's time you still won't be able to do set after set with 200 pounds with no rest between sets. In 6 months time you still won't be able to do it!
I applaud anyone who can come up with something new and original re training. If the method works and others swear that it does then it should be investigated more closely. No one is at a loss about what to do after 12 weeks so suggests progressively increasing anabolics. This is an admission that the method doesn't work because the steroids will be generating new growth after the initial protocols are tried. No thanks.
Hey Vince, every study I have come across states as long as lower-load training (lighter weights high reps) is taken to volitional fatigue, equivalent hypertrophy will be produced as with high-intensity training or low volume heavy weight training.
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the hell are you talking about? have you been following what I say happens after the body adapts?
after 12 weeks your body is capable of handling not just 7x the workload your probably giving it now, you could quite feasibly had you the time and inclination train your whole body 2x a day 7 days a week.
that being said after 12 weeks this program will increase exponentially your ability to do more work, and recover rapidly despite that increased workload.
you might not be able to see the benefits of this routine in increasing your performance, your lean tissue in both the assisted and natty alike, or how such an upswing in workload and recovery will create a denser more quality fiber but others following this thread and trying the routine will.
given what I have outlined in the above paragraph I don't understand how you can't see that hypertrophy will take place.
far be it from me to talk someone into trying this, but I'm not about to let someone who's never even attempted it to tell others it's a waste of time when it's the exact opposite of that.
I imagine all you would have to do after 12 weeks is repeat the process with different exercise and/or increase weight.
What I would do is start Phase 1 again with totally new exercises and weights. That way you get a deload period and then build back up again. You would really only need about 4 different routines for an entire year doing 12 weeks of each. Your thoughts?
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http://www.scirp.org/journal/PaperInformation.aspx?PaperID=28182
Low-Load Bench Press Training to Fatigue Results in Muscle Hypertrophy Similar to High-Load Bench Press Training
DownloadDownload as PDF (Size:190KB) HTML PP. 114-121
DOI: 10.4236/ijcm.2013.42022 6,590 Downloads 19,882 Views
Author(s) Leave a comment
Riki Ogasawara, Jeremy P. Loenneke, Robert S. Thiebaud, Takashi Abe
Affiliation(s)
Graduate School of Frontier Sciences, University of Tokyo, Kashiwa, Japan; College of Sport and Health Science, Ritsumeikan University of Tokyo, Kusatsu, Japan.
Department of Health and Exercise Science, University of Oklahoma, Norman, USA.
Department of Health and Exercise Science, University of Oklahoma, Norman, USA.
Graduate School of Frontier Sciences, University of Tokyo, Kashiwa, Japan；Department of Health, Exercise Science, & Recreation Management, University of Mississippi, Oxford, USA.
ABSTRACT
The purpose of this study was to determine whether the training responses observed with low-load resistance exercise to volitional fatigue translates into significant muscle hypertrophy, and compare that response to high-load resistance training. Nine previously untrained men (aged 25 [SD 3] years at the beginning of the study, standing height 1.73 [SD 0.07] m, body mass 68.9 [SD 8.1] kg) completed 6-week of high load-resistance training (HL-RT) (75% of one repeti-tion maximal [1RM], 3-sets, 3x/wk) followed by 12 months of detraining. Following this, subjects completed 6 weeks of low load-resistance training (LL-RT) to volitional fatigue (30% 1 RM, 4 sets, 3x/wk). Increases (p < 0.05) in magnetic resonance imaging-measured triceps brachii and pectorals major muscle cross-sectional areas were similar for both HL-RT (11.9% and 17.6%, respectively) and LL-RT (9.8% and 21.1%, respectively). In addition, both groups increased (p < 0.05) 1RM and maximal elbow extension strength following training; however, the percent increases in 1RM (8.6% vs. 21.0%) and elbow extension strength (6.5% vs. 13.9%) were significantly (p < 0.05) lower with LL-RT. Both protocols elicited similar increases in muscle cross-sectional area, however differences were observed in strength. An explanation of the smaller relative increases in strength may be due to the fact that detraining after HL-RT did not cause strength values to return to baseline levels thereby producing smaller changes in strength. In addition, the results may also suggest that the consistent practice of lifting a heavy load is necessary to maximize gains in muscular strength of the trained movement. These results demonstrate that significant muscle hypertrophy can occur without high-load resistance training and suggests that the focus on percentage of external load as the important deciding factor on muscle hypertrophy is too simplistic and inappropriate.
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I imagine all you would have to do after 12 weeks is repeat the process with different exercise and/or increase weight.
What I would do is start Phase 1 again with totally new exercises and weights. That way you get a deload period and then build back up again. You would really only need about 4 different routines for an entire year doing 12 weeks of each. Your thoughts?
given real life evidences of adaptation ie cyclists, roofers forearms, fat people's calves etc all of them had very advanced bodyparts just thru daily repetitive stress.
the roofer didn't have to increase the number of roofs he had to shingle in a day to keep developing his forearms, he simply kept pounding them every day. the cyclist doesn't have to cycle an extra 100km every week to develop a world class body part he just simply followed the same amount of mileage and training daily.
given those real world proofs^- the ones vince basille is looking for incidentally- once you reach the point where you can hit everything every day and recover in order to repeat the feat next time increasing workload or time under tension or even frequency isn't necessary. you just need to keep training and everything will keep developing.
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I imagine all you would have to do after 12 weeks is repeat the process with different exercise and/or increase weight.
What I would do is start Phase 1 again with totally new exercises and weights. That way you get a deload period and then build back up again. You would really only need about 4 different routines for an entire year doing 12 weeks of each. Your thoughts?
No one stated he didn't want to argue or discuss his method. Well, he has to defend it and that he does.
There are many things one can do to trigger hypertrophy. There are very few that will trigger maximum hypertrophy and then continue to generate
more hypertrophy until the maximum size possible is attained.
Most people make gains for a while then plateau. What then? They try something different and it works for a while. Eventually most people reach
the intermediate stage and seldom improve beyond it. An astute gym owner can detect when this happens and congratulate those members for
reaching their peaks. Naturally, nobody wants to believe they have stopped growing. The truth is very few can get arms over 18 inches. Well, except
for people over 6 feet and naturally fat people. For someone under 5' 11" those 18 inch arms are rare to see. Muscular arms that is.
Will Adonis get 18 inch arms following his guru no one? Time will tell. I am skeptical. Especially when changes are made to the original method.
Please, if no one knows what he is talking about then use his brain and not your own. Good luck.
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given real life evidences of adaptation ie cyclists, roofers forearms, fat people's calves etc all of them had very advanced bodyparts just thru daily repetitive stress.
the roofer didn't have to increase the number of roofs he had to shingle in a day to keep developing his forearms, he simply kept pounding them every day. the cyclist doesn't have to cycle an extra 100km every week to develop a world class body part he just simply followed the same amount of mileage and training daily.
given those real world proofs^- the ones vince basille is looking for incidentally- once you reach the point where you can hit everything every day and recover in order to repeat the feat next time increasing workload or time under tension or even frequency isn't necessary. you just need to keep training and everything will keep developing.
What do you make of the Sprint Cyclists thighs being so much larger than the Distance Cyclists thighs? Its a considerable difference, just like the Sprinter vs. the Marathon runner.
Sprint Cyclists
(http://images.dailylife.com.au/2012/08/06/3530765/729_greipel-and-forste-620x349.jpg)
(http://i61.tinypic.com/25qg2tt.jpg)
Distance Cyclists
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1e/Bradley_Wiggins%2C_2007_Tour_de_Frace%2C_Prologue_%28cropped%29.jpg)
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(http://anthonymychal.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/marathon-vs-sprint.jpg)
(http://www.fitnflexed.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/marathon-sprinters.jpg)
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given real life evidences of adaptation ie cyclists, roofers forearms, fat people's calves etc all of them had very advanced bodyparts just thru daily repetitive stress.
the roofer didn't have to increase the number of roofs he had to shingle in a day to keep developing his forearms, he simply kept pounding them every day. the cyclist doesn't have to cycle an extra 100km every week to develop a world class body part he just simply followed the same amount of mileage and training daily.
given those real world proofs^- the ones vince basille is looking for incidentally- once you reach the point where you can hit everything every day and recover in order to repeat the feat next time increasing workload or time under tension or even frequency isn't necessary. you just need to keep training and everything will keep developing.
Okay, Adam, explain this. I trained for pinch gripping years ago. I would warm up then proceed to add resistance and work up to a maximum single rep. Then I would rest and attempt to do another single with that maximum.
Then I would reduce the weight by 10 kg and do as many reps as I could. I would rest a bit then do more reps and continue for a few sets.
I tried training every second day but I stopped improving. I concluded that training like this every 3rd day was optimal and I set a world record pinch grip lift of 92.5 kg or about 204 pounds.
If strength follows this timeline I wondered if hypertrophy did the same. So that is what I based my protocols on. Sure, I also wondered about training every day. I even thought about
training all day on arms! Alternating back and forth supersetting biceps and triceps. That would have been interesting. I would be using the same maximum resistance all day long for at least 8 hours.
I would have rested sufficiently between sets to duplicate the reps. I never did try this program but it appealed to me. A bit like no one suggests where you force the body to adapt to extreme protocols.
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Okay, Adam, explain this. I trained for pinch gripping years ago. I would warm up then proceed to add resistance and work up to a maximum single rep. Then I would rest and attempt to do another single with that maximum.
Then I would reduce the weight by 10 kg and do as many reps as I could. I would rest a bit then do more reps and continue for a few sets.
I tried training every second day but I stopped improving. I concluded that training like this every 3rd day was optimal and I set a world record pinch grip lift of 92.5 kg or about 204 pounds.
If strength follows this timeline I wondered if hypertrophy did the same. So that is what I based my protocols on. Sure, I also wondered about training every day. I even thought about
training all day on arms! Alternating back and forth supersetting biceps and triceps. That would have been interesting. I would be using the same maximum resistance all day long for at least 8 hours.
I would have rested sufficiently between sets to duplicate the reps. I never did try this program but it appealed to me. A bit like no one suggests where you force the body to adapt to extreme protocols.
Why? Just fucking why?
How on earth would this result in anything beneficial, practically or aesthetically?
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Why? Just fucking why?
How on earth would this result in anything beneficial, practically or aesthetically?
Unbelievable! We had comps for fun in the gym. Period. Why not try for a world record in a strength feat? That is an achievement.
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listen up, boneheads.
there are people who will try this routine in earnest and find it to be everything I say it is. the rest of you fucking numptys like colon4life will sit and bitch and still look like the dork he is a year from now.
this is for those who want to better themselves. I'm not going to give you proof. I'm not going to give you pics. don't fucking do it. I don't care. when your done reading this go look in the mirror. see that skinny fat idiot looking back at you? that's exactly what your going to be a year from now. I gave you the opportunity to change that. but your rather doubt, mock and deride.
what I do care to do is help those genuinely interested in improving their physiques and performance. it's that simple. lol
" I'm not going to give you proof. "
Awesome way of making your case.
At least Mentzer and Jones presented proof.
You're an advance bodybuilder but certainly nothing special. If you were you would have won something. There are tons of guys in every nowhere gym in the world going through the motions that blow you away.
Next.
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Adonis asked: "What do you make of the Sprint Cyclists thighs being so much larger than the Distance Cyclists thighs? Its a considerable difference, just like the Sprinter vs. the Marathon runner."
This is easy to explain. The sprint cyclists are doing reps at the maximum effort for a short time, then repeating those efforts. This should generate hypertrophy and continue to do so for years. Plus, I imagine they also do resistance training in the gym.
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" I'm not going to give you proof. "
Awesome way of making your case.
At least Mentzer and Jones presented proof.
You're an advance bodybuilder but certainly nothing special. If you were you would have won something. There are tons of guys in every nowhere gym in the world going through the motions that blow you away.
Next.
What qualifies as "proof" anyways? He came up with it, found that it worked well for him & others, and shared it with us.
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What do you make of the Sprint Cyclists thighs being so much larger than the Distance Cyclists thighs? Its a considerable difference, just like the Sprinter vs. the Marathon runner.
Sprint Cyclists
(http://images.dailylife.com.au/2012/08/06/3530765/729_greipel-and-forste-620x349.jpg)
(http://i61.tinypic.com/25qg2tt.jpg)
Distance Cyclists
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1e/Bradley_Wiggins%2C_2007_Tour_de_Frace%2C_Prologue_%28cropped%29.jpg)
hey dude it's the amount of force required by each disciplene to get the cycle going. from what I understand sprinters need to apply a significant greater force to get their bicycles up to speed compared distance cyclists thus the change in the size of the muscle.
I'm am sure sprinters also use a significant free weight training program to aid in this function in order to generate the power necessary to excel in that event.
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" I'm not going to give you proof. "
Awesome way of making your case.
At least Mentzer and Jones presented proof.
You're an advance bodybuilder but certainly nothing special. If you were you would have won something. There are tons of guys in every nowhere gym in the world going through the motions that blow you away.
Next.
thanks for sharing.
enjoy mediocrity.
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We all know that extreme NEW protocols can trigger adaptation and growth. If you change what you are doing every 3 weeks for 12 weeks you should continue to adapt.
However, if after 9 weeks the soreness disappears I doubt hypertrophy is occurring. What then?
Consider what would happen if instead of trying to make your body a machine that you tried to keep your muscles in a steady state of DOMS? Not all your muscles but one or two groups.
It is my conjecture that the muscle will continue to hypertrophy and do so rapidly. To test this see if you can get your biceps sore. Next, keep them sore for a whole month! It is easy to get your triceps sore. Then do the same for
the calves. Train every third day for a month and you should put an inch on both muscle groups. I advocate gaining weight as you grow.
You have never been able to make the progress that you claim "should" put an inch on muscle groups. You remember how I outlined the routine that transformed my calves on IronAge from that polio look to my most impressive body part (admittedly a low standard).
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Okay, Adam, explain this. I trained for pinch gripping years ago. I would warm up then proceed to add resistance and work up to a maximum single rep. Then I would rest and attempt to do another single with that maximum.
Then I would reduce the weight by 10 kg and do as many reps as I could. I would rest a bit then do more reps and continue for a few sets.
I tried training every second day but I stopped improving. I concluded that training like this every 3rd day was optimal and I set a world record pinch grip lift of 92.5 kg or about 204 pounds.
If strength follows this timeline I wondered if hypertrophy did the same. So that is what I based my protocols on. Sure, I also wondered about training every day. I even thought about
training all day on arms! Alternating back and forth supersetting biceps and triceps. That would have been interesting. I would be using the same maximum resistance all day long for at least 8 hours.
I would have rested sufficiently between sets to duplicate the reps. I never did try this program but it appealed to me. A bit like no one suggests where you force the body to adapt to extreme protocols.
I think the ideal workout is heavy as you can go, as fast as you can go, with little to no rest as many times possible each week, like the No One Machine Method.
With that said, I do think hypertrophy is individualistic to an extent in that everybody has different muscle fibers even if the muscles are the same. I think the "Sprinter-like" weight training sessions (No One Machine Method) covers all the bases for just about everyone.
As for Pinch grip, I think practicing different angles of pinching with different wrist positions would be the most important step first. Try pinching something and then moving your wrist up and down while pinched and you can feel that your grip is stronger and weaker at different points. Finding that groove where you are your strongest is the most important. Same is true for weight lifting or power lifting, with the elite not having to ever really try positioning as they are automatically set up ideally. Usually for bench for instance, its the fatso types with extremely short forearms, short bicep muscles, short torsos that can move the weight. The longer the forearm, the worse the bench press and more difficult it is as its just not a mechanical advantage. Same for squats. A persons femur length, tibia length and foot length will all have an effect for squats.
The good thing though is, weight does not really matter as an absolute. We all have seen 500 lb raw benchers with shitty chests, people who can squat 405 for 20 with crappy legs, powerlifters dieting down and looking like shit and so on. (in fact, most powerlifters who do diet down, look like shit-could be a structure issue, short torso/short forearm barrel look etc.. or even lack of muscle development despite lifting all that weight)
A person who can only lift half the weight of someone else can certainly have a better chest, better quads and arms and so on.
(http://37.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lmhciv68z91qk65fgo1_500.jpg)
(http://anabolicminds.com/forum/attachments/%2034841d1282411616-francisco-montealegre-genomyx-fls.jpg%20.att)
(http://anabolicminds.com/forum/attachments/%2034906d1282663629-francisco-montealegre-genomyx-tris.jpg%20.att)
(http://anabolicminds.com/forum/attachments/%2034908d1282663638-francisco-montealegre-genomyx-bis.jpg%20.att)
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Adonis asked: "What do you make of the Sprint Cyclists thighs being so much larger than the Distance Cyclists thighs? Its a considerable difference, just like the Sprinter vs. the Marathon runner."
This is easy to explain. The sprint cyclists are doing reps at the maximum effort for a short time, then repeating those efforts. This should generate hypertrophy and continue to do so for years. Plus, I imagine they also do resistance training in the gym.
Which I think is what the No One Machine Method really excels at vs. a lot of the other workouts out there.
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I like to see others helping people with ideas to improve their training. However, when such help suggests using anabolics I turn off because that method is devoid of principles that will continue to generate hypertrophy. What a shame.
From my 56 years training with resistance I can't see how no one's method will work. Sure, maybe for a few weeks or a month but after that nothing but more endurance.
It all comes down to asking a very simple question. What are big muscles good for? Ah, when you know that you can then train properly. Quite simply big muscles are good at moving significant loads over a short distance for several times and then repeat this several times. That is it. Suppose you can bench press 200 pounds for 10 reps. If you rest 2 to 3 minutes you can probably duplicate that number of reps. However, if you don't rest but try to do another set you can't do any reps. So that means you have to reduce the starting load to something like 100 to 120 pounds. That isn't going to generate much in the way of hypertrophy. In a month's time you still won't be able to do set after set with 200 pounds with no rest between sets. In 6 months time you still won't be able to do it!
I applaud anyone who can come up with something new and original re training. If the method works and others swear that it does then it should be investigated more closely. No one is at a loss about what to do after 12 weeks so suggests progressively increasing anabolics. This is an admission that the method doesn't work because the steroids will be generating new growth after the initial protocols are tried. No thanks.
Point well taken. No One is an intelligent and thinking person. I just get turned off a bit by the arrogance. And lets not forget he's a long time heavy juicer including insulin and hgh. That changes things considerably.
Now I believe that TA has been clean for years and has attained a very advanced level given his self imposed restrictions. I would take what he says a bit more seriously. That's why I wanted to see if there was any real difference in progress and advancement other than how he feels in terms of body warmth and DOMS. I mean, this is assuming that muscle hypertrophy is the goal. The idea that you can present a theory as sound without offering any proof seems a bit suspect but you choose instead to attack those that request some proof.
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Unbelievable! We had comps for fun in the gym. Period. Why not try for a world record in a strength feat? That is an achievement.
Ok, fair enough. As far as hypertrophy, though, do you believe there is a single, unbending scientific law that dictates how a muscle grows for everyone, without exception?
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Point well taken. No One is an intelligent and thinking person. I just get turned off a bit by the arrogance. And lets not forget he's a long time heavy juicer including insulin and hgh. That changes things considerably.
Now I believe that TA has been clean for years and has attained a very advanced level given his self imposed restrictions. I would take what he says a bit more seriously. That's why I wanted to see if there was any real difference in progress and advancement other than how he feels in terms of body warmth and DOMS. I mean, this is assuming that muscle hypertrophy is the goal. The idea that you can present a theory as sound without offering any proof seems a bit suspect but you choose instead to attack those that request some proof.
I seldom attack people but I will try to kill what I consider are false theories. We all have an obligation to do that. Otherwise, how can we improve knowledge?
I am just about finished with a modification to my biceps-supinator machine. It is simpler now and more user friendly. I now have the tools to start getting
my arms bigger. Should be interesting.
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given real life evidences of adaptation ie cyclists, roofers forearms, fat people's calves etc all of them had very advanced bodyparts just thru daily repetitive stress.
the roofer didn't have to increase the number of roofs he had to shingle in a day to keep developing his forearms, he simply kept pounding them every day. the cyclist doesn't have to cycle an extra 100km every week to develop a world class body part he just simply followed the same amount of mileage and training daily.
given those real world proofs^- the ones vince basille is looking for incidentally- once you reach the point where you can hit everything every day and recover in order to repeat the feat next time increasing workload or time under tension or even frequency isn't necessary. you just need to keep training and everything will keep developing.
My uncle owns a roofing and construction company and the employees run the gamut. A few look very strong and muscular but there are a lot that are fat and out of shape with very little muscular development. A classic case of just counting the hits but not the (majority) of misses. Same reason why people think a full moon influences aberrant behavior. People act crazy everyday but when it happens to be a full moon they look up into the sky and say, "See!"
It would stand to reason the construction workers would be on average stronger and more muscular than the average person but not because they do construction. It's just that if you are a weakling you are not going into a profession that requires you to be physically robust. It's like saying playing basketball makes you tall.
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Ok, fair enough. As far as hypertrophy, though, do you believe there is a single, unbending scientific law that dictates how a muscle grows for everyone, without exception?
Generally speaking, yes! It has to be otherwise it isn't the optimal method for hypertrophy. The right theory has to explain all growth....and non growth from serious training.
As long as the other conditions for hypertrophy are met, namely, adequate rest and sufficient nutrients are ingested to gain weight and muscle.
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My uncle owns a roofing and construction company and the employees run the gamut. A few look very strong and muscular but there are a lot that are fat and out of shape with very little muscular development. A classic case of just counting the hits but not the (majority) of misses. Same reason why people think a full moon influences aberrant behavior. People act crazy everyday but when it happens to be a full moon they look up into the sky and say, "See!"
It would stand to reason the construction workers would be on average stronger and more muscular than the average person but not because they do construction. It's just that if you are a weakling you are not going into a profession that requires you to be physically robust. It's like saying playing basketball makes you tall.
Most roofers use nail guns anyways. The best roofers are the short little Mexicans that can run and up down ladders like nobody`s business. They also are the ones that can literally stand with their back facing the edge of the gutter on an extreme slope without an ounce of fear. Crazy to see in person really.
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What qualifies as "proof" anyways? He came up with it, found that it worked well for him & others, and shared it with us.
Huh? Proof would be progress and advancement. If he claims that this program enhances muscle hypertrophy than if say, for instance, TA should marked increase in muscular development I would consider this proof. It's the same elementary concept of the before and after pics so ubiquitous today.
Again, I have no problem with No One sharing his findings.
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thanks for sharing.
enjoy mediocrity.
Again, not addressing the argument itself. Just a personal attack.
Last I checked you were nothing special.
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Ok, fair enough. As far as hypertrophy, though, do you believe there is a single, unbending scientific law that dictates how a muscle grows for everyone, without exception?
As far as general principles yes. How could a field such as medical science exist? It's the specifics that's the rub.
Antibiotics cures a bacterial infection for virtually everyone. What antibiotic is used matters some. I'm allergic to pennicillin. But the principle of using antibiotic applies to everyone.
We are unique in specifics but biologically we are identical. Carbon base life froms, use oxygen, heart, lungs, process carbs, proteins and fats....
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Generally speaking, yes! It has to be otherwise it isn't the optimal method for hypertrophy. The right theory has to explain all growth....and non growth from serious training.
As long as the other conditions for hypertrophy are met, namely, adequate rest and sufficient nutrients are ingested to gain weight and muscle.
So how do we explain comparable results from guys using complete opposite methods? Yates and Dillet, say: heavy, intense, brief, infrequent vs. light, lazy, long, and frequent. And both, if I recall, weren't lifting increasingly heavier, so no new stimulus resistance-wise. Yet both monstrous. Shouldn't this be impossible if we're talking about a scientific law?
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Point well taken. No One is an intelligent and thinking person. I just get turned off a bit by the arrogance.
your mistaking not letting someone walk on me, or not putting up with bullshit as arrogance.
I'm one of the most humble / non attention seeking guys you will ever meet. ffs I went to the opening of drais pool in LV Memorial Day weekend and kept my shirt on all day. only guy in the place prolly to do so.
I stand by my convictions. that's not arrogance. that's confidence.
as to you other post I know I'm nothing special. I have admitted freely on this forum several times in the past I have shitty genetics. lol something special? that's funny. that's prolly more of a reflection of how you perceive me than anything.
so listen here. 99% of people in gyms around the world are 'nothing special'. they just love to train. the whys are individualistic. I'm one of those 99%. that doesn't mean I'm going to sit on my ass and not be the best I can be cause I got dealt a shit hand genetically- just like pretty much everyone reading this post. and if I can help someone who wants to be better and help them be better despite being 'nothing special' I'm more than fucking happy to do so.
lol 'nothing special' fuck you and your 'special'- I'm one the 99% who busts his ass every day and is proud of it and happy to do so and I wouldn't change it if I could cause I fucking earned every ounce of tissue I have.
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The few days into it I am still feeling pumped continually and extremely tight and extremely sore. Keep in mind I am not coming off any layoff from the gym (never have had one) and have been continually working out, hard. Its funny to think, that I have reduced my workout time by 30-50 minutes but am feeling it MUCH, MUCH more. Keep in mind its the same workout that I had been doing. I am keeping track of my progress and will be adjusting calories accordingly.
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Which I think is what the No One Machine Method really excels at vs. a lot of the other workouts out there.
I am not buying it. No one suggests using maybe a few seconds between sets which he says is virtually no rest. Well, what is the purpose of doing that? To cause the body to adapt?
Well, why bother with endurance unless it helps you grow bigger muscles. To me big muscles are good for lifting reasonably heavy poundages for many reps (5 to 50 but usually 10 to 20) over and over and over again.
If you look at what almost all large bodybuilders do you find they do about 10 to 20 sets for a body part. Some do several movements but it is still putting mechanical tension on those muscles for that many sets.
We can conclude that this is what is required for building large muscles. Milos Sarcev advocates moving quickly between different exercises for the same body part as giant sets. So there are many 'equivalent' ways to
achieve hypertrophy. We can think of all the methods as being the wide part of a funnel. Everyone has to reach the narrow part of the funnel where the muscles are pumped, shaking and spent. There is no easy way
to get there but many paths to the same state where a training effect resulting in hypertrophy is present. Exactly how long before you train the same muscles has been determined to be 2 to 4 days. Once you know
what generated the maximum amount of hypertrophy each week you don't waver. If the body needs X gms of protein for maximum muscle growth is there any point in ingesting 2X? To me that is foolish, expensive and wasteful
because the excess protein will be converted to energy for the body. If training every third day is optimal for maximum growth (I am not stating this is actually determined) then there is no point training more frequently. A serious
consideration here is the possibility of injuries to connective tissue. The best method for building muscles had better be a safe one because once connective tissue is damaged that can be permanent or limit training in the future.
Yes, the muscles can adapt to daily severe training but can sustained daily extreme training be good for the connective tissue? This I rather doubt. This is another reason for the 3rd day cycle.
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My uncle owns a roofing and construction company and the employees run the gamut. A few look very strong and muscular but there are a lot that are fat and out of shape with very little muscular development. A classic case of just counting the hits but not the (majority) of misses. Same reason why people think a full moon influences aberrant behavior. People act crazy everyday but when it happens to be a full moon they look up into the sky and say, "See!"
It would stand to reason the construction workers would be on average stronger and more muscular than the average person but not because they do construction. It's just that if you are a weakling you are not going into a profession that requires you to be physically robust. It's like saying playing basketball makes you tall.
fuck me read my posts properly before you rebuttal.
your in such a fucking hurry to throw me under the bus your comprehension is lacking.
roofers forearms before automatic nailers. not their fucking physiques. the muscle group the most often used repetitively. outstanding forearms.
your in such a fucking hurry to discredit me your making yourself look stupid.
you don't 'like' me. I get it. I'm not here for you.
carry on.
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your mistaking not letting someone walk on me, or not putting up with bullshit as arrogance.
I'm one of the most humble / non attention seeking guys you will ever meet. ffs I went to the opening of drais pool in LV Memorial Day weekend and kept my shirt on all day. only guy in the place prolly to do so.
I stand by my convictions. that's not arrogance. that's confidence.
as to you other post I know I'm nothing special. I have admitted freely on this forum several times in the past I have shitty genetics. lol some funny special? that's funny. that's prolly more of a reflection of how you perceive me than anything.
so listen here. 99% of people in gyms around the world are 'nothing special'. they just love to train. the whys are individualistic. I'm one of those 99%. that doesn't mean I'm going to sit on my ass and not be the best I can be cause I got dealt a shit hand genetically- just like pretty much everyone reading this post. and if I can help someone who wants to be better and help them be better despite being 'nothing special' I'm more than fucking happy to do so.
lol 'nothing special' fuck you and your 'special'- I'm one the 99% who busts his ass every day and is proud of it and happy to do so and I wouldn't change it if I could cause I fucking earned every ounce of tissue I have.
If the pics are really you, that's pretty damn special for your age. The attack is purely personal.
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You have never been able to make the progress that you claim "should" put an inch on muscle groups. You remember how I outlined the routine that transformed my calves on IronAge from that polio look to my most impressive body part (admittedly a low standard).
Can you outline that routine again, thanks.
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If the pics are really you, that's pretty damn special for your age. The attack is purely personal.
they're me.
since I'm in an advise dispensing mood today I have some for pellius.
instead of bitching and crying about me trying to help people cause you find my personality abrasive get off your fucking ass and start your own thread and help people out.
the fuck is your problem? is this highschool? this a fucking popularity contest to you? this is called the free exchange of ideas and discussion for the betterment of those who wish to apply the ideas discussed.
how the fuck can you sit there and say to me 'it won't work?' even basille said he almost went to the idea of training everyday but 'conventional wisdom' stopped him.
I didn't let it stop me and what I found was rewarding. instead of crying about it get off your ass for 12 weeks and follow it to a T. if the adaptations that I said will happen don't take place then come back and bitch. until then shut the fuck up.
pretty simple concept.
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Finaly best way to train
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they're me.
since I'm in an advise dispensing mood today I have some for pellius.
instead of bitching and crying about me trying to help people cause you find my personality abrasive get off your fucking ass and start your own thread and help people out.
the fuck is your problem? is this highschool? this a fucking popularity contest to you? this is called the free exchange of ideas and discussion for the betterment of those who wish to apply the ideas discussed.
how the fuck can you sit there and say to me 'it won't work?' even basille said he almost went to the ideas if training everyday but 'conventional wisdom' stopped him.
I didn't let it stop me and what I found was rewarding. I start of crying about it get off your ass for 12 weeks and follow it to a T. if the adaptations that I said will happen don't take place then come back and bitch. until then shut the fuck up.
pretty simple concept.
Not sure about the age difference, but I've seen pics of you both. Our Hawaiian brother's got huge balls criticizing your physique is all I gotta say.
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Conventional wisdom didn't stop me! I just didn't get around to doing it. I figured I would need some preparation before proceeding with such an extreme protocol.
My reasoning went something like this. Suppose when humans were much more primitive a hunter set out one day to find an animal for food. Suppose he had to
battle that animal but didn't succeed. He was left bruised and battered. The next day he awoke all sore from the effort. Would he be able to repeat that effort and
find food? Well, if humans couldn't have adapted to such ordeals then they wouldn't have survived. So, I concluded our ancestors would have been able to battle
even if sore. That led me to retraining a muscle group while sore. It worked. What I worry about are injuries. As one progresses in hypertrophy the muscles grow
and so does the strength. If you experience rapid hypertrophy then your strength improves rapidly as well. This is where things can get dangerous and sometimes
the muscles tear or the connective tissue gets damaged. So any system had better be a safe one. That is what worries me about daily training of the same muscles.
If we look at champion swimmers we discover that they train daily. How on earth did they adapt? When did they adapt? During the lead up to meets where they
tapered off? Also, even if champion swimmers can improve times by training daily does this mean that is the optimal frequency? I doubt it but there you are.
Lots of different methods have come and gone over the past 75 years in the Iron Game. What has evolved is the frequency of training a muscle twice a week.
10 to 20 sets and 8 to 15 reps. That pretty much sums up what the champions do. Goodness knows how distorted thing have become because of the steroids, etc.
Perhaps we can't use the pros any more to determine optimal protocols and frequency for naturals?
Pellius has given good information before. No one has attacked him in this thread so I can understand the comments Pellius made in return.
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The few days into it I am still feeling pumped continually and extremely tight and extremely sore. Keep in mind I am not coming off any layoff from the gym (never have had one) and have been continually working out, hard. Its funny to think, that I have reduced my workout time by 30-50 minutes but am feeling it MUCH, MUCH more. Keep in mind its the same workout that I had been doing. I am keeping track of my progress and will be adjusting calories accordingly.
This is all consistent with conventional hypertrophy theory. Time is a factor in increasing intensity of effort. You have shortened your time considerably so is it any wonder you are sore? Plus, just about any extreme method will achieve the same state following a lay off. The interesting thing is you reduced the resistance. Well, you had to reduce the resistance to complete the protocol.
Reminds me of a story about a young couple who wanted me to put them through a calf workout. I did a simple progression down the weight stack doing each weight for 5 reps. No rest, move the pin down one plate and do 5 more reps and continue until you can't complete the 5 reps. Rest 10 seconds then do the same weight for 10 reps or as many as you can do. Then reduce the weight by one plate and do 5 reps and continue until you are back to where you started. That is it. Just one big ascending and descending set. Well, the next day they had trouble getting out of bed. The husband had to carry his wife to the car and then to work where she could sit down. They were seasoned trainees so I didn't expect that much soreness. So it does show how easy it is to generate DOMS in people unused to certain extreme routines especially ones with little rest between sets.
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As long as the system makes the pussies wet :D
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Euterpe, it is always refreshing to hear the opinion of a genuine authority.
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Euterpe, it is always refreshing to hear the opinion of a genuine authority.
Would you consider yourself an authority?
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the fuck are you so concerned about endless hypertrophy? you missed a crucial point to this system, or you simply don't give a fuck; lean, dense tissue, endurance, adaptation, athleticism > strength, 'big muscles'
i'm natty and have been doing this 4 months. and i'm bigger AND denser AND leaner. so there goes your theory, einstein.
'a pic is worth a thousand words' type of reasoning; why aren't the words of the people who have success doing this proof enough? like TA started this what, two days ago? that's really good for him, i hope he keeps it up. there are people who have been doing it for months. pay attention.
don't sell yourself short.
i'm certainly 'nothing special' either, and have considerable obstacles convoluting my training. does this have anything to do with this system? no. the system still works.
endurance provides a competitive advantage for ATHLETES. obviously something you have no idea about.
fuck this is the stupidest question i've seen.
nope. this is the stupidest question.
You do need to remember this is a bodybuilding forum.
Not an athleticism forum.
hypertrophy, drugs, anal sex, shredded 20's are more important than "being, looking, and feeling...healthy"
::)
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I tried dat none workouts yo today namsayn! Shits works like for reals not even on some tuck tail frog bitch type tip tho nom/say
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the real question is, why is no one talking to himself ???
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This routine is just a rehash of Ellington Darden's HIT from 30 years ago. Nothing revolutionary here.
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i've been trying the "noone" technique on my dick daily and even sometimes two a days for about.. sixteen years
roughly the same amount of time since noone was able to get an erection without viagra
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your mistaking not letting someone walk on me, or not putting up with bullshit as arrogance.
I'm one of the most humble / non attention seeking guys you will ever meet. ffs I went to the opening of drais pool in LV Memorial Day weekend and kept my shirt on all day. only guy in the place prolly to do so.
I stand by my convictions. that's not arrogance. that's confidence.
as to you other post I know I'm nothing special. I have admitted freely on this forum several times in the past I have shitty genetics. lol something special? that's funny. that's prolly more of a reflection of how you perceive me than anything.
so listen here. 99% of people in gyms around the world are 'nothing special'. they just love to train. the whys are individualistic. I'm one of those 99%. that doesn't mean I'm going to sit on my ass and not be the best I can be cause I got dealt a shit hand genetically- just like pretty much everyone reading this post. and if I can help someone who wants to be better and help them be better despite being 'nothing special' I'm more than fucking happy to do so.
lol 'nothing special' fuck you and your 'special'- I'm one the 99% who busts his ass every day and is proud of it and happy to do so and I wouldn't change it if I could cause I fucking earned every ounce of tissue I have.
Obviously I hit a nerve. Because I have questioned your system of training and wanted to see real world proof as to the results attained you made the comment "enjoy the mediocrity" as if to imply that is the logical consequence. Sure I am mediocre in the sense there is nothing about me that puts me far above the pack. But that has little or nothing to do with me subscribing to your training protocol. I pointed out the obvious incongruity of you calling me mediocre when you, yourself, are nothing special yet you subscribe and practice a protocol that you imply contributes to my lack of, well, greatness. Yet you presume to offer theories as breakthrough advancements yet offer no real world verifiable proof but simply make comments like "if you don't think this will work for you, great don't do it. stick to mediocrity.", "if your happy to be a lazy trainer don't even bother reading past this line.", "don't ask me questions csuse I made this all very clear. if you don't get it your unintelligence will only be aggravating to me.", " I'm not going to debate defend or explain it. I don't give a fuck if you use this or not."
Then in the same breath you claim to be one of the most humble guys I'll ever meet and you offer as proof that you kept your shirt on at some pool party. Must have been tough as you were evaluating all the other shirtless males nodding to yourself as to your physical superiority and how you would put them all to shame and it was only your "humbleness" that kept your shirt on and avoid humiliating all the perceived betas. In reality most people don't give a crap about big muscles and look on bodybuilders as drugged up monkeys with low self-esteem.
My only issue is that when someone presents a theory or perceived breakthrough or advancement and then immediately shuts down all questions and debate. Clarification or a better understanding to what is presented is forbidden and we are only to take one's word for it. In this case, the word of a person how has achieved nothing in a field he is claiming to have some advance knowledge of.
I prefer and I'm always up for a lively debate and will take on all questions from all comers to defend my position. Even if it means I have been proven wrong. Which in some cases I have been. If my theories and/or beliefs are sound it should stand up to any scrutiny.
That's the difference between you and someone like Arthur Jones. Jones was no physical specimen. He was arrogant, difficult and dogmatic. But he was always up for a debate and answered serious and intelligent questions in the same manner as presented. He outlined in agonizing detail why both his equipment and training theories were sound and superior to those employed at the time. He thought himself as superior to others but never presented himself as a God who should be listened and obeyed without question or be destined to a life of mediocrity.
Talk to people with respect and ixnay on the implied insults if you want the same back at you.
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The few days into it I am still feeling pumped continually and extremely tight and extremely sore. Keep in mind I am not coming off any layoff from the gym (never have had one) and have been continually working out, hard. Its funny to think, that I have reduced my workout time by 30-50 minutes but am feeling it MUCH, MUCH more. Keep in mind its the same workout that I had been doing. I am keeping track of my progress and will be adjusting calories accordingly.
How one feels does not necessarily translate into advancement.
I look forward to you outlining your progress.
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fuck me read my posts properly before you rebuttal.
your in such a fucking hurry to throw me under the bus your comprehension is lacking.
roofers forearms before automatic nailers. not their fucking physiques. the muscle group the most often used repetitively. outstanding forearms.
your in such a fucking hurry to discredit me your making yourself look stupid.
you don't 'like' me. I get it. I'm not here for you.
carry on.
Wow! You really are a touchy and easily offended fellow. Let me state categorically that I do not dislike you. Actually, I've always considered you one of the top tier members on this board and I have complemented you routinely over the years. You have offered tons of information and even your insulin protocol is still a sticky on the gh 15 board when I was still there. Questioning your theories has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not I like you and for you to take it that way does not reflect well on you.
I have said nothing to discredit your training protocol but only the fact that you present it as absolute truth and above any debate.
I do not think old school roofers developed massive forearms due to being roofers. They got into roofing because it better matched their physical robustness than say someone with a build like Woody Allen.
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Can you outline that routine again, thanks.
It's on IronAge which I think is now gone. But it went on about a dozen pages. And it was more than just a routine. A some point you have to transcend sets and reps.
Lets just say if I had to do it over again I wouldn't. There are some things more important than developed calves and I am a bit ashamed that I became so obsessed with them. But stand at nearly 6'2" and barely having 13 inch calves my insecurities did get the better of me. That shows more a weakness in my character and priorities then any fierce determination on my part.
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they're me.
since I'm in an advise dispensing mood today I have some for pellius.
instead of bitching and crying about me trying to help people cause you find my personality abrasive get off your fucking ass and start your own thread and help people out.
the fuck is your problem? is this highschool? this a fucking popularity contest to you? this is called the free exchange of ideas and discussion for the betterment of those who wish to apply the ideas discussed.
how the fuck can you sit there and say to me 'it won't work?' even basille said he almost went to the idea of training everyday but 'conventional wisdom' stopped him.
I didn't let it stop me and what I found was rewarding. instead of crying about it get off your ass for 12 weeks and follow it to a T. if the adaptations that I said will happen don't take place then come back and bitch. until then shut the fuck up.
pretty simple concept.
Now questioning you is "bitching and crying"? And exactly where did I say it won't work.
The problem is not any abrasiveness on your part but that you are easily rattled emotionally. You had the moral high ground on Alex but he toyed with you because you
are so easily rattled.
Check your estro levels and ease up on the constant melt downs.
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Not sure about the age difference, but I've seen pics of you both. Our Hawaiian brother's got huge balls criticizing your physique is all I gotta say.
o
When and where did I criticize his physique? The only comment I made regarding his physique on this thread is that I consider him an advance bodybuilder.
I don't even consider myself a bodybuilder as such -- advance or otherwise.
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'a pic is worth a thousand words' type of reasoning; why aren't the words of the people who have success doing this proof enough? like TA started this what, two days ago? that's really good for him, i hope he keeps it up. there are people who have been doing it for months. pay attention.
Since bodybuilding is primarily if not entirely a visual "sport" pics, in lieu of an in person presentation, is how we measure one's progress. I would think this would be obvious.
If someone were presenting a weight loss program but could produce no actual physical evidence that such a transformation occurred it would render the program meaningless.
TA presents constant photos of alleged naturals as proof as to what can be attained through proper training and nutrition. He presents photos here about the physical difference between those that do different types of training. I simply asked that he present photos of himself showing the progress he claims to have made other than the subjective feelings of warmth and pump.
I never even asked No One about photos or even questioned his training protocol. I simply asked for real world physical evidence of progress and advancement claimed. TA remains silent on the issue whereas No One took personal offense and that I was trying to discredit him and "throw him under the bus".
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Is this no one?
I have presented my theory of hypertrophy here on the G & O board. I had to defend it against all experts and skeptics. I doubt anyone even tried my ideas. Most needed step by step protocols to know what to do! I figured an intelligent person should be able to proceed armed with the theory. Not so on Getbig.
Pellius is always fair in debates. He has one flaw, however, and that is he will persist and debate to the bitter end even with dicks and trolls. Sometimes it is better to walk away.
Some of us have been around training for a very long time. My experience goes back to 1958. Guys like Pellius and myself have tried most of the methods out there. Eventually we get a grasp on what bodybuilding is about. We can look at a method and make a pretty accurate judgement about its potential and effectiveness. We don't have to try everything.
I can design gym equipment that works when it is completed. That isn't so easy to do. Usually new machines require several prototypes before they work properly, etc. So experience is invaluable for designing machines and also for assessing bodybuilding methods. From what I have read here I doubt anyone is going to build much muscle using the no one method. You might make some modest gains for a few weeks then what? Up the dosage? Well, any method that is going to produce hypertrophy had better be effective for everyone and that includes natural bodybuilders.
Those here who are impressed with the body as a machine can participate and try no one's method. I can predict that Adonis won't make many gains. Let us see if I am right.
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If that is no one in the photo above he does have an excellent physique. A bit weak in the triceps. I have no doubt that I could put an inch on his arms in a month using my equipment and method. How about that?
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Almost entirely genetic predisposition. An ectomorph like Lance Armstrong would have never built thighs like these sprinters regardless how what he ate, hoe he trained, or even how much drugs he took.
This statement is probably false. Lance did long distance cycling for decades. How would we know what his capacity for hypertrophy is? No one is arguing that if you put the right stress on a body it will
respond by adapting. Suppose Lance stopped that distance riding and just did sprints and gym work for legs. I would predict he would grow significantly from those protocols. He might not that the capacity
to be as big as most of the champion sprinters but he would be bigger than most endurance cyclists.
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Yes he would have been bigger than he was when he was riding the TDF and purposefully keeping his body weight down but he doesn't have the genetics for heavy musculature. If he did he never would have been the cyclist and triathlete that he was.
It is always speculation about what muscular potential anyone has. We literally do not know what our or anyone else's genetics are. Yes, we can observe that some are naturally slender and so on, however, we have all seen guys show up at a gym with almost no potential and yet they persisted and became quite large. So we can't know what Lance was capable of because he probably won't give bodybuilding a go.
On the other hand, I do agree that all of us when going to school get to try various sports and probably take up those we do well in. If you are tall they want you in the basketball team. If you can run fast they want you in the track team or football team. If you are strong they want you in the football team or perhaps wrestling and definitely weightlifting.
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My uncle owns a roofing and construction company and the employees run the gamut. A few look very strong and muscular but there are a lot that are fat and out of shape with very little muscular development. A classic case of just counting the hits but not the (majority) of misses. Same reason why people think a full moon influences aberrant behavior. People act crazy everyday but when it happens to be a full moon they look up into the sky and say, "See!"
It would stand to reason the construction workers would be on average stronger and more muscular than the average person but not because they do construction. It's just that if you are a weakling you are not going into a profession that requires you to be physically robust. It's like saying playing basketball makes you tall.
good post
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No gym owner could have predicted what Larry became.
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We have this down pretty much to a science now. When the scout with the D-1 college football scholarship comes to look at a 16 year-old boy (no homo) he can pretty much tell how the boy will develop based on things like bone structure, musculature, etc. He will even look at the parents. There will be some exceptions of course but 99 percent of the time he will be right. He can't afford not to be.
Flex Wheeler was a scrawny kid, nobody thought that he would be what he was. And even as a bodybuilder he looked better light. It was also thanks to his light frame that he looked the way he did.
Besides haven't you seen average height parents with 6'5 monster sons?
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Ah yes... the science of bodybuilding. ::)
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Ah yes... the science of bodybuilding. ::)
The only sicence we know, is "bro science", ok bro?
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There is plenty of science relating to muscles. The trouble is very few people can comprehend the research.
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We have this down pretty much to a science now. When the scout with the D-1 college football scholarship comes to look at a 16 year-old boy (no homo) he can pretty much tell how the boy will develop based on things like bone structure, musculature, etc. He will even look at the parents. There will be some exceptions of course but 99 percent of the time he will be right. He can't afford not to be.
::)
"ectomorph"
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=377348.0;attach=414353;image)
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any system will produce results beyond walking into the gym and training randomly.
If you train though DOMS how do you know you're developing muscle and not inflammation?
a gorilla sits around all day eating fruit and insects. what do we learn from that?
look forward to seeing the latest supinating apparatus
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big muscle = drugs
;)
There are no drug free mass monsters
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When and where did I criticize his physique?
You're an advance bodybuilder but certainly nothing special. If you were you would have won something. There are tons of guys in every nowhere gym in the world going through the motions that blow you away.
Now you didn't exactly tell him to get his shinebox, but you insulted him a little bit. You got a little bit out of order yourself.... I'm sorry. You insulted him a little bit.
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If that is no one in the photo above he does have an excellent physique. A bit weak in the triceps. I have no doubt that I could put an inch on his arms in a month using my equipment and method. How about that?
This is a silly claim, and you know it. Would you promise Dennis Wolf a specific calve size increase if he were to train under you for x amount of time?
No one can predict genetic limitations; to assert or imply otherwise is simply dishonest.
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This is a silly claim, and you know it. Would you promise Dennis Wolf a specific calve size increase if he were to train under you for x amount of time?
No one can predict genetic limitations; to assert or imply otherwise is simply dishonest.
I told both Luke Wood and Milos Sarcev I could help them get bigger arms. Luke died before he had a chance. Milos was angry when he read that but we sorted things out.
His training is somewhat like what no one recommends. I prefer longer rests and heavier resistance. I doubt whether lighter weights can build huge arms.
From the photo of no one I can see he has the potential for larger arms, especially triceps. Well, if he used my machines and equipment and followed my
protocols he should gain some size within a month. Half inch at least and maybe more. These guys never show up at my gym to see what I could do for
them.
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Wow! You really are a touchy and easily offended fellow. Let me state categorically that I do not dislike you. Actually, I've always considered you one of the top tier members on this board and I have complemented you routinely over the years. You have offered tons of information and even your insulin protocol is still a sticky on the gh 15 board when I was still there. Questioning your theories has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not I like you and for you to take it that way does not reflect well on you.
I have said nothing to discredit your training protocol but only the fact that you present it as absolute truth and above any debate.
I do not think old school roofers developed massive forearms due to being roofers. They got into roofing because it better matched their physical robustness than say someone with a build like Woody Allen.
what in the fuck are you talking about. lol holy fuck. re read what i just enbolded and please tell me where i said anything about roofers getting into roofing because they big forearms.
are you fucking kidding me? like how is someone this stupid.
like im not even going to bother explaining myself for the THIRD fucking time.
you say im emotional? dude its not emotion. its not being able to deal well with stupidity- its a trait a lot of intelligent people have in common- they become easily frustrated w stupidity.
are you on painkillers? this is serious question and would explain a lot.
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hey vince im glad to see you posting here yet. i like your post about heavier resistance in relation to the size of the muscle. that makes sense to me. the reason i like to run the pump is that i find i get a much better response from training that way and i was what you'd call a heavy lifter for prolly 3/4's of my training career.
that being said my running the pump isnt curling 15lb dumbells. when i run the pump im reaching muscular fatigue every set. so, in that i think that the 'weight' being used is sufficent heavy to generate what results i desire. running the pump doesnt mean training lazy or light.
yes, that is me in that pic. and there are several other pics on this board of me.
what burns my ass about pellius asking for 'proof' is exactly what he touched on- in 10 years of posts regarding training, diet and anabolics usage i have never once had anyone stand up and say 'i followed that rountine/ that cycle advise/ that diet and its bullshit- it didnt work worth a fuck'. i have almost 800 pms in my inbox. i dont know how many of them are people i have never heard of thanking me and and saying 'i took your advise and its working'.
just like with everything else i have given advise about, i came here with this and i said this is a routine i invented. i said this is what you can expect to have happen over the x amount of weeks you are on it. i said this is the results it will manifest.
proof? what fucking more proof do you need? double blind studies? i did it. i walk the walk. i dont bullshit. i bust balls on here a lot but when it comes to solid advise im the straight goods.
this is all very frustrating for me. 10 years ive been trying to help people. and every single time i post something like this i gotta go thru the same fucking bullshit with the same fucking kind of small minded / closed minded people. naysayers critics and loudmouths. basically people who couldnt hold my fucking bag in the gym.
anyway vince the last part of this post isnt aimed at you. i think the discussion of all ideas often shapes and hones rough stones into brilliant diamonds. this could be no different. but to have guys pipe up about how this has been around forever, how it wont work, how you dont need this when they obviously havent even taken the time to read what the system entails, just a bunch of fat sloppy know it alls who havent broken 10%bf in the 10 years of doing the same routines sitting on their computer repeating the same bullshit i can find on any bbing board on the web.
like how the fuck can i not get frustrated.
:D
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I hear what you are saying. Heck, the guys in my gym don't listen to what I say about my system of training. They will listen to suggestions about how to perform various exercises they are not familiar with.
I got the same treatment when I post my theory here. I concluded that everyone with arms over 15 inches in an expert. Not only in building muscle but in nutrition!
Arthur Jones said that people knocked his ideas and even laughed. Eventually they copied him! Now there was a smart guy. However, he didn't get it right about bodybuilding. Partly right.
His theory about how muscles contract wasn't right so that affected everything. It wasn't the intensity that caused hypertrophy. It was partly that. You know it is more.....volume. Yep, that
is what big muscles are good for. Big effort for a short while then repeat again and again. So that is how you should train to get big.
We differ mainly re the amount of rest. I have included in my theory the concept of equivalence. That means there may be many different but equivalent ways to get big. You and I know that
no matter how you get there the end result is exhausted, shaking but pumped muscles. You have to experience those symptoms to grow. You should also be sore the next few days if you are
triggering rapid hypertrophy. So when I read where you said soreness ends after the 9 th week I wondered about the system. I don't advocate using any drugs or supplements. If you can
cause the muscles to grow you should get sufficient hormones released by the body. In old age that is the fountain of youth. It doesn't please me that so many Getbiggers resort to drugs
both to augment muscle size and prevent atrophy in old age. I still have to get my arms to 18 1/2 inches one day soon. Maybe shoot for 19! Now that would be an achievement. Drug free!
I need to design and build a new triceps machine to have a chance to do so rapidly. The darn elbows are too easy to damage when the weights get heavy enough to build big triceps.
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I still have to get my arms to 18 1/2 inches one day soon. Maybe shoot for 19! Now that would be an achievement. Drug free!
I need to design and build a new triceps machine to have a chance to do so rapidly
If you were going to have 19 inch arms you would have had them doing barbell curls.
machines dont make arms , intensity does.
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I hear what you are saying. Heck, the guys in my gym don't listen to what I say about my system of training. They will listen to suggestions about how to perform various exercises they are not familiar with.
I got the same treatment when I post my theory here. I concluded that everyone with arms over 15 inches in an expert. Not only in building muscle but in nutrition!
Arthur Jones said that people knocked his ideas and even laughed. Eventually they copied him! Now there was a smart guy. However, he didn't get it right about bodybuilding. Partly right.
His theory about how muscles contract wasn't right so that affected everything. It wasn't the intensity that caused hypertrophy. It was partly that. You know it is more.....volume. Yep, that
is what big muscles are good for. Big effort for a short while then repeat again and again. So that is how you should train to get big.
We differ mainly re the amount of rest. I have included in my theory the concept of equivalence. That means there may be many different but equivalent ways to get big. You and I know that
no matter how you get there the end result is exhausted, shaking but pumped muscles. You have to experience those symptoms to grow. You should also be sore the next few days if you are
triggering rapid hypertrophy. So when I read where you said soreness ends after the 9 th week I wondered about the system. I don't advocate using any drugs or supplements. If you can
cause the muscles to grow you should get sufficient hormones released by the body. In old age that is the fountain of youth. It doesn't please me that so many Getbiggers resort to drugs
both to augment muscle size and prevent atrophy in old age. I still have to get my arms to 18 1/2 inches one day soon. Maybe shoot for 19! Now that would be an achievement. Drug free!
I need to design and build a new triceps machine to have a chance to do so rapidly. The darn elbows are too easy to damage when the weights get heavy enough to build big triceps.
So guys like Dorian, Mentzer, Labrada, even Haney to a degree, low/lower volume. If one size fits all, how do we explain their growth?
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If you were going to have 19 inch arms you would have had them doing barbell curls.
machines dont make arms , intensity does.
How simple you are. No, intensity is only part of the formula. A certain intensity plus an accumulated time under tension is what is required.
I have the only biceps supinator in the world so how would you know what is possible. I don't like doing barbell or dumbbell curls. I need
more effective machines. I built my own and it allows me to have an absolutely brutal workout. It is just a pity that I tore a biceps decades
ago doing those stupid deadlifts. Had I not had that injury I would have larger arms now. I also have sore elbows from doing heavy pullovers
with 250 pounds way back in 1965. Silly exercise as well.
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I told both Luke Wood and Milos Sarcev I could help them get bigger arms. Luke died before he had a chance. Milos was angry when he read that but we sorted things out.
His training is somewhat like what no one recommends. I prefer longer rests and heavier resistance. I doubt whether lighter weights can build huge arms.
From the photo of no one I can see he has the potential for larger arms, especially triceps. Well, if he used my machines and equipment and followed my
protocols he should gain some size within a month. Half inch at least and maybe more. These guys never show up at my gym to see what I could do for
them.
Oh...you have a solution for bad genetics? Jesus Christ Vince, think a little.
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So guys like Dorian, Mentzer, Labrada, even Haney to a degree, low/lower volume. If one size fits all, how do we explain their growth?
Ray Mentzer stayed at my home for over a year. He trained at my gym as well. He would train muscle groups twice a week. Once directly and once
indirectly. I didn't see him increase the size of his already huge muscles. I concluded that what he did was sufficient to sustain his size.
Don't get me wrong, Ray was an extremely strong individual. His workouts were brief but intense. He used heavy weights.
Dorian Yates is an interesting bodybuilder. We can conclude that what he did was dangerous because he tore several muscles and some severly
like his biceps. That pretty much ended his career. It isn't great training arms with a torn biceps.
I would guess that whatever those guys did it was sufficient to trigger hypertrophy of an extreme order.
Let us do a thought experiment here. If we assume that all bodybuilders with 20 inch arms have similar genetics then if some do significantly
different things to achieve that size we have to conclude that maybe many are doing more than they need. If you grow as much muscle as you
can by ingesting 300 gm of protein that doesn't mean you need that much. It may be that half that amount is sufficient. The same thing goes
for exercise. Maybe 5 hard sets are sufficient to trigger hypertrophy, but most do double or triple that to be sure.
What we have to find out is what is necessary and sufficient to generate hypertrophy.
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Oh...you have a solution for bad genetics? Jesus Christ Vince, think a little.
How can you conclude that Milos and Luke had bad genetics for arms? What I have noticed with some bodybuilders is that they
recruit other muscles when training arms. Thus, they get big shoulders, chest and back while the arms don't grow much. My solution
is to get them to do special exercises that result in severe mechanical tension of the target muscles. That is the only way they are
going to get big arms.
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How can you conclude that Milos and Luke had bad genetics for arms? What I have noticed with some bodybuilders is that they
recruit other muscles when training arms. Thus, they get big shoulders, chest and back while the arms don't grow much. My solution
is to get them to do special exercises that result in severe mechanical tension of the target muscles. That is the only way they are
going to get big arms.
Holy shit....
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How can you conclude that Milos and Luke had bad genetics for arms? What I have noticed with some bodybuilders is that they
recruit other muscles when training arms. Thus, they get big shoulders, chest and back while the arms don't grow much. My solution
is to get them to do special exercises that result in severe mechanical tension of the target muscles. That is the only way they are
going to get big arms.
Fuck Vince, Milo's did like 40 exercises per workout for arms at high reps and still didn't get over 18-19. Lol
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I can't guarantee that Milos would get bigger arms but I am confident I could help.
I have two machines that I haven't seen in other gyms. It does make a difference for arms to have
movements that put more tension on the muscles. For example, the triceps respond better when the elbows
are overhead and stretched. Then you stop the elbows from moving and the triceps get more tension.
The biceps will grow faster by hitting two degrees of freedom. Flexion and supination.
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Fuck Vince, Milo's did like 40 exercises per workout for arms at high reps and still didn't get over 18-19. Lol
Milos had a great gym but he didn't have my equipment. No other gym does.
He still had big arms. Just not big enough to win the Olympia.
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Can anyone post a picture of that true Adonis up to date picture, how he look RIGHT NOW!! RIGHT FUCKING NOW???? AT this mmotherfuckermoment! RIGHT NOW WHEN HE HAVE THIS UNIQUE GREAT TRAININGMETHOD!!!!!!!!! PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE! I BET HE LOOK LIKE AGOOD RIGHT NOW: LIKE A FUCKING HEROIC MOTHERFUCKIN GOOOOOD!
How come all the losera always talk, talk talk....they cant do anything accept talk talk talk...
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If I was KIM JONG UN I would fucking tell the securityguards get out and find him then get him to the Parlament and shop his head off! Fooling my people with stupid ideas make them confused! Man I love dictatorship!
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I can't guarantee that Milos would get bigger arms but I am confident I could help.
I have two machines that I haven't seen in other gyms. It does make a difference for arms to have
movements that put more tension on the muscles. For example, the triceps respond better when the elbows
are overhead and stretched. Then you stop the elbows from moving and the triceps get more tension.
The biceps will grow faster by hitting two degrees of freedom. Flexion and supination.
I really wonder what you have ben doing all these years, two machines that do something you cant do with a free weight for arms, Im all ears.
The triceps straightens the arm., thats what it does, so straightning the arm under resistance develops the triceps.
Jeez.
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Vince Basil most be the kid that was pretty retard as a teenager. But now with 70 years of life experience he can cath up and get along with people 1/3 of his age...
Does he trying to say that one machine is the reason MIlosh dident get big arms? What the fuck is wrong with old man?
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I can't guarantee that Milos would get bigger arms but I am confident I could help.
I have two machines that I haven't seen in other gyms. It does make a difference for arms to have
movements that put more tension on the muscles. For example, the triceps respond better when the elbows
are overhead and stretched. Then you stop the elbows from moving and the triceps get more tension.
The biceps will grow faster by hitting two degrees of freedom. Flexion and supination.
You are fucking delusional.
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Can anyone post a picture of that true Adonis up to date picture, how he look RIGHT NOW!! RIGHT FUCKING NOW???? AT this mmotherfuckermoment! RIGHT NOW WHEN HE HAVE THIS UNIQUE GREAT TRAININGMETHOD!!!!!!!!! PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE! I BET HE LOOK LIKE AGOOD RIGHT NOW: LIKE A FUCKING HEROIC MOTHERFUCKIN GOOOOOD!
How come all the losera always talk, talk talk....they cant do anything accept talk talk talk...
The last pic I posted on here was in April and I leaned down way more, but couldn`t be really bothered or cared to take any more pics. In fact, that is the last picture I have taken of myself I believe. Its just something I don`t really do at all.
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=528255.0;attach=559922;image)
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I really wonder what you have ben doing all these years, two machines that do something you cant do with a free weight for arms, Im all ears.
The triceps straightens the arm., thats what it does, so straightning the arm under resistance develops the triceps.
Jeez.
I am wasting my time debating with some of you blokes. Let us examine triceps pressdowns done on the lat machine with various handles or ropes.
I have even fashioned apparatus where the user can stand with his back resting on a support at an angle. Even when people use my machines
they all cheat when the weight gets heavy. The elbows move. When the elbows move it means different muscles are being recruited to shift the
load and not only the triceps. So you have to try to isolate the triceps and it definitely helps to have pads to rest the triceps on and also pads
to prevent the elbows from moving outwards. Even with these pads some guys cheat. Their shoulders rise up and other muscles are recruited.
It appears that a certain control of the body is required to develop big triceps. Surely one doesn't need some brains to lift weights? I am afraid
knuckleheads are going to have trouble getting really big. Well, they can use someone else's brains!
My biceps machine provides an adjustable resistance for the twisting outward movement. No one machine that I have seen will do that.
I have finally worked out the correct movement of the arc for the curl movement. It isn't as easy as people think. My biceps machine is unique
and it is without a doubt the most effective that has ever been built.
In the photo there are no side pads on the apparatus because they were installed after this photo was taken. You can see how the straight leg allows
the user to be in a powerful position to train triceps. By having the elbow adjacent to the head the triceps are in a stretched position and this is
very effective for keeping mechanical tension on that muscle.
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Vince, do you do the machine welding and all the design yourself or do you take your plans and someone does it for you?
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Vince, do you do the machine welding and all the design yourself or do you take your plans and someone does it for you?
I do everything myself. From the design to the upholstery. I had to teach myself welding, fabricating, machining and so on.
I can visualize some machine and then design and build it. Not many bodybuilders have come up with anything original re
equipment. I have designed things from dumbbells to complex machines.
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I do everything myself. From the design to the upholstery. I had to teach myself welding, fabricating, machining and so on.
I can visualize some machine and then design and build it. Not many bodybuilders have come up with anything original re
equipment. I have designed things from dumbbells to complex machines.
That is extremely impressive. Did you have to learn all the correct angles in regards to load bearing, yield strength and all of that? I am always thinking about how machines and workout equipment should be designed rather than how it currently is and would like to learn what you know one day. I find that most machines are designed with fulcrums at the wrong point and not being adjustable, ranges of motion that force you to conform to the machine rather than the machine conforming to you, unequal resistance at certain points in movement. I think a lot of machines value safety over actual function.
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That is extremely impressive. Did you have to learn all the correct angles in regards to load bearing, yield strength and all of that? I am always thinking about how machines and workout equipment should be designed rather than how it currently is and would like to learn what you know one day. I find that most machines are designed with fulcrums at the wrong point and not being adjustable, ranges of motion that force you to conform to the machine rather than the machine conforming to you, unequal resistance at certain points in movement. I think a lot of machines value safety over actual function.
What has been happening with gym equipment companies is they have been buying the competitors stuff and eventually most get the movements right or good enough.
I was the first to use linear bearings in a Smith Machine. That solves the friction problem and never jams like the old machines did. Now all manufacturers use linear bearings.
Sometimes everyone makes similar machines. Take the leg extension machine. Just about everyone makes an apparatus with the user leaning back slightly and the seat tilted back a bit.
The problem here is that when a big load is used the person tends to come up off the pads. So handles are installed to help hold you down. One manufacturer from the 70s had the user
leaning back substantially more. I eventually did the same and modified a few of my machines. Why? Well, when you lean back a lot more of your bodyweight is lower than the pivot
point and you don't rise off the pads any more. So, someone got it right decades ago but no one copied it.
With the Smith Machine you find the movement isn't quite right for squats and bench presses. However, if the apparatus has approximately a 10 degree angle all of a sudden the movement follows
the correct line the body takes. Makes all the difference in the world.
If you want to design and build equipment then do so as a hobby only. It is far cheaper to buy used gym equipment at auctions, etc. Making you own requires a substantial investment
in engineering machines and tools. You need good tools to do a good job. Auto band saw, lathe, radial drill, Tig-Mig welder, linishers, milling machines, cut off machines, etc., etc.
I have my own engineering factory but I don't make equipment for anyone else. Takes too long and is too expensive and gym owners are basically cheap skates.
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What has been happening with gym equipment companies is they have been buying the competitors stuff and eventually most get the movements right or good enough.
I was the first to use linear bearings in a Smith Machine. That solves the friction problem and never jams like the old machines did. Now all manufacturers use linear bearings.
Sometimes everyone makes similar machines. Take the leg extension machine. Just about everyone makes an apparatus with the user leaning back slightly and the seat tilted back a bit.
The problem here is that when a big load is used the person tends to come up off the pads. So handles are installed to help hold you down. One manufacturer from the 70s had the user
leaning back substantially more. I eventually did the same and modified a few of my machines. Why? Well, when you lean back a lot more of your bodyweight is lower than the pivot
point and you don't rise off the pads any more. So, someone got it right decades ago but no one copied it.
With the Smith Machine you find the movement isn't quite right for squats and bench presses. However, if the apparatus has approximately a 10 degree angle all of a sudden the movement follows
the correct line the body takes. Makes all the difference in the world.
If you want to design and build equipment then do so as a hobby only. It is far cheaper to buy used gym equipment at auctions, etc. Making you own requires a substantial investment
in engineering machines and tools. You need good tools to do a good job. Auto band saw, lathe, radial drill, Tig-Mig welder, linishers, milling machines, cut off machines, etc., etc.
I have my own engineering factory but I don't make equipment for anyone else. Takes too long and is too expensive and gym owners are basically cheap skates.
I noticed that about Smith Machines for me. Smith Machines, every one I have ever used, was way more difficult for me to use than the free weight counterpart. I could do way more on free weight bench and squat than on the Smith Machine and it always occurred to me that some sort of angle needed to be introduced and you are the first person I have ever heard of noticing and building it. Do you ever file patents or is that more trouble than its worth if you have no intention of mass producing?
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I do everything myself. From the design to the upholstery. I had to teach myself welding, fabricating, machining and so on.
I can visualize some machine and then design and build it. Not many bodybuilders have come up with anything original re
equipment. I have designed things from dumbbells to complex machines.
teach us how to weld vince .do you miss soldering what you?
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Any electric workout machines vince.
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Jesus, if it were all this complicated I never would have started.
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Now you didn't exactly tell him to get his shinebox, but you insulted him a little bit. You got a little bit out of order yourself.... I'm sorry. You insulted him a little bit.
Lets recap: Never did I initially address No One or his training protocol. I am very well aware of his writings and some of his contributions on hormones and peptides are invaluable. But when it comes to training protocols I tend to take it with a grain of salt because, as Vince also pointed out, he is a long time, experience, heavy user of hormones. That mucks everything up in regard to training and nutrition.
The only reason I even opened this thread is because it was started by TA. I did see No One's previous thread regarding his "new" training discovery but didn't even bother to read it for reasons just stated. Now with TA it's different. Although I believe he has experimented with AAS I believe he has been clean for many years and for all practical purposes a "natural". Despite some of our differences I find him to be a rational and thinking person. So when he says something I tend to pay attention. When it comes to training and nutrition I take him more seriously than I do No One even though TA is not even in the same league physique-wise as No One.
So when I hear him praising this new program I am less interested in subjective feelings and evaluations such as body warmth and a "pumped up" feeling throughout the day. I want to see real quantitative and qualitative reasons. Specifically, is he experiencing real lean muscle growth? Presumably that is what the goal is.
Again, I did not address No One and didn't even have him in mind. But it was No One who decided to attack me.
"lol fuck you guys are dense. I give you something that will 100% change the way you look in less than 9 weeks and you want pics.
pics?
I got something better than pics for you. it's advise. you ready?
don't do it. no sweat off my balls."
Advise from someone who has achieved nothing in competitive bodybuilding is better than real world proof? Really? Do you agree with that?
He then advised TA not to post pics as if it was some kind of trap. He also sarcastically told me to enjoy my "mediocrity" which seems to imply that my sense of self-worth and self-esteemed stems from how big my muscles are. Continuing the meltdown, he cries that I don't like him, I'm throwing him under the bus and trying to undermine him.
All because I wanted to see progress pics which is probably the most common way all physique enhancements and fitness programs use to prove the efficacy of their programs.
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I told both Luke Wood and Milos Sarcev I could help them get bigger arms. Luke died before he had a chance. Milos was angry when he read that but we sorted things out.
His training is somewhat like what no one recommends. I prefer longer rests and heavier resistance. I doubt whether lighter weights can build huge arms.
From the photo of no one I can see he has the potential for larger arms, especially triceps. Well, if he used my machines and equipment and followed my
protocols he should gain some size within a month. Half inch at least and maybe more. These guys never show up at my gym to see what I could do for
them.
But Vince, you tried yourself. You started a whole thread about your quest to get bigger arms and to exceed your 1970's condition despite your advancement in age. You failed miserably. You claimed it was because of injuries. Of course it is! That's because you're old. Being prone to injuries is one of the limitations that advance age renders.
I cannot achieve the levels of condition and muscular size that I did 20 years ago because my body won't allow it. It breaks down first. It happens to everybody.
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what in the fuck are you talking about. lol holy fuck. re read what i just enbolded and please tell me where i said anything about roofers getting into roofing because they big forearms.
are you fucking kidding me? like how is someone this stupid.
like im not even going to bother explaining myself for the THIRD fucking time.
you say im emotional? dude its not emotion. its not being able to deal well with stupidity- its a trait a lot of intelligent people have in common- they become easily frustrated w stupidity.
are you on painkillers? this is serious question and would explain a lot.
You seem incapable of responding with melting down and pounding your spoon in your high chair. You implied that roofers had big forearms because they were roofers pounding nails all day. I disagree.
Take a deep breath and try to keep up. Better spelling and grammar would help. For someone who aspires to be a writer and considers himself intelligent because of his impatience with others that do not match his level of brilliance you do leave a lot to be desired.
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hey vince im glad to see you posting here yet. i like your post about heavier resistance in relation to the size of the muscle. that makes sense to me. the reason i like to run the pump is that i find i get a much better response from training that way and i was what you'd call a heavy lifter for prolly 3/4's of my training career.
that being said my running the pump isnt curling 15lb dumbells. when i run the pump im reaching muscular fatigue every set. so, in that i think that the 'weight' being used is sufficent heavy to generate what results i desire. running the pump doesnt mean training lazy or light.
yes, that is me in that pic. and there are several other pics on this board of me.
what burns my ass about pellius asking for 'proof' is exactly what he touched on- in 10 years of posts regarding training, diet and anabolics usage i have never once had anyone stand up and say 'i followed that rountine/ that cycle advise/ that diet and its bullshit- it didnt work worth a fuck'. i have almost 800 pms in my inbox. i dont know how many of them are people i have never heard of thanking me and and saying 'i took your advise and its working'.
just like with everything else i have given advise about, i came here with this and i said this is a routine i invented. i said this is what you can expect to have happen over the x amount of weeks you are on it. i said this is the results it will manifest.
proof? what fucking more proof do you need? double blind studies? i did it. i walk the walk. i dont bullshit. i bust balls on here a lot but when it comes to solid advise im the straight goods.
this is all very frustrating for me. 10 years ive been trying to help people. and every single time i post something like this i gotta go thru the same fucking bullshit with the same fucking kind of small minded / closed minded people. naysayers critics and loudmouths. basically people who couldnt hold my fucking bag in the gym.
anyway vince the last part of this post isnt aimed at you. i think the discussion of all ideas often shapes and hones rough stones into brilliant diamonds. this could be no different. but to have guys pipe up about how this has been around forever, how it wont work, how you dont need this when they obviously havent even taken the time to read what the system entails, just a bunch of fat sloppy know it alls who havent broken 10%bf in the 10 years of doing the same routines sitting on their computer repeating the same bullshit i can find on any bbing board on the web.
like how the fuck can i not get frustrated.
:D
Sorry that I "burn" and "frustrate" you. Perhaps you should focus on developing more coping skills than big muscles.
I don't know any of the people that have benefited from your program nor what else they are doing or using. It doesn't matter that it worked for you because you are a long time juicer. I am familiar with TA which is why I addressed him and only him. You weren't even on my radar until you started, and continue, your constant tantrums.
In this world not everyone is going to agree with you. You can defend yourself, ignore it, or get angry and frsutrated. You decided to get angry and frustrated. That's why I am taking you apart at will. Guys like you are tailor made for me in a debate or argument.
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Vince, do you do the machine welding and all the design yourself or do you take your plans and someone does it for you?
Vince is a genius when it comes to developing gym equipment. It's really pity he couldn't find investors.
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there's no 'taking me apart' sunshine.
I look the way I do. you look the way you do.
that's your reality.
when I want to walk around looking like a 130 pound dried prune I'll look you up. I'm in the business of bettering myself. looking godly. improving my body and my performace. in doing so I'm sharing w others who might have the same goals.
I have no vested interest in you or anyone else wanting to try this. I could give a fuck what you 'think'. cause your basing your ignorant opinion on nothing other than speculation and a distain for my personality.
you see where 'win' and you 'lose' since that seems to be such a repeated motif in your posts is that it is everything I say it is. I'm going to keep improving that physique you see in the pics I've posted. your going to sit there crying abt how you don't like me.
who wins? lol
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Lets recap: Never did I initially address No One or his training protocol. I am very well aware of his writings and some of his contributions on hormones and peptides are invaluable. But when it comes to training protocols I tend to take it with a grain of salt because, as Vince also pointed out, he is a long time, experience, heavy user of hormones. That mucks everything up in regard to training and nutrition.
The only reason I even opened this thread is because it was started by TA. I did see No One's previous thread regarding his "new" training discovery but didn't even bother to read it for reasons just stated. Now with TA it's different. Although I believe he has experimented with AAS I believe he has been clean for many years and for all practical purposes a "natural". Despite some of our differences I find him to be a rational and thinking person. So when he says something I tend to pay attention. When it comes to training and nutrition I take him more seriously than I do No One even though TA is not even in the same league physique-wise as No One.
So when I hear him praising this new program I am less interested in subjective feelings and evaluations such as body warmth and a "pumped up" feeling throughout the day. I want to see real quantitative and qualitative reasons. Specifically, is he experiencing real lean muscle growth? Presumably that is what the goal is.
Again, I did not address No One and didn't even have him in mind. But it was No One who decided to attack me.
"lol fuck you guys are dense. I give you something that will 100% change the way you look in less than 9 weeks and you want pics.
pics?
I got something better than pics for you. it's advise. you ready?
don't do it. no sweat off my balls."
Advise from someone who has achieved nothing in competitive bodybuilding is better than real world proof? Really? Do you agree with that?
He then advised TA not to post pics as if it was some kind of trap. He also sarcastically told me to enjoy my "mediocrity" which seems to imply that my sense of self-worth and self-esteemed stems from how big my muscles are. Continuing the meltdown, he cries that I don't like him, I'm throwing him under the bus and trying to undermine him.
All because I wanted to see progress pics which is probably the most common way all physique enhancements and fitness programs use to prove the efficacy of their programs.
I didn't read any of this because it's way too long a response to my short, simple post. Again, this is what you said:
certainly nothing special. If you were you would have won something. There are tons of guys in every nowhere gym in the world going through the motions that blow you away.
Nothing in those long response paragraphs can possibly make this a compliment, which is all I pointed out. Not interested in overwrought defenses, etc. I have the attention span of a nat ( :)) and poor reading comprehension skills.
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The last pic I posted on here was in April and I leaned down way more, but couldn`t be really bothered or cared to take any more pics. In fact, that is the last picture I have taken of myself I believe. Its just something I don`t really do at all.
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=528255.0;attach=559922;image)
haha still on hormones
Brutal wtf are shoes doing on the faux fireplace complete with a stuffed bird ;D
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a question of strength inside the system-
i recieved this question via pm and thought i'd post it here cause it raises and interesting question that im sure a lot of you will have and experience.
I was wondering if I can ask you a question.
Can you give me an idea of the kind of poundage's you have built up to doing the no one workouts with no rest?
As soon as I start going heavier with no rest it all fucks up and I just can't recover quick enough to do more than hitting the same body part for more than 3 times a week.
if I go way lighter then its ok and not a problem.
But I am trying to push myself to do the same thing but heavier and its not really working with no rest
peace
ya man your going to notice initially a drop in the weight your able to work with because the body hasnt adapted to the frequency yet.
what is important is the frequency at this time, or at any time, not the idea of weight. once the body adapts to the 7x a week, then the strength comes. in fact i was stronger thru all sets on a lot of exercises by week 12 than before i started the routine when i was at my 'strongest'.
the strength will come. focus on the frequency. thats where the money is-constantly pounding the fiber. resiliency. endurance. think of the examples of adaptation i mentioned- none involved increasing ones 'strength' to see the growth in the tissue. its entriely based on repetitive stress.
if your using enough weight to cause the fiber to fatigue, then 'strength' becomes relative at this point.
cheers
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sounds revolutionary, where can I find details on this groundbreaking method?
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Vince is a genius when it comes to developing gym equipment. It's really pity he couldn't find investors.
Basile could have found investors but didn't because he's not a good salesman. He should have hired an outside pitchman to sell his equipment. Despite how annoying he is, he has built some unique stuff but even Arthur Jones needed to hire people.
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actually I'd rather you didn't use it, QN.
last thing I need is some 3rd world fuck up prancing abt Yugoslavia bastardising my system and selling it for the small price of some turnip and beets.
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actually I'd rather you didn't use it, QN.
last thing I need is some 3rd world fuck up prancing abt Yugoslavia bastardising my system and selling it for the small price of some turnip and beets.
your IQ must match your calf ;D
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haha still on hormones
Brutal wtf are shoes doing on the faux fireplace complete with a stuffed bird ;D
Shoes are Tramezza (moved them out of the way and put them there for a second), fireplace was hand carved 170 years ago with marble inserts, bird is a Phasianus colchicus, Ring-Necked Pheasant around 110 years old.
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Shoes are Tramezza (moved them out of the way and out them there for a second), fireplace was hand carved 170 years ago with marble inserts, bird is a Phasianus colchicus, Ring-Necked Pheasant around 110 years old.
looks like a cheap faux one .. it's ok though..bird looks dead as shit though ... do you try to feed it?
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Been training this ways for years. I always joke that when people see me working out they think I'm warming up the whole time. I rarely lift at a gym but when I do I usually get stared at not solely based on my size but because of the light weight I use compared to people half my size who throw enormous amounts of weight on the bar. Tempo and rest periods are pretty much all you need to understand for one to grow from resistance exercise. Remember though that muscle size does have a limit so gains will eventually stop.
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haha still on hormones
Brutal wtf are shoes doing on the faux fireplace complete with a stuffed bird ;D
They are strategically placed items intended to initiate debate. ;)
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They are strategically placed items intended to initiate debate. ;)
Qft
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Been training this ways for years. I always joke that when people see me working out they think I'm warming up the whole time. I rarely lift at a gym but when I do I usually get stared at not solely based on my size but because of the light weight I use compared to people half my size who throw enormous amounts of weight on the bar. Tempo and rest periods are pretty much all you need to understand for one to grow from resistance exercise. Remember though that muscle size does have a limit so gains will eventually stop.
Do you think there is any good reason to "go heavy" as far muscle building is concerned?
I always laugh at this one:
(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-ptzCKia0Wzw/UVH-vf-dCfI/AAAAAAAAAFU/7uSSROsTLHA/s1600/PIo8E.jpg)
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Do you think there is any good reason to "go heavy" as far muscle building is concerned?
I always laugh at this one:
(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-ptzCKia0Wzw/UVH-vf-dCfI/AAAAAAAAAFU/7uSSROsTLHA/s1600/PIo8E.jpg)
Well I know that you know that ( ???) "go heavy" really has no meaning at all when applied to how someone should lift weights when looking to increase muscle hypertrophy. But yes usually people tend to think go heavy is to use a weight that you can barely move for 5 or so reps have your spotter do most of the work and maybe scream a few times for that extra umf and then they go home and over eat and get fat.
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there's no 'taking me apart' sunshine.
I look the way I do. you look the way you do.
that's your reality.
when I want to walk around looking like a 130 pound dried prune I'll look you up. I'm in the business of bettering myself. looking godly. improving my body and my performace. in doing so I'm sharing w others who might have the same goals.
I have no vested interest in you or anyone else wanting to try this. I could give a fuck what you 'think'. cause your basing your ignorant opinion on nothing other than speculation and a distain for my personality.
you see where 'win' and you 'lose' since that seems to be such a repeated motif in your posts is that it is everything I say it is. I'm going to keep improving that physique you see in the pics I've posted. your going to sit there crying abt how you don't like me.
who wins? lol
Your continued meltdowns and whining about how I burn and frustrate you is proof enough.
You care a lot about what I, and others, think of you. Remember it was you that started this pissing match. I never addressed you or the training protocol you claimed to have invented. I didn't even have you mind when I simply addressed TA and asked him to show clear evidence as to the progress he claims to have made. I don't care about your programs or protocols as your development comes from vials and needles. But that's when you inserted yourself and personally insulted me.
Now you find yourself embroiled in a situation you regret getting involved in. You may think you can talk to people anyway you want. To be condescending and arrogant. To consider your impatience with people that do not share your level of perceived brilliance as a sign of your superior intelligence. That one just has to "deal" with your "abrasive" personality. And that's just what I'm doing. I deal with it by teaching you some manners and to show respect and courtesy for other people regardless of their level of intelligence, or more importantly to you, muscular development.
As an aside, I rarely allow events on this board to spill over in real life but I just couldn't resist sharing your story with my brochachos about how you so magnanimously kept your shirt on at a pool party. How self satisfied you must have felt that you spared the rest of the men there the embarrassment of feeling so inferior because you have bigger muscles than they do. Do you also wear those absurdly baggy shirts to "hide" your advance level of physical development as further proof that you are the "most humble person" one would ever meet?
The level of self-delusion and skewed sense of self worth of bodybuilders just never cease to amaze me. Actually I take that back. I am never surprised or amazed. It is more accurate to say "never cease to amuse me."
A hearty and mocking laugh was had by all.
The burning and frustrating continues.....
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I didn't read any of this because it's way too long a response to my short, simple post. Again, this is what you said:
certainly nothing special. If you were you would have won something. There are tons of guys in every nowhere gym in the world going through the motions that blow you away.
Nothing in those long response paragraphs can possibly make this a compliment, which is all I pointed out. Not interested in overwrought defenses, etc. I have the attention span of a nat ( :)) and poor reading comprehension skills.
You are quite right that this is, and was intended as, an insult. But context is everything. I made that remark in response to an out of nowhere personal insult from No One. His implication that I, and others (as he has made this claim several times), are condemned to a life of mediocrity because we don't do what he does. The implication by that comment is clearly that he doesn't consider himself mediocre but in fact better than others and feels qualified to give advice and training theories on a take or leave it terms and considers his word as evidence enough. I begged to differ. He may consider himself exceptional but I don't. And I have more evidence to support my position than he does his, i.e., he has done nothing to merit being a expert on anything.
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Basile could have found investors but didn't because he's not a good salesman. He should have hired an outside pitchman to sell his equipment. Despite how annoying he is, he has built some unique stuff but even Arthur Jones needed to hire people.
Yes, you make a valid point. Many of us could have been more successful only if....
I do consider A.J. a good salesman. Vince's talent was in construction and creating. Unfortunately that does not automatically translate into talents elsewhere.
In all seriousness, I do consider this a real tragedy. No just for Vince but for the entire fitness industry.
I doubt his sons has his gifts so all of it will die with his passing.
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I'm not reading all that shit.
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I'm not reading all that shit.
I actually LOL'd
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Well I know that you know that ( ???) "go heavy" really has no meaning at all when applied to how someone should lift weights when looking to increase muscle hypertrophy. But yes usually people tend to think go heavy is to use a weight that you can barely move for 5 or so reps have your spotter do most of the work and maybe scream a few times for that extra umf and then they go home and over eat and get fat.
Well. if you are say a 400lb bench presser and spend six months training fast and light with say 225, I can guarantee you that if you decide to get under 400 again you will be crushed. That's just the way it is. Even Frank Zane, who was not a super heavy trainer said that you should take as much time as you need between sets to be able to give a full effort for your next set. I think he knew his stuff.
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We need before/after pics for validity or it's just one white mans opinion.
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haha still on hormones
Brutal wtf are shoes doing on the faux fireplace complete with a stuffed bird ;D
you are such a god damned romanian sex offender sev
TA looks good in that photo above
but that is a 120% natural physique you twinkie
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Been training this ways for years. I always joke that when people see me working out they think I'm warming up the whole time. I rarely lift at a gym but when I do I usually get stared at not solely based on my size but because of the light weight I use compared to people half my size who throw enormous amounts of weight on the bar. Tempo and rest periods are pretty much all you need to understand for one to grow from resistance exercise. Remember though that muscle size does have a limit so gains will eventually stop.
jim,
Not to get out of topic. can you share with us your thought ( in different thread), AAs, diet principles for gym rat. someone not plaining to step one stage.. just to look good \ healthy...
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You are quite right that this is, and was intended as, an insult. But context is everything. I made that remark in response to an out of nowhere personal insult from No One. His implication that I, and others (as he has made this claim several times), are condemned to a life of mediocrity because we don't do what he does. The implication by that comment is clearly that he doesn't consider himself mediocre but in fact better than others and feels qualified to give advice and training theories on a take or leave it terms and considers his word as evidence enough. I begged to differ. He may consider himself exceptional but I don't. And I have more evidence to support my position than he does his, i.e., he has done nothing to merit being a expert on anything.
Nothing personal, Pellius, by why do the older folk express themselves at such length? One, two sentences, done. Points are valid, my friend, but brevity is an ally.
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Been training this ways for years. I always joke that when people see me working out they think I'm warming up the whole time. I rarely lift at a gym but when I do I usually get stared at not solely based on my size but because of the light weight I use compared to people half my size who throw enormous amounts of weight on the bar. Tempo and rest periods are pretty much all you need to understand for one to grow from resistance exercise. Remember though that muscle size does have a limit so gains will eventually stop.
Very succinct. I think it was during a Cutler video where I fell asleep and woke up to hear him say something about quality time under tension. Without good momentum and quality time under tension, you're not stimulating your muscles to their full potential.
I do a 5 day split, but do a full body workout as well. I hit my target muscle the hardest, redo my previously trained muscle (full workout, only warm up weights] and a light circuit for everything else. If that makes sense...
I used to think it was a ticket to flattening out until my body got used to it. I started training non stop since before summer pretty much. My wife studies on the stair stepper so I'm also on that thing once or twice a day. Keeps your calves super jacked and I think it helps with recovery. I don't get tired from the stepper anymore.
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We need before/after pics for validity or it's just one white mans opinion.
Someone gets it.
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Nothing personal, Pellius, by why do the older folk express themselves at such length? One, two sentences, done. Points are valid, my friend, but brevity is an ally.
Ron pays me by the word and I never want to miss an opportunity to spite CalvinH.
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I remember when I first watched Coleman's "Unbelievable" vid. For chest he did about five sets of flat bench, about 5 inclines then declines and dumbbell flies. The same routine that has been, and still is, done for generations on end.
With genetics and lots hormones it doesn't really matter what you do. You'll be huge. Without genetics and lots of hormones it doesn't matter what you do. You'll be, well, mediocre.
Everyone can get better and improve. Only a precious few can be champs.
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Dr. Walczak, the go to doctor in the 1970s-80s in So Cal and whom probably only Basile and Coach will remember, told me that if you know what you are doing and follow everything to a "T" you will max out naturally in about 3 years with about 90% of your gains coming in the first year. After that you can play with body composition but as far as gaining lean muscle... ain't gong to happen. Your body does not like muscle and keeps the minimal amount necessary for it's needs. Give it the slightest excuse and it will get rid of it.
No exercise routine will make much of a difference. Because No One thought of something that he hasn't thought of before he assumes, in his typical self-absorbed and conceited manner, that nobody has thought of it and tried it previously. There are millions and millions of people across generations who have been experimenting with training protocols.
He has come up with nothing new and as with previous trainers before him will experience little to nothing in gains. The only thing that will matter is whether he ups his dose or not. Put away the vials and needles for 3 months and then see how innovative and productive your training methods are.
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I'm not reading all that shit.
You follow every word that I write. You have research my post history in detail. But I get it that you are easing out of this thread. I, too, am growing weary of bullying you around. I trust that you will learn your lesson about staying out of issues that wasn't directed at you or even concerned you.
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lol dude you're a bit of a headcase eh? like I actually think your a good dude. but you have waaaay to much time on your hands and way to high an opinion of your own importance if you think I'm going to read all that shit.
so keep writing your 1000 word monologues. it gives me great joy to know im deep enough in someone's head that when I open a thread all I see is a full page of 'pelvis' quoting my posts. lol like holy fuck dude. the only one who cares is you. and your looking like a retard right now.
just trying to help.
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I like pellius but I also scrolled over his treatises on muscular development on this page.
-
Dr. Walczak, the go to doctor in the 1970s-80s in So Cal and whom probably only Basile and Coach will remember, told me that if you know what you are doing and follow everything to a "T" you will max out naturally in about 3 years with about 90% of your gains coming in the first year. After that you can play with body composition but as far as gaining lean muscle... ain't gong to happen. Your body does not like muscle and keeps the minimal amount necessary for it's needs. Give it the slightest excuse and it will get rid of it.
No exercise routine will make much of a difference. Because No One thought of something that he hasn't thought of before he assumes, in his typical self-absorbed and conceited manner, that nobody has thought of it and tried it previously. There are millions and millions of people across generations who have been experimenting with training protocols.
He has come up with nothing new and as with previous trainers before him will experience little to nothing in gains. The only thing that will matter is whether he ups his dose or not. Put away the vials and needles for 3 months and then see how innovative and productive your training methods are.
Well, Pellius, ignore the comprehension limited fellows here. I didn't talk with Dr Walczak much but he was on holiday in Vancouver in the summer of 1970. I was still looking good after winning my title at the end of May. He told me if I came to LA and went under his supervision with Decadurabolin that I could be Mr Universe in 6 months. No thanks to that as those titles and trophies weren't more important than my health. Besides, Arnold and Sergio had arrived and pushed bodybuilding to a whole new level. I mean, no matter what most of us did we were never going to be as big as those two giants.
I did come up with something new re training. As long as I can remember the idea of training was to break down the tissue and then wait until the body adapted by growing bigger and stronger muscles. We followed Dr Hans Selye's stress model. What evolved was to train bodyparts twice a week. We used to train upper body MWF and legs TThSa. So we had split routines that did this. When Arthur Jones arrived around 1969 the whole scene changed and we all tried to be more efficient by doing less sets. I still clung to the idea put forward by Larry Scott. He said if you could pump your arms bigger than ever you would grow muscle. So what I did was try to see how few sets I could do to reach the maximum pump. It was about 7 sets. I totally missed what I had to do and my arms never did measure 18 inches cold.
In 1999 I thought I would have a go at seeing how big I could get my arms. No drugs, of course. That stopped in 1975 and only 2 Dianabol tablets were used. What I discovered was that when I did something that made my arms larger they were sore for several days. Ah, ha, I thought, what if I kept them sore?! Up until then just about everyone believed you grew after the soreness went. In other words, we were supposed to let the muscle recover then retrain them. The problem with doing that is we have to overcome the repeated bout effect and it takes much more of whatever you were doing to generate more hypertrophy. I concluded that DOMS could be used to guage when hypertrophy was occurring. If a workout didn't generate significant DOMS then I wasn't going to grow. I would stay the same which is what 90% of what bodybuilders do every time they train. Few keep growing.
For a month I kept both arms and calves sore. I was growing 1/10 inch per workout and in one month put an inch on my arms and over an inch on my calves. Unfortunately for me I got sore elbows from having my elbows on the pads. Since then I never let my elbows touch any pads. I injured my Achilles tendons from doing too many ballistic movements with 700 pounds on the calf machine. Gosh, I really got strong quickly. However, sooner or later you enter the danger zone where injuries can happen. I trained every 3rd day to give the connective tissue a chance to heal. The muscles seemed fine.
-
When I trained calves for the month I got to the point where I didn't rest much between sets. I would finish one set then so a short circle twice then do another set. Over and over and over.
Perhaps the rest was about 10 seconds. I never looked at my watch. The muscle recovered enough in that short time to allow me to get about the same reps with the heavy load. I kept
the load constant after the warm up sets.
For arms I did supersets for triceps then biceps. Just enough rest to go back and forth between the machines. Then I would rest a couple of minutes before the next superset. After the 4th
superset I couldn't do as many reps unless I rested much longer. My goal was to repeat set after set with the same resistance to failure. Stopping before failure didn't seem sensible because
I always believed you have to do something extraordinary to cause the muscles to grow larger. So I would start my working sets at a weight I could just get 20 reps with. By the 4th set
the reps were down to about 12. That was still sufficient to generate a good pump.
Somehow the idea of using lighter weights and virtually no rest between sets doesn't seem right to me. Your body will surely adapt to these protocols but I doubt the light weights will
stimulate much hypertrophy.
-
Well, Pellius, spare the comprehension limited fellows here. I didn't talk with Dr Walczak much but he was on holiday in Vancouver in the summer of 1970. I was still looking good after winning my title at the end of May. He told me if I came to LA and went under his supervision with Decadurabolin that I could be Mr Universe in 6 months. No thanks to that as those titles and trophies weren't more important than my health. Besides, Arnold and Sergio had arrived and pushed bodybuilding to a whole new level. I mean, no matter what most of us did we were never going to be as big as those two giants.
I did come up with something new re training. As long as I can remember the idea of training was to break down the tissue and then wait until the body adapted by growing bigger and stronger muscles. We followed Dr Hans Selye's stress model. What evolved was to train bodyparts twice a week. We used to train upper body MWF and legs TThSa. So we had split routines that did this. When Arthur Jones arrived around 1969 the whole scene changed and we all tried to be more efficient by doing less sets. I still clung to the idea put forward by Larry Scott. He said if you could pump your arms bigger than ever you would grow muscle. So what I did was try to see how few sets I could do to reach the maximum pump. It was about 7 sets. I totally missed what I had to do and my arms never did measure 18 inches cold.
In 1999 I thought I would have a go at seeing how big I could get my arms. No drugs, of course. That stopped in 1975 and only 2 Dianabol tablets were used. What I discovered was that when I did something that made my arms larger they were sore for several days. Ah, ha, I thought, what if I kept them sore?! Up until then just about everyone believed you grew after the soreness went. In other words, we were supposed to let the muscle recover then retrain them. The problem with doing that is we have to overcome the repeated bout effect and it takes much more of whatever you were doing to generate more hypertrophy. I concluded that DOMS could be used to guage when hypertrophy was occurring. If a workout didn't generate significant DOMS then I wasn't going to grow. I would stay the same which is what 90% of what bodybuilders do every time they train. Few keep growing.
For a month I kept both arms and calves sore. I was growing 1/10 inch per workout and in one month put an inch on my arms and over an inch on my calves. Unfortunately for me I got sore elbows from having my elbows on the pads. Since then I never let my elbows touch any pads. I injured my Achilles tendons from doing too many ballistic movements with 700 pounds on the calf machine. Gosh, I really got strong quickly. However, sooner or later you enter the danger zone where injuries can happen. I trained every 3rd day to give the connective tissue a chance to heal. The muscles seemed fine.
Perhaps you'd be so kind to do likewise.
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Perhaps you'd so kind to do likewise.
If some of you guys can't absorb what is written in a couple of paragraphs you are unlikely to grasp the details of any theory of hypertrophy.
No worries, just continue to believe what you do now. If you don't make any gains just say it is because you are not on the gear. If you are on
then blame your genetics.
-
When I trained calves for the month I got to the point where I didn't rest much between sets. I would finish one set then so a short circle twice then do another set. Over and over and over.
Perhaps the rest was about 10 seconds. I never looked at my watch. The muscle recovered enough in that short time to allow me to get about the same reps with the heavy load. I kept
the load constant after the warm up sets.
For arms I did supersets for triceps then biceps. Just enough rest to go back and forth between the machines. Then I would rest a couple of minutes before the next superset. After the 4th
superset I couldn't do as many reps unless I rested much longer. My goal was to repeat set after set with the same resistance to failure. Stopping before failure didn't seem sensible because
I always believed you have to do something extraordinary to cause the muscles to grow larger. So I would start my working sets at a weight I could just get 20 reps with. By the 4th set
the reps were down to about 12. That was still sufficient to generate a good pump.
Somehow the idea of using lighter weights and virtually no rest between sets doesn't seem right to me. Your body will surely adapt to these protocols but I doubt the light weights will
stimulate much hypertrophy.
You don't have to use light wights. go heavier. I do follow the no one style for months with great succeed. I use wight I can hit 10 reps. then my reps go lower 8, 6, 5, 3...and I'm stronger than ever. with half the AAs doses....infact. all what i use is 40 anvar ED.... :)
-
When I trained calves for the month I got to the point where I didn't rest much between sets. I would finish one set then so a short circle twice then do another set. Over and over and over.
Perhaps the rest was about 10 seconds. I never looked at my watch. The muscle recovered enough in that short time to allow me to get about the same reps with the heavy load. I kept
the load constant after the warm up sets.
For arms I did supersets for triceps then biceps. Just enough rest to go back and forth between the machines. Then I would rest a couple of minutes before the next superset. After the 4th
superset I couldn't do as many reps unless I rested much longer. My goal was to repeat set after set with the same resistance to failure. Stopping before failure didn't seem sensible because
I always believed you have to do something extraordinary to cause the muscles to grow larger. So I would start my working sets at a weight I could just get 20 reps with. By the 4th set
the reps were down to about 12. That was still sufficient to generate a good pump.
Somehow the idea of using lighter weights and virtually no rest between sets doesn't seem right to me. Your body will surely adapt to these protocols but I doubt the light weights will
stimulate much hypertrophy.
vince your missing the point.
the lighter weight/ no rest is strictly to allow you to train your whole body in around an hour, get a massive pump and get the fuck out of the gym so you can hit it again tomorrow, and the day after that and the day after that. and every day after those. and recover enough between sessions to do it.
thats where the growth is. not the duration of the workouts. not the time under tension. not the weight. the FREQUENCY OF THE SESSIONS. constant pounding of the fiber forcing the adaptation necessary for it to strengthen, become more efficient, and grow.
the no rest/ compression is simply just one aspect of it. and i'll address the 'lighter weight' comment here as well.
i didnt say train lighter. i said to use the same number of sets and reps your using now. if you have to reduce the weight to do that your still taxing the fiber to failure regardless of weight so weight becomes relative at this point.
this isnt about just training with no rest. no rest enables you to train your body in an hour and gtfo the gym go home rest and force the adaptations necessary to come back tomorrow and hit it again. the frequency- training the whole body every day is where the changes are made.
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You don't have to use light wights. go heavier. I do follow the no one style for months with great succeed. I use wight I can hit 10 reps. then my reps go lower 8, 6, 5, 3...and I'm stronger than ever. with half the AAs doses....infact. all what i use is 40 anvar ED.... :)
fuck man thats what im trying to tell these guys and its like banging my fucking head on a rock in here.
jesus christ its frustrating.
im at a point where im not even going to bother posting shit like this any longer. its just not worth my time debating and arguing something that i know works, that others say works. to a bunch of people who have never tried it that say it wont work.
im going thru the same thing in my diet thread. ffs. unreal. people are fucked.
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If some of you guys can't absorb what is written in a couple of paragraphs you are unlikely to grasp the details of any theory of hypertrophy.
No worries, just continue to believe what you do now. If you don't make any gains just say it is because you are not on the gear. If you are on
then blame your genetics.
Do you have even a single example of someone benefitting from your breakthrough theories or overly complicated mousetraps?
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lol dude you're a bit of a headcase eh? like I actually think your a good dude. but you have waaaay to much time on your hands and way to high an opinion of your own importance if you think I'm going to read all that shit.
so keep writing your 1000 word monologues. it gives me great joy to know im deep enough in someone's head that when I open a thread all I see is a full page of 'pelvis' quoting my posts. lol like holy fuck dude. the only one who cares is you. and your looking like a retard right now.
just trying to help.
Nice back pedaling. I understand. You bit off more than you can chew. A bully always meets his match someday.
Now tell the story again about how you kept your shirt on at a pool party to prove how you are the most modest and humblest guy one could ever meet. And how you actually think about these things. That one will never get old. Also, keep peppering your responses with "lol". It proves how intelligent you are and why you are so impatient with the plebs.
-
Well, Pellius, ignore the comprehension limited fellows here. I didn't talk with Dr Walczak much but he was on holiday in Vancouver in the summer of 1970. I was still looking good after winning my title at the end of May. He told me if I came to LA and went under his supervision with Decadurabolin that I could be Mr Universe in 6 months. No thanks to that as those titles and trophies weren't more important than my health. Besides, Arnold and Sergio had arrived and pushed bodybuilding to a whole new level. I mean, no matter what most of us did we were never going to be as big as those two giants.
I did come up with something new re training. As long as I can remember the idea of training was to break down the tissue and then wait until the body adapted by growing bigger and stronger muscles. We followed Dr Hans Selye's stress model. What evolved was to train bodyparts twice a week. We used to train upper body MWF and legs TThSa. So we had split routines that did this. When Arthur Jones arrived around 1969 the whole scene changed and we all tried to be more efficient by doing less sets. I still clung to the idea put forward by Larry Scott. He said if you could pump your arms bigger than ever you would grow muscle. So what I did was try to see how few sets I could do to reach the maximum pump. It was about 7 sets. I totally missed what I had to do and my arms never did measure 18 inches cold.
In 1999 I thought I would have a go at seeing how big I could get my arms. No drugs, of course. That stopped in 1975 and only 2 Dianabol tablets were used. What I discovered was that when I did something that made my arms larger they were sore for several days. Ah, ha, I thought, what if I kept them sore?! Up until then just about everyone believed you grew after the soreness went. In other words, we were supposed to let the muscle recover then retrain them. The problem with doing that is we have to overcome the repeated bout effect and it takes much more of whatever you were doing to generate more hypertrophy. I concluded that DOMS could be used to guage when hypertrophy was occurring. If a workout didn't generate significant DOMS then I wasn't going to grow. I would stay the same which is what 90% of what bodybuilders do every time they train. Few keep growing.
For a month I kept both arms and calves sore. I was growing 1/10 inch per workout and in one month put an inch on my arms and over an inch on my calves. Unfortunately for me I got sore elbows from having my elbows on the pads. Since then I never let my elbows touch any pads. I injured my Achilles tendons from doing too many ballistic movements with 700 pounds on the calf machine. Gosh, I really got strong quickly. However, sooner or later you enter the danger zone where injuries can happen. I trained every 3rd day to give the connective tissue a chance to heal. The muscles seemed fine.
I think what is often missed, ignore or not considered by bbers is that when the body adapts to resistance training this doesn't necessarily mean that adaptive response is muscle hypertrophy. Arnold mentioned in his first bio how they went up into the mountains and did 60 sets of squats. Benny Podda said that he and Ray Mentzer would have "squat parties" in which they would literally squat for hours on end through the night.
I imgine they would have adapted in the sense that they could endure such training better than when they first started. But did this translate into an increase in muscle size? Though I personally thought Arnold had great quads in his prime, it was often considered a weak point and I imgaine if 60 sets were productive he would have continued to use this protocol.
Again I look at Coleman's training. He did nothing special but push himself. Just basic exercises using questionable form yet he built more quality muscle mass than any human being thus far. I looked at Jay's training. Same monotous routine that seem to rarely change with a more "going through the motions" mentality than Coleman yet was a multiple Mr. O.
As Thomas Sowell from Stanford University once remarked, "So much of a person's fate is determine on the day he is born."
Where you are born? With what you are born with? To whom you are born from?.... The list is endless.
-
When I trained calves for the month I got to the point where I didn't rest much between sets. I would finish one set then so a short circle twice then do another set. Over and over and over.
Perhaps the rest was about 10 seconds. I never looked at my watch. The muscle recovered enough in that short time to allow me to get about the same reps with the heavy load. I kept
the load constant after the warm up sets.
For arms I did supersets for triceps then biceps. Just enough rest to go back and forth between the machines. Then I would rest a couple of minutes before the next superset. After the 4th
superset I couldn't do as many reps unless I rested much longer. My goal was to repeat set after set with the same resistance to failure. Stopping before failure didn't seem sensible because
I always believed you have to do something extraordinary to cause the muscles to grow larger. So I would start my working sets at a weight I could just get 20 reps with. By the 4th set
the reps were down to about 12. That was still sufficient to generate a good pump.
Somehow the idea of using lighter weights and virtually no rest between sets doesn't seem right to me. Your body will surely adapt to these protocols but I doubt the light weights will
stimulate much hypertrophy.
Well, the whole idea, at least as I first was made to understand it, is that the reason we even use weights/resistance is to provide what was then termed as and "over load" to the muscle. Making it do something it has not done before or as Jones put it, "Attempt the momentarily impossible."
I idea of simply performing a movement and getting a pump is secondary. I can pump up my biceps by repeatedly flexing and relaxing then. No one would argue this would stimulate any adaptive response. There is no resistance. That's why I always considered crunches pretty useless in developing your abs. Sits-ups on a decline I felt was much better if you are trying to increase the size and strength of your abdominals.
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Hold on...... Pellius is actually talking shit to no one?
Pellius looks like a veiny corpse.
No one has a body only Pellius could dream of.
Turtle belly mad.
-
you will max out naturally in about 3 years with about 90% of your gains coming in the first year.
I totally disagree
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vince your missing the point.
the lighter weight/ no rest is strictly to allow you to train your whole body in around an hour, get a massive pump and get the fuck out of the gym so you can hit it again tomorrow, and the day after that and the day after that. and every day after those. and recover enough between sessions to do it.
thats where the growth is. not the duration of the workouts. not the time under tension. not the weight. the FREQUENCY OF THE SESSIONS. constant pounding of the fiber forcing the adaptation necessary for it to strengthen, become more efficient, and grow.
the no rest/ compression is simply just one aspect of it. and i'll address the 'lighter weight' comment here as well.
i didnt say train lighter. i said to use the same number of sets and reps your using now. if you have to reduce the weight to do that your still taxing the fiber to failure regardless of weight so weight becomes relative at this point.
this isnt about just training with no rest. no rest enables you to train your body in an hour and gtfo the gym go home rest and force the adaptations necessary to come back tomorrow and hit it again. the frequency- training the whole body every day is where the changes are made.
This is directed at Vince because it makes a good point. As Arthur Jones pointed out, the relationship between intensity and resistance is coincidental. In fact, he considered it an ideal situation to have low resistance with high intensity to avoid injury and wear and tear.
Take a person doing, say, a set of barbell curls. Say he can curl 100 lbs for 10 reps failing at the 11th despite all his effort. During his first rep his output is high because he could very easily curl more than 100 lbs at that moment. Yet intensity is low because it's easy for him. As the set progresses his output starts to drop, i.e. his ability to exert force via muscular contraction, yet his intensity goes up as it takes more volitional effort with each additional rep. On his last rep his output is at his lowest, he is at his weakest, but his intensity is at his highest.
By moving quickly Jones claimed that you can increase intensity as well as develop "cardiovascular conditioining". You train your muscles individually anaerobically and your body, in the systemic sense, aerobically.
If can do 20 sets in an hour and then later do that same 20 sets in the same fashion in a half an hour you have not increased the work load but you have increased the intensity. Same principle that no matter whether you walk or run a mile you still burn the same amount of calories except if you run the mile in 4.5 minutes you have just increase the intensity of the run then if you did it in 10 minutes.
Who will be in better shape? The one who runs a mile or the one who walks the mile. Of the three factors in training: frequency, duration and intensity; it is intensity that is by far the most neglected. People simply don't train hard enough to stimulate an adaptive response.
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Hold on...... Pellius is actually talking shit to no one?
Pellius looks like a veiny corpse.
No one has a body only Pellius could dream of.
Turtle belly mad.
Good to see you back on the boards. Loved that latest pic you posted. I wasn't able to get in on the thread that ran for volumes due to time constraints.
-
I totally disagree
Well, the good doctor did say there are exceptions to everything. I consider you far above average genetically. Just look at the average gym rat that has been training for years and years.
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dear pelvis.
it brings me great pleausre to write you this letter.
you are a very very weird little man, sir. do you realise this? i think not or else you wouldnt be behaving in such an erratic manner. its a combination of stalkerish/ weird vested interest in trying to conquer the mighty no one, which is just not a possibility.
you seem so infatuated with my shirt being on at a pool party- but i can understand looking the way you do, that if you in the remotest looked like me you'd have your shirt off before you got thru the lobby of the hotel. i get that.
understand this, gimp. you are not me. the reasons i do the things i do are not the same reasons you would. thats why when you say i left my shirt on was because i think im better than everyone else? well thats exactly why you'd leave your shirt on if you looked like me -your reasoning belies the cock that you'd be in real life.
you see, my reasons are far less complex, dildo. i didnt feel the need to remove my shirt simply because i felt like leaving it on. its a pretty simple concept. i wasnt there to showcase myself like you would be if you didnt look like something that fell out of a bag of raisins.
believe it or not, speedbag, there actually are some people who look great that dont take their shirts off at venues one would typically expect one to be shirtless. amazing isnt it? Xfactor has one the best builds on this site, and one of the best builds i have seen irl, and he had his shirt on this summer at an event we attended. i was like dude, whats with the shirt. he gave me this look that was so blank it was like i had asked him why he was eating if we were at a restaurant.
of course being the cock you are you just wouldnt get that, would you, cock?
so, let me end this wonderful soliloquy to my greatness by encouraging you to further follow me around this thread like a tail on a dog as you continue your downward spiral into looking like a bigger fucking weirdo than you were two pages ago. lol
dismissed, nancy.
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Well, the good doctor did say there are exceptions to everything. I consider you far above average genetically. Just look at the average gym rat that has been training for years and years.
It took me about 10 years of consistent training to max out , BTW you still training MMA ?
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It took me about 10 years of consistent training to max out , BTW you still training MMA ?
I heard he switched to BBC.
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Who cares why someone didn't take off his shirt! What are the principles of hypertrophy? That is what is important.
No one has presented a system and claims the frequency is the trigger for adaptation. The problem for this system
is that how do you progress if you are training once a day already? When you have to spend so much time training
it defeats the purpose of doing exercises. In other words, who wants to train daily like that to keep his gains?
We need progression for hypertrophy to keep occurring.
Pellius is arguing that intensity is the trigger. Unfortunately that isn't completely true. Yes, you have to experience
time under tension for a certain length of time. Suppose it is the last two reps of a set that contribute the most to
a stimulus for more muscle size. If you do just one set that is insufficient to keep a large muscle growing. What we
need are more sets. Perhaps we need from 1 to 2 minutes under the maximum intensity per workout. That means
you need to do plenty of sets. That is exactly what most champs have discovered. Lots of hard sets. I think we
need 5 or 6 sets using the maximum resistance. Now, whether there are equivalent methods that generate the same
stimulus isn't known but I rather doubt we need big muscles to lift light weights. We need big muscles to lift
moderately heavy weights over and over and over again. I don't see how anyone can avoid doing this.
-
I think what is often missed, ignore or not considered by bbers is that when the body adapts to resistance training this doesn't necessarily mean that adaptive response is muscle hypertrophy. Arnold mentioned in his first bio how they went up into the mountains and did 60 sets of squats. Benny Podda said that he and Ray Mentzer would have "squat parties" in which they would literally squat for hours on end through the night.
I imgine they would have adapted in the sense that they could endure such training better than when they first started. But did this translate into an increase in muscle size? Though I personally thought Arnold had great quads in his prime, it was often considered a weak point and I imgaine if 60 sets were productive he would have continued to use this protocol.
Again I look at Coleman's training. He did nothing special but push himself. Just basic exercises using questionable form yet he built more quality muscle mass than any human being thus far. I looked at Jay's training. Same monotous routine that seem to rarely change with a more "going through the motions" mentality than Coleman yet was a multiple Mr. O.
As Thomas Sowell from Stanford University once remarked, "So much of a person's fate is determine on the day he is born."
Where you are born? With what you are born with? To whom you are born from?.... The list is endless.
You've seen his pics, right? We've seen yours. Doesn't that mean anything to you?
-
I have been trying this workout and so far i gotta say i am really impressed.
I have found it hard to get any cardio time in at the gym and i feel like doing the noone method is helping me build muscle and get my cardio in at the same time.
Just few questions:
1. When we get to stage where we do full body-workout everyday do we still do exact same routines. I have currently been doing 6 exercises for back and then 4 for bi's on the same day. Do i continue with these into the full body-workout or shall i cut it down somewhat??
2. My fiends reckons the chance of injury doing workouts like this will increase - he said muscles when sore need rest and training already sore muscles will lead to failure. So what are chance of injury (i can't really suffer any-more as i had 3 knee surgeries and multiple back and elbow issues).
3. I am in my second week of doing this routine and i have good cardio anyway i do alot of long distance swimming - so i am finding the no rest thing not as difficult as 1st week. Should i wait till week 4 or shall i start incorporating more routines into my workout already??
Muscles feel super pumped and i am actually enjoying lifting again as time flies by when you are doing the non-stop protocol. Thanks noone.
-
dear pelvis.
it brings me great pleausre to write you this letter.
you are a very very weird little man, sir. do you realise this? i think not or else you wouldnt be behaving in such an erratic manner. its a combination of stalkerish/ weird vested interest in trying to conquer the mighty no one, which is just not a possibility.
you seem so infatuated with my shirt being on at a pool party- but i can understand looking the way you do, that if you in the remotest looked like me you'd have your shirt off before you got thru the lobby of the hotel. i get that.
understand this, gimp. you are not me. the reasons i do the things i do are not the same reasons you would. thats why when you say i left my shirt on was because i think im better than everyone else? well thats exactly why you'd leave your shirt on if you looked like me -your reasoning belies the cock that you'd be in real life.
you see, my reasons are far less complex, dildo. i didnt feel the need to remove my shirt simply because i felt like leaving it on. its a pretty simple concept. i wasnt there to showcase myself like you would be if you didnt look like something that fell out of a bag of raisins.
believe it or not, speedbag, there actually are some people who look great that dont take their shirts off at venues one would typically expect one to be shirtless. amazing isnt it? Xfactor has one the best builds on this site, and one of the best builds i have seen irl, and he had his shirt on this summer at an event we attended. i was like dude, whats with the shirt. he gave me this look that was so blank it was like i had asked him why he was eating if we were at a restaurant.
of course being the cock you are you just wouldnt get that, would you, cock?
so, let me end this wonderful soliloquy to my greatness by encouraging you to further follow me around this thread like a tail on a dog as you continue your downward spiral into looking like a bigger fucking weirdo than you were two pages ago. lol
dismissed, nancy.
X2. Was at a XS in Vegas swim and was in my best shape in years. Full clean cut abs, lean, running tren hard. I felt comfortable in my tank. Even though my friends pestered me to take it off I just felt uncomfortable being in a club with my shirt off. I wasn't embarassed or anything, just didn't make me feel comfortable to do. I still racked up more chicks than them anyways. Even at the pool parties I took my shirt off a couple times but I just feel better dressed. I guess it doesn't make sense to work out so hard, diet and get clean to keep a shirt off but chicks can see enough from my arms and shoulders that I am lean and cut underneath the shirt.
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vince your missing the point.
If Vince put on an inch on his arms and over an inch on his calves in a month, perhaps he has a point too?
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Good to see you back on the boards. Loved that latest pic you posted. I wasn't able to get in on the thread that ran for volumes due to time constraints.
We are thankful for that.
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If Vince put on an inch on his arms and over an inch on his calves in a month, perhaps he has a point too?
i was referring to the point of my routine.
he can have all the points he wants.as much as i enjoy thr discussion all they add up to are specualtion and hypothesis.
he needs to either try it himself, or mentor someone at his gym for 12 weeks if he really wants to prove or disprove the basis of this thread- that my rotuine works.
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I have been trying this workout and so far i gotta say i am really impressed.
I have found it hard to get any cardio time in at the gym and i feel like doing the noone method is helping me build muscle and get my cardio in at the same time.
Just few questions:
1. When we get to stage where we do full body-workout everyday do we still do exact same routines. I have currently been doing 6 exercises for back and then 4 for bi's on the same day. Do i continue with these into the full body-workout or shall i cut it down somewhat??
2. My fiends reckons the chance of injury doing workouts like this will increase - he said muscles when sore need rest and training already sore muscles will lead to failure. So what are chance of injury (i can't really suffer any-more as i had 3 knee surgeries and multiple back and elbow issues).
3. I am in my second week of doing this routine and i have good cardio anyway i do alot of long distance swimming - so i am finding the no rest thing not as difficult as 1st week. Should i wait till week 4 or shall i start incorporating more routines into my workout already??
Muscles feel super pumped and i am actually enjoying lifting again as time flies by when you are doing the non-stop protocol. Thanks noone.
glad you like it dude. keep going the best it yet to come.
so to your questions...
1) keep the volume. you'll recover easily between workouts. in fact you might find by week 12 you'll want to increase the sest as you might not find your original routine taxing enough. as for exercises, switch them up or keep them the same it doesnt matter. all that matters is that the fiber is trained to fatigue w enough weight to cause it to need to repair and adapt, and often enough to get the density and growth and endurance we are after.
2) if you let the body adapt to this routine imo you wont get injured since you are creating a more resilient adapted muscle. thats why you can hendle increased workloads. this ties into directly with your 3rd question...
3) the first two stages are not just about becoming efficient and getting your cardio up, they are there to allow the fiber time to adapt to the increase in workload and frequency of workouts. thats what causes the gains- the adaptations. when you dont give the muscle time to adapt thats when you damage it.
great questions. i hope everyones special attention to numbers 2 and 3. dont be impatient anfd skip weeks. you need to allow the mucsle time to get used to the frequencies. to not do so will set you up for possible injury.
cheers dude thanks for taking the time to post up your questions. id much rather answer qustions from someone doing it, than prove to someone not doing it that it will work.
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I am loving the routine so far as well. Leg day is absolutely brutal with nearly no rest, doing squats.
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I never want to miss an opportunity to spite CalvinH.
:o ;D >:(
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Thanks noone for answering my questions - your a good guy.
I have another question:
- Assuming we were training full body in a single workout. Now do we got in serial fashion i.e train back then chest then tris? Or can we simply do one chest exercise and then one back and so forth. So we still do same routine just in random order. I think this will make it a lot easier because once chest is fatigued on one exercise then if we hit back next it will give chest recover for next time we get around to it. What is the optimal way to do this?
Thanks again, i have not enjoyed working out this much for nearly a decade. Hope i can keep it up.
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I am loving the routine so far as well. Leg day is absolutely brutal with nearly no rest, doing squats.
Sounds dangerous.
Is your GF spotting ???
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dear pelvis.
it brings me great pleausre to write you this letter.
you are a very very weird little man, sir. do you realise this? i think not or else you wouldnt be behaving in such an erratic manner. its a combination of stalkerish/ weird vested interest in trying to conquer the mighty no one, which is just not a possibility.
you seem so infatuated with my shirt being on at a pool party- but i can understand looking the way you do, that if you in the remotest looked like me you'd have your shirt off before you got thru the lobby of the hotel. i get that.
understand this, gimp. you are not me. the reasons i do the things i do are not the same reasons you would. thats why when you say i left my shirt on was because i think im better than everyone else? well thats exactly why you'd leave your shirt on if you looked like me -your reasoning belies the cock that you'd be in real life.
you see, my reasons are far less complex, dildo. i didnt feel the need to remove my shirt simply because i felt like leaving it on. its a pretty simple concept. i wasnt there to showcase myself like you would be if you didnt look like something that fell out of a bag of raisins.
believe it or not, speedbag, there actually are some people who look great that dont take their shirts off at venues one would typically expect one to be shirtless. amazing isnt it? Xfactor has one the best builds on this site, and one of the best builds i have seen irl, and he had his shirt on this summer at an event we attended. i was like dude, whats with the shirt. he gave me this look that was so blank it was like i had asked him why he was eating if we were at a restaurant.
of course being the cock you are you just wouldnt get that, would you, cock?
so, let me end this wonderful soliloquy to my greatness by encouraging you to further follow me around this thread like a tail on a dog as you continue your downward spiral into looking like a bigger fucking weirdo than you were two pages ago. lol
dismissed, nancy.
Wow! Now tha'ts a meltdown! I've really got in your head. "Pelvis", "gimp", "dildo", "speed bag", "cock"..... and the list goes on and on and the epic owning is complete.
Sucks when you mouth off to the wrong person. Should have just mind your own business. Are you going to take your shirt off?
Pellius = Winning
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It took me about 10 years of consistent training to max out , BTW you still training MMA ?
But after about, say five years, were you still about to put on lean muscle. For example, how heavy were you after 8 years of training compare to five years? But in your case even the god of hormonas said that you were exceptional. Look at most people in the gym. They are there year after year but most look like they never picked up a weight in their life.
Yes, still keep the training up but I'm down to twice a week. When people say it's all in the mind I guess they're right in a sense. My "mind", i.e., desire and drive is their but the body simply cannot endure that type of training like it use to. I have to be very careful with the partners I choose to roll with and throw hands with. Hawaii is different than the mainland. Everybody wants to fight all out even in training.
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Who cares why someone didn't take off his shirt! What are the principles of hypertrophy? That is what is important.
No one has presented a system and claims the frequency is the trigger for adaptation. The problem for this system
is that how do you progress if you are training once a day already? When you have to spend so much time training
it defeats the purpose of doing exercises. In other words, who wants to train daily like that to keep his gains?
We need progression for hypertrophy to keep occurring.
Pellius is arguing that intensity is the trigger. Unfortunately that isn't completely true. Yes, you have to experience
time under tension for a certain length of time. Suppose it is the last two reps of a set that contribute the most to
a stimulus for more muscle size. If you do just one set that is insufficient to keep a large muscle growing. What we
need are more sets. Perhaps we need from 1 to 2 minutes under the maximum intensity per workout. That means
you need to do plenty of sets. That is exactly what most champs have discovered. Lots of hard sets. I think we
need 5 or 6 sets using the maximum resistance. Now, whether there are equivalent methods that generate the same
stimulus isn't known but I rather doubt we need big muscles to lift light weights. We need big muscles to lift
moderately heavy weights over and over and over again. I don't see how anyone can avoid doing this.
Yes, you make a good point. How much intensity is required? Maybe it's only 90% or even 80%? But as Mentzer argue you cannot objectively measure those levels. You can accurately measure only two levels: zero intensity and 100% intensity. But even 100% is subjective. Sometimes you think you are really pushing yourself when you really are not. Maybe it's a good thing for at least a beginning to keep track of progress. If you did 8 reps the last time you strive for 9 reps the next.
And the same with duration and frequency. I don't think one set per body part will do it. So how much? Ten, twenty, sixty? Do we train 3 times a week? Six times? Twice a day?
This is where the rub is. The basic principle is the same for everybody and applies to everybody. To increase size, strength and functional ability of a muscle you have to subject it to an over load. It's the specifics that varies from individual to individual as well as the response and results.
I will now take off my shirt.
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You've seen his pics, right? We've seen yours. Doesn't that mean anything to you?
Yes, it means he has a much better physique than me. As I said early on in this thread, No One is an advance bodybuilder. There are tons of advance bodybuilders in every gym across the world.
My issue with him has nothing to do with who has bigger and nicer muscles. In fact, I had no issue with him and never initially addressed him. I simply ask TA for some real world proof as to the great results he is claiming. It was No One who picked a fight with me.
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Yes, it means he has a much better physique than me. As I said early on in this thread, No One is an advance bodybuilder. There are tons of advance bodybuilders in every gym across the world.
My issue with him has nothing to do with who has bigger and nicer muscles. In fact, I had no issue with him and never initially addressed him. I simply ask TA for some real world proof as to the great results he is claiming. It was No One who picked a fight with me.
are u still training/shredded /using?you were very lean 'skinned'for a while .i think your a good dude and good poster here for longtime.
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I am loving the routine so far as well. Leg day is absolutely brutal with nearly no rest, doing squats.
What kind of weights/sets/reps are you using for squats?
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Yes, you make a good point. How much intensity is required? Maybe it's only 90% or even 80%? But as Mentzer argue you cannot objectively measure those levels. You can accurately measure only two levels: zero intensity and 100% intensity. But even 100% is subjective. Sometimes you think you are really pushing yourself when you really are not. Maybe it's a good thing for at least a beginning to keep track of progress. If you did 8 reps the last time you strive for 9 reps the next.
And the same with duration and frequency. I don't think one set per body part will do it. So how much? Ten, twenty, sixty? Do we train 3 times a week? Six times? Twice a day?
This is where the rub is. The basic principle is the same for everybody and applies to everybody. To increase size, strength and functional ability of a muscle you have to subject it to an over load. It's the specifics that varies from individual to individual as well as the response and results.
I will now take off my shirt.
Let us step back and look at the stimulus required to cause an already highly trained muscle to grow bigger. I have read about thresholds when it comes to intensity and it is something like over 75% and probably closer to 80% that is required. If you can do 1 rep with 400 lbs in the bench press then you need somewhere between 300 and 320 pounds to have sufficient intensity. If you use 300 pounds then you should get from 8 to 10 reps with the 300 and from 6 to 8 reps with 320. Then all you need to do is many sets with that resistance and perhaps you will grow. I recommend 5 or 6 heavy sets using the same resistance.
What bodybuilders discovered is that they cannot keep adding weight to the bar. So they added sets. Weight is also added over time as well, so there is always a progression. The accumulation of waste products from those hard sets is what stimulates the muscle to grow.
So along comes no one who discards everything that has been learned over the last 6 decades and suggests we train with greater frequency without rest between the sets. I am not buying this. Sure, severe protocols can work for a while but even he recommends taking anabolics if growth slows. That really is disappointing because the true theory of hypertrophy should allow one to keep progressing with or without drugs.
-
Let us step back and look at the stimulus required to cause an already highly trained muscle to grow bigger. I have read about thresholds when it comes to intensity and it is something like over 75% and probably closer to 80% that is required. If you can do 1 rep with 400 lbs in the bench press then you need somewhere between 300 and 320 pounds to have sufficient intensity. If you use 300 pounds then you should get from 8 to 10 reps with the 300 and from 6 to 8 reps with 320. Then all you need to do is many sets with that resistance and perhaps you will grow. I recommend 5 or 6 heavy sets using the same resistance.
What bodybuilders discovered is that they cannot keep adding weight to the bar. So they added sets. Weight is also added over time as well, so there is always a progression. The accumulation of waste products from those hard sets is what stimulates the muscle to grow.
So along comes no one who discards everything that has been learned over the last 6 decades and suggests we train with greater frequency without rest between the sets. I am not buying this. Sure, severe protocols can work for a while but even he recommends taking anabolics if growth slows. That really is disappointing because the true theory of hypertrophy should allow one to keep progressing with or without drugs.
(http://mrwgifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/Michael-Scott-Closes-The-Door-Awkwardly-On-The-Office.gif)
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(http://mrwgifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/Michael-Scott-Closes-The-Door-Awkwardly-On-The-Office.gif)
LMAO!!
Can you imagine if the machine below had wheels on it and pushing Basile out the door while he rolled away doing arm curls lol.
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=394408.0;attach=428409;image)
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LMAO!!
Can you imagine if the machine below had wheels on it and pushing Basile out the door while he rolled away doing arm curls lol.
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=394408.0;attach=428409;image)
If only ironmeister could make this happen.
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LMAO!!
Can you imagine if the machine below had wheels on it and pushing Basile out the door while he rolled away doing arm curls lol.
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=394408.0;attach=428409;image)
can someone explain to me the story of this photo shop
wtf is vince doing
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I just had a workout on my biceps-supinator. Brutal arm workout combined with triceps extensions on modified Nautilus machine.
I always superset bis and tris and today I did so with no rest after each superset. Did that for 4 sets then a short break and then a few more sets.
If you can superset using opposite muscles then perhaps reducing the rest will work and you can avoid the heavy weights. As you progress with
this protocol you can of course increase the resistance.
I always keep an open mind about hypertrophy and perhaps there are many equivalent means to the same end. However, we all have to stimulate
the muscles and the same symptoms will be there no matter which means we used. Pump, shaking, fullness, exhaustion, etc.
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can someone explain to me the story of this photo shop
wtf is vince doing
Not a photo shop :-\
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If only ironmeister could make this happen.
LMAO!!!
Ill have to put in the request.
edit: request submitted ;D
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Not a photo shop :-\
That photo was taken in January 2005. The machine has recently been modified to make it simpler and easier to use.
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That photo was taken in January 2005. The machine has recently been modified to make it simpler and easier to use.
do you have a website where i can purchase one?
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I just had a workout on my biceps-supinator. Brutal arm workout combined with triceps extensions on modified Nautilus machine.
I always superset bis and tris and today I did so with no rest after each superset. Did that for 4 sets then a short break and then a few more sets.
If you can superset using opposite muscles then perhaps reducing the rest will work and you can avoid the heavy weights. As you progress with
this protocol you can of course increase the resistance.
I always keep an open mind about hypertrophy and perhaps there are many equivalent means to the same end. However, we all have to stimulate
the muscles and the same symptoms will be there no matter which means we used. Pump, shaking, fullness, exhaustion, etc.
It's gotta bug you that with all these groundbreaking hypertrophy theories and innovative wormhole-traveling vehicles you've designed, your safety fat-protected physique can no longer enjoy even the most minimal gains.
All due respect, of course.
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do you have a website where i can purchase one?
No. None for sale. That could change in the future but I won't be building any more.
I just finished training my arms. Got an 1 3/8 inch pump doing my routine with less weight and rest between sets. If a routine is difficult and results in a larger pump then that should stimulate more hypertrophy.
I will see tomorrow morning if I have grown.
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No. None for sale. That could change in the future but I won't be building any more.
I just finished training my arms. Got an 1 3/8 inch pump doing my routine with less weight and rest between sets. If a routine is difficult and results in a larger pump then that should stimulate more hypertrophy.
I will see tomorrow morning if I have grown.
can you please remember to report back though?
that's really interesting actually. i think you'll grow by tomorrow. i don't know if it will be a quarter of an inch or an inch, but i'm pretty sure. i don't know though. who knows. but definitely report back. because i think what you said about when a routine is difficult and results in a larger pump then that should stimulate more hypertrophy or whatever is kind of like, right on. i think you're on to something that's basically, like, big.
if you've grown by the morning, i'm going to try this out. and once you get the website up, i'm buying one of the machines.
Thanks!
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No. None for sale. That could change in the future but I won't be building any more.
I just finished training my arms. Got an 1 3/8 inch pump doing my routine with less weight and rest between sets. If a routine is difficult and results in a larger pump then that should stimulate more hypertrophy.
I will see tomorrow morning if I have grown.
Oh, shit. Please disregard my previous post, I've clearly been proven wrong. Well done, sir. Your post-workout progress is undeniable. If you were ancient, Greek, and naked, some artistic queer would've chiseled your image for his gay stoneporn brethren.
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I started training in 1958. That is a long time ago. I began with basic equipment in a mate's basement. Plenty of others came and went but I persisted and started making gains.
I got my arms to 17 1/2 without any drugs by 1968 when I trained at Golds, Venice. I want to see if I can exceed that measurement now at the age of 72 and without any supplements whatever, including drugs.
Should be interesting. My biceps today are as big as they have ever been. So I can't see why I can't build my arms over 18 and perhaps beyond 18 1/2. I got them to 18 about 15 years ago then got sore
elbows. I avoid that now my never placing my elbows on pads. The biceps-supinator is amazing. I can use it alternating arms which allows me to do more reps than doing both
simultaneously. Supersetting with triceps extensions on the Nautilus machine I get a great pump. The short reps help a lot so I will continue with those protocols and see what
happens. Believe me if any of you used this machine you would never go back to dumbbells or any other machine. It is that good. What happens is that you have two weight stacks. One for the curling movement
and another for the twisting movement. Even if you don't twist your hands much during the movement it has to resist unwinding so there are two forces on the biceps and thus the brutal workouts that are possible.
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I started training in 1958. That is a long time ago. I began with basic equipment in a mate's basement. Plenty of others came and went but I persisted and started making gains.
I got my arms to 17 1/2 without any drugs by 1968 when I trained at Golds, Venice. I want to see if I can exceed that measurement now at the age of 72 and without any supplements whatever, including drugs.
Should be interesting. My biceps today are as big as they have ever been. So I can't see why I can't build my arms over 18 and perhaps beyond 18 1/2. I got them to 18 about 15 years ago then got sore
elbows. I avoid that now my never placing my elbows on pads. The biceps-supinator is amazing. I can use it alternating arms which allows me to do more reps than doing both
simultaneously. Supersetting with triceps extensions on the Nautilus machine I get a great pump. The short reps help a lot so I will continue with those protocols and see what
happens. Believe me if any of you used this machine you would never go back to dumbbells or any other machine. It is that good. What happens is that you have two weight stacks. One for the curling movement
and another for the twisting movement. Even if you don't twist your hands much during the movement it has to resist unwinding so there are two forces on the biceps and thus the brutal workouts that are possible.
I can get the same workout with an elastic band.
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so we are back to here
I remember vinces legendary grow your arms a inch in a week thread from a couple of years ago
when all he did was train arms and nothing else
he got gains of 0.0000000000000000000000 000000000000000000000001 inch after that month
from fat accumulation then gave up
the body building world was rocked and a anew era was born
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so we are back to here
I remember vinces legendary grow your arms a inch in a week thread from a couple of years ago
when all he did was train arms and nothing else
he got gains of 0.0000000000000000000000 000000000000000000000001 inch after that month
from fat accumulation then gave up
the body building world was rocked and a anew era was born
Poor memory, bigmc. An inch in a month is what I was aiming for. I have no doubt I can gain over an inch in a month now. Should be fun. My forearms feel like solid steel!
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Poor memory, bigmc. An inch in a month is what I was aiming for. I have no doubt I can gain over an inch in a month now. Should be fun. My forearms feel like solid steel!
I genuinly laughed out loud at the possible responses you are going to get with that comment.
Cue the avalanche.
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Poor memory, bigmc. An inch in a month is what I was aiming for. I have no doubt I can gain over an inch in a month now. Should be fun. My forearms feel like solid steel!
Steel? Hell, don't sell yourself short, stud. Forearms look like they're made from that stuff they use on the space shuttle, that magic shit.
Seriously, though, on a scale of zero to negative ten, how would you rate your current physique? Be honest now.
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Poor memory, bigmc. An inch in a month is what I was aiming for. I have no doubt I can gain over an inch in a month now. Should be fun. My forearms feel like solid steel!
i don't doubt you can achieve two inches if you put your mind to it vince.
just keep at it.
and keep us updated many times a day.
thanxxxxx!
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Poor memory, bigmc. An inch in a month is what I was aiming for. I have no doubt I can gain over an inch in a month now. Should be fun. My forearms feel like solid steel!
what about leaning up a bit
surely that will be better health wise
im not trolling you here
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That photo was taken in January 2005. The machine has recently been modified to make it simpler and easier to use.
Simpler and easier to use...maybe this one?
18inch arms are not that smal, but a mearserment without any referense is shit. Arms vs waist ratio make it more intresting...My arms are 15,7 and waist 31...thats ratio 2.0...well dosent seem I can get under 2...without roids...my arms are toothpicks!
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I can get the same workout with an elastic band.
lolz
-
(http://oi57.tinypic.com/295yb7q.jpg)
-
(http://oi58.tinypic.com/2w4mbl1.jpg)
-
I just had a workout on my biceps-supinator. Brutal arm workout combined with triceps extensions on modified Nautilus machine.
I always superset bis and tris and today I did so with no rest after each superset. Did that for 4 sets then a short break and then a few more sets.
If you can superset using opposite muscles then perhaps reducing the rest will work and you can avoid the heavy weights. As you progress with
this protocol you can of course increase the resistance.
I always keep an open mind about hypertrophy and perhaps there are many equivalent means to the same end. However, we all have to stimulate
the muscles and the same symptoms will be there no matter which means we used. Pump, shaking, fullness, exhaustion, etc.
(http://i59.tinypic.com/2z4z1ja.jpg)
(http://i59.tinypic.com/2z4z1ja.jpg)
-
(http://i59.tinypic.com/2z4z1ja.jpg)
(http://i59.tinypic.com/2z4z1ja.jpg)
haha :D
-
haha :D
I would like to take credit for that photoshop but I cannot. I did put in the request, but someone else made it for me. I am sure you know who :D :D
(http://i59.tinypic.com/2z4z1ja.jpg)
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(http://i59.tinypic.com/2z4z1ja.jpg)
(http://i59.tinypic.com/2z4z1ja.jpg)
LMFAO!!!
-
updates? TA? VC?
i took a day off yesterday (still did hit cardio in the a.m.), can't remember the last time i did. weird feeling today, like i have an overabundance of energy that i didn't use up.
able to smash more sets in same time, vary exercises.
people ask me if they can 'work in'. no. you can't. but you can wait for the machine cause i'll be done my 10 sets in oh, about 4 minutes. so fuck off in the meantime.
no one, someone posted a question about routines - to cycle through exercises (back, chest, legs, etc) or just hit each body part in order. my understanding was that it makes more sense to destroy each body part individually before moving onto the next, keep the muscles warm and pumped, etc. i'm sure others might appreciate a response from you.
:D
sorry i missed it. pelvis' stalking is causing me to skip entire pages on this thread.
i do one body part before i go onto the next. but there are times i overlap if i feel really good when training one part and dont want to stop. so i'll be doing shoulders, then i'll start chest then i'll sneak back and do a few more sets of shoulders while im training chest.
-
(http://i59.tinypic.com/2z4z1ja.jpg)
(http://i59.tinypic.com/2z4z1ja.jpg)
;D
-
Let us step back and look at the stimulus required to cause an already highly trained muscle to grow bigger. I have read about thresholds when it comes to intensity and it is something like over 75% and probably closer to 80% that is required. If you can do 1 rep with 400 lbs in the bench press then you need somewhere between 300 and 320 pounds to have sufficient intensity. If you use 300 pounds then you should get from 8 to 10 reps with the 300 and from 6 to 8 reps with 320. Then all you need to do is many sets with that resistance and perhaps you will grow. I recommend 5 or 6 heavy sets using the same resistance.
What bodybuilders discovered is that they cannot keep adding weight to the bar. So they added sets. Weight is also added over time as well, so there is always a progression. The accumulation of waste products from those hard sets is what stimulates the muscle to grow.
So along comes no one who discards everything that has been learned over the last 6 decades and suggests we train with greater frequency without rest between the sets. I am not buying this. Sure, severe protocols can work for a while but even he recommends taking anabolics if growth slows. That really is disappointing because the true theory of hypertrophy should allow one to keep progressing with or without drugs.
I still believe there is a correlation between muscle size and how much you can lift. I believe there is a direct causation between muscle size and contractile strength, i.e., how strong the muscle is. The bigger the muscle the stronger it will be. The greater the contractile strength.
The reason one is no longer able to keep adding weight, get stronger, is that they have reached the upper limits of their muscular size. Even enhanced bodybuilders reach this sticking point. Jay could never get bigger after his last Olympia win and neither could Ronnie after after 2003. You can play with conditioning but as far as adding appreciable lean muscle it's not going to happen unless there is some new break through in PEDs.
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Let us step back and look at the stimulus required to cause an already highly trained muscle to grow bigger. I have read about thresholds when it comes to intensity and it is something like over 75% and probably closer to 80% that is required. If you can do 1 rep with 400 lbs in the bench press then you need somewhere between 300 and 320 pounds to have sufficient intensity. If you use 300 pounds then you should get from 8 to 10 reps with the 300 and from 6 to 8 reps with 320. Then all you need to do is many sets with that resistance and perhaps you will grow. I recommend 5 or 6 heavy sets using the same resistance.
What bodybuilders discovered is that they cannot keep adding weight to the bar. So they added sets. Weight is also added over time as well, so there is always a progression. The accumulation of waste products from those hard sets is what stimulates the muscle to grow.
So along comes no one who discards everything that has been learned over the last 6 decades and suggests we train with greater frequency without rest between the sets. I am not buying this. Sure, severe protocols can work for a while but even he recommends taking anabolics if growth slows. That really is disappointing because the true theory of hypertrophy should allow one to keep progressing with or without drugs.
Also, in regard to intensity, surely someone doing a one rep max at 400lbs is exerting maximum momentary intensity as he couldn't do 2 reps or do one rep with 405 lbs. But I don't think anyone will claim that is enough to trigger an adaptive response. There is something often referred to as "inroads". How deep you dig into the muscle group (for lack of a better analogy). But how deep do you go? Six reps? Twenty reps? Three sets? Twenty sets?
I think Coleman decided to do a high rep program (15-20 reps) for his last O. Well, he was not at his best. But was this because of switching to high reps or simply age. I think he decided to do higher reps, and therefore use lighter weights, simply who could not handle the poundages he could before.
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I still believe there is a correlation between muscle size and how much you can lift. I believe there is a direct causation between muscle size and contractile strength, i.e., how strong the muscle is. The bigger the muscle the stronger it will be. The greater the contractile strength.
The reason one is no longer able to keep adding weight, get stronger, is that they have reached the upper limits of their muscular size. Even enhanced bodybuilders reach this sticking point. Jay could never get bigger after his last Olympia win and neither could Ronnie after after 2003. You can play with conditioning but as far as adding appreciable lean muscle it's not going to happen unless there is some new break through in PEDs.
::)
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::)
You can't compare two different individuals. Way too many factors at play. What I'm saying is that if you, TA, get considerably bigger in terms of lean muscle mass, you will be stronger. And there is a difference between pure contractile strength of a muscle and the ability to move more weight. That's why even though a body builder may have bigger muscles than a power lifter they can't lift as much weight as that power lifter. There is technique and neurological efficiency involved in, say, a bench press that is also in play. One can develop a tremendous chest without benching a lot or even benching at all.
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You can't compare two different individuals. Way too many factors at play. What I'm saying is that if you, TA, get considerably bigger in terms of lean muscle mass, you will be stronger. And there is a difference between pure contractile strength of a muscle and the ability to move more weight. That's why even though a body builder may have bigger muscles than a power lifter they can't lift as much weight as that power lifter. There is technique and neurological efficiency involved in, say, a bench press that is also in play. One can develop a tremendous chest without benching a lot or even benching at all.
All I know is the ones who move big weight, 600-700 lb bench press, 800 plus squats look like shit. When dieted down, they look like shit too.
(http://bearmythology.files.wordpress.com/2009/03/shirtless-bear-patriot-powerlifter.jpg)
(http://37.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lmhciv68z91qk65fgo1_500.jpg)
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Wow, this morning my arms and especially biceps are bigger! This is the first time I can remember experiencing DOMS in my biceps. They are sore right down to the insertions in the elbows. I have proven to myself that my biceps-supinator machine is the most effective biceps exercise there is. Triceps are sore, too, which is great. Now, if I can keep the muscles sore I should keep them growing. I measured them this morning and I have added 3/8" to my arms in one workout. I have never added more than 1/8" in a day before. This is really exciting to me.
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I still believe there is a correlation between muscle size and how much you can lift. I believe there is a direct causation between muscle size and contractile strength, i.e., how strong the muscle is. The bigger the muscle the stronger it will be. The greater the contractile strength.
The reason one is no longer able to keep adding weight, get stronger, is that they have reached the upper limits of their muscular size. Even enhanced bodybuilders reach this sticking point. Jay could never get bigger after his last Olympia win and neither could Ronnie after after 2003. You can play with conditioning but as far as adding appreciable lean muscle it's not going to happen unless there is some new break through in PEDs.
Yes, there is a correlation between muscle size and strength. However, you can sometimes get stronger but not necessarily bigger. What will cause more size are incremental strength increases while doing plenty of
sets.
If you have ever entered a power-lifting meet you know that doing maximum singles does cause DOMS and therefore muscle growth. It is just a dangerous way to train for any length of time.
What I found years ago re triceps is that some exercises are more effective than others. If you don't do the effective exercises then that will limit the size of the muscles. I am confident that anyone
training biceps on my machine will get bigger biceps. No worries there at all.
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Wow, this morning my arms and especially biceps are bigger! This is the first time I can remember experiencing DOMS in my biceps. They are sore right down to the insertions in the elbows. I have proven to myself that my biceps-supinator machine is the most effective biceps exercise there is. Triceps are sore, too, which is great. Now, if I can keep the muscles sore I should keep them growing. I measured them this morning and I have added 3/8" to my arms in one workout. I have never added more than 1/8" in a day before. This is really exciting to me.
(http://i59.tinypic.com/2z4z1ja.jpg)
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What a bunch of tools here on Getbig. I discovered a breakthrough in arm training at 72 and put 3/8 inch on my arms from one severe workout. This is an important day for hypertrophy as far as I am concerned.
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What a bunch of tools here on Getbig. I discovered a breakthrough in arm training at 72 and put 3/8 inch on my arms from one severe workout. This is an important day for hypertrophy as far as I am concerned.
Its called swelling.
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Its called swelling.
Yes, we know about inflammation. However, unless there is inflammation there can be no growth. So some of that 'swelling' is hypertrophy. I have no doubt about it.
Years ago we read about all day programs to add half an inch to the arms. We tried training arms for 8 hours on two occasions and the most anyone gained was 1/8 inch. Most gained nothing at all.
So for me to gain 3/8 inch in one day is amazing. I have argued before that it is still possible to build muscle at any age. Just about everyone here scoffed at the idea. Well, it can and will happen
as long as you train right with the best equipment.
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Yes, we know about inflammation. However, unless there is inflammation there can be no growth. So some of that 'swelling' is hypertrophy. I have no doubt about it.
Years ago we read about all day programs to add half an inch to the arms. We tried training arms for 8 hours on two occasions and the most anyone gained was 1/8 inch. Most gained nothing at all.
So for me to gain 3/8 inch in one day is amazing. I have argued before that it is still possible to build muscle at any age. Just about everyone here scoffed at the idea. Well, it can and will happen
as long as you train right with the best equipment.
(http://i59.tinypic.com/2z4z1ja.jpg)
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All I know is the ones who move big weight, 600-700 lb bench press, 800 plus squats look like shit. When dieted down, they look like shit too.
(http://bearmythology.files.wordpress.com/2009/03/shirtless-bear-patriot-powerlifter.jpg)
(http://37.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lmhciv68z91qk65fgo1_500.jpg)
lean legs thats all,due to heavy body mass he carried and squatting 'the density'he developed there..legs look pretty good there..
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All I know is the ones who move big weight, 600-700 lb bench press, 800 plus squats look like shit. When dieted down, they look like shit too.
(http://bearmythology.files.wordpress.com/2009/03/shirtless-bear-patriot-powerlifter.jpg)
(http://37.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lmhciv68z91qk65fgo1_500.jpg)
Really. ALL trainers who can move a lot of weight look like shit? Remember Ronnie Coleman?
Even bodybuilders who aren't considered strong: Jay Cutler, Phil Heath, Dexter... are in reality incredibly strong. Insanely strong. Maybe not by powerlifting standards or even bodybuilder standards, but by human being standards, gym rat standards, they are exceptional. Doing, say, ten reps ass to ankles squat with 315 is incredibly strong and puts you in the upper 10% of the population.
The fellow you posted is very, very strong for his weight but not physically impressive. But can you doubt that if you were to add 30 lbs of lean muscle to his frame he would not be even stronger? To say that there is no correlation between muscle size and muscle strength simply does not comport with common sense and real world experience. A marked increase in muscle mass leads also to an increase in strength and vice versa.
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Yes, there is a correlation between muscle size and strength. However, you can sometimes get stronger but not necessarily bigger. What will cause more size are incremental strength increases while doing plenty of
sets.
If you have ever entered a power-lifting meet you know that doing maximum singles does cause DOMS and therefore muscle growth. It is just a dangerous way to train for any length of time.
What I found years ago re triceps is that some exercises are more effective than others. If you don't do the effective exercises then that will limit the size of the muscles. I am confident that anyone
training biceps on my machine will get bigger biceps. No worries there at all.
Yes, you can increase the weight of your lifts without getting bigger. Power/Olympic lifters do so all the time. They increase their lifts while remaining in the same weight class. But there are many other factors in play in moving weight than just pure muscle strength.
And you are quite right that there are some exercises more productive to muscle hypertrophy than others. I consider the tricep kick backs with a dumbbell to be probably on of the more useless tricep exrecises out there regardless of the pump one feels. I can feel a pump doing the kick backs with no weight at all. Just the contraction alone is enough for a pump.
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strength is a by product of training. you could even call it a side effect of training.
you do not need to increase your strength to increase your lean mass.
but as you increase your lean mass so also your strength will increase. there actually needs not even be a significant increase or any measurable increase in lean mass to become 'stronger'. strength an adaptative response of the body to the stress of training.
don't put the cart before the horse.
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strength is a by product of training. you could even call it a side effect of training.
you do not need to increase your strength to increase your lean mass.
but as you increase your lean mass so also your strength will increase. there actually needs not even be a significant increase or any measurable increase in lean mass to become 'stronger'. strength an adaptative response of the body to the stress of training.
don't put the cart before the horse.
I would agree somewhat but I believe that strictly speaking I would say that you don't have to move more weight/resistance to increase muscle size and yes, that increase in muscle size always leads to an increase in the strength/contractile force of the muscle. That's why I was careful to say there was a correlation, not causation, between strength and size.
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ya it's a tough debate that one could agrue from different stances and not be incorrect.
for myself I'm 'weaker' than I was 10 years ago. 10 years ago I had a 545 for reps ass to the floor squat, and a bigger deadlift. I trained like that for years obviously. you just don't jump under 546 and grind good reps.
since I stopped training heavy, cut my poundages back, focused more on the muscle I'm training, my physique has improved considerably. well it's not even considerably it's night and day.
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A lot of Olympic lifters are incredibly strong and look like shit, small muscles.
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A lot of Olympic lifters are incredibly strong and look like shit, small muscles.
Conversely, a lot of lifters are incredibly strong and look great. Not sure what your point is.
You seem to be conflating muscle size with aesthetics. Big muscles in and of itself does not guarantee that you will look good.
I can just as easily say that there are a lot of lifters that are not particular strong with small muscles that look great. You being a
prime example.
My only point is that all else being equal the bigger the muscle the stronger the muscle. If you can curl X amount of weight for 8 reps you will be able
to curl even more for 8 reps if your bicep muscle increased markedly in size. But it is true as No One pointed out that an increase in resistance for any particular movement does not translate into an automatic increase in muscle size. So many factors are involved when one moves a particular weight.
When I was in high school I remember telling my friend that I always seemed to be a bit stronger when I trained with a partner or if a hot chick was watching. My body was the same but my daily performance varied somewhat. I asked why do you think you are stronger when training with a partner or when girls were around. He just shrugged and said, "I don't know. Maybe it's because you want to be."
He may have been more right than either of us realized at the time.
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Also, another factor to be consider is that a person who is incredibly strong, I mean freaky strong, often -- not always - has a body frame or make up not necessarily conducive to pleasing aesthetics. They often have stout and sturdy frames with broad, large and stable joints. They will look more like a Paul Anderson rather than a Bob Paris or Frank Zane.
(http://www.onlineworldofwrestling.com/pictures/p/paulanderson/03.jpg)
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Also, another factor to be consider is that a person who is incredibly strong, I mean freaky strong, often -- not always - has a body frame or make up not necessarily conducive to pleasing aesthetics. They often have stout and sturdy frames with broad, large and stable joints. They will look more like a Paul AndersonShit rather than a Bob Paris or Frank Zane.
(http://www.onlineworldofwrestling.com/pictures/p/paulanderson/03.jpg)
Fixed.
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strength is a by product of training. you could even call it a side effect of training.
you do not need to increase your strength to increase your lean mass.
but as you increase your lean mass so also your strength will increase. there actually needs not even be a significant increase or any measurable increase in lean mass to become 'stronger'. strength an adaptative response of the body to the stress of training.
don't put the cart before the horse.
I believe this statement is false. There is enough science out there to demonstrate that you need increases in resistance to make the muscles larger. Have a look at Hypertrophy Specific Training and view the research that their protocols are based on.
If the body/brain detects an increase in resistance then that can trigger more hypertrophy. The point being that the increases need not be huge. There has to be a progression for continued hypertrophy. You can mix it up by increasing the load,
doing more volume or decreasing the time. Or you can do two or more at the same time.
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I believe this statement is false. There is enough science out there to demonstrate that you need increases in resistance to make the muscles larger. Have a look at Hypertrophy Specific Training and view the research that their protocols are based on.
If the body/brain detects an increase in resistance then that can trigger more hypertrophy. The point being that the increases need not be huge. There has to be a progression for continued hypertrophy. You can mix it up by increasing the load,
doing more volume or decreasing the time. Or you can do two or more at the same time.
I don't think that's what No One meant specifically. Perhaps saying you have to increase intensity, level of difficulty, or training load.
One can increase the training load of a muscle substantially simply by how they perform the movement without changing the actual resistance.
Even a change in the stimulus can trigger hypertrophy. Say, going from barbell over head presses to dumbbell presses.
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Yes! The more weight you do the huge muscles you get like this guy.
[ Invalid YouTube link ]
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Proof that the more weight you do, the bigger your chest and muscles are going to be.
(http://tnation.t-nation.com/forum_images/6/d/6d4e1_ORIG-ca_u_powerlifter_01.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/5s6n3.jpg)
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Repping that 405 Bench will get nice muscles like this:
(http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y130/justin_yz426/leftarm1.jpg)
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Yes! The more weight you do the huge muscles you get like this guy.
[ Invalid YouTube link ]
i'm with you on this one,leaner in shape 'who looks strong'vs someone who is strong but less impressive shirt off,,but majority of people who would see someone of this type would say 'damn man he's twice the size as you 'even tho you throw that line like lets see him with his shirt off or 'i;'m ripped he's not..people will still be impressed of the size regardless of the gut in a shirt..
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i'm with you on this one,leaner in shape 'who looks strong'vs someone who is strong but less impressive shirt off,,but majority of people who would see someone of this type would say 'damn man he's twice the size as you 'even tho you throw that line like lets see him with his shirt off or 'i;'m ripped he's not..people will still be impressed of the size regardless of the gut in a shirt..
Well most people think fat people in shirts who never have lifted a weight in their life are huge and have muscle. They usually have the prefix "Big" attached to their name. Big "Timmy", Big "Mike". Then you get to hear all the stories about how strong "Big" Kevin is and how he is twice the size of everyone and "all muscle".
Then he makes an appearance looking like this:
(http://www.fatmanunleashed.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/09/ittibeardsmaller.jpg)
(http://www.fatmanunleashed.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/06/100_2991.JPG)
(http://www.fatmanunleashed.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/06/100_3009.JPG)
The moral is, who cares what the average public thinks. If you want to impress the average public, all you gotta do is eat a ton of calories and wear a strategic shirt that accentuates fat rolls and turns them into muscle.
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Well most people think fat people in shirts who never have lifted a weight in their life are huge and have muscle. They usually have the prefix "Big" attached to their name. Big "Timmy", Big "Mike". Then you get to hear all the stories about how strong "Big" Kevin is and how he is twice the size of everyone and "all muscle".
Then he makes an appearance looking like this:
The moral is, who cares what the average public thinks. If you want to impress the average public, all you gotta do is eat a ton of calories and wear a strategic shirt that accentuates fat rolls and turns them into muscle.
i know and it is what it is....he's considered the 'big man'bouncing and he'll toss you out if you get out of line cause he has 50/70 lbs on u...
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(http://oi58.tinypic.com/2w4mbl1.jpg)
Hahahaha!
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What's the point of being strong if you look like this:
(http://nattyornot.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/fat-powerlifter-1.jpg)
(http://asp.elitefts.com/images/upload/qa/Day2-134.jpg)
(http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=&imgrefurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.criticalbench.com%2FJeff-Lewis.htm&h=0&w=0&tbnid=Zx9NC7YpxNRZ6M&zoom=1&tbnh=183&tbnw=275&docid=W2YwVmP2paqsbM&tbm=isch&ei=Kvk5VJKeA4zksASWjIL4AQ&ved=0CAQQsCUoAA)
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This is what a real strongman looks like, that is a big gymrat but he makes him look like a baby
(https://warosu.org/data/fa/img/0078/48/1393496263687.jpg)
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TA, you can post all the pix you want of fat people that you claim are strong that look like shit. What does that prove? I can post pics of strong people that look great, weak people that look great, weak people that look horrible, strong people that look horrible.... That proves nothing. As I tried to point out to you, muscle size (small or large) and aesthetics are too different issues. If you are simply not put together well you will not look good no matter how big or small your muscles all. I would think that such an elementary concept would be obvious to your massive intellect. But, as is often your propensity, you often let your personal bias cloud your thinking. You prefer more slender physiques, or rather, do not like that massively built ones so you will portray heavily muscled physiques in the worse possible light.
Johnny Jackson is consider one of the strongest bodybuilders that has ever lived. Again, this is in and of itself meaningless and we can go back and forth ad infinitum.
(http://forum.bodybuilding.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=196983&d=1114208201)
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What's the point of being strong if you look like this:
(http://nattyornot.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/fat-powerlifter-1.jpg)
(http://asp.elitefts.com/images/upload/qa/Day2-134.jpg)
(http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=&imgrefurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.criticalbench.com%2FJeff-Lewis.htm&h=0&w=0&tbnid=Zx9NC7YpxNRZ6M&zoom=1&tbnh=183&tbnw=275&docid=W2YwVmP2paqsbM&tbm=isch&ei=Kvk5VJKeA4zksASWjIL4AQ&ved=0CAQQsCUoAA)
No point if physical appearance is your main concern and objective. Obviously these fellas are performance athletes and do whatever it takes to move more weight and win competitions.
For most athletes, they are far more concerned about athletic performance than physical attractiveness.
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How stupid to argue lol
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TA, you can post all the pix you want of fat people that you claim are strong that look like shit. What does that prove? I can post pics of strong people that look great, weak people that look great, weak people that look horrible, strong people that look horrible.... That proves nothing. As I tried to point out to you, muscle size (small or large) and aesthetics are too different issues. If you are simply not put together well you will not look good no matter how big or small your muscles all. I would think that such an elementary concept would be obvious to your massive intellect. But, as is often your propensity, you often let your personal bias cloud your thinking. You prefer more slender physiques, or rather, do not like that massively built ones so you will portray heavily muscled physiques in the worse possible light.
Johnny Jackson is consider one of the strongest bodybuilders that has ever lived. Again, this is in and of itself meaningless and we can go back and forth ad infinitum.
(http://forum.bodybuilding.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=196983&d=1114208201)
You and Basile were saying something the stronger one is, the bigger the muscle has to be.
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You and Basile were saying something the stronger one is, the bigger the muscle has to be.
I state it quite clearly. You need big muscles to move a reasonably heavy resistance many times over and over. Lots of sets with a fairly decent weight for 5 to 20 reps. You could do less reps but then it becomes dangerous and bodybuilders
have to avoid injuries at all costs. If you can bench press 200 pounds for 10 reps you will be a certain size. If the same guy can do 300 for 10 reps he will be much bigger.
Most of those massive powerlifters have huge muscles.
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I state it quite clearly. You need big muscles to move a reasonably heavy resistance many times over and over. Lots of sets with a fairly decent weight for 5 to 20 reps. You could do less reps but then it becomes dangerous and bodybuilders
have to avoid injuries at all costs. If you can bench press 200 pounds for 10 reps you will be a certain size. If the same guy can do 300 for 10 reps he will be much bigger.
Most of those massive powerlifters have huge muscles.
What about Paul Dillet? Light weights, extremely lazy, long rests?
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The bodybuilder look is not the product of strength or reps or any kind of rep range strategy. It is just drugs.
For all of G15's shortcomings, at least he kept us all honest. Here we are arguing about different lifting strategies, it's so pathetic.
Any way, it's resistance training: "heavy" weights, time under tension, rep speed, repetition duration, rest periods are all forms of resistance strategies. the main element to look good in all of them is 10% diet and 90% genetics. ( and 100% drugs)
Also I think Adonis might be trolling that Basille guy at this point...
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The bodybuilder look is not the product of strength or reps or any kind of rep range strategy. It is just drugs.
For all of G15's shortcomings, at least he kept us all honest. Here we are arguing about different lifting strategies, it's so pathetic.
Any way, it's resistance training: "heavy" weights, time under tension, rep speed, repetition duration, rest periods are all forms of resistance strategies. the main element to look good in all of them is 10% diet and 90% genetics. ( and 100% drugs)
Also I think Adonis might be trolling that Basille guy at this point...
Guys like you think you know everything but I doubt you are an expert. We are discussing hypertrophy without any artificial sweeteners. If hypertrophy was easy to sustain then everyone training hard in gyms would be huge but that isn't true.
The drugs and genetics arguments are excuses when one fails to do the right thing to grow. No one insists we increase the frequency. I say that is not enough and resistance and special exercises and protocols are required.
To answer Adonis, whatever the true theory of hypertrophy it has to explain ALL growth and all NON growth from serious training for hypertrophy. Dillett had to be doing things right to get that big. Perhaps he was gifted in many ways and took
supplements which helped a lot.
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You and Basile were saying something the stronger one is, the bigger the muscle has to be.
Actually, it was that all else being equal the bigger the muscle the stronger the muscle. No One said the same thing.
Measuring strength on a performance level, moving heavy objects, is another thing entirely and many factors come into play besides pure muscle contractile force.
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The bodybuilder look is not the product of strength or reps or any kind of rep range strategy. It is just drugs.
For all of G15's shortcomings, at least he kept us all honest. Here we are arguing about different lifting strategies, it's so pathetic.
Any way, it's resistance training: "heavy" weights, time under tension, rep speed, repetition duration, rest periods are all forms of resistance strategies. the main element to look good in all of them is 10% diet and 90% genetics. ( and 100% drugs)
Also I think Adonis might be trolling that Basille guy at this point...
Correct somewhat. After a certain level you cannot advance without hormones and peptides. But you still need resistance training and you have to eat. Of course I'm just nit picking but just want it to be clear that at the advance level training, diet and rest is a given. At the advance level no matter what you do and how you manipulate those factors you will not advance in any meaningful way without PEDs.
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What about Paul Dillet? Light weights, extremely lazy, long rests?
Lightweights compare to what? Maybe compared to other IFBB pros but having trained at the same gym as Paul for years in the mid
1990s he was very strong compared to the average gym rat. He was a veritable superman compared to the vast majority of the
population.
Paul Dillet was incredibly gifted when it came to his ability to put on lean muscle mass. I found him to be the most physically impressive
specimen at that time at Gold's Venice. A time when it was populated by Flex Wheeler, Cormier, Ferrigno during his comeback, and a host of other
greats or near greats that populated Gold's in the 1990s.
He did not train harder than anybody else. I doubt he used more drugs than anybody else. The only other factor is genetics which is what made him exceptional. He did not achieve his physique BECAUSE he trained light and with low intensity. He advanced despite poor training because he was simply blessed.
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What about static holds and Isometrics?
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What about static holds and Isometrics?
>:(
On a serious note though, haven't static holds gotten overlooked?
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The bodybuilder look is not the product of strength or reps or any kind of rep range strategy. It is just drugs.
For all of G15's shortcomings, at least he kept us all honest. Here we are arguing about different lifting strategies, it's so pathetic.
Any way, it's resistance training: "heavy" weights, time under tension, rep speed, repetition duration, rest periods are all forms of resistance strategies. the main element to look good in all of them is 10% diet and 90% genetics. ( and 100% drugs)
Also I think Adonis might be trolling that Basille guy at this point...
posts like this that make getbig
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The bodybuilder look is not the product of strength or reps or any kind of rep range strategy. It is just drugs.
For all of G15's shortcomings, at least he kept us all honest. Here we are arguing about different lifting strategies, it's so pathetic.
Any way, it's resistance training: "heavy" weights, time under tension, rep speed, repetition duration, rest periods are all forms of resistance strategies. the main element to look good in all of them is 10% diet and 90% genetics. ( and 100% drugs)
Also I think Adonis might be trolling that Basille guy at this point...
no. I've discovered you're incorrect.
altho overall development will be dictated by genetics and / or use of or amounts of compounds, a fully repaired muscle than can be trained daily using the same poundages as the day before will become a denser bigger muscle.
it's that simple. frequency + stress + repair= growth.
throw drugs in there you get more growth. I don't see how anyone cannot see a correlation between frequency , repair and growth. those who get it will continue to improve. those who don't won't.
if you want to believe there is nothing you can do to keep improving/ growing outside of genetics or taking more drugs then you'll either relegate yourself to megadosing, or never reach your full potential.
this routine is the first and only time in my life that I can say a training routine is important to hypertrophy. I used to believe the exact same thing Master Blaster did. not anymore.
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What about static holds and Isometrics?
What about it? Are you asking if static holds/Isometrics can be a factor in stimulating an adaptive response via muscle hypertrophy.
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What about it? Are you asking if static holds/Isometrics can be a factor in stimulating an adaptive response via muscle hypertrophy.
Yes!
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Not sure if it is a "static hold" but I feel that just holding heavy dumbells for a good amount of time gives the forearms a great pump and possibly hypertrophy :o
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No, it isn't trolling. If someone tries something 'new' and it works they become believers. If more frequency is important for hypertrophy then it must be incorporated.
The people on HST (Hypertrophy Specific Training) forum insist that muscles need to be retrained every 36 hours. There is scientific evidence that protein synthesis slows after 24 hours and is more or less complete by 36 hours after training. I guess they assume this is also when
hypertrophy ceases. To be practical, they advocate training a muscle every 2nd day. No one believes in training every 24 hours. Interesting.
I had an arm workout on Monday. On Tuesday one of my elbows was a bit sore. Not sure what caused it but sometimes even sitting in a chair with the arms on a rest can do it. So I had another arm workout yesterday and today the elbow soreness is gone.
In the past I wondered if connective tissue took longer to heal than muscle. So I trained every 3rd day and it worked as far as growing rapidly. It remains to be seen if daily training will increase hypertrophy even more.
Mike Mentzer advocated training a muscle once a week. Ray Mentzer did a variation and did one direct workout and one indirect workout for that muscle.
If what HST and no one believe is true then it means much more frequent training for any muscle group you want to get larger. This protocol is surely not for lazy people!
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Yes!
I'm not really sure. It seems clear that static holds/isometrics adds to the intensity of effort you exert during set. And it certainly adds to "time under tension" which is suppose to a be a better measure than "reps". The only way one would know for sure would be if one trained solely using isometrics. I know there were studies done using just the concentric or the positive portion of an exercise and it was found that though it increased cardiovascular conditioning it did very little in increasing muscle size and strength. This was in direct contrast to negative only or eccentric training which did little to increase cardio vascular conditioning but was very useful in increasing muscular size and strength.
I remember as a kid a device was advertised as "isotonics" and gave resistance to only the positive portion of an exercise. It's selling point was that no matter how hard you trained you never had to worry or endure muscle soreness or DOMS.
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I'm not really sure. It seems clear that static holds/isometrics adds to the intensity of effort you exert during set. And it certainly adds to "time under tension" which is suppose to a be a better measure than "reps". The only way one would know for sure would be if one trained solely using isometrics. I know there were studies done using just the concentric or the positive portion of an exercise and it was found that though it increased cardiovascular conditioning it did very little in increasing muscle size and strength. This was in direct contrast to negative only or eccentric training which did little to increase cardio vascular conditioning but was very useful in increasing muscular size and strength.
I remember as a kid a device was advertised as "isotonics" and gave resistance to only the positive portion of an exercise. It's selling point was that no matter how hard you trained you never had to worry or endure muscle soreness or DOMS.
If a muscle has mechanical tension applied to it and if that tension is sufficient and the time adequate the muscle will hypertrophy. It will happen doing conventional training, positive only or negative only. Scientists found that lowering a resistance under a load
caused more damage and hence growth.
Doug Hepburn, a Canadian strongman and weightlifter, invented a concentric only exercise machine. I trained under his supervision for a couple of weeks back in 1969. He gave me a very difficult program. I supersetted curls with standing triceps extensions. 20 sets for 5 reps. I can tell
I put half an inch on my arms from 4 workouts. I arrived one day to discover the machine was elsewhere so that ended that. I guess I should have persisted. Doug was one of the first humans to bench press over 500 pounds way back in the early fifties. He was the world heavyweight
weightlifting champion in 1953. In 1954 Paul Anderson arrived and that was the end of Doug reign as world champion. Doug was very intelligent and he worked out what was required to increase strength and size.
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What about static holds and Isometrics?
In 1965 I visited York, Pa. I trained at the York gym and met John Grimek, Bob Hoffman and Jules Bacon. I saw Bob Gajda win the Mr USA contest.
I saw Bill March do an easy 375 pound standing press. That was impressive. The weightlifters were using an isometric program that was effective.
I used it for a week there. On Monday you held a barbell against pins for three sets of 10 seconds. You chose a weight that didn't allow you to hold
it for more than 10 seconds. I did curls, standing press, row, bench and I think a squat. On Monday you put the pins at a position half way through the
movement. Then on Wednesday you repeated the program but held the weight 1/4 way into the movement. On Friday you used a position 3/4 through
the movement. Then on Saturday you tried to do a maximum for a single in each movement. I well remember doing a strict standing curl with 175 pounds
at the end of the week. My arms were around 16 inches. I gained some size so it was effective for hypertrophy. The problem was not having a rack with pins.
The program was in a York magazine but I wasn't able to find it. It is there somewhere because I have all the magazines going back to the early sixties.
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Once, I trained every day for the whole of february but felt like the walking dead 28 days later.
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as Gal (pbuh) wrote, the mind-muscle connection is crucial
so many people lift/move weights but don't maintain tension or even use the muscle at all
no one's system is brilliant for many reasons - in some part because it forces you to use weight light enough to truly isolate the muscle
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as Gal (pbuh) wrote, the mind-muscle connection is crucial
so many people lift/move weights but don't maintain tension or even use the muscle at all
no one's system is brilliant for many reasons - in some part because it forces you to use weight light enough to truly isolate the muscle
Took me over 10 years but I finally got the mind muscle connection and believe in it.
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i'll put this here cause those reading this thread are serious about wanting to better themselves and are always looking for edges to help w their diets or training.
so, i started dieting. hard. in that i use certain foods that i like to get my protein and cals in for the day. im very minimalist for two reasons i dont got time to cook fancy meals that meet my macros, and i dont eat for taste- eating for taste causes me too look fwd to eating. i dont want to look fwd to eating. that makes me hungry.
this drink in an appetite killer, and tastes awesome.
coffee/ one scoop low carb protein powder (chocolate) / 1 tsp coconut oil
if you bought gals and mine book you'd see that i recommend protein/ coffee. but i just started adding the coconut oil. try it. you wont be disappointed.
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Took me over 10 years but I finally got the mind muscle connection and believe in it.
100% dude.
i believe the guy who can feels his muscle 'work' is going to have a better physique that the guy who doesnt.
*cue argumentative shitstorm 'i know a guy who trains like shit and he looks awesome' blah blah blah :D
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100% dude.
i believe the guy who can feels his muscle 'work' is going to have a better physique that the guy who doesnt.
*cue argumentative shitstorm 'i know a guy who trains like shit and he looks awesome' blah blah blah :D
Actually it took me 15 years now that I think about it. IMO very important to bodybuilders but not important at all for powerlifters. Myself I don't care about strength even though I am strong in some lifts and any weight training should increase ones strength somewhat.
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Actually it took me 15 years now that I think about it. IMO very important to bodybuilders but not important at all for powerlifters. Myself I don't care about strength even though I am strong in some lifts and any weight training should increase ones strength somewhat.
I dont lift weights, I use them to stress a muscle.
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Took me over 10 years but I finally got the mind muscle connection and believe in it.
Tell us more about your mind-muscle journey? ::) ::) :-\ :-X :D :D
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I dont lift weights, I use them to stress a muscle.
My Gravity Suit was actually based on that simple concept. It would be a suit you could wear with adjustable hydraulic resistance that conform to all moveable joints in the body. You wear the thing for an hour and just go about your normal activities. No gym or weights needed.
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I dont lift weights, I use them to stress a muscle.
I often use the mind muscle connection. however, at times I feel myself getting lazy and just lifting. It takes a lot to keep that mind muscle connection going throughout a workout.
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I often use the mind muscle connection. however, at times I feel myself getting lazy and just lifting. It takes a lot to keep that mind muscle connection going throughout a workout.
Do No One`s workout. You are forced to have it if you forget or not. Its insane the pumps you get.
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If you are having trouble with the mind-muscle connection you are likely using too much weight.
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What is all this nonsense about mind-muscle? The body is a single machine. The brain controls everything including growth. The brain and the muscle are one. So the trick is to stimulate growth. I can tell you that the requirements for continuous hypertrophy are not for the faint hearted. There has to be a good reason for a large muscle to hypertrophy more. Simply doing more frequency is not the answer but is part of the equation. What is required is a progressively more difficult program and effort. This is where most fall away and are stuck on plateaus.
Ask yourself this: do your muscles have a good reason to grow? There is only one true theory of hypertrophy. It isn't guesswork. It has nothing to do with folklore or beliefs. The methods have been worked out by many huge bodybuilders over the decades. The scientists do not know because they have no interest in the subject so no experiments have been done on champion bodybuilders. To make matters worse, drugs have entered the scene and to tell the truth hardly anyone knows what is responsible for their huge size. Was it the drugs, the training or both? If we eliminate the drugs then we have a chance of finding what really causes hypertrophy. That is what I am interested in. Most Getbiggers literally do not believe that training makes a difference. They believe you need drugs to get huge, but you also need good genetics. Well, tell that to Larry Scott. He didn't have good genetics except perhaps long muscle bellies. The guy invented ways to keep growing. His protocols are painful, extreme, but effective. If you don't grow doing what Larry did then perhaps you should take up table tennis or surfing the internet.
I can tell you that after a few workouts that left my biceps sore I am almost avoiding training them again. Why? Because it is extremely hard work and very painful. If this is what you have to progressively do then it is not something most would continue doing.
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I want to address a couple of things mentioned by no one. First of all, if hypertrophy is your goal there is absolutely no way you can train all body parts every two days. Definitely not every day. No way and still grow.
Second, suppose you decide to train just your arms using the no one frequency. After 9 weeks you would be training them daily. I can tell you this is a big ask. After 9 or 12 weeks it will be difficult if not nearly impossible
to sustain the effort needed to keep the arms growing. I doubt there are very many human beings that motivated to keep the effort progressive. What we find is the body adapts alright but further growth in the arms is
unlikely unless severe and difficult protocols are followed using the most effective exercises. We can forget about watching the videos of the steroid champions because their choice of exercises and their form is not optimal.
You need just one effective exercise for biceps and one effective exercise for triceps. Doing other things is mostly a waste of time. The brain doesn't know what the muscle is doing. The brain makes a muscle grow if the
right conditions are there. Waste products accumulated from severe, prolonged tension.
Third, there is no possible way to do a set to the max and then repeat using the same weight. No way. Not possible. I superset biceps and triceps but after the first set the reps are less and after the third set the reps drop again.
If I rest for a couple of minutes then I can do another three sets with more reps.
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so Vince you DONT follow the routine EXACTLY as I have outlined, jumped right into training your arms every two days after I have REPEATEDLY said to follow the routine EXACTLY and warned about this very thing and are now so sore you have determined that to train the way I suggest is 'impossible'.
thank you for further highlighting to everyone the importance of adaptation in my routine, which is the entirety of what it is based on- the body being given time to adapt to increasing stress until it is capable of performing 7x the workload you currently train with.
everyone please learn from Vince's mistake. the whole routine and the results from it are based totally on adaptation which you just skipped altogether.
thank you for posting this.
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so Vince you DONT follow the routine exactly as I have outlined, jumped right into training your arms evetyaimmtnu two days after I have REPEATED said to follow the routine exactly and warned about this very thing and are now so sore you have determined that to train the way I suggest is 'impossible'.
thank you for further highlighting to everyone the importance of adaptation in my routine, which is the entirety of what it is based on- the body being given time to adapt to increasing stress until it is capable of performing 7x the workload you currently train with.
everyone please learn from Vince's mistake.
thank you for posting this.
I am interested in immediate, continuous hypertrophy. Your method doesn't generate what I am after. Sorry, not possible with your protocols. If you were in Sydney I could prove it to you.
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I am interested in immediate, continuous hypertrophy. Your method doesn't generate what I am after. Sorry, not possible with your protocols. If you were in Sydney I could prove it to you.
there is no such thing as 'immediate hypertrophy' vince. if there was every one in every gym around the world would be jacked and huge. it takes time to create the environment for growth. the body needs to adapt as your injury has pointed out. adaptation is not immediate. it is a means of survival under prolonged periods of stress. typically the organism changes or strengthen to meet these demands. it's simple biology. I guess that at the laws of biological adaptation that have existed for millenias apply globally except in your gym in Australia.
the body needs time to adapt to the workloads. inside of that adaptation comes the ability to repair rapidly in order to perform more work the next day. that is where one experiences growth vince - frequency + stress + repair = growth.
you decided to NOT to listen to what I said, skipped the repair aspect of the equation which is necessary for growth and are now left scratching your head wondering why it didn't work. lol unreal.
all you have 'proven' is your inability to follow a simple routine to fruition.
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there is no such thing as 'immediate hypertrophy' vince. if there was every one in every gym around the world would be jacked and huge. it takes time to create the environment for growth. the body needs to adapt as your injury has pointed out. adaptation is not immediate. it is a means of survival under prolonged periods of stress. typically the organism changes or strengthen to meet these demands. it's simple biology. I guess that at the laws of biological adaptation that have existed for millenias apply globally expect in your gym in Australia.
the body needs time to adapt to the workloads. inside of that adaptation comes the ability to repair rapidly in order to perform more work the next day. that is where one experiences growth vince - frequency + stress + repair = growth.
you decided to NOT to listen to what I said, skipped the repair aspect of the equation which is necessary for growth and are now left scratching your head wondering why it didn't work. lol unreal.
all you have 'proven' is your inability to follow a simple routine to fruition.
x2
Vince, aren't you 60-something? "Immediate continuous hypertrophy" isn't really possible for someone your age, probably not even with aggressive HRT.
No one, check your PMs, bro.
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x2
Vince, aren't you 60-something? "Immediate continuous hypertrophy" isn't really possible for someone your age, probably not even with aggressive HRT.
No one, check your PMs, bro.
just did.
this man ^ is a GB legend. good to have you back sir.
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there is no such thing as 'immediate hypertrophy' vince. if there was every one in every gym around the world would be jacked and huge. it takes time to create the environment for growth. the body needs to adapt as your injury has pointed out. adaptation is not immediate. it is a means of survival under prolonged periods of stress. typically the organism changes or strengthen to meet these demands. it's simple biology. I guess that at the laws of biological adaptation that have existed for millenias apply globally expect in your gym in Australia.
the body needs time to adapt to the workloads. inside of that adaptation comes the ability to repair rapidly in order to perform more work the next day. that is where one experiences growth vince - frequency + stress + repair = growth.
you decided to NOT to listen to what I said, skipped the repair aspect of the equation which is necessary for growth and are now left scratching your head wondering why it didn't work. lol unreal.
all you have 'proven' is your inability to follow a simple routine to fruition.
Says who? Of course it is possible to make a muscle keep growing. It is just very difficult to do so most either don't work hard enough or they do the wrong exercises or both.
I am interested in your frequency idea. Previously, because of injuries, I concluded that connective tissue needs time to repair. However, I knew the muscles did not. They keep growing.
So when my joints are sore I go back and do another workout. I always warm up with high maximum sets progressing to my training sets that I can do for about 20 reps. I always try to
add weight over the weeks. Without adding resistance I doubt much growth will occur. The muscles respond to perceived load increases not absolute increases so these can be gradual.
In my system the goal is to generate severe DOMS in the target muscles. That is the only way to know the muscle is going to grow. Then I try to keep the muscle sore. Now, I have
speculated on daily training but have yet to do it. I even wondered how the arms would respond if I trained them daily all day! Not that is being really crazy. I guessed that very rapid
hypertrophy would occur.
The no one system is more or less untested. I would be happy to have both the DOMS method and the no one method tested scientifically. That isn't going to happen.
So here is what I propose. You continue using your system and see if you can get your arms bigger. I will use my system and do the same thing. Report any significant results here on
Getbig.
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x2
Vince, aren't you 60-something? "Immediate continuous hypertrophy" isn't really possible for someone your age, probably not even with aggressive HRT.
Says who? I am 72 and I see no reason why I can't keep my arms growing. I don't need any HRT, drugs or supplements either. Time will tell.
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Says who? I am 72 and I see no reason why I can't keep my arms growing. I don't need any HRT, drugs or supplements either. Time will tell.
just arms????
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just arms????
Yes, that is all I have the energy to train at the moment. I do some climbing in the hills to take photos and that serves as leg workouts.
I want to test my theory and since I am the only person who believes the DOMS theory I have to test it on myself.
My biceps-supinator machine is great. This is the first time I have used it consistently since I first built it in 2001. I have modified the machine
several times and it now works both simply and effectively. Last week was the first time I can remember my biceps being sore the next few
days after a severe workout. I can tell you those workouts are brutal and it takes a lot of motivation to do them. I use a modified Nautilus triceps
machine for triceps. It is also effective and safer than most triceps exercises because of the hand position which is vertical..
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Says who? Of course it is possible to make a muscle keep growing. It is just very difficult to do so most either don't work hard enough or they do the wrong exercises or both.
I am interested in your frequency idea. Previously, because of injuries, I concluded that connective tissue needs time to repair. However, I knew the muscles did not. They keep growing.
So when my joints are sore I go back and do another workout. I always warm up with high maximum sets progressing to my training sets that I can do for about 20 reps. I always try to
add weight over the weeks. Without adding resistance I doubt much growth will occur. The muscles respond to perceived increases not absolute increases so these can be gradual.
In my system the goal is to generate severe DOMS in the target muscles. That is the only way to know the muscle is going to grow. Then I try to keep the muscle sore. Now, I have
speculated on daily training but have yet to do it. I even wondered how the arms would respond if I trained them daily all day! Not that is being really crazy. I guessed that very rapid
hypertrophy would occur.
The no one system is more or less untested. I would be happy to have both the DOMS method and the no one method tested scientifically. That isn't going to happen.
So here is what I propose. You continue using your system and see if you can get your arms bigger. I will use my system and do the same thing. Report any significant results here on
Getbig.
this is more like it.
I started the system again last week. I dropped down to 2 full body workouts a week to focus more on cycling.
I will post my pics in 6 weeks. maybe sooner since my body is acclimating rapidly to the increase in workloads already. the compression phase I'm adapted to. so ya 6 weeks or so before I get back to where I ended before I posted this. we can then compare those pics to the last ones I posted here from last summer where I feel I was in my best ever shape and conditioning.
to further strengthen the ability of the system to create the environment I claim it will I will be doing it in a severe calorie deficit. apparently this is not ideal for 'growth' they say which will only strengthen my claims as to the efficacy of the system.
i have already proven my original stance- the body can adapt to any environment you create for it. i was training 10x a week at the apex of it. I created a highly functioning machine. that's what I set out to do and that's what I did.
the 'cosmetic' part ie creating tissue / density is an added bonus that I'll be happy to prove.
just for you vince.
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this is more like it.
I started the system again last week. I dropped down to 2 full body workouts a week to focus more on cycling.
I will post my pics in 6 weeks. maybe sooner since my body is acclimating rapidly to the increase in workloads already. the compression phase I'm adapted to. so ya 6 weeks or so before I get back to where I ended before I posted this. we can then compare those pics to the last ones I posted here from last summer where I feel I was in my best ever shape and conditioning.
to further strengthen the ability of the system to create the environment I claim it will I will be doing it in a severe calorie deficit. apparently this is not ideal for 'growth' they say which will only strengthen my claims as to the efficacy of the system.
i have already proven my original stance- the body can adapt to any environment you create for it. i was training 10x a week at the apex of it. I created a highly functioning machine. that's what I set out to do and that's what I did.
the 'cosmetic' part ie creating tissue / density is an added bonus that I'll be happy to prove.
just for you vince.
Good, you have a deal. I will keep to my regular nutrition program or lack of one. Bachelors don't eat the best meals but I can add muscle with the minimum amount of protein. I believe you need both a positive energy and protein balance to grow muscle. It might not be much but it still has to be positive.
The photo here was taken a week or so ago. How about posting a photo of what you look like now? That is only fair. I was pumped up after a severe arm workout in the photo.
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The photo here was taken a week or so ago. How about posting a photo of what you look like now? That is only fair. I was pumped up after a severe arm workout in the photo.
Vince, is this the best pose you could do to show off your arm development? Seems like a different angle would make your arm look more muscular. This one mainly makes you upper arm look fat. It is hard to see the muscles.
I have no doubt your a maniac in the gym and that you are strong. I just think for someone that previously competed, you should be able to show yourself to better advantage.
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Next week I am at the full body routines. I have to say, so far I have stayed pumped the entire time after still. My shirts seem to fit just a bit tighter and I am noticing I am leaning up way faster than usual.
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Good, you have a deal. I will keep to my regular nutrition program or lack of one. Bachelors don't eat the best meals but I can add muscle with the minimum amount of protein. I believe you need both a positive energy and protein balance to grow muscle. It might not be much but it still has to be positive.
The photo here was taken a week or so ago. How about posting a photo of what you look like now? That is only fair. I was pumped up after a severe arm workout in the photo.
Thats not a muscular arm.
its an old man fat arm.
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Thats not a muscular arm.
its an old man fat arm.
This fat arm and my grip of steel could easily break an arm or even rip ribs out! I don't take kindly to being disrespected on the Internet you know so watch what you say!
Those who scoff at my doing only arms obviously haven't tried it. If you did you would know that all the adjoining muscles grow a little as well.
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This fat arm and my grip of steel could easily break an arm or even rip ribs out! I don't take kindly to being disrespected on the Internet you know so watch what you say!
Those who scoff at my doing only arms obviously haven't tried it. If you did you would know that all the adjoining muscles grow a little as well.
Fuck off.
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Vince, is this the best pose you could do to show off your arm development? Seems like a different angle would make your arm look more muscular. This one mainly makes you upper arm look fat. It is hard to see the muscles.
I have no doubt your a maniac in the gym and that you are strong. I just think for someone that previously competed, you should be able to show yourself to better advantage.
I just pumped my arms over 1 3/8 inches in that photo. I will worry about definition later. I invite others to post how big their arms are.
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...
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That is a huge arm.
Now, where are photos of no one and Adonis? Both are cutting up so this will be rather easy to surpass any gains those two will achieve!
I am grateful for the motivation to show 'em!
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x2
Vince, aren't you 60-something? "Immediate continuous hypertrophy" isn't really possible for someone your age, probably not even with aggressive HRT.
No one, check your PMs, bro.
Legend has returned.
Welcome back!
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Says who? I am 72 and I see no reason why I can't keep my arms growing. I don't need any HRT, drugs or supplements either. Time will tell.
There are many reasons why your arms, and everybody's arm, can't keep growing. In your case, age is a major factor. You no longer produce in sufficient quantities the necessary hormones. You down play this but it's the same reason why women, and prepubescent men, can't get as big muscularly as men naturally.
Even the greatest of bodybuilders have never been able to maintain the muscular mass that they had in their prime let alone keep growing. You may say it's because they don't train as hard or as seriously. Maybe so. But I submit it's because they simply can't maintain that level of intensity as they get older. You are a prime example. You always quit or say you are injured. That's because you are old. You simply can't endure what it takes anymore. The lack of ability often goes hand in hand with the lack of desire.
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That is a huge arm.
Now, where are photos of no one and Adonis? Both are cutting up so this will be rather easy to surpass any gains those two will achieve!
I am grateful for the motivation to show 'em!
i look fwd to seeing you at your best sir.
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There are many reasons why your arms, and everybody's arm, can't keep growing. In your case, age is a major factor. You no longer produce in sufficient quantities the necessary hormones. You down play this but it's the same reason why women, and prepubescent men, can't get as big muscularly as men naturally.
Even the greatest of bodybuilders have never been able to maintain the muscular mass that they had in their prime let alone keep growing. You may say it's because they don't train as hard or as seriously. Maybe so. But I submit it's because they simply can't maintain that level of intensity as they get older. You are a prime example. You always quit or say you are injured. That's because you are old. You simply can't endure what it takes anymore. The lack of ability often goes hand in hand with the lack of desire.
he wil gain :P ???
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he wil gain :P ???
You know I will always be rooting for Vince.
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I want to address a couple of things mentioned by no one. First of all, if hypertrophy is your goal there is absolutely no way you can train all body parts every two days. Definitely not every day. No way and still grow.
What is the reasoning behind this thinking? I somewhat understand everyday but def not willing to say you cant train everything everyday as I have never done it myself but every two days I see no reason to make such a definitive statement as that (especially since recovery studies show otherwise and since I do it myself and have no issue).
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cause he jumped into training his arms every other day without waiting for his body to adapt to the increased demand for performance and hurt himself.
therefore, its not he that is the crux of the problem, its the system thats a failure.
for a fella who preaches logic his opinion isnt very based on logical thinking.
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You know I will always be rooting for Vince.
why all of sudden at 70 will thise life time bodybuilder gayn anything maybe for 60 years he didnt go to failure
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why all of sudden at 70 will thise life time bodybuilder gayn anything maybe for 60 years he didnt go to failure
He will begin eating that orange clay from ~ a two-foot depth and this will trigger new things.
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I am interested in immediate, continuous hypertrophy. Your method doesn't generate what I am after. Sorry, not possible with your protocols. If you were in Sydney I could prove it to you.
Help me out here, Vince. Why would a man your age, who hasn't looked anything anywhere near presentable since color film was invented, care so much about hypertrophy? Shouldn't you be more concerned about diet and cardio at this point? Grim Reaper's already got you programmed into his GPS, and big muscles are still on your bucket list?
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Says who? I am 72 and I see no reason why I can't keep my arms growing. I don't need any HRT, drugs or supplements either. Time will tell.
Time DID tell. Decades ago, it screamed it through a megaphone. But you stuck your fingers in your ears and did the six year-old "BLAH, BLAH, BLAH, I CAN'T HEAR YOU!" routine.
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My biceps-supinator machine is as effective as Uncle Rico's time travel device..
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Vince, is this the best pose you could do to show off your arm development? Seems like a different angle would make your arm look more muscular. This one mainly makes you upper arm look fat. It is hard to see the muscles.
You think he might have a slightly distorted view of that 1 3/8" pump? We see an old man with a soft, fat arm, but Vince sees Arnold's right peak before a glorious European mountainscape.
VP summed it up best.
Fuck off.
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Help me out here, Vince. Why would a man your age, who hasn't looked anything anywhere near presentable since color film was invented, care so much about hypertrophy? Shouldn't you be more concerned about diet and cardio at this point? Grim Reaper's already got you programmed into his GPS, and big muscles are still on your bucket list?
Some folks have a hard time adjusting to the changes age brings. They delude themselves into believing that everything is still possible as long as they work hard enough for it and believe in it. As long as they don't end up injuring themselves, there's probably no harm done accept the eventual disappointment when their muscles don't respond the way they thought they would. That can be a real letdown.
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Some folks have a hard time adjusting to the changes age brings. They delude themselves into believing that everything is still possible as long as they work hard enough for it and believe in it. As long as they don't end up injuring themselves, there's probably no harm done accept the eventual disappointment when their muscles don't respond the way they thought they would. That can be a real letdown.
You two are in a similar age bracket, Prime. Can you imagine spending these golden years pursuing hypertrophy? The soft, fat arm variety, it would appear, the main benefit of which seems to be shoveling heavy calorie-laden forkloads into a soft, fat, Herbert-like face.
Is this a wise quest?
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You two are in a similar age bracket, Prime. Can you imagine spending these golden years pursuing hypertrophy? Soft, fat arm hypertrophy, it would appear, the main benefit of which seems to be shoveling heavy calorie-laden forkloads into a soft, fat, Herbert-like face.
Is this a wise quest?
This forum is called Getbig, right?
If a man can cause his muscles to grow at 72 that should interest a lot of people. Building large muscles has never been seen as a wise quest.
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There are many reasons why your arms, and everybody's arm, can't keep growing. In your case, age is a major factor. You no longer produce in sufficient quantities the necessary hormones. You down play this but it's the same reason why women, and prepubescent men, can't get as big muscularly as men naturally.
Even the greatest of bodybuilders have never been able to maintain the muscular mass that they had in their prime let alone keep growing. You may say it's because they don't train as hard or as seriously. Maybe so. But I submit it's because they simply can't maintain that level of intensity as they get older. You are a prime example. You always quit or say you are injured. That's because you are old. You simply can't endure what it takes anymore. The lack of ability often goes hand in hand with the lack of desire.
The fact that almost nobody has built large arms at my age hardly means it can't be done. Yes, it is easy to injure connective tissue and I have adjusted my exercises to avoid those injuries. This is called learning from experience.
I do specific things to trigger hypertrophy. This is what makes a big difference . Motivation can be found and intensity sustained. We will see what happens.
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If a man can cause his muscles to grow at 72 that should interest a lot of people.
Of whom do you speak?
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The fact that almost nobody has built large arms at my age hardly means it can't be done. Yes, it is easy to injure connective tissue and I have adjusted my exercises to avoid those injuries. This is called learning from experience.
I do specific things to trigger hypertrophy. This is what makes a big difference . Motivation can be found and intensity sustained. We will see what happens.
surely u can put more effort in than u did in your 20's
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Still no before photos from Adonis or no one? You guys are not fair dinkum.
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why all of sudden at 70 will thise life time bodybuilder gayn anything maybe for 60 years he didnt go to failure
Never under estimate a man that can rip out your ribs.
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You two are in a similar age bracket, Prime. Can you imagine spending these golden years pursuing hypertrophy? The soft, fat arm variety, it would appear, the main benefit of which seems to be shoveling heavy calorie-laden forkloads into a soft, fat, Herbert-like face.
Is this a wise quest?
If one is doing what he loves then whose business is it. If a guy wants to pump iron and strive for bigger muscles or collect rare stamps or golf until they finally bury him who cares?
What do you plan to do during your retirement years?
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Of whom do you speak?
I would think virtually everyone on this board and everyone interested in bodybuilding. If a man has figured out a way to big substantial amount of muscle at 72 you imagine what a 50 year old man can do? I would think even the medical community would be interested in this as muscle wasting is one of the biggest problems facing oldsters.
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Still no before photos from Adonis or no one? You guys are not fair dinkum.
I remember a guy on the gh 15 board claiming that pharm grade hgh was so superior that he has been seeing daily changes for the last month. Daily changes. I asked him to post a before and after pic a day apart to prove this outrageous claim. When I got no response I said how about a week apart. Surely that would be even more dramatic than a day. Again no response. A month apart?
He never returned to the thread.
Making claims is one thing. Proving those claims are quite another. I find that in bodybuilding in particular proving claims are quite rare. That's because it's so easily quantified and verified, and of course, dismissed. TA, as is his habit when backed into a corner, simply ignores the issue. You will not see before and after pics posted on this thread that proves the vast difference this training method has made on his physique. In fact, I doubt anybody will.
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I would think virtually everyone on this board and everyone interested in bodybuilding. If a man has figured out a way to big substantial amount of muscle at 72 you imagine what a 50 year old man can do? I would think even the medical community would be interested in this as muscle wasting is one of the biggest problems facing oldsters.
Guess I'll just address all my Basile queries to you from now on.
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Guess I'll just address all my Basile queries to you from now on.
I am not a queer.
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If one is doing what he loves then whose business is it. If a guy wants to pump iron and strive for bigger muscles or collect rare stamps or golf until they finally bury him who cares?
What do you plan to do during your retirement years?
Build a rocketship that adds 1 3/8" of extra soft to my fat arms.
You?
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Build a rocketship that adds 1 3/8" of extra soft to my fat arms.
You?
Extract vengeance from all that has offended me in life. I keep a list.
Become an E-pal with TA and learn how to cook.
Increase my internet porn consumption.
Identify who the real gh 15 is.
Keep my scrotum shaved.
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Extract vengeance from all that has offended me in life. I keep a list.
Become an E-pal with TA and learn how to cook.
Increase my internet porn consumption.
Identify who the real gh 15 is.
Keep my scrotum shaved.
Good list, best of luck. But your abrupt 180 on the previous post was quite unexpected. Two unsolicited defenses, fine, he's a pal, but you then turn and imply a li'l Basile buggery? Puzzling.
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You two are in a similar age bracket, Prime. Can you imagine spending these golden years pursuing hypertrophy? The soft, fat arm variety, it would appear, the main benefit of which seems to be shoveling heavy calorie-laden forkloads into a soft, fat, Herbert-like face.
Is this a wise quest?
No I can't because that doesn't work for me. My goal has always been to be fit and to look as good as possible (yes I am vain). At my age, to me looking good and being fit means not carrying around extra pounds. I am not as concerned with adding muscle as I am with maintaining as much of what I have as I can. A big thing is that I feel better when I am on the lean side.
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This forum is called Getbig, right?
If a man can cause his muscles to grow at 72 that should interest a lot of people. Building large muscles has never been seen as a wise quest.
Although this forum is called Getbig, some folks go beyond, modify and outgrow this rather simple goal. There is evidence all around that simply being bigger than the next fellow, isn't enough.
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One day I might meet Pellius in Hawaii. I would enjoy meeting him and talking about the Iron Game. Those islands would be great to photograph so that is another reason I would like to visit Hawaii again.
Btw, how would anyone know how solid my arms are from a photo? My arms get stronger and therefore muscle mass is increasing.
They are solid when I flex. So there you are. I will continue this experiment for a while even if no one else does.
There are so many things that people believe about life, humans and the universe. Believing something, no matter how passionate, doesn't make it right. To be right you have to either be lucky
or do a lot of work and research to find out about things. Hypertrophy is one of those elusive things. Just about everybody figures he knows what to do but few attain huge size and even fewer
do it naturally.
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One day I might meet Pellius in Hawaii. I would enjoy meeting him and talking about the Iron Game. Those islands would be great to photograph so that is another reason I would like to visit Hawaii again.
Btw, how would anyone know how solid my arms are from a photo? My arms get stronger and therefore muscle mass is increasing.
They are solid when I flex. So there you are. I will continue this experiment for a while even if no one else does.
There are so many things that people believe about life, humans and the universe. Believing something, no matter how passionate, doesn't make it right. To be right you have to either be lucky
or do a lot of work and research to find out about things. Hypertrophy is one of those elusive things. Just about everybody figures he knows what to do but few attain huge size and even fewer
do it naturally.
Can't even begin to express how much fun this sounds. Good times.
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One day I might meet Pellius in Hawaii. I would enjoy meeting him and talking about the Iron Game. Those islands would be great to photograph so that is another reason I would like to visit Hawaii again.
Btw, how would anyone know how solid my arms are from a photo? My arms get stronger and therefore muscle mass is increasing.
They are solid when I flex. So there you are. I will continue this experiment for a while even if no one else does.
There are so many things that people believe about life, humans and the universe. Believing something, no matter how passionate, doesn't make it right. To be right you have to either be lucky
or do a lot of work and research to find out about things. Hypertrophy is one of those elusive things. Just about everybody figures he knows what to do but few attain huge size and even fewer
do it naturally.
You have no chance of getting past customs.
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I am on the first of the full body workouts and just completed a workout. I have to alter it a little bit and break it up between two days until I can get used to it. Its brutal. I also may look into lowering the sets a bit or eliminate one exercise here and there. Best workout I have done in years nonetheless!
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Good list, best of luck. But your abrupt 180 on the previous post was quite unexpected. Two unsolicited defenses, fine, he's a pal, but you then turn and imply a li'l Basile buggery? Puzzling.
I wouldn't consider Basile a "pal" but I do respect that he is an institution and legend on the boards. Also, he has a vast array of first hand experience in the bbing world. But I do support his quest and wish him success as I would to anybody who helps human kind progress whether it be bbing or any other endeavor. If Vince develops a system that can increase the size, strength and functional ability of anybody at any age that would be a huge benefit for all.
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You have no chance of getting past customs.
LMAO!
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I do respect that he is an institution and legend on the boards. Also, he has a vast array of first hand experience.
Vince is the only person I know of that has developed an actual theory of hypertrophy. I do half strength and conditioning training and half higher volume DOMS Basile training. Vince is a misunderstood genius. I have read all his posts.
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Vince is the only person I know of that has developed an actual theory of hypertrophy. I do half strength and conditioning training and half higher volume DOMS Basile training. Vince is a misunderstood genius. I have read all his posts.
Please join us in Hawaii.
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Those who are following this discussion should realize that there can be only one true theory of hypertrophy. I have advocated the DOMS method whereas no one has put forward his ideas.
If there is value in what no one says then it will and should be incorporated into the complete field theory of hypertrophy. I am experimenting with less rest to see if it makes a difference.
I have been aware that two successful bodybuilders in the past have advocated training with the minimum rest between sets. I refer to Larry Scott and Milos Sarcev.
Larry did his up and down the rack dumbbell work for biceps and shoulders. Very painful to do, indeed. Milos preferred giant sets targetting the same muscle. Naturally, those doing
giant sets cannot use extreme poundages. Another trainer advocating no rest was Arthur Jones of Nautilus and MedX fame. When training Sergio Oliva he devised a program as follows:
After a brief warmup do leg presses with sufficient resistance to do something like 20 to 30 reps until failure. Then run to the leg extension machine and do 15 to 20 reps. Then run to
the squat rack and do 10 + reps. Casey Viator was strong at this routine. He used over 400 pounds in the squat. When Sergio tried to duplicate the resistance in the squat he couldn't get
up after 1 rep. After a few of these brutal sessions Sergio got much stronger.
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Once, I trained every day for the whole of february but felt like the walking dead 28 days later.
What a post
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Please join us in Hawaii.
Where's my invite you crinkled looking old prune ??? >:(
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Where's my invite you crinkled looking old prune ??? >:(
I didn't think you'd be interested. By all means. It would be a pleasure and an honor. You'd like it in Hawaii. Golf is huge here. Golf courses everywhere. And people here love there beer. Boy do they love their beer.
You'd fit right in.
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Lol thread of sedentary guys who keep gayning muscle because they found the right routine yaaaaaaay 4 them
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Vince... respect your passion for bodybuilding, even at an advanced age.
But the plain truth is your just talking shit, you never actually EXPLAIN your theory. and not to be mean, but you are an old man, and you haven't changed a lick in the ten years I know you. What are you trying to prove? seriously.
and I wouldn't start talking shit about "i don't know what I'm doing" if I were you.
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Vince... respect your passion for bodybuilding, even at an advanced age.
But the plain truth is your just talking shit, you never actually EXPLAIN your theory. and not to be mean, but you are an old man, and you haven't changed a lick in the ten years I know you. What are you trying to prove? seriously.
and I wouldn't start talking shit about "i don't know what I'm doing" if I were you.
groink im fat but i can pull off this pic better than you bro.
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groink im fat but i can pull off this pic better than you bro.
I missed you Mortimer F. Nigglefap
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I didn't think you'd be interested. By all means. It would be a pleasure and an honor. You'd like it in Hawaii. Golf is huge here. Golf courses everywhere. And people here love there beer. Boy do they love their beer.
You'd fit right in.
I've been to Hawaii, Maui, Kauai, and the big Island multiple times, mostly Hawaii and Maui......spent many a night drinking in Lahaina....seen the sunset from Kimos.
I've been lucky enough to play a bunch of golf.
....Its been to long. I'd love to get back again...hell we could train and you could hook me up with some turtletropin :)
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Next month adonis and bass ill will report extreme gains
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I am on the first of the full body workouts and just completed a workout. I have to alter it a little bit and break it up between two days until I can get used to it. Its brutal. I also may look into lowering the sets a bit or eliminate one exercise here and there. Best workout I have done in years nonetheless!
you should be almost a week in.
hows it going?
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Vince... respect your passion for bodybuilding, even at an advanced age.
But the plain truth is your just talking shit, you never actually EXPLAIN your theory. and not to be mean, but you are an old man, and you haven't changed a lick in the ten years I know you. What are you trying to prove? seriously.
and I wouldn't start talking shit about "i don't know what I'm doing" if I were you.
Anyone who stays the same for 10 years is maintaining his size which is still a good result. I am going way beyond that.
I am trying to prove that I can get my arms bigger than ever at 72 years of age. If I can do that it is important to everyone who lifts weights and even those who don't.
I also want to demonstrate what is possible using my biceps-supinator machine. I won't be using any drugs or supplements. Not even vitamins and minerals. Just a balanced diet.
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About 45 years ago Arthur Jones addressed the question about why so few are growing bigger muscles. According to his analysis muscleheads were not training with enough intensity. He said they were also training too long. Arthur advocated brief, intense workouts and even designed his Nautilus machines to make exercises more intense. What did we find? A few champions tried the High Intensity Training. Mike and Ray Mentzer were outspoken proponents of that way of training. Ellington Darden, PhD, wrote many books about HIT and is probably the best authority on that method today. Sergio Oliva was at his largest and most impressive size after training with Arthur.
Well, has HIT become the way to train to gain muscles? Nope. What everyone found was intensity wasn't the only factor. You needed volume as well. Arnold, Sergio and just about everyone else who got huge did it by doing volume.
So what is the factor that causes hypertrophy? It isn't intensity per se or even volume. What has to happen for the muscles to grow is something extraordinary. When you think about it such a system would soon become extremely difficult to do.
If we look at the current pros training in videos we don't see themselves training in any brutal fashion. Sure, they workout hard but we see just about everyone doing the same thing. Lots of sets and lots of different exercises.
Instead of asking what is the stimulus we can examine the aftermath of training. If and only if the muscles are sore the following few days is rapid growth occurring. Anything else is mere maintenance.
The goal then is to always try to tigger DOMS on the day following a hard workout. Then sustain the DOMS after each and every hard workout. You will see that there has to be a progression in some way.
More weight lifted, finishing the sets quicker, doing more sets. It really doesn't matter as long as the end result is always DOMS. Combine that with a diet that makes you gain a little weight and growth will occur.
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Anyone who stays the same for 10 years is maintaining his size which is still a good result. I am going way beyond that.
I am trying to prove that I can get my arms bigger than ever at 72 years of age. If I can do that it is important to everyone who lifts weights and even those who don't.
I also want to demonstrate what is possible using my biceps-supinator machine. I won't be using any drugs or supplements. Not even vitamins and minerals. Just a balanced diet.
So it has nothing to do with getting in shape, it's just for science. Just arms, huh. No desire to fix the whole shebang?
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So it has nothing to do with getting in shape, it's just for science. Just arms, huh. No desire to fix the whole shebang?
How on earth is a sensible person supposed to discuss serious matters with The Ugly? Never mind what I am going to do. Just watch.
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How on earth is a sensible person supposed to discuss serious matters with The Ugly? Never mind what I am going to do. Just watch.
You've gone on and on about hypertrophy, arm inches, and your flux-capacitor fueled biceps contraption; what exactly makes my question nonsensical, you condescending fuck? You'll be dead before your second session, Vince. There's nothing to watch except Sydney's obituary column.
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How on earth is a sensible person supposed to discuss serious matters with The Ugly? Never mind what I am going to do. Just watch.
ALL DRUGS.
I don't take kindly to being disrespected here or anywhere else! You haven't used my biceps machine so know zero about how it works the muscle better than any other biceps machine.
I religiously took two Dianabol tablets for a couple of years straight starting back in 1958.
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"I religiously took two Dianabol tablets for a couple of years straight starting back in 1958."
Don't go fabricating lies about me. 12 years training before any Dianabol. Then only for a short while then off. Clean since 1975.
You have to understand that in those days only the foolhardy and desperate would take drugs. Broscience in those days said anabolics might cause cancer. The scientists even
claimed that steroids didn't work! The guys in California knew otherwise. Ditto the weightlifters in York and Russia.
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"I religiously took two Dianabol tablets for a couple of years straight starting back in 1958."
Don't go fabricating lies about me. 12 years training before any Dianabol. Then only for a short while then off. Clean since 1975.
You have to understand that in those days only the foolhardy and desperate would take drugs. Broscience in those days said anabolics might cause cancer. The scientists even
claimed that steroids didn't work! The guys in California knew otherwise. Ditto the weightlifters in York and Russia.
and the drug addicts in canada apparently.
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Ok, I stuck with it for a long time and will post what I think of it.
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Ok, I stuck with it for a long time and will post what I think of it.
Excellent
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I enjoyed using this method overall. Is it the magic bullet-no. Is it a good routine-yes-if not done for too long a period of time.
First things first-I kept my calories 2400-2500 and never went over. I was already 8-10 percent bodyfat when I started.
What I liked about the routine:
The length of time working out was short and fast
The initial pumps were awesome (faded fast as I adapted)
Great heart rate the whole time
What I did not like:
Pumps faded after a few weeks to not much pump
Burn out after a few weeks-I did not bother going to full body for 6-7 days. Its way too much.
The routine becomes way too much and too time consuming and not worth it in my opinion.
Lack of weight progression and strength. I saw no strength gains really and was stuck doing low weight to the point I was not feeling too much anymore.
Training became more of a burden than enjoyable.
Progress kind of stalled as a result.
Would I do the routine again-yes, but only in short bursts for 1-3 weeks. I would not use this as a continuing routine.
I did not see any more or less gains than other routines I have tried in the past and it worked about the same as any other despite being more demanding to a point.
When I did try to lift my normal weight, I found that I had trouble. Perhaps I adapted to using light weights.
Overall, it was a good experience.
I am now doing a German Volume routine and everything is back to normal weight wise and am feeling the pumps and soreness again! Calories are still the same.
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I had similar results, TA.
No different from any other program, though. It feels great at first, then it's back to however you felt on your old routine.
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I had similar results, TA.
No different from any other program, though. It feels great at first, then it's back to however you felt on your old routine.
Yes!
I found it not to be worth it for an extended period of time. 1-3 weeks I would say max, just for a change. Its certainly not sustainable unless you want to live in the gym.
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if you follow this routine but drop the reps, and raise the weights youll be pleasantly surprised. also your body will adapt and tolerate the higher weights with virtually no breaks.
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Good, you have a deal. I will keep to my regular nutrition program or lack of one. Bachelors don't eat the best meals but I can add muscle with the minimum amount of protein. I believe you need both a positive energy and protein balance to grow muscle. It might not be much but it still has to be positive.
The photo here was taken a week or so ago. How about posting a photo of what you look like now? That is only fair. I was pumped up after a severe arm workout in the photo.
respect the fact that you believe what you say. and try to back it up. most dont. my question is if you really beleive these things why not just compete in some drug free masters meets. wouldnt that prove you right, as opposed to arguing all day on the internet? just curious
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if you follow this routine but drop the reps, and raise the weights youll be pleasantly surprised. also your body will adapt and tolerate the higher weights with virtually no breaks.
I did do that.
Its just not for me in the long run. Its not sustainable and I did not notice any strength gains or any other gains than using other methods.
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I've still stuck with this routine. I found myself training already-trained body parts and just doing small pump exercises to get blood through everything while it was still sore. Never went beyond warm-up reps and just did a couple compound movements.
My workouts slowly evolved into full body workouts, which is something I would never picture an advanced lifter doing. But I'm still responding well. Each day I still have a "focus" muscle where I reserve most of my intensity. Instead of just pumping everything else up, I do fast sets (about 4-5) and a few exercises for each body part. Doing chest/back/shoulders/arms/legs, more or less. But sometimes I'll retrain (with lots of intensity) another body part which I had worked out just a couple of days before.
I'm finding that I'm still growing and still getting really conditioned. I'm able to train my body parts way more frequently and still get them sore. There is still a couple days of soreness, but I can lift through it without my strength being impeded. I had to cut my weights back a little bit, but the intensity is out of this world. Volume is very high and everything is very fast. There's no such thing as muscle wasting or anything from high volume - just glycogen depletion. I eat like a porker so I don't ever get too flat. I burn about 500 calories using the stepper each workout (mostly to pump my calves, get warmed up and to do actual CARDIO). Sometimes I burn a thousand calories. I used to think I would get flat, but I still get super pumped. I'm not running any supplements or anything. Just a little bit of test enth which I haven't run in years.
I don't think I'll change things up for a while because if I miss a few days at the gym, I can always bank on having just done a full body workout more or less. And if I know I only have one workout or two to make things count, I'll have a damn good workout and that'll be that. Little drunk right now. But I like no one's approach. I was able to meld it with what I was already sort of doing and it's going good for me.
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Impressive, Dustin! How much do you think you eat each day?
Still clean?